So are you saying that MMOs suck now because they aren't sandbox RPG like SWG and UO once was? Shit we all know that, developers found a bigger market, so they will never go the route of 'create your own content thru roplay" like the old days. They are in a way, massively single player games online, but they are still much bigger than any single player game will ever be. The definition of MMO has been defined by Wow.

Originally posted by efefia

Originally posted by demalus

 

Stop taking this so personally, lol.  You probably really only like this game because of former associations (it's Star Wars and it's made by BioWare).  Do you think that a requirement to have an MMO is to call it an "MMO" and to have a bunch of money?

 

Not taking it personal at all, just find it funny that when I see an MMO announcement, I take it to mean that it's an MMO being announced, not exactly rocket science is it.

Actually I thought kotor was a piece of shit, Mass Effect was average at best, so no, I'm not a huge BioWare fan, I pretty much hate LucasFarts and so far SWTOR looks pretty uninspiring to me, so you couldn't be more wrong. Here's what I do know though, when they jointly announce an MMO, produced by the same people that worked on UO and SWG, I'm pretty sure they're going to deliver an MMO.

Come back to me when Ferrari announce their new supercar, and release a moped.

 

 

Why do you even post if you have nothing constructive to say? You probably never even played KOTOR or Mass Effect, you're just one of those people that sees a game by a company they don't like and completely hates it, without even playing it. Both of those games were HUGE breakthroughs for the RPG genre, HUGE. They took precedence over franchises like Final Fantasy, because they were so innovative and pulled the player into the story as if they were living out their favorite character in their favorite film. The awards don't lie, Bioware has time and again won awards for breakthrough RPG, RPG of the year, etc. They have proven themselves worthy (over probably every other game company that has or is making an MMORPG), to make an MMORPG. And with that they bring the Bioware touch, compelling stories, a game that truly puts you right in the middle of the action. Innovation, it's just what the MMORPG genre needs right now, and there's no other company better than Bioware to bring it to the table.

I find it very hard to believe you even played those games, you're just a hater, a troll, with nothing better to do than try to be a 'badass' on the internet. Spare us dude, no one wants to hear it.

Originally posted by xaldraxius

 

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Originally posted by demalus
 Thanks for starting to have a reasonable discussion xaldraxius :)
I've always felt the opposite.  Do you think that if they make everyone "heroic" that it will cheapen the experience?  What is heroism without non-heroism?  I always felt that WoW, which has an awesome story, told it poorly.  Everyone becoming the champion that killed all the evil bosses makes it so that no one really did anything in my opinion.  I always envisioned the first MMO to have a good story to be more of a "Quest for everyone" kind of deal.  Suppose there was some hard-to-solve mystery that everyone could help solve.  The collective wisdom might prevail, or some single person might save the day with the answer.  Sure this system has a lot of problems, but it seems as though it brings the community together under the umbrella of the story.  I agree with having an individual story for everyone's own character, but this game seems as though everyone will play there own story (which is extremely similar for similarly-classed players) and there will never be any actual content or activities for people to do together (besides chatting).
 
The thing that was so magical about early MMOs was the community.  MMOs are nothing without community.  I am concerned that this game won't promote community (ex: SWG, UO, Everquest, DAoC, etc.).  It seems that WoW turned the genre into Diablo where players don't really depend upon each other.  For example, if you started up a private server and were the only one playing, you could successfully play most of WoW.  You couldn't do that with many of the pre-WoW games.

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If, and this is a big if, they can keep the content fresh, and the storyline evolving, with no true 'good has won the day' kind of ending, then I can see the game going beyond the linear 'themepark' kind of game that WoW has corrupted the world of MMO's into. What I liked best about Asheron's Call, which was my favorite MMO of all, was that every month the story evolved. New things were added, and the story, which did it's best to involve everyone of every level, continued to grow. The devs have to understand that to be a good MMO the game will never be 'finished'. If one story ends, a new one will have to begin. Like looking at the Star Wars novels and graphic, the story doesn't end where the movies do, it continues on. New heroes are introduced, new villains, new intrigues, and even though it still maintains the same general theme, it evolves. That's what I want, and I think Bioware can do it. That's why I am glad this is an MMO and not a single player game.

