I didn't think much of any of them.I did not understand what exactly the Warhammer idea was trying to achieve that was so innovative?Was Warhammer trying to achieve solo quests? that is what i took from it.In EQ2 last i played they were adding zones that scale down to player or players and the level of difficulty.YES these zones had quests ,so in essence they wee achieving the EXACT same thing,but again i am not sure exactly what WARHAMMEr is trying to achieve so i may be off here.

The AOC idea i guess is sort of unique but is not a good idea.I would rather learn something a little more challenging than arrow directions.Just the idea of arrow directions sounds too superficial to me,to be counted as anything exciting or challenging or thinking.This idea is actually a variation of the FINAL FANTASY [console] special attacks where by you have to enter directions and symbols to achieve the special attacks,so really it has already been done.I can't quite remember witch game it was but i think it was FF8 or FF9 or maybe it was even 10.

I do not think ANY game out there is even close to Final Fantasy when comes to innovation in combat,just because they have covered soooo many different areas in not only there console games but there FFXI as well,using the renkai chart/combos/sub classes and attacks that utilize more than one player and they have levels of renkai varying from level 1 combos to level2/3,then you can add magic bursts,geesh other games should be embarrassed at how far ahead the Final Fantasy genres are .

As far as the council of stellar management goes,that is not really unique as a whole.Sure they have 9 players i think it was ,but they are to take input from the whole community,that is something SOE did with EQ2 long ago.For a whole year at least maybe longer they put out petitions to every player ,chocked full of questions as to what they liked or did not like about the game.So in reality both ideas are taking input from the community,where as  EVE is relying on the 9 players to take from all,but in reality they may ignore all and just utilize what they feel personally.I would rather choose to trust the Developer to arrange feedback rather than players in the game,as i have ALWAYS seen players to be VERY biased towards themselves, whilst not caring about the ENTIRE game community.

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by Ozmodan

I don't think any of these game concepts are really that innovative.  I guess if I had to pick one, it would probably be the public quests in Warhammer.

I think the entire industry reeks of a lack of innovation.  All I see is one copycat game after another.

Age of Conan combat combo is most certainly not innovative, it has been done before in other games.  As to ship combat, how is that different than ship combat in Eve?  I think the jury is still out on the Council of Stellar Management in Eve, it seems more a marketing ploy than anything helpful to date.

I think we have to look to the indy developers for a company to take a chance on something truely innovative, the major ones seem to avoid that lately.

 

I have to respectfully completely disagree:

I honestly can't remember ever seeing Age of Conan-style combat in another MMO.  I'm not saying I'm king of all knowledge or anything, but to the best of my recollection, or that of anyone else that I have spoken to, we've not seen it in another MMO.

Have you played Pirates of the Burning Sea? I can't recall the last time that wind direction and strength played a role in EVE Online... given there's no wind in space. I'm not knocking EVE's combat, I'm just saying.. it's different.

The Council of Stellar Management has already made a number of differences in the direction of EVE. I wouldn't say it's any more of a marketing thing than any other feature of an MMO. when there's news about it, they send out a release. Take a look at this interview.

Honestly, and please don't take this personally, but I think you might be confused as to the meaning of the word innovation.

Invention is the creation of something completely and wholly new, while innovation is taking something that already exists and somehow changing it (generally to improve upon it).

Communities have always contributed to development decisions, The CSM takes a new spin on that and formalizes it via elections

Quests have always existed in MMOs, PQs present them in a different way, encouraging people to work together without requiring grouping

ship to ship combat has always existed, but PotBS used what they knew of nautical age of sail combat and integrated functions to replicate it.

MMOs have almost always used single key attacks, Age of Conan added a new layer to that by requiring combos to activate certain abilities.

These are all innovative features. I'm not saying they're all great, and we're not asking you what the best feature is. You don't have to like something for it to be innovative. Inf act, innovation often results in the opposite.

+5 Respect points for this post.

