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Off-Topic Discussion  » Oil Addiction and Its Resolution: How Would You Solve It?

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32 posts found
  User Deleted
 
11/18/08 12:33:09 AM#1

Drilling - Not Viable

The United States of America is an addict; its consumption of oil is 21 to 22 million barrels per day

We have nothing left to drill.  ANWR could help, but it would produce roughly, maybe, 2 million barrels per day of oil.  No one wants to drill on the West or East Coasts because no oil is there.  The only place left is in the Gulf of Mexico near the Missippi because the river created the underwater structures.  Otherwise, we are basically tapped out.

We import our oil from Canada, more than any other country, in the world.

Canada's reliance on the U.S.A for oil revenue is 99% (works great for Canada to forgo shipping and other costs such as taxes)


Old Habits Die Hard

Solution One:  Transportation

95% of our transportation depends on oil.  If we implemented a four-day workweek, we could effectively reduce our commuting by 20%.  If we expanded telecommuting even further, we could reduce consumption even more.  All non-essential federal employees should telecommute on Fridays or work 10-hour, four-day workweek.  It is a start.  And telecommuting should be encouraged - not feared.

Employers need to encourage car-pooling among employees, and perhaps even reward the driver(s) with some sort of compensation. 

Fuel-efficient automobiles have federal tax credits available.  If you do not know what a tax credit it, well, it is better than a deduction.  It is money you get, not a deduction from income.  Hybrids have a credit of 3,400 dollars and others even more.

Fuel-flexible automobiles that can run on gasoline, ethanol, or methanol should be mandated.  Oh, my God, more regulation!  It would add, perhaps, 100 to 200 for new vehicles.  

Americans love new, flashy, "cool" cars --so do Germans-- and I am sure would not notice the difference.

States need to impose greater licensing fees on fuel-inefficient vehicles and lesser licensing fees on fuel-efficient vehicles.  It can encourage use of fuel-efficiency.


Solution Two:  Taxes

Increase federal gasoline taxes and use the proceeds to fund research in alternative energy.  For the first time recently Americans drove less.  

End the oil price variance. 

  • Below 100 a barrel - increase tax
  • Above 100 a barrel - reduce tax
    • Oil price should be established at some price set by Congress.  As it decreases from that established price, reduce taxes; as it increase, raise taxes.  It is necessary to keep oil at a consistent price.  Edit:  Not "established" by Congress; some price that Congress sets as the middle to raise or reduce taxes as price deviates from that number, say, 100.


Solution Three:  Conservation

We need a conservation ethos in this country.  My family was fairly disciplined, or disciplined me, at an early age never to waste energy.  Never to use energy in a wasteful way.  Not in the room?  Turn off the lights, the fans, etc.  I remember that to this day being told never to waste energy.  

U.S. car makers, though broke, must increase average vehicle fuel-efficiency by 2020 to 40% (35 miles per gallon).  It can reduce 2.3 million barrels per day in the U.S. (in 2020). 

The AIRLINE INDUSTRY and PACKAGE DELIVERY INDUSTRY should be significant leaders in this.  


IT (Information Technology)  v. ET (Energy Technology)

The IT boom required vast investments of capital.

Where would we be today without the success of the IT boom?  Many companies failed, and many are fabulously successful, and those successful companies have improved our lives vastly.

The same could be true for ET.  The truth about ET, however, is there is not a demand for it so long as polluting sources of energy are cheap; this will, however, change.

The country that commands ET is the country that commands its destiny.

The Future is Energy Technology.

 

  Finwe

Novice Member

Joined: 7/15/03
Posts: 3112

All that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

11/18/08 2:58:42 AM#2

It doesn't matter how we would solve it.

You ever thought of how all the alternative energies we have now are for lack of a better word, horseshit?

Hybrids...Lame. Still fossil dependent. Solar power and wind power are inefficient. Nuclear power has gotten a bad rap, could help with limited fuel dependecy, but still has limitations and wouldn't remove our reliance. Hydro-electricity is very limited according to natural phenomena.

Fact is, special interest groups control this whole thing. Think of shadow government type illuminati that love that oil!

A good example is thomas moray. Google/wiki him! Man discovered free energy in the thirties.

"The greatest trick the devil played on humanity in the 20th century was convincing them that he didn't exist." (Paraphrasing) C.S. Lewis

"If a mother can kill her own child, what is left before I kill you and you kill me?" -Mother Teresa when talking about abortion after accepting the Nobel Peace Prize in 1979

  Faxxer

Novice Member

Joined: 11/19/05
Posts: 3266

Star Wars Galaxies, R.I.P. NGE was your final death blow.