I know my opinion of a good MMO and other peoples may be radically different, so I am not really arguing for anything here, just saying how I would like the game to be.

You see, I agree completely with that.  The problem is this though:  What is this game about?  Is it about playing with other players, or is it about playing your story?  I'm a BioWare fan, a Star Wars fan, and an MMO fan...but I just don't think they understand what an MMO really means.  It isn't just allowing a bunch of players to play the same game at the same time.  It is all about playing WITH all of these people.  The players should really be the heart of the game.  I don't think story is a bad thing, but it seems like that is all that there is going to be, which wouldn't be bad if it were really a single player game.  Like I've said, I don't want to play through the story in a month and watch everyone become disappointed that there isn't anything else to do.  An MMO should be continuous, there should be no such thing as an "endgame".  That is a perversion upon this genre.

Originally posted by Sliverspark

Originally posted by efefia

Originally posted by demalus

 

Stop taking this so personally, lol.  You probably really only like this game because of former associations (it's Star Wars and it's made by BioWare).  Do you think that a requirement to have an MMO is to call it an "MMO" and to have a bunch of money?

 

Not taking it personal at all, just find it funny that when I see an MMO announcement, I take it to mean that it's an MMO being announced, not exactly rocket science is it.

Actually I thought kotor was a piece of shit, Mass Effect was average at best, so no, I'm not a huge BioWare fan, I pretty much hate LucasFarts and so far SWTOR looks pretty uninspiring to me, so you couldn't be more wrong. Here's what I do know though, when they jointly announce an MMO, produced by the same people that worked on UO and SWG, I'm pretty sure they're going to deliver an MMO.

Come back to me when Ferrari announce their new supercar, and release a moped.

 

 

 

Why do you even post if you have nothing constructive to say? You probably never even played KOTOR or Mass Effect, you're just one of those people that sees a game by a company they don't like and completely hates it, without even playing it. Both of those games were HUGE breakthroughs for the RPG genre, HUGE. They took precedence over franchises like Final Fantasy, because they were so innovative and pulled the player into the story as if they were living out their favorite character in their favorite film. The awards don't lie, Bioware has time and again won awards for breakthrough RPG, RPG of the year, etc. They have proven themselves worthy (over probably every other game company that has or is making an MMORPG), to make an MMORPG. And with that they bring the Bioware touch, compelling stories, a game that truly puts you right in the middle of the action. Innovation, it's just what the MMORPG genre needs right now, and there's no other company better than Bioware to bring it to the table.

I find it very hard to believe you even played those games, you're just a hater, a troll, with nothing better to do than try to be a 'badass' on the internet. Spare us dude, no one wants to hear it.

You haven't read what I have said.  For the record, Kotor is my favorite game :p

I love the story.  I don't play single player games except ones with really great stories.  I like multiplayer games and MMOs.  This is not going to be a real MMO though, and I think it is a shame given such an awesome franchise.

Edit:  Haha, I'm dumb.  Thought you meant me!  I love KOTOR though :D

Originally posted by tillamook

So are you saying that MMOs suck now because they aren't sandbox RPG like SWG and UO once was? Shit we all know that, developers found a bigger market, so they will never go the route of 'create your own content thru roplay" like the old days. They are in a way, massively single player games online, but they are still much bigger than any single player game will ever be. The definition of MMO has been defined by Wow.

No no no!  Not true! :p

How many post-WoW games have seen WoW's success?  You can't judge MMOs by WoW.  Here is the problem:  most MMOs have bad quality (but good philosophy).  Then WoW came along and stuck Diablo 2 in with an EXTREMELY polished and high-quality version of older MMOs and people liked it because they liked Diablo 2 (it's more like Diablo 2 than an MMO).  You see, MMOs are about the PLAYERS, the COMMUNITY.  The early MMOs wouldn't have been successful had there not been 200k players on average.