I agree the AoC combat system is a novel system. I also think the Murder vs Innocent Consequence PvP system is novel though. I can not think of any other game that ever have implemented such a concept. I know Fable was really doing a lot of work on this side of things but Fable again never had PvP and murderers hunting innocents and vica versa. Anyways, my vote goes to AoC for their combat system.

i pretymuch just snored through all of these. not are really inovative.

If i had to pic a inovation their really only one game that comes to mind City of heroes (and later champions Onlines) Character Creation Sytem. No other MMO comes close to that level of customizbility

Originally posted by damian7

some of us aren't that easily impressed.

 you can't just look at a piece without considering the whole.  when is the last time you were looking to buy a car and said "man, that's one sweet driver's side seat"?  do you only watch cable/satellite for the local news channel?

Actually, you might, if you were concerned with the ways that front sdeats operate. Maybe the front seat has a butt warnmer in it, maybe it adjusts to fit the driver... In this case, we're only looking at specific pieces of the car... you'll have your chance to vote for best overall car later on.

Originally posted by nekollx

i pretymuch just snored through all of these. not are really inovative.

 

If i had to pic a inovation their really only one game that comes to mind City of heroes (and later champions Onlines) Character Creation Sytem. No other MMO comes close to that level of customizbility

I think you're missng the 2008 part... Champions han't launched yet and CoH's customization system was implemented a long time ago...

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by nekollx

i pretymuch just snored through all of these. not are really inovative.

 

If i had to pic a inovation their really only one game that comes to mind City of heroes (and later champions Onlines) Character Creation Sytem. No other MMO comes close to that level of customizbility

 

I think you're missng the 2008 part... Champions han't launched yet and CoH's customization system was implemented a long time ago...

I think you're missing the part about any of these things on your list as being innovative. As others have even commented upon.

• Council of Stellar Management (EVE) Not a feature of the game itself

• Combo Combat (Age of Conan) Not a first for real time combat and has been dumbed down at that

• Public Quests (Warhammer Online) Noone is wasting their time doing these now so I fail to see their importance in player enjoyment or retention (I'm sure 3-20 dudes will come to the mechanics defense on this forum but that don't mean shit to the barren PQ's found in game.)

• Ship Combat (Pirates of the Burning Sea) Awesome, now my virtual avatar is a boat, I have never played a boat before /sarcasm. Nothing but a cosmetic change to essentially more of the same ol'
  

None of these implementations in 2008 deserve to reserve any kind of award. They either lack being original, changing game dynamics beyond appearance or actually gathered much player interest at this point and are either being ignored and retooled by devs to lose any sense of originality.

Originally posted by purewitz

Say what you will about how Funcom aka Failcom dropped the balled, but they got one thing right. Age of Conan's Combo Combat System is by far the best combat system right not. Too bad that and the lore is the only two things the game has going for it, other than the hot graphics and the DX 10 support. Alas not enough to be the new number one for most MMO gamers.

I actually agree with that, AoC's combat system is better than every other MMO simply because of the combo system.  The funny thing is, it isn't even really all that different than most other MMO's combat systems, with specials and all that.  What they did was add something extra to clicking on the specials, and some very nice animations.

Too bad they released the game unfinished and have decided some of the promised features are not important enough to implement into the game.  AoC is the biggest waste of potential since SWG was destroyed by SOE.

Originally posted by Unicorns_Pwn

 

• Ship Combat (Pirates of the Burning Sea) Awesome, now my virtual avatar is a boat, I have never played a boat before /sarcasm. Nothing but a cosmetic change to essentially more of the same ol'
  

 

I completely agree with that.  PotBS's ship combat is not much different that normal MMO game combat, it just has ships instead of a humanoid avatar.  Hell, if you want to claim having a ship instead of the usual MMO type avatar is innovative, EVE has had ship combat since it launced several years ago.  Even SWG, for all its flaws (and those flaws greatly outweigh any good points that waste of an MMO has), has had ship to ship combat since the JtL expansion, which is actually different than anything found in any other MMO.

