Originally posted by templarga

So if you take the new aggregate score or average, it would be roughly a 7.2. So let's just say a 72%. That means about 28% of the MMO's are better than WAR. Maybe still a little low but a lot more fair and accurate.

Wow, that means 10% of all games are perfect TENS! Statistics are fun!

I love threads like this.  "I am a gamer that has been gaming x amount of years, played y mmo's and am impartial so my oppinion is correct and the oppinions of the hundreds of people that rated that game are wrong"  Oh sorry, <Insert comment about viral marketers falseley upping the score>.  There are at least a few of these for every game. 

First off rating "fun" in a mmo is about as subective as you can get.  A frightengly large group of men think getting hot wax poured on their testicles is "fun".  My wife thinks watching golf is "fun", I think I would rather go with the hot wax to the testicles.  Either way, you can't rate fun in a mmo.  I would venture a guess that if people enjoy playing a game it will get a high fun score.  if they don't enjoy playing it they will give it a low one. 

Sound.  This is another one of those "Do you seriously care stats?"  Everyone in my guild has their sound at bare min so they can hear vent.  most people are going to rate this high because it's something they don't pay attention to.

Roleplaying. You stated no reasons why the role playing score shouldnt be that high.  You just trashed it.  Makes you sound biased.

Support.  You gave it a 6 but admitted that you never contacted support.  Once again this makes you sound biased.

Originally posted by mate0377

Even 7 for graphic is too much. I would give max 4 for graphic. There are older mmo like war with superior graphic like LOTRO, Vanguard, AOC

So compared to them 4 for war graphic is more than appropriate

lol, vanguard better graphics than war...i dont think so. lotro has horrible character models, the world looks nice though. AOC, what good is graphics if theres no gameplay?

vangurd has the worse graphics ever! not even better than WOWs.

Id have to agree that War desrves a 7 for graphics, while it doesnt look great it doesnt look horrible.

Sound and RP both should be below 4, anyone rating higher is an obvious fanboy

Originally posted by medafor

Originally posted by mate0377

Even 7 for graphic is too much. I would give max 4 for graphic. There are older mmo like war with superior graphic like LOTRO, Vanguard, AOC

So compared to them 4 for war graphic is more than appropriate

 

lol, vanguard better graphics than war...i dont think so. lotro has horrible character models, the world looks nice though. AOC, what good is graphics if theres no gameplay?

 

vangurd has the worse graphics ever! not even better than WOWs.

im not a fan of vangurad toon models. i hate em.

but even i have to admit that you chose an extremly poor blury picture for comparison.

any way here is a picture which i have to admit look pretty cool

Originally posted by Frobner

Originally posted by Pheace

I am going to answer you in detail since you obviously have very little knowledge of Warhammer francies for the past 20 years.  It will also maybe show you that already at this point - Warhammer has brought more into the MMO genre even before release than most ppl realise. 

But first - I desided to take a look at what WOTLK bonus video on BLizzon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jm30uux7B5k

Ok - nice schenery in few places - nothing new tho - same old castles all looking exactly the same in 100 diffrent places.  Thats WOW for you.  New mobs... oh wait... what new mobs ?  It was all the same old models - now in red instead of green - or black instead of red.   Why ?  Yes... because the WOW graphic engine has been pushed to the limit.  Blizzard are trying to hide it with qoutes like "we expect all to look the same based on their acomplishments"..  oh yes...  thats why Some classes are forced to be purple....

The exact same goes for Monsters.  Blizzard graphic engine is so limited that all monsters with same name look exactly the same.  Thats how it is and thats how it will be.  But at the same time...

I'm no WoW fan here (game does little for me), but you are way off here. Having friends who are avid WoW fans, I get to hear about much of what Blizzard's doing with the game and, from what I've heard so far, it sounds like they're doing anything but "more of the same".

First... The WoW engine has not been pushed to its limits. In fact, they're *adding* to it. Dynamic shadows, improved fire, water and ice effects, etc. will be added in WoTLK. I wouldn't call