Originally posted by BiggusRiggus

This is sadly ironic and should be evidence to Mythic that RvR rewards will drive RvR! Blizz recently released Patch 3.02 and in said patch there is an achievments tab (their version of the ToK). If you kill the leaders of the major cities you get a special bear mount. There have been constant raids all weekend on all of the major cities... all for a stupid mount! There is more RvR right now in WoW than in WAR! It makes me sad, because as many have written, this game was marketed ias an RvR game. How is it that this lame PvE (wanna be PvP) game I played for the last 2.5 years can pull this off, but the RvR game we all waited for cannot? Hmm Mr. Jacobs??? Hmm???

This is proably true minus the fact that peopel are rvring everynight in WAr and WILL BE FOR A MONTH TO COME. Where as wow pvp raids will drop down to same as "never" or "almost never"  in a months time. Good story tho, playing with a half a deck is good for Euchre, not so much for making points, in fact it makes ya seem a tad desperate.

Originally posted by BiggusRiggus

This is sadly ironic and should be evidence to Mythic that RvR rewards will drive RvR! Blizz recently released Patch 3.02 and in said patch there is an achievments tab (their version of the ToK). If you kill the leaders of the major cities you get a special bear mount. There have been constant raids all weekend on all of the major cities... all for a stupid mount! There is more RvR right now in WoW than in WAR! It makes me sad, because as many have written, this game was marketed ias an RvR game. How is it that this lame PvE (wanna be PvP) game I played for the last 2.5 years can pull this off, but the RvR game we all waited for cannot? Hmm Mr. Jacobs??? Hmm???

what happens when the players get the mount or achievement? will they continue raiding the cities even though there's no reason left to do so or will they go back to hard core raids like always? The new content will of course be tried out by millions around the world but pvp will lead to complaints by players asking for better balance and i honestly think it'll die out and players will start raiding again unless blizzard continues to launch content for both PvE and PvP. I guess time will tell. I give it about 6 months before one game or the other will pull ahead in the pvp department...I'm still going to stick with mythic since they essentially have more to lose then blizzard does.

Originally posted by synn

Originally posted by BiggusRiggus

This is sadly ironic and should be evidence to Mythic that RvR rewards will drive RvR! Blizz recently released Patch 3.02 and in said patch there is an achievments tab (their version of the ToK). If you kill the leaders of the major cities you get a special bear mount. There have been constant raids all weekend on all of the major cities... all for a stupid mount! There is more RvR right now in WoW than in WAR! It makes me sad, because as many have written, this game was marketed ias an RvR game. How is it that this lame PvE (wanna be PvP) game I played for the last 2.5 years can pull this off, but the RvR game we all waited for cannot? Hmm Mr. Jacobs??? Hmm???

 

what happens when the players get the mount or achievement? will they continue raiding the cities even though there's no reason left to do so or will they go back to hard core raids like always? The new content will of course be tried out by millions around the world but pvp will lead to complaints by players asking for better balance and i honestly think it'll die out and players will start raiding again unless blizzard continues to launch content for both PvE and PvP. I guess time will tell. I give it about 6 months before one game or the other will pull ahead in the pvp department...I'm still going to stick with mythic since they essentially have more to lose then blizzard does.

If you would have played the game you would know that since Feb 2007, it has a 6 months cycle of renewing all content, professions , rewards and it's a huge success. From PVE to PVP rewards. From extra raid drops, to new extremely profitable crafted goods, from new BG gear to Arena gear.

As an example the 2.3 patch launched at the end of Oct 2007 made for a record high play during the 3 months following the update patch. It makes for very high play value even without an expansion pack. Last winter showed this.

This 6 months gear and objects cycle will continue in WotLK . It's one of the reasons the present day players don't complain anymore of "gear" reset because now everyone can choose a new gear with whatever he likes to play - every 6 months.

The only new element in WotLK will be achievements and world PvP gear and objects (titles/mounts/trinkets). So I don't understand your question. Gear and rewards are  constantly upgraded in the choice of styles the player chooses.

What is the reward in War? If you EVER get to a capitol with Order.

So many blind, misguided WoW fans. Seriously can you guys not give it a rest? Not all of us like your little Nickelodoenesque pastime. Thank you please drive through.

When Mythic first announced instanced PvP I KNEW this was going to happen. Of course back then I got flamed and told that I'm just a lame blind WoW fanboy (I don't even play WoW) for pointing out the folly of instanced PvP. Now look at where we are at.

Please, Mythic, atleast make one server without scenarios and bump up the XP earned from taking keeps and battlefield objectives (and not just a weak amount like 2k exp. More like 20k). That way a lot of people who just want to RvR would be happy.

Problem with rvr in WAR is that the scenarios give out way too much experience. Either they need to drastically raise the xp in rvr(50% is not enough) or lower it in scenarios. Same with quest/public quest experience. That shit is way too low compared with scenarios. People will ALWAYS choose the road of least resistance. It's just buggers like me who go the odd way around, but we are in staggering minority.

With that said, rvr in WoW is a bleeding joke. Why? The servers can't handle the stress most of the time, no global effect if you kill the city boss and so on. Just wait till everyone have gotten their mount then what WoW call rvr, will be a ghost town again.

WoW is a pve game with a pvp afterthought, WAR the excact opposite. So again, this is a useless, ignorant troll thread. Go away, troll.

Originally posted by slask777

Problem with rvr in WAR is that the scenarios give out way too much experience. Either they need to drastically raise the xp in rvr(50% is not enough) or lower it in scenarios. Same with quest/public quest experience. That shit is way too low compared with scenarios. People will ALWAYS choose the road of least resistance. It's just buggers like me who go the odd way around, but we are in staggering minority.

With that said, rvr in WoW is a bleeding joke. Why? The servers can't handle the stress most of the time, no global effect if you kill the city boss and so on. Just wait till everyone have gotten their mount then what WoW call rvr, will be a ghost town again.

WoW is a pve game with a pvp afterthought, WAR the excact opposite. So again, this is a useless, ignorant troll thread. Go away, troll.

I see the problem a little differently, I love RvR, but its a guild project. I see stragglers show up for something else to do when my guild does a keep raid, but for the most part its something you have to do as a well coordinated group.

Most people think they should be able to solo through a game, and not have to ever be social, or even remotely pleasant to anyone beyond  auto joining a group.

This whole "Soloable MMO", which is paradoxical, is something WoW did to the genre.

Originally posted by slask777

Problem with rvr in WAR is that the scenarios give out way too much experience. Either they need to drastically raise the xp in rvr(50% is not enough) or lower it in scenarios. Same with quest/public quest experience. That shit is way too low compared with scenarios. People will ALWAYS choose the road of least resistance. It's just buggers like me who go the odd way around, but we are in staggering minority.

With that said, rvr in WoW is a bleeding joke. Why? The servers can't handle the stress most of the time, no global effect if you kill the city boss and so on. Just wait till everyone have gotten their mount then what WoW call rvr, will be a ghost town again.

WoW is a pve game with a pvp afterthought, WAR the excact opposite. So again, this is a useless, ignorant troll thread. Go away, troll.

WotLK changed it already in it's pre launch patch.

Not a night goes by without a City raid or 4, 5 on SW on Al'Akir. And SW is but one of the many capitols to raid.

:))

It's because there is nothing to do at this moment in WoW. None needs old gear so people try to find something else. As soon as WotLK will get released they get back to their raids and arenas. I saw this kind of an activity right before BC was released, and it died shortly thereafter...

And on EU Eltharion world pvp is going all day (and perhaps night) long. I went to sleep at 3 AM today and there was a good battle in t2...

Originally posted by elondor

MMO's will always be about the dungeons and loot to me, has been since ultima online.   PVP in MMO's is in my opinion, for people who can't play a true pvp game, an FPS.  i've said it before and i'll say it again, there will never be a good pvp MMO unless every class is the same, because as long as your items, your race, your class, and your level makes a difference, it will always be bullshit of who is what class and who is what level, and who has the most badass gear, skill will never be involved.

you can't balance multiple classes evenly.  it will never happen.  there will be flavor of the month each neft bat comes out, the hoard of players will switch to the one class who has the i-win buttons.

 

so, i play fps games when i want to pvp and test my skill, i play mmo's to kill some frikken dragons.

 

PvE is for people who have no skill. Sorry scripts arnt a challenge.  And im damn good in FPS, always top the charts.  And PvP takes more brains than FPS, in FPS its all about the eye hand coordination and how quick u can react.   They play two different ways.

Originally posted by Z3R01

Originally posted by ghettobooste

They really need to do something to stop everyone from just doing scenarios.  Not just that, people only do 3 scenarios after t1.   WTF ya know?  That's like .01% of the game.  The game is great, but the only good action is usually in these 3 scenarios and it is really killing the game.  I wish they had never even made the scenarios.  This game would be 100x better without them.

 

Yeah cause WAR got the damn WoW trained chimps in its game now and all those dudes did for almost four years was run four battlegrounds.

Of course it doesn't bother them to run 3-4 scenarios until tier 4.

lol -- funny and true.

Originally posted by EvolvedMonky

Originally posted by elondor

MMO's will always be about the dungeons and loot to me, has been since ultima online.   PVP in MMO's is in my opinion, for people who can't play a true pvp game, an FPS.  i've said it before and i'll say it again, there will never be a good pvp MMO unless every class is the same, because as long as your items, your race, your class, and your level makes a difference, it will always be bullshit of who is what class and who is what level, and who has the most badass gear, skill will never be involved.

you can't balance multiple classes evenly.  it will never happen.  there will be flavor of the month each neft bat comes out, the hoard of players will switch to the one class who has the i-win buttons.

 

so, i play fps games when i want to pvp and test my skill, i play mmo's to kill some frikken dragons.

 

 

PvE is for people who have no skill. Sorry scripts arnt a challenge.  And im damn good in FPS, always top the charts.  And PvP takes more brains than FPS, in FPS its all about the eye hand coordination and how quick u can react.   They play two different ways.

your so modest omg , so you think your good so does alot of poeples btw people dont play pve because they think they have skill but mainly because it's fun and they like to achieve that kind of goal within a game , i recommend just a little respect for other people choice and what they like .

Originally posted by bodypass

Originally posted by slask777

Problem with rvr in WAR is that the scenarios give out way too much experience. Either they need to drastically raise the xp in rvr(50% is not enough) or lower it in scenarios. Same with quest/public quest experience. That shit is way too low compared with scenarios. People will ALWAYS choose the road of least resistance. It's just buggers like me who go the odd way around, but we are in staggering minority.

With that said, rvr in WoW is a bleeding joke. Why? The servers can't handle the stress most of the time, no global effect if you kill the city boss and so on. Just wait till everyone have gotten their mount then what WoW call rvr, will be a ghost town again.

WoW is a pve game with a pvp afterthought, WAR the excact opposite. So again, this is a useless, ignorant troll thread. Go away, troll.

WotLK changed it already in it's pre launch patch.

Not a night goes by without a City raid or 4, 5 on SW on Al'Akir. And SW is but one of the many capitols to raid.

:))

 

I think your missing the point, your promoting WoW in the WAR forum. You are giving advertising to a company that couldn't care less if you were dead or alive (So long as you pay their monthly fee).

Originally posted by micona

Originally posted by EvolvedMonky

Originally posted by elondor

MMO's will always be about the dungeons and loot to me, has been since ultima online.   PVP in MMO's is in my opinion, for people who can't play a true pvp game, an FPS.  i've said it before and i'll say it again, there will never be a good pvp MMO unless every class is the same, because as long as your items, your race, your class, and your level makes a difference, it will always be bullshit of who is what class and who is what level, and who has the most badass gear, skill will never be involved.

you can't balance multiple classes evenly.  it will never happen.  there will be flavor of the month each neft bat comes out, the hoard of players will switch to the one class who has the i-win buttons.

 

so, i play fps games when i want to pvp and test my skill, i play mmo's to kill some frikken dragons.

 

 

PvE is for people who have no skill. Sorry scripts arnt a challenge.  And im damn good in FPS, always top the charts.  And PvP takes more brains than FPS, in FPS its all about the eye hand coordination and how quick u can react.   They play two different ways.

 

your so modest omg , so you think your good so does alot of poeples btw people dont play pve because they think they have skill but mainly because it's fun and they like to achieve that kind of goal within a game , i recommend just a little respect for other people choice and what they like .

 

Nay ill pass.
 

Originally posted by Ajacks_US

Originally posted by bodypass

Originally posted by slask777

Problem with rvr in WAR is that the scenarios give out way too much experience. Either they need to drastically raise the xp in rvr(50% is not enough) or lower it in scenarios. Same with quest/public quest experience. That shit is way too low compared with scenarios. People will ALWAYS choose the road of least resistance. It's just buggers like me who go the odd way around, but we are in staggering minority.

With that said, rvr in WoW is a bleeding joke. Why? The servers can't handle the stress most of the time, no global effect if you kill the city boss and so on. Just wait till everyone have gotten their mount then what WoW call rvr, will be a ghost town again.

WoW is a pve game with a pvp afterthought, WAR the excact opposite. So again, this is a useless, ignorant troll thread. Go away, troll.

WotLK changed it already in it's pre launch patch.

Not a night goes by without a City raid or 4, 5 on SW on Al'Akir. And SW is but one of the many capitols to raid.

:))

 

 

I think your missing the point, your promoting WoW in the WAR forum. You are giving advertising to a company that couldn't care less if you were dead or alive (So long as you pay their monthly fee).

I played WoW 1-70 twice, hated it, played end game, hated it, pvp'd, hated it. It was complete garbage, I only played it because of friends and family, who now have either quit or moved on to WAR.

It wasn't complex, it didn't make you think, its the Counterstrike of the MMO genre, but atleast counterstrike players need to be able to aim.

If god wanted us to aim in CS he wouldnt have made aim bots and AWPs.

Originally posted by EvolvedMonky

Originally posted by elondor

MMO's will always be about the dungeons and loot to me, has been since ultima online.   PVP in MMO's is in my opinion, for people who can't play a true pvp game, an FPS.  i've said it before and i'll say it again, there will never be a good pvp MMO unless every class is the same, because as long as your items, your race, your class, and your level makes a difference, it will always be bullshit of who is what class and who is what level, and who has the most badass gear, skill will never be involved.

you can't balance multiple classes evenly.  it will never happen.  there will be flavor of the month each neft bat comes out, the hoard of players will switch to the one class who has the i-win buttons.

 

so, i play fps games when i want to pvp and test my skill, i play mmo's to kill some frikken dragons.

 

 

PvE is for people who have no skill. Sorry scripts arnt a challenge.  And im damn good in FPS, always top the charts.  And PvP takes more brains than FPS, in FPS its all about the eye hand coordination and how quick u can react.   They play two different ways.

I like pvp but its the path of least resistance.  Pvp satisfies those moments when you don't want to think too hard.  Theres a player....I'll use something on him hoping it will do alot of damage....oh it doesn't....I'll try this then....that didn't help much.....wait this will hurt him I know.....k, I'm almost dead now.....I'll keep  hitting him anyway.  No skill there.  Sometimes you're LUCKY and kill your victim.  Unless you're many levels above the player you're attacking thats how most pvp battles occur and if the player is many levels below you where is the challenge in that?

Skill might work if you knew all the attacks / spells your opponent has to use.  Even if you did there are variables that can quickly turn the battle into your favor or your victims favor.  As examples, the morale abilities in war, buffs and potions found in all mmorpgs. 

Skill might also work if you were paired against a similar class (again you'll need to know everything your opponent could use against you) but how often do order and destruction pair up before a battle?  I haven't seen that yet.  Its all run around and hit anything that moves like, imo, every mmorpg pvp game.

The perceived idea of using skill in pvp comes from not knowing what the other player will do and the reaction you use to counter the player.  Its luck of the draw....no real skill.

   The problem with WOW and the killing of the city leaders is, it is not a siege (RVR). All you need to do is get 3 people in one of the vacant areas of the city and "port" your army in. This has been done so many times in the past from the basement of the cathedral and vacant areas of the dwarven district and other areas. Same with Ogrimmar. Virtually impossible to defend from.

    Nice idea but lacks substance. Kind of cheap really.

    And as mentioned earlier, these tactics in the past would crash the servers, and that is why Blizz went to the instanced BG's and put a penalty on world PVP. So it will be interesting to see if this remains in the game.

WoW players will soon migrate back once the new expansion is released.

for one there isnt alot of max lvl ppl yet... and wow has been out for 5 or 6 years so there are tons of higher lvl ppl to do the raids war has just started wow didnt have anything close to wars rvr when it first released

how big is wintergrasp pvp zone in wow? is it as big as a zone say, marshes of madness in war? if it is then i think blizzard has the better game. they just need another pvp zone or two. i never understood why people say theres no open pvp in wow. i instigated many fights beginning in some outlying countryside and ending up at a capitol city gate. its a fun game. some guy above said how he played wow 1-70 twice and raided and hated it lol, whyd you play so long? anyway blizz can look at all the games and say we will do this better then throw a billion dollars at it.