I'm not saying this game should be SWG or even a sandbox.  I'm saying it should focus on players, community and cool things players can do together.  That is why MMOs are a success.  Most people only play WoW because there are no better alternatives and that is where their friends are (most people that I know - I know it is subjective, but I think many of you have had the same experience).

Originally posted by tillamook

Originally posted by demalus

 OK, you are giving pretty poor reasons.  It is also possible that I have phrased my question incorrectly.

Why should this game be an MMO instead of a single player game?  What does making it an MMO add?

 

Now, obviously MMOs make more money (which has interesting implications, no?), and they obviously wanted to make an MMO.  Those two reasons don't explain why this game is an MMO instead of a single player game.

 

plain and simple, 4 reasons

a) because many people wanted a KOTOR MMO (it's been talked about since 2004)

b) because BioWare wanted to do an MMO

c) because SWG failed to draw in as many people as Lucas Arts thinks Star Wars is capable of drawing in, and they wanted another shot.

4) MMOs have a bigger draw over a longer period of time than single player games.

you sir just won this thread!

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by tillamook

So are you saying that MMOs suck now because they aren't sandbox RPG like SWG and UO once was? Shit we all know that, developers found a bigger market, so they will never go the route of 'create your own content thru roplay" like the old days. They are in a way, massively single player games online, but they are still much bigger than any single player game will ever be. The definition of MMO has been defined by Wow.

 

No no no!  Not true! :p

How many post-WoW games have seen WoW's success?  You can't judge MMOs by WoW.  Here is the problem:  most MMOs have bad quality (but good philosophy).  Then WoW came along and stuck Diablo 2 in with an EXTREMELY polished and high-quality version of older MMOs and people liked it because they liked Diablo 2 (it's more like Diablo 2 than an MMO).  You see, MMOs are about the PLAYERS, the COMMUNITY.  The early MMOs wouldn't have been successful had there not been 200k players on average.

I'm not saying this game should be SWG or even a sandbox.  I'm saying it should focus on players, community and cool things players can do together.  That is why MMOs are a success.  Most people only play WoW because there are no better alternatives and that is where their friends are (most people that I know - I know it is subjective, but I think many of you have had the same experience).

then why did wow become successful? the only thing it does is force raid content down peoples throats. The community? hah! wow's community is easily one of the worst.

 I said why WoW was so successful just a few posts ago.

How many games like WoW have been successful I ask you?  WoW is more like Diablo 2 than it is an MMO.

Originally posted by Sliverspark

 

Why do you even post if you have nothing constructive to say? You probably never even played KOTOR or Mass Effect, you're just one of those people that sees a game by a company they don't like and completely hates it, without even playing it. Both of those games were HUGE breakthroughs for the RPG genre, HUGE. They took precedence over franchises like Final Fantasy, because they were so innovative and pulled the player into the story as if they were living out their favorite character in their favorite film. The awards don't lie, Bioware has time and again won awards for breakthrough RPG, RPG of the year, etc. They have proven themselves worthy (over probably every other game company that has or is making an MMORPG), to make an MMORPG. And with that they bring the Bioware touch, compelling stories, a game that truly puts you right in the middle of the action. Innovation, it's just what the MMORPG genre needs right now, and there's no other company better than Bioware to bring it to the table.

I find it very hard to believe you even played those games, you're just a hater, a troll, with nothing better to do than try to be a 'badass' on the internet. Spare us dude, no one wants to hear it.

I don't need to be a "badass" on the internet, I'm a badass in real life.

Seriously bad badass actually, I can put a bathroom out of commission for 24 hours after I've taken a shit

Come on now, honestly.... look up the word "opinion" you'll be amazed to see that the world is full of people with opinions that differ, it's a fantastic thing. Yes I thought Kotor was terrible, hated the combat, didn't think much of the graphics (although I played it about a year after it was released) but the story was very good. Mass Effect, too much twitch combat for me to even remotely enjoy it, again story and setting were great though. But honestly, if you don't want to see or hear such opinions, and you want to live in a pink, fluffy world where everyone thinks BioWare shit doesn't stink, go here: www.bioware.com  I can recommend the off topic forum, all the cool BioWare kiss arses live in there.

