So I checked the ratings on this site and according to the list, World of Warcraft is rated at around number 21 of all released MMORPGs.  Ouch.   Okay, so I play WoW, but my intention behind this post is not to tell you that you're wrong or voting badly, but merely to ask the following:

Do you honestly believe that there are 20 better  MMORPGs than WoW (or at least closely comparable)?  

If you are at all willing to answer, perhaps you would be inclined estimate how the following might rank WoW as well, I assume there are none around to ask directly:

a) Professional opinion -(what other game developers might think.)
b) Pseudo-professional opinion -(what games journalists might think.)
c) A typical PC-gamer's opinion - (what a person who might enjoy games such as Half-Life, Fallout 3, Red Alert 3, etc might think)
d) The 'Veteran' - what someone that has played more than a couple of MMORPGs for signfiicant periods of time might think.  Actually I think that includes most of us.
 

There's no rhetoric behind that question, if you really believe that that there are 20, or even 50 better MMORPGs, then that's fine with me. 

WoW is a popular MMO, not a good one. Same with McDonalds and Britney Spears. Its a difference.

Originally posted by daarco

WoW is a popular MMO, not a good one. Same with McDonalds and Britney Spears. Its a difference.

Aye its a game for the masses that brought countless people into the genre.  Blizzard knows what they are doing and they have a lot of business savy and it obviously shows.

That being said...like daarco said...that doesn't make it a good mmo.  Amusing to some?  Obviously.

His analogy of McDonalds and Britney Spears is right on.  Both popular and brought in $$$$$$.  But if they are reviewed by the experts of their respective areas, then they fail big time.  Cmon brittney spears is hardly music and McDonalds barely qualifies as food. 

The rankings that the games on this site get are merely subjective, even the prior post that its popular rather than good is basically someone's opinion and doesn't apply to everyone.  When it comes to it, most of the people who are posting their negatives are here while those enjoying thier game of choice are, well, enjoying thier game of choice and don't have time to go around bashing other games unless they are at work doing it (shame on you).

If im in the mood to play WoW, i play WoW.  If im in the mood to play WAR, I play WAR.  If im in the mood to play.....etc, etc.

Dont sweat the small stuff, and why some else does anyting is small stuff.  Just enjoy what you enjoy.

Originally posted by daarco

WoW is a popular MMO, not a good one. Same with McDonalds and Britney Spears. Its a difference.

I take it that we can assume that your answer to my question would be "yes, there are at least 20 better MMORPGs than World of Warcraft'?   I'm not going to use this thread to debunk the McDonalds/Spears theory, ignore my sig :p.

i wouldn't say theres 20 better, me personally, i can think of about 8 better (but again thats my personal opinion)

The rating list here is more like reading a list of which game has the most people on mmorpg.com that are looking for a new game to play.  That is why the majority of people are here in the first place.

20 Better? 

Hmm... Maybe in their prime but currently at today's standards nah. 

I can think of quite a few though.  Personally if I had to rank MMOs past and present at their peak.

1.  Asheron's Call 1

2.  Dark Age of Camelot

3.  Lord of the Rings Online

4.  City of Heroes / City of Villians

5.  Guild Wars

6.  Everquest 2

7.  Everquest 1

8.  EvE (Even though it was never really the game for me)

9.  World of Warcraft

So I would place 8 games ahead of World of Warcraft. 

World of Warcraft is extremely popular and even though Recant tries to dispute it, it is comparable to McDonalds or Britney Spears. 

All three are super popular.  All three have one awards.  All three are Icons of Pop Culture. 

And all three are fairly average.

Anyone trying to deny the Above will use the fact that World of Warcraft has won numerous critical acclaim from reviewers. 

But then again so has Britney Spears.  Being the best of a particular genre doesn't make you the best overall. 

No one is going to compare Britney Spears and Elvis and say they are equally talented. 

Just like World of Warcraft is not an equal achievement to many many other games (The Sims, Super Mario Brothers, Legend of Zelda, Final Fantasy, Half Life, Doom, Quake, etc)  It is only when you compare World of Warcraft in the sub genre of MMO games does it shine.  Just like Britney shines in the "Pop" bubblegum princess category of Music or McDonald's does in the Fast food burger genre. 

World of Warcraft isn't even Blizzard's best game by any means.  (Diablo 1 & 2, Warcraft 1,2, & 3, are all good but Starcraft is by far Blizzard's greatest game to date).

Gamespot (while only one site) even shines light on what I am saying.  World of Warcraft was not the Game of the year for 2004 for the PC (that was Half Life 2) and over all the game of the year for 2004 was Halo 2.  

In 2005 it was Resident Evil 4.

Another good example is 2007 when The Burning Crusade released.  Lord of the Rings Online beat it for the Golden Joystick award for 2007 PC Game of the Year.

Another great example:

http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/top10/article/0,30583,1686204_1686305_1692236,00.html

Halo 3 was the Time Magazine Game of the year in 2007.  (Even Blizzard's at that point millions of subscribers didn't sway the critics for Time Magazine.  World of Warcraft's The Burning Crusade didn't even make the list of top 10 games of 2007)  Bioschock and the Orange Box both made the list for 2007. 

I don't personally thinK there are 20 games that are better just that they might have better parts to them or might do things better but overall I'd stick them in the same place as WoW.

When I rank games on the list I give my personal opinion nothing more.  What the rating system does is add up all that stuff and the whatever number at the end comes up is the slot you are given.  Sure WoW does some things good but it also does other things bad.  All the opinions are subjective as well.  You and I will most likely not enjoy the same things in games.  You play WoW, I don't.  See it's starting already.

Most MMO players have tried WoW, most WoW players have not tried the 20 mmos in front of WoW on the ratings.

See where I'm going with this?