11/18/08 10:38:41 AM#3
Originally posted by declaredemer

Drilling - Not Viable

The United States of America is an addict; its consumption of oil is 21 to 22 million barrels per day

We have nothing left to drill.  ANWR could help, but it would produce roughly, maybe, 2 million barrels per day of oil.  No one wants to drill on the West or East Coasts because no oil is there.  The only place left is in the Gulf of Mexico near the Missippi because the river created the underwater structures.  Otherwise, we are basically tapped out.

We import our oil from Canada, more than any other country, in the world.

Canada's reliance on the U.S.A for oil revenue is 99% (works great for Canada to forgo shipping and other costs such as taxes)


Old Habits Die Hard

Solution One:  Transportation

95% of our transportation depends on oil.  If we implemented a four-day workweek, we could effectively reduce our commuting by 20%.  If we expanded telecommuting even further, we could reduce consumption even more.  All non-essential federal employees should telecommute on Fridays or work 10-hour, four-day workweek.  It is a start.  And telecommuting should be encouraged - not feared.

Employers need to encourage car-pooling among employees, and perhaps even reward the driver(s) with some sort of compensation. 

Fuel-efficient automobiles have federal tax credits available.  If you do not know what a tax credit it, well, it is better than a deduction.  It is money you get, not a deduction from income.  Hybrids have a credit of 3,400 dollars and others even more.

Fuel-flexible automobiles that can run on gasoline, ethanol, or methanol should be mandated.  Oh, my God, more regulation!  It would add, perhaps, 100 to 200 for new vehicles.  

Americans love new, flashy, "cool" cars --so do Germans-- and I am sure would not notice the difference.

States need to impose greater licensing fees on fuel-inefficient vehicles and lesser licensing fees on fuel-efficient vehicles.  It can encourage use of fuel-efficiency.


Solution Two:  Taxes

Increase federal gasoline taxes and use the proceeds to fund research in alternative energy.  For the first time recently Americans drove less.  

End the oil price variance. 

  • Below 100 a barrel - increase tax
  • Above 100 a barrel - reduce tax
    • Oil price should be established at some price set by Congress.  As it decreases from that established price, reduce taxes; as it increase, raise taxes.  It is necessary to keep oil at a consistent price.  Edit:  Not "established" by Congress; some price that Congress sets as the middle to raise or reduce taxes as price deviates from that number, say, 100.


Solution Three:  Conservation

We need a conservation ethos in this country.  My family was fairly disciplined, or disciplined me, at an early age never to waste energy.  Never to use energy in a wasteful way.  Not in the room?  Turn off the lights, the fans, etc.  I remember that to this day being told never to waste energy.  

U.S. car makers, though broke, must increase average vehicle fuel-efficiency by 2020 to 40% (35 miles per gallon).  It can reduce 2.3 million barrels per day in the U.S. (in 2020). 

The AIRLINE INDUSTRY and PACKAGE DELIVERY INDUSTRY should be significant leaders in this.  


IT (Information Technology)  v. ET (Energy Technology)

The IT boom required vast investments of capital.

Where would we be today without the success of the IT boom?  Many companies failed, and many are fabulously successful, and those successful companies have improved our lives vastly.

The same could be true for ET.  The truth about ET, however, is there is not a demand for it so long as polluting sources of energy are cheap; this will, however, change.

The country that commands ET is the country that commands its destiny.

The Future is Energy Technology.

 


 

you said "we have nothing left to drill"   Care to ammend that statement?

  Venger

Elite Member

Joined: 8/03/04
Posts: 1142

Help Fight Global Warming
Shut Your Mouth :D

11/18/08 11:25:26 AM#4

www.pickensplan.com/

Is a start. 

We need more nuclear plants.  Affordable alternative fuel cars and/or electric cars.  I could easily use a electric car as my daily commuter about 60 miles round trip.  The big users industry, commercial, etc. need to use and/or be retro fited with energy efficient lighting and use day lighting features in new designs.  Higher tax breaks for purchasing and installing alternative energy equipment and energy efficient heating, cooling, etc for private citizens and business.

There is no single answer.  We just need to start taking baby steps to being energy independent.

  User Deleted
11/18/08 12:09:30 PM#5
Originally posted by Venger

www.pickensplan.com/

Is a start. 