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by efefia

Originally posted by demalus

 

I couldn't agree more.  All I am saying is that they keep saying this is an MMO but it has no MMO elements.  I posed the question to have this discussion be more interactive than to come right out and say, "This isn't an MMO."  Discussion, that's what this forum is all about, no?

 

Anyways, I kept telling many of you that your answers don't answer the quesiton.

Example:

Me: Starcraft 2 is an MMORPG.

You: How is it an MMORPG and not an RTS?

Me: Because Blizzard wanted to make an MMO.

 

That doesn't really answer the question.  I'm hoping to show some of you (who are somehow diehard fans of this game when it isn't even in alpha yet) that they are going down a road of making a single player game (which won't be cureable if they go too far into development).  I eagerly look forward to this game, but I don't want to sit there a month in when we have all finished the story (and maybe multiple ones) and go, "Damn, what is there to do but quit for now :/"

How many MMOs must come out that fail?  Shouldn't we be giving them some positive feedback to let them know that they need to actually make an MMO?  Or are too many of you just wanting this to be a single player game and don't really care whether or not this is actually an MMO (which is fine, but let's not use false terms)?

 

Maybe you could explain to me how SWTOR isn't an fps, or an rts?

The ONLY answer, because it's pretty much the ONLY info we have is that both LA and BioWare have themselves called it an MMO. BioWare spent fuck knows how much money setting up a new MMO studio, filled it with MMO developers to work on this game, if you still think that points at anything other than an MMO, quite frankly you need your head read.

 

Stop taking this so personally, lol.  You probably really only like this game because of former associations (it's Star Wars and it's made by BioWare).  Do you think that a requirement to have an MMO is to call it an "MMO" and to have a bunch of money?

 

Also, do you really think I'm suggesting that this is going to be an actual single player game sold as an MMO?  It will obviously have servers and whatnot, but in theory it won't QUALIFY as an MMO because it will be lacking MMO content.  Imagine if you logged into WoW but could only run around and that was it.  No UI, no chat, no fighting, no menus...nothing but movement.  Would that be an MMORPG?

You seem to think on an extremely literall level...

For someone who has been insulting and  borderline trolling for this whole discussion you sure are quick to point out someone else taking it "too seriously". I seriously hope you get suspended for your repeated attempts at trolling, which was horribly done.

I really hope you grow up, the world doesn't revolve around you, no matter how much you want it to. Almost everyone is excited over it being an MMO, which is one of the best things that could of happend for the SW universe. If you can't handle that, then I suggest going back to your xbox live where you belong.

Originally posted by MrArchy

Originally posted by demalus

 Why are they making this an MMO instead of a single player game (kotor 3)?

 

Probably because LEC wants a SW MMO.  If LEC wanted a single player RPG, they'd make that instead.

Karahandras also has a very good point - MMOs yield monthly subs, single player RPGs usually don't.  Ka-ching!!

Who the hell is LEC?

Some Lex Luthor wannabe?

Originally posted by pandrax

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by efefia

Originally posted by demalus

 

I couldn't agree more.  All I am saying is that they keep saying this is an MMO but it has no MMO elements.  I posed the question to have this discussion be more interactive than to come right out and say, "This isn't an MMO."  Discussion, that's what this forum is all about, no?

 

Anyways, I kept telling many of you that your answers don't answer the quesiton.

Example:

Me: Starcraft 2 is an MMORPG.

You: How is it an MMORPG and not an RTS?

Me: Because Blizzard wanted to make an MMO.

 

That doesn't really answer the question.  I'm hoping to show some of you (who are somehow diehard fans of this game when it isn't even in alpha yet) that they are going down a road of making a single player game (which won't be cureable if they go too far into development).  I eagerly look forward to this game, but I don't want to sit there a month in when we have all finished the story (and maybe multiple ones) and go, "Damn, what is there to do but quit for now :/"

How many MMOs must come out that fail?  Shouldn't we be giving them some positive feedback to let them know that they need to actually make an MMO?  Or are too many of you just wanting this to be a single player game and don't really care whether or not this is actually an MMO (which is fine, but let's not use false terms)?