Originally posted by Sabiancym

Most MMO players have tried WoW, most WoW players have not tried the 20 mmos in front of WoW on the ratings.

 

See where I'm going with this?

I see what you did there.

mmorpg.com = we play/try many mmos and rank them accordingly.

Many of the old WoW players I played with quote WoW as their first mmo (some their first computer GAME) and very few of them have tried any other mmo (or game).

Originally posted by Sabiancym

Most MMO players have tried WoW, most WoW players have not tried the 20 mmos in front of WoW on the ratings.

 

See where I'm going with this?

QFT right there and then some.

Originally posted by Cabe2323

Anyone trying to deny the Above will use the fact that World of Warcraft has won numerous critical acclaim from reviewers. 

Don't you find it odd that after you make that statement you go on to list several reviews and awards that WoW didn't win.

Funny how you dismiss anyone for mentioning those things then you turn around and do the same thing.

#21 haha. Think most people know really it should be top 5 but it's perhaps pleasing in a way this site doesn't rate it #1 as maybe it gives people a clue other mmos actually exist.

Originally posted by Recant

So I checked the ratings on this site and according to the list, World of Warcraft is rated at around number 21 of all released MMORPGs.  Ouch.   Okay, so I play WoW, but my intention behind this post is not to tell you that you're wrong or voting badly, but merely to ask the following:

Do you honestly believe that there are 20 better  MMORPGs than WoW (or at least closely comparable)?  

If you are at all willing to answer, perhaps you would be inclined estimate how the following might rank WoW as well, I assume there are none around to ask directly:

a) Professional opinion -(what other game developers might think.)
b) Pseudo-professional opinion -(what games journalists might think.)
c) A typical PC-gamer's opinion - (what a person who might enjoy games such as Half-Life, Fallout 3, Red Alert 3, etc might think)
d) The 'Veteran' - what someone that has played more than a couple of MMORPGs for signfiicant periods of time might think.  Actually I think that includes most of us.
 

There's no rhetoric behind that question, if you really believe that that there are 20, or even 50 better MMORPGs, then that's fine with me. 

 

Maybe there are 20 better games, or maybe not. When it comes to MMO's, people use 3 things to pick that MMO.

1. Do my friends play it? It is an MMO after all, and the MAIN pull for playing it is to play with friends, or make new friends. Anyone can play Oblivion by him/herself, but MOST people play MMO's for company and teamwork.

2. Is it popular? Obviously, it is popular, but there are other games that have hundreds of thousands of players as well. If you play on servers, then it's only as good as the servers, and people that play on them.

3. Is it fun? WoW isn't the only game in town. WoW is fun, but so are many other games. Plus the fact that many people think of fun differently. Some just like to PvP, some like teamwork, some like the social aspect, some like it easy and non-stressful, and some like a challenge. 12 people will have 12 different definitions of fun, but for the most part, they'll all be similar.

The big picture? There are many MMO's out there and people are going to play whatever they like best. Some like fantasy, and some like futuristic. Some like deep engaging challenges, and some like to just goof off. Everyone has their own take on what they want out of a game, and WoW is fun, has many subscribers, a well known and solid company, and a great ad campaign.

As far as your estimations:

a. WoW is well designed, and accomplishes the goal it sets out. People can log in, and it's easy to play, and it has a lot of options and content to explore. So does a lot of games to differing degrees. It doesn't do or try anything new, but it does what it does well.

b. A jouralist will only look and cost and effect. Do I get my money's worth? It is fun and engaging, and it is easy to start and get into right off the bat. Again, many games do this to differing degrees.

c. A typical PC-gamer, depending on his/her background will either love or hate WoW. PC-gamers that play Sims will love the game because it's easy and fun. A typical HL or RA player might hate it because it doesn't challenge them. Some gamers like having that part of the game they like at the ready and want to enjoy that aspect NOW, while others like the journey, and like to work up to something better. Some want to eat the carrot now and some like chasing the carrot.

d. Veterans are easy. They are mostly the people that like the chase. They like always having something better to work towards. They like games that don't end, because the chase, the making oneself better, IS the game. They like challenges they have to overcome, and like always having a goal to accomplish. WoW doesn't do this for a lot of veterans because it is too predictable, too easy, and just doesn't satisfy the need to always be reaching for something.

Originally posted by Recant

Originally posted by daarco

WoW is a popular MMO, not a good one. Same with McDonalds and Britney Spears. Its a difference.

 

I take it that we can assume that your answer to my question would be "yes, there are at least 20 better MMORPGs than World of Warcraft'?   I'm not going to use this thread to debunk the McDonalds/Spears theory, ignore my sig :p.

One of the best things i have seen this quarter of 2008.

But to a more serious note. I was merly trying to explain why there could be 20 more interesting games then WoW. All my friends play WoW because its easy, simple and you can always do something, and you dont have to think much...they say to me atleast.  Same thing with example McDonalds, its easy, you know what you will get, everyone else eat there and so on. But i can think of 20 more interesting places to go anyway : )

Man.. I'm still hard pressed to find two good games, let alone twenty!?!

Hi Draco, haven't seen you post for a while, hows life and how hav you been?

As "better" is a matter of opinion, there is no right or wrong answer. It seems 11 million people have the opinion that WoW is better than the others though. Just an observation.

And those saying WoW is like Britney Spears ("popularity doesn't mean it's good") might want to consider that it could also be like R.E.M. - popularity doesn't mean it's bad either. And comparing entertainment to food is just silly. ;-)

Originally posted by Recant

 Okay, so I play WoW, but my intention behind this post is not to tell you that you're wrong or voting badly. 

 

but isnt that exactly what your doing? you don't like the results so your making a stinky over why people voted that way. why should anyone justifiy thier voting just for you? why do you think WoW is better than the listed games? because of its population?