A friendly reminder about Darkfall's Beta NDA: If you are in the beta, telling other people you are in the beta is an NDA violation. If you say you're in beta, expect to get warned and expect your post to get deleted.

In addition, exposing information available only to beta testers (the "My-Friend-Is-In-Beta-So-I'm-Not-Breaking-The-NDA" defense) is also going to get you a warning, because you are not allowed to disclose things that are covered by the NDA, even if you are not the one in the beta.

Edit: Removed the lion consumption threat. I'm working to try and get a hold of Darkfall's NDA to help calm the concerns of some of the people here.

Originally posted by VPellen

A friendly reminder about Darkfall's Beta NDA: If you are in the beta, telling other people you are in the beta is an NDA violation. If you say you're in beta, expect to get warned and expect your post to get deleted.

In addition, exposing information available only to beta testers (the "My-Friend-Is-In-Beta-So-I'm-Not-Breaking-The-NDA" defense) is also going to get you a warning, because you are not allowed to disclose things that are covered by the NDA, even if you are not the one in the beta.

There, now wasn't that little bit of reading worth it to avoid getting dropped into a pit of lions?

Thanks for clearing that up. At least we now know that you cant say you are in the Darkfall beta. Even so, Id have expected a leak somewhere on the internet.

However at least now we dont have to see these cheesy "Im in the beta" threads.

Should have added, I've seen a brave few posters say they had been in various betas but left the beta period prematurely then posting  there thoughts on it because they believe they are not bound by the NDA just because they turned there back on it and  uninstalled the client.

This is wrong, no matter if you currently play  or have left in an attack of nerd rage or just didn't like what you see you are still bound by the NDA for as long as the close beta runs.

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

I know NDA's are draconian by their very nature - but to be reprimanded for even stating that you're in a Beta without actually disclosing any details about the game ... sounds a bit of an overreaction if I'm brutally honest.

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

I know NDA's are draconian by their very nature - but to be reprimanded for even stating that you're in a Beta without actually disclosing any details about the game ... sounds a bit of an overreaction if I'm brutally honest.

This has been standard practice for all MMO betas that I can think of.

Originally posted by VPellen

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

Ok. Thanks for the clarification.

But if I am not in the Darkfall Beta can I then lie and say I am in the Darkfall Beta, as I would not break any NDA and just lie which some might see immoral?

Come on let us all say I am in the Darkfall Beta

*makes best Spartacus imitation*

Originally posted by VPellen

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

Errr how would you know that Darkfall is in the "Don't" category , I'm guessing there is only one way you would know that and I cant see it being   I - have - a - friend - that - told - me - so

RAWR!

Originally posted by VPellen

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

Wow! I'm guessing that you know that because an Aventurine developer contacted MMORPG.com with details about the NDA.

um ... what kind of lions are we talking about here?

Originally posted by VPellen

A friendly reminder about Darkfall's Beta NDA: If you are in the beta, telling other people you are in the beta is an NDA violation. If you say you're in beta, expect to get warned and expect your post to get deleted.

In addition, exposing information available only to beta testers (the "My-Friend-Is-In-Beta-So-I'm-Not-Breaking-The-NDA" defense) is also going to get you a warning, because you are not allowed to disclose things that are covered by the NDA, even if you are not the one in the beta.

There, now wasn't that little bit of reading worth it to avoid getting dropped into a pit of lions?

So with that being said, can you delete the threads that are created to demand evidence and proof of beta testing and reprimand those trying to encourage to break that violation? I am not going to mention any names in particular, but I do see qutie a few in the Darkfall threads frequently always spamming about how "there is no beta at all", "it is all a fake",  and "if there is give us evidence and proof" etc. Will the following posts be deleted as well?

Well either way, thank you for the information VPellen. I just hope what you said here will shut some people up and hopefully they will think twice before whining about proof or evidence of Darkfall's beta. It really gets annoying to hear them complain over and over again. 

Originally posted by 0muffins0

Originally posted by VPellen

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

 

Wow! I'm guessing that you know that because an Aventurine developer contacted MMORPG.com with details about the NDA. 

 

um ... what kind of lions are we talking about here?

But then that would be revealing a small portion of the NDA.

Also I'd say the type of lion is the bite your head of kind rather than the stuffed beanie kind.

lol with the dark cloud of false dates looming over darkfall you would think they would be happy to let their testers say there are in a beta, so infact people believe darkfall is something more then a wetdream to most (yes i seen the vids, doesnt mean the release dates mean anything).

Saying your not allowed to talk about being in beta still could mean they have zero closed beta testers, with a simple way to hide it.

to me it just seems a little strange.

oh on a side note if there is a NDA can you post it

Originally posted by VPellen

Originally posted by Zayne3145

You can't even say you're in the Beta? That seems strange since people were allowed to state their inclusion in Beta for other games, unless I missed something?

NDAs vary from game to game. Some allow you say you're in beta, some don't. Darkfall is in the "don't" catagory.

Have you seen this NDA to know what it says? Because, you know, if you haven't personally seen it and your wrong ( or worse, there isn't even a beta to have an NDA for ), you're going to look pretty.........silly.

Wow... You would think with thier "word of mouth only" marketing style, they would want people to atleast know the beta exists. This is an odd NDA move if you ask me.

i think this "nda rule" is a way for them to hide that there is no beta test going on.

i hope iam wrong. and maybe sooner or later i will know for sure.  But playing "First rule of fight club" doesn't really give any hope that Darkfall is any closer to release then it was a year ago.

For those of you asking how I know what the NDA says and hoping that I'm a trustworthy confirmation of the beta's existance, you're out of luck.

I contacted Darkfall's Community Manager and asked him. He told me in no uncertain words that disclosing that you are in the beta is a violation of the NDA.

Originally posted by VPellen

For those of you asking how I know what the NDA says and hoping that I'm a trustworthy confirmation of the beta's existance, you're out of luck.

I contacted Darkfall's Community Manager and asked him. He told me in no uncertain words that disclosing that you are in the beta is a violation of the NDA.

Umm, yeah. I don't think their CM telling you is quite the same as showing you the actual written document. Verbal agreements are not really enforceable, so if you're going to be banning/warning people for NDA breach, you really should have something tangible to show that breach occured in the first place. In any form of business and community management, I don't quite think "He told me so" cuts it.

I.E. If I were to say I was in beta and you banned me, and I decide to go to Richard and ask to be shown the part of the NDA I breached in order for my ban to be justified, how's he going to do that with an "He said so"?

I'm sorry, but the drama that this game has caused and continues to cause is just mind boggling and silly.  I can only conclude that the DF devs love to keep the whole "vaporware" argument going.  It's their entire marketing strategy.  Is it any wonder there are so many doubters? 

Zorvan: I think I get what you're saying, but there's some confusion.

Is your primary concern that the word of Darkfall's CM is somehow not trustworthy? Or is it rather the concern that when dealing with moderation, one should have more solid ground to stand on than the word of an official?

For whatever it's worth, here's the message Darkfall's CM sent me in its entirety:
 

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Absolutely nothing may be discussed, up to and including participation in the beta. So really people can't even tell you if they are playing.

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Incidentally, if you were to up and say "I'm in the beta", you'd probably receive a warning even if you weren't actually in the beta. This is more a practical reason than anything else, because really, there's no simple or efficient means through which we can confirm a user's participation in the beta.

Now would be a great time for me to state that I'm not an official word on this: I'm just a moderator. I didn't write the rules, I've simply been told how to interpret them and how to uphold them.

This actually reminds me of an issue we had when AOC or WAR's NDA was in effect; There was some ambiguity on if you were allowed to state you were in the beta or not.