 

Maybe you could explain to me how SWTOR isn't an fps, or an rts?

The ONLY answer, because it's pretty much the ONLY info we have is that both LA and BioWare have themselves called it an MMO. BioWare spent fuck knows how much money setting up a new MMO studio, filled it with MMO developers to work on this game, if you still think that points at anything other than an MMO, quite frankly you need your head read.

 

Stop taking this so personally, lol.  You probably really only like this game because of former associations (it's Star Wars and it's made by BioWare).  Do you think that a requirement to have an MMO is to call it an "MMO" and to have a bunch of money?

 

Also, do you really think I'm suggesting that this is going to be an actual single player game sold as an MMO?  It will obviously have servers and whatnot, but in theory it won't QUALIFY as an MMO because it will be lacking MMO content.  Imagine if you logged into WoW but could only run around and that was it.  No UI, no chat, no fighting, no menus...nothing but movement.  Would that be an MMORPG?

You seem to think on an extremely literall level...

 

For someone who has been insulting and  borderline trolling for this whole discussion you sure are quick to point out someone else taking it "too seriously". I seriously hope you get suspended for your repeated attempts at trolling, which was horribly done.

 

I really hope you grow up, the world doesn't revolve around you, no matter how much you want it to. Almost everyone is excited over it being an MMO, which is one of the best things that could of happend for the SW universe. If you can't handle that, then I suggest going back to your xbox live where you belong.

You see, this is the kind of stuff I was trying to dispell.  I haven't trolled, I have been having a conversation about the fundamentals of MMOs, which I am a fan of.  Obviously you don't like MMOs.

The world doesn't revolve around me, and I am sick of being disappointed (like everyone else) of all these new crappy MMOs that take the MMO out of MMORPG.  Honestly, I have no idea why people like you are so excited about this game.  You either really don't like MMOs and think this will be a good single player game or you are just assuming it will be good because it is Star Wars or is being made by BioWare.

I want a good Star Wars MMO, what is so hard to understand about that?  You say I'm mad about it being a SW MMO, yet I'm one of the few who seem to want this to actually be an MMO and not just a single player game that will be finished in a month.  I really hope you can understand my viewpoint, because if you truly want a good SW MMO also, then you would also be concerned that this game might not last longer than 2 months.

I haven't insulted anyone, you are just upset that I am being blasphemous against Star Wars and BioWare (which I'm really not).

Originally posted by demalus

 My question makes sense.  The reason I asked it is because hopefully some of you will begin to think about the issues this game has.  Could any of you think of one reason why this game would be better as an MMO than a single player game?

 Your question makes no real sense because your point may be trying to discuss what IS a MMORPG (or what constitute one), but the question of WHY Bioware decided to make SW:TOR a MMORPG isn't a huge complex one if you think about it.

Answers like "because they wanted to" really don't answer the question.  Look, I loved Kotor 1 & 2 and many other BioWare games (NWN, ME, etc.).  I also like Star Wars.  This game will simply have a fantastic story.  As an MMO lover though, I find it rather insulting for these companies to degrade the genre.  What are they going to do next, start charging monthly subscriptions for all online games (oh wait, that's already happening).

Has BioWare no shame or are they just being forced to pump up this cash cow with tons of steroids by the wonderful minds at LucasArts and EA?

Answer like "because they want to" is the perfect answer (which for them it's the one they don't need to explain).  MMORPG doesn't revolve around the idea of JUST pure freedom.  Bioware is making one where your character's story matters (supposedly), so I wouldn't say they are degrading the genre until I see HOW their system works.

 

Seriously, the game might be fun, but what will you do when you finish the story?  How is a 'story' in an MMO any good if it doesn't involve everyone, it allows everyone to be the same hero, and it has no effect on the playerbase as a whole?  MMOs are made up of people, they provide the context.  You should NOT be able to play an MMO if you are the only subscriber, right?