We need more nuclear plants.  Affordable alternative fuel cars and/or electric cars.  I could easily use a electric car as my daily commuter about 60 miles round trip.  The big users industry, commercial, etc. need to use and/or be retro fited with energy efficient lighting and use day lighting features in new designs.  Higher tax breaks for purchasing and installing alternative energy equipment and energy efficient heating, cooling, etc for private citizens and business.

There is no single answer.  We just need to start taking baby steps to being energy independent.

 

If the united states just doubles it's nuclear energy production we could easily run through all known deposits and stockpiles of 'reaction mass' before my life time is up.   Then we'll be worse off than we were before.

I would hedge some of my bets on tidal energy.  You already have extensive research by oil companies for which materials do and don't work for 30+ years in ocean waters and what they can take.   There's a dozen ways to catch that energy.  Water itself also offers more energy per-foot-area-motion(lame) than wind does.

 

edit:   'environmental' Hydrogen and Electric cars are a myth.  

  qazyman

Gurista

Joined: 10/04/06
Posts: 1783

A Good Sandbox isn't about your characters abilities; It's about the players ability.

11/18/08 12:28:45 PM#6

I think the answer lies in two areas.

First, carbon composite car frames. These frames are stronger that steel at a fraction of the weight. Today, these cars can easily get between 70 and 100 mpg. The only problem ATM is cost.

Second, redesigned gas combustion engines. Currently engines only use about 10% of the gas as it ignites the pistons. Car companies are working hard to improve this but so far all gains have gone to increase engine horsepower not fuel efficiency.

Finally, drill baby drill won't work. There is no way we compete with Europe and the Middle East in oil production, and it takes us much more money to produce and refine it than it does them. We've tried this before, on several occasions, with disastrous results. This is the reason we have limited refinery and production capacity. In the end, we only end up paying more. Today. this is just a divisive political issue both side's like to play.

  tvalentine

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/01/06
Posts: 4231

“The things you own end up owning you.” -Tyler Durden

11/18/08 1:15:53 PM#7

why not use ethanol, take after brazil and start growing our own oil. And no corn is not the only source of ethanol and it is not the most efficient source of ethanol either.

Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
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  daeandor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/02/04
Posts: 2984

11/18/08 1:21:12 PM#8

I'm curious to know how much energy Americans burn every day just powering their miscellaneous devices that draw power when not turned on.  Example:  TV's, cable boxes, electric clocks, wireless phones, computers, stereos, microwaves, ovens, coffee makers, battery chargers, etc.

 

I'm wondering how much we could save if, say, we removed all the clocks from every damned appliance in existance.  If we removed the little red lights from every battery charger.  Removed the little red lights off power strips.... you get the idea.

  GrooMan

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/06
Posts: 22

11/18/08 1:33:20 PM#9

The funny thing is that Canada produces 1/3 of the worlds uranium. 

  GrooMan

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/06
Posts: 22

11/18/08 1:43:20 PM#10
Originally posted by daeandor

I'm curious to know how much energy Americans burn every day just powering their miscellaneous devices that draw power when not turned on.  Example:  TV's, cable boxes, electric clocks, wireless phones, computers, stereos, microwaves, ovens, coffee makers, battery chargers, etc.

 

I'm wondering how much we could save if, say, we removed all the clocks from every damned appliance in existance.  If we removed the little red lights from every battery charger.  Removed the little red lights off power strips.... you get the idea.

don't forget all of the annoying excess beeping of our appliances as well.

  Illius

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 3843

I intend to live forever -- So far so good!

11/18/08 2:22:59 PM#11
Originally posted by GrooMan
Originally posted by daeandor

I'm curious to know how much energy Americans burn every day just powering their miscellaneous devices that draw power when not turned on.  Example:  TV's, cable boxes, electric clocks, wireless phones, computers, stereos, microwaves, ovens, coffee makers, battery chargers, etc.

 

I'm wondering how much we could save if, say, we removed all the clocks from every damned appliance in existance.  If we removed the little red lights from every battery charger.  Removed the little red lights off power strips.... you get the idea.

don't forget all of the annoying excess beeping of our appliances as well.

Now that you mention it.. I'm interested in knowing these figures as well.  I'm inclined to in the future buy appliances and other stuff without clocks or blinking red lights just to see if I could see a visible reduction in energy consumption.

No required quests! And if I decide I want to be an assassin-cartographer-dancer-pastry chef who lives only to stalk and kill interior decorators, then that's who I want to be, even if it takes me four years to max all the skills and everyone else thinks I'm freaking nuts. -Madimorga-

  Cleffy

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/09/04
Posts: 4779

11/18/08 2:30:51 PM#12

I think we do need something to tide development while we develop a resolution since a resolution will take decades.

Thats investments in Hybrid, Fuel Effecient, Fuel Cell, and Electric Vehicles as they are right now working methods of transportation.

I think Conservation is the best approach.  I don't think we should be investing $15 Billion a year in the study of alternative energies.  Instead we should be investing in infrastructure.  That being a better mass transit system.  Infact I think the budgets on Mass Transit and Highway should be reversed.  I think a stronger mass transit system will end up better overall as commuting times would be reduced.  (Subways don't deal with traffic jams.)

Out of means for collecting electricity, I think Tide is the most viable method.

  User Deleted
11/18/08 6:23:18 PM#13

The Amish are way ahead of us in energy independance.

 

  Fishermage

Novice Member

Joined: 11/23/05
Posts: 7695

"I find your lack of faith disturbing."

11/18/08 6:54:40 PM#14

It's not an addiction by any definition.

The answer, as always, is freedom. Allow the market to do its thing -- as the commodity gets more scarce, the prices rises, leading to private investment into alternatives.

Government can only harm the market signals, and it has. Once again, the problem is government, the solution, is freedom.

 

  hadub1

Novice Member

Joined: 7/25/08
Posts: 127

11/18/08 7:57:21 PM#15
Originally posted by GrooMan

The funny thing is that Canada produces 1/3 of the worlds uranium. 

 

And 50% of the worlds dumb blondes.

 

  hadub1

Novice Member

Joined: 7/25/08
Posts: 127

11/18/08 7:58:21 PM#16
Originally posted by olddaddy

The Amish are way ahead of us in energy independance.

 

 

We'll all be living like Omish once the Carbon Dioxide tax is in place...

 

  User Deleted
11/18/08 8:00:26 PM#17
Originally posted by hadub1
Originally posted by olddaddy

The Amish are way ahead of us in energy independance.

 

 

We'll all be living like Omish once the Carbon Dioxide tax is in place...

 

 

Maybe Henry Ford should have just made those faster horses...   :quote bastardization FTW:

  SioBabble

Novice Member

Joined: 6/10/07
Posts: 2823

11/18/08 8:02:25 PM#18
Originally posted by Fishermage

It's not an addiction by any definition.

The answer, as always, is freedom. Allow the market to do its thing -- as the commodity gets more scarce, the prices rises, leading to private investment into alternatives.

Government can only harm the market signals, and it has. Once again, the problem is government, the solution, is freedom.

 


 

Sorry, but the market will NEVER be allowed to "do it's thing" as long as there are huge corporations manipulating it for their private profit.

Adam Smith figured this out over 225 years ago.

We'd be so much better off, energy independence wise, if Jimmy Carter's initatives of the late 70's were not all deliberately sabotaged by Ronald Reagan's puppetmasters.

CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.

Once a denizen of Ahazi

  Fishermage

Novice Member

Joined: 11/23/05
Posts: 7695

"I find your lack of faith disturbing."

11/18/08 9:24:21 PM#19
Originally posted by SioBabble
Originally posted by Fishermage

It's not an addiction by any definition.

The answer, as always, is freedom. Allow the market to do its thing -- as the commodity gets more scarce, the prices rises, leading to private investment into alternatives.

Government can only harm the market signals, and it has. Once again, the problem is government, the solution, is freedom.

 


 

Sorry, but the market will NEVER be allowed to "do it's thing" as long as there are huge corporations manipulating it for their private profit.

Adam Smith figured this out over 225 years ago.

We'd be so much better off, energy independence wise, if Jimmy Carter's initatives of the late 70's were not all deliberately sabotaged by Ronald Reagan's puppetmasters.

Ah, the vast right wing conspiracy theory....

Actually they were shapeshifting reptilians from the fourth dimension, and they are VERY liberal. But then, you only read HALF of the memo, so it's undertstandable that you would misinterpret the data.

  frodus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/15/06
Posts: 2391

Justification is an event. Sanctification is a process.

11/18/08 9:44:28 PM#20

Natural gas is the only feasible way to get off the oil.

Its already piped to the threw out the nation,cheap,burns clean,and we have tons of it.Wouldn't take much to covert cars and trucks to it.

Bio fuels is a waste of time.food related gas is to costly to make, ethanol is already higher than gas right now in our state.

 

Trade in material assumptions for spiritual facts and make permanent progress.

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