The ship combat in PotBS is in no way innovative, not even cosmetically.

Originally posted by Obee

Originally posted by Unicorns_Pwn

 

• Ship Combat (Pirates of the Burning Sea) Awesome, now my virtual avatar is a boat, I have never played a boat before /sarcasm. Nothing but a cosmetic change to essentially more of the same ol'
  

 

 

I completely agree with that.  PotBS's ship combat is not much different that normal MMO game combat, it just has ships instead of a humanoid avatar.  Hell, if you want to claim having a ship instead of the usual MMO type avatar is innovative, EVE has had ship combat since it launced several years ago.  Even SWG, for all its flaws (and those flaws greatly outweigh any good points that waste of an MMO has), has had ship to ship combat since the JtL expansion, which is actually different than anything found in any other MMO.

The ship combat in PotBS is in no way innovative, not even cosmetically.

 

But dude...

it was a boat.

This is MMORPG.COM here and we like to lower the bar on standards

Edit: I guess if fallen earth releases it can let you build a dunebuggy or something similar. That has never been done before. Do I smell a potential 09' Awards: Most Inovative feature nominee?

ok, innovations for 2008.

wow's new siege vehicles allow for one player to drive/attack with the siege vehicle and several people to ride in the back, shooting at enemies AND they're pretty safe from attacks until the vehicle is destroyed.  combine this with the siege vehicles are capable of destroying enemy castles and such.  that is innovation on pvp play.

what about the mounts?  flying and land based mounts also include mechnical flying machines, choppers/hogs and flying carpets.  not sure about mounts in other games...

COx has improved qol for character creation and/or respecs. as of the release of  i13 (tomorrow) there are a number of changes.  villains may now respec out of their patron power set.  all toons may have dual builds.  day jobs gives badges/accolades/powers/buffs while your character is offline.  i believe powerset proliferation was introduced this year.  new powersets continue to (slowly) be added.  these are very close to new classes being introduced in other games.  combine all these together and only counting the new stuff in 2008 and you have quite a bit of innovation in character creation, re-creation and advancement.

depending on mounts being offered in other games, i would say the above three are all excellent innovations introduced this year.

yeah, i know mentioning wow isn't cool; but, improving upon the status quo is what blizzard (north) was known for, and this new crew at blizzard seems commited to (at least attempt) continuing this tradition.

Originally posted by Obee

Originally posted by Unicorns_Pwn

 

• Ship Combat (Pirates of the Burning Sea) Awesome, now my virtual avatar is a boat, I have never played a boat before /sarcasm. Nothing but a cosmetic change to essentially more of the same ol'
  

 

 

I completely agree with that.  PotBS's ship combat is not much different that normal MMO game combat, it just has ships instead of a humanoid avatar.  Hell, if you want to claim having a ship instead of the usual MMO type avatar is innovative, EVE has had ship combat since it launced several years ago.  Even SWG, for all its flaws (and those flaws greatly outweigh any good points that waste of an MMO has), has had ship to ship combat since the JtL expansion, which is actually different than anything found in any other MMO.

The ship combat in PotBS is in no way innovative, not even cosmetically.

 

Have you played the game, or even read the article describing why it was different? Did you read my earlier post in this thread discussing how it was different? I'll grant you, you use WSAD, but the last time I checked, you don't have to worry about whether your avatar is broadside or face on, you don't generally need to worry about how the wind direction is going to effect your foot based avatar...

Seriously, maybe reading before posting a scathing criticism is in order as this matter has been addressed several times both in the article and WITHIN THIS THREAD. Just saying.

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by Obee

Originally posted by Unicorns_Pwn

 

• Ship Combat (Pirates of the Burning Sea) Awesome, now my virtual avatar is a boat, I have never played a boat before /sarcasm. Nothing but a cosmetic change to essentially more of the same ol'
  

 

 

I completely agree with that.  PotBS's ship combat is not much different that normal MMO game combat, it just has ships instead of a humanoid avatar.  Hell, if you want to claim having a ship instead of the usual MMO type avatar is innovative, EVE has had ship combat since it launced several years ago.  Even SWG, for all its flaws (and those flaws greatly outweigh any good points that waste of an MMO has), has had ship to ship combat since the JtL expansion, which is actually different than anything found in any other MMO.

The ship combat in PotBS is in no way innovative, not even cosmetically.

 

 

Have you played the game, or even read the article describing why it was different? Did you read my earlier post in this thread discussing how it was different? I'll grant you, you use WSAD, but the last time I checked, you don't have to worry about whether your avatar is broadside or face on, you don't generally need to worry about how the wind direction is going to effect your foot based avatar...

Seriously, maybe reading before posting a scathing criticism is in order as this matter has been addressed several times both in the article and WITHIN THIS THREAD. Just saying.

I guess I will go ahead and take the bait first.

Yes I have played the game, it was not my cup of tea. You are talking about  the wind and positioning?, Sorry, but this is nothing new. Many games use positioning in offensive and defensive tactics. All You have done here is explained that the game changes it's appearance and terminology to do the same things we have been doing for years.

---

For those who might not be aware, Age of Conan employs a combat system that requires players to enter a directional sequence in order successfully complete many of their abilities. This means that while most MMOs on the market require a single button to activate any attack, AoC attempts to simulate some of the chaos and attention to detail required in real combat.

---

I had to laugh when I read that. Oh hooray, you now press two buttons instead of one! It's definitely much more innovative now!

The only MMO that can brag about being able to "stimulate some of the choas and attention to detail required in real combat" is DDO, due to its active combat system. And almost 3 years since its release, still no MMO has come close to replicating it.

Innovation my ass.

People forgot to add Vanguards Diplomacy to the list, that was a novality!  My vote goes for Warhammers PQ as that blew me away and I think every game will emmulate this feature.  It was a hard choice though as PotBS has an exceleent ship combat system that requires sailing tactics along with the right combat moves. 

AoCs combo system was kinda craptacular after playing Cabals combo system. AoC was still button smashing with a lil something ripped from God of War.Cabals combos took timing and practice to get right was very cool and very original. with that power bar moving faster and faster each hit gets more and more difficult and the closer to the target line you hit the attack the more on target you as wich did more dmg.

on that list tho i would say PQs in beta they was packed and always got a group, after launch tho the new people went to the old tried and true WoW ways of soloing in an mmo

Originally posted by damian7

ok, innovations for 2008.

 

wow's new siege vehicles allow for one player to drive/attack with the siege vehicle and several people to ride in the back, shooting at enemies AND they're pretty safe from attacks until the vehicle is destroyed.  combine this with the siege vehicles are capable of destroying enemy castles and such.  that is innovation on pvp play.

 

what about the mounts?  flying and land based mounts also include mechnical flying machines, choppers/hogs and flying carpets.  not sure about mounts in other games...

 

COx has improved qol for character creation and/or respecs. as of the release of  i13 (tomorrow) there are a number of changes.  villains may now respec out of their patron power set.  all toons may have dual builds.  day jobs gives badges/accolades/powers/buffs while your character is offline.  i believe powerset proliferation was introduced this year.  new powersets continue to (slowly) be added.  these are very close to new classes being introduced in other games.  combine all these together and only counting the new stuff in 2008 and you have quite a bit of innovation in character creation, re-creation and advancement.

 

depending on mounts being offered in other games, i would say the above three are all excellent innovations introduced this year.

 

yeah, i know mentioning wow isn't cool; but, improving upon the status quo is what blizzard (north) was known for, and this new crew at blizzard seems commited to (at least attempt) continuing this tradition.

seirously, this stuff is more innovative (and actually a part of the games) than the choices listed. 

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by nekollx

i pretymuch just snored through all of these. not are really inovative.

 

If i had to pic a inovation their really only one game that comes to mind City of heroes (and later champions Onlines) Character Creation Sytem. No other MMO comes close to that level of customizbility

 

I think you're missng the 2008 part... Champions han't launched yet and CoH's customization system was implemented a long time ago...

actually, as my other post shows, cox has furthered their character customization features this year.

i voted pq even tough they could improve a bit

my order would be:

1. pq
seems pretty new and innovative to me and the few time i had the pleasure to actually see people do one of those it was pretty cool.

2. combo system
i found it pretty fun in aoc but it isnt a huge innovation
the general innovative trend i see is that some mmos move towards a more action orientated fighting style then the click and wait from wow/war. i have to mention ddo as well as a game that implemented action orientated fighting pretty early

3. ship combat
since i didnt experience it 1st hand, cant say to much about it

4. csm
i disqualified it personally. first and foremost i dont see it as innovative feature to listen to the community.
if the csm would be a political factor that would shape the ingame world it would be innovative but as it is i see them a bit more like unpayed community managers

here are some latecomers or minor innovations on my personal list
- turn based fighting in atlantica online
- voice over quests in aoc
- pep system in chronicles in spellborne, omg that makes me mad atm
- skill wheel (and manual targeting) in spellborne
- henchman system in ddo (well prolly been done bevore)
- the chaotic weapon in lineage 2 (find it, become uber, go on a pvp spreeeee)

and something i look forwared to
- dialog tree options in aoc and star wars old republic that really influence your quest/ position in the world

I wouldn't call any of that innovations, Vehicles exactly like that were in Planetside, unless your speaking purely about destroying a castle I believe that belongs to DAOC or maybe something before that. Honestly I think your reaching with the mount thing, I wouldn't consider new skins for mounts innovation.

Regarding CoX, I also would hardly considered furthering char creation innovating or respecs, dual builds I believe are in EQ2. I'm not sure what you speak of about Day Jobs but that seems like a EVE like advancement. Thought honestly I can't comment with complete confidence on CoX since it has been awhile since i've played but most of that sounds very similar other games features, though giving more features to a mmorpg that features some of the best char customization is great but, it just dosen't seem like a innovation.

As for my vote it would go for PQs, even if I think PvE is just plain awful in that game, if it was in a PvE focused game I think it would be pretty amazing.

Guess I will add my take on this seeing how I have played 3 of the 4 games listed as having an Innovative Feature.

Eve Online -- Here is a game that was innovative in it's own right when first conceived. An entire player base for the game on a single world? Not possible thought by some but indeed it is possible. Either way, I have long sense quit the game before the Council of Stellar Management. I find this innovative as it is the first game to bring a real world system into a vitural world. But beyond that, it really does not add anything innovative to the game in terms of gameplay.

Age of Conan -- This seemed quite interesting when I got into the beta. Grim, dark world with action-packed gameplay yet with the openness of a MMO (while its not totally open as in like Everquest or Shadowbane but more open than a hack n' slash or standard RPG game). I believe this game could have went the distance, and still might age very well. The combo system in of itself is not innovative but in the world of an MMO, it breaths new life into the genre, which is the definition of innovation in my book.

Warhammer: Age of Reckoning -- This game I am currently playing so anything I say here could easily be bias. Generally speaking, this game is a redux of DAoC with a new world and some interesting changes to gameplay. One of those major changes is the public quest system. From what I see, a PQ is exactly like a raid except you do not need the structure or organization of a guild to complete (i.e. time needed). I can see many changes made to this system to incorporate RvR, PvP, world events, chained events to unfold a story, and a great many other ideas.

Pirates of the Burning Sea -- Now I have not played this game before so I can only give insight into what I have read or seen. But the added realism of having to control your character/avatar based on real world stimuli adds another depth to the MMO world. While just like Age of Conan, the system in of itself is not innovative, it does bring something new to the MMO world and can easily understand why its considered innovative.

Of these four, I know I would not pick the Council of Stellar Management as something innovative because while unique, it really adds no gameplay values to the MMO in itself. So of the three left, my vote goes to the PQ system from WAR as it could have a long impacting and game changing system to current and future MMOs in development.