They didn't say that your story won't involve everyone.  They just say that the focus will be on your character as a class.  We need to see how the system works before we can just categorize it as "just another X".

Would none of you be upset if they charged a subscription fee for Fallout 3, Fable 2, The Witcher, or any other single player game (without actually doing anything besides charging you)?

You seem to want to argue on WHAT is a MMO instead of WHY Bioware is making this a MMO.  Get your question straight first.

The game will be what it will be, and it can't be everything to everyone. If you don't like it, then don't play it.

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by tillamook

Some people just like playing a game with other people, trading, chatting, crafting stuff for others, making a name for themselves, running huge epic quests and sharing that experience with others. It's kinda like drinking; sometimes it's just more fun with friends.

 

I couldn't agree more.  All I am saying is that they keep saying this is an MMO but it has no MMO elements.  I posed the question to have this discussion be more interactive than to come right out and say, "This isn't an MMO."  Discussion, that's what this forum is all about, no?

 

Anyways, I kept telling many of you that your answers don't answer the quesiton.

Example:

Me: Starcraft 2 is an MMORPG.

You: How is it an MMORPG and not an RTS?

Me: Because Blizzard wanted to make an MMO.

Pick a relevant example.  StarCraft II was stated by the company AS RTS, hence we categorize it as such.  If today, they made a SoS (System of StarCraft or whatnot), and say it's StarCraft to the next level, then you'll have a relevant example.  And the answer WOULD answer the question of "Why".

That doesn't really answer the question.  I'm hoping to show some of you (who are somehow diehard fans of this game when it isn't even in alpha yet) that they are going down a road of making a single player game (which won't be cureable if they go too far into development).  I eagerly look forward to this game, but I don't want to sit there a month in when we have all finished the story (and maybe multiple ones) and go, "Damn, what is there to do but quit for now :/"

You don't seem to understand that you CAN have a complex story system in MMO that may take the idea of single-player style RPG and expand on it.  From what we can gather at this time, we can't predict how the system will work.  But to state that it's a single-player game just because you see "story-driven" in the description just make your argument a biased one.

There's more than one way to design a game, so sit back, and see the direct FIRST before coming out and categorize the game when you don't even have enough information to do so.

How many MMOs must come out that fail?  Shouldn't we be giving them some positive feedback to let them know that they need to actually make an MMO?  Or are too many of you just wanting this to be a single player game and don't really care whether or not this is actually an MMO (which is fine, but let's not use false terms)?

Again, your agrument is at what constitute as a MMO, so focus on that.

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by xaldraxius

 

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Originally posted by demalus

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Originally posted by xaldraxius

 

 

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Originally posted by demalus
 What I'm trying to get at is that this isn't really an MMO.  It's a single player game that's made to make some more money that borders on the side of consumer manipulation.  If you honestly thought I was really trying to ask that question, get off of your high and mighty horse.  Notice how not one person named ONE single MMO element.

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Hey, you are saying that this is a single player game that they are making an MMO to make more money with. My question is: How do you know this is a single player game? Must be psychic powers as the game hasn't even entered the alpha stage yet. Speculate all you want, but don't present it as fact, and certainly don't get your panties in a bunch when no one else seems to agree with you.

 

Honestly, they have been clamoring on about a wonderful single-player story.  What more proof do you need?  Should I suddenly expect the game to be completely different than what they said it was going to be?  

Correction:

They've been focus on selling the CHARACTER CLASS STORY system, not single-player story.

The ONLY mention of actual MMO content is the discussion on end game, which is frankly delusional.  WoW made this work because WoW is more like Diablo 2 than an MMO.  All games that have come out so far that have used ideas from WoW haven't seen big success.

This is opinion (why WoW is a success), and can be argue till WoW disappear from the MMO scene, but that's something you are not really focus on are you?

Am I wrong to want a real Star Wars MMO to succeed?  I think this makes me more on your side than you know..

 Why do you people even come to forums if you don't want to discuss things?  Would it be better if we all just continually posted our admiration?  On the contrary, I say.

Anyways, the starcraft example was relevant.  This genre is the only genre that is having these big issues, that is why I can't give a real example from another genre.  If this game has story and focuses on a MASSIVE amount of PLAYERS and what they can do TOGETHER, it'll certainly be the first story-driven MMO and will probably be good (given BioWare's track record).

If however, they are simply taking WoW but throwing in the games Kotor 3, 4, 5, 6, ..., then there is no actual MMO element to the game.  I don't understand why people seem to think that an awesome story that you will play BY YOURSELF (and everyone from your class will do the same thing...but not with you) is a good idea for an MMO.  

Well, whatever.  It is clear to me now that no one actually really cares enough about this game to have a discussion on it.  One month after we all finish it, I'll be very disappointed with the rest of you that we will have to wait x amount of months for the game to continue (patch or expansion).

Originally posted by demalus

 Why do you people even come to forums if you don't want to discuss things?  Would it be better if we all just continually posted our admiration?  On the contrary, I say.

 
You say you want a discussion, but the focus of your questions have NOTHING to do with your opening post.

What is there to discuss?

If you want to discuss what constitute as MMO... Sure, I'll bite, but to keep going back to the questions of "Why Bioware is doing such and such..." isn't really relevant in any of your points. You can use it as example, but not purely focus on it.

 

Anyways, the starcraft example was relevant.  This genre is the only genre that is having these big issues, that is why I can't give a real example from another genre.  If this game has story and focuses on a MASSIVE amount of PLAYERS and what they can do TOGETHER, it'll certainly be the first story-driven MMO and will probably be good (given BioWare's track record).

Not relevant in term of different situation (that is, did you read how I use a non-exist StarCraft game to show relevance here?)  If the situation is as I stated, then it's relevant in the sense of the direction of the studios.

Again, they didn't not say that this will be a single-player game, but that there will be an emphasis on your character class story.  That doesn't mean anything at this time, and we have no information to go on except speculations (which may very well turn out to be false speculations).

 

If however, they are simply taking WoW but throwing in the games Kotor 3, 4, 5, 6, ..., then there is no actual MMO element to the game.  I don't understand why people seem to think that an awesome story that you will play BY YOURSELF (and everyone from your class will do the same thing...but not with you) is a good idea for an MMO.  

Where did they say that they are taking WoW and throwing in the SW:TOR?  The only quote I find is that they are going after WoW in terms of subs and sales.  WoW has its MMO elements (however small it is), but that doesn't mean it's not an MMO.

They focus on personal story because that was part of what's lacking in MMO.  WoW has none (and most of their quests sucked and is meanless).  Most of other MMO I play didn't have any personal stories.  Of course we can argue about whether personal stories should be created by developers or players, but that's a different topics.

Again, even though they are using a class system (which I hate and detest for many reasons), I still think there is a chance their class story will be complex enough that it creates different direction for one class, and when you multiply that by how many classes they may have, the result will be interesting.  However, we have NO MORE information as this moment to judge the system, so maybe your speculation is right, maybe my speculation is right, but we have no way of knowing.  So to argue on this is moot.

Well, whatever.  It is clear to me now that no one actually really cares enough about this game to have a discussion on it.  One month after we all finish it, I'll be very disappointed with the rest of you that we will have to wait x amount of months for the game to continue (patch or expansion).

Again, people are willing to discuss when there is a clear topic and more information, but if all you're trying to do is to draw people into endless debate of what is and what isn't, and how the choice of the developers are not answering the "WHY" questions, then what's there to discuss?

Originally posted by demalus

 Why are they making this an MMO instead of a single player game (kotor 3)?

 

I'm curious to see what you all think the BioWare answer to this would be.  I'm not trying to praise or denounce this game; I'm just asking a simple question that I'd like to see this particular community's outlook on.

They've stated that making it an MMORPG means they have more variety, this isn't KotOR 3, it's KotOR 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, etc due to the number of possibilities..  Free content updates, expansions whatever..  it means they can also get more money by using the subs in an MMORPG which as everyone knows is the main goal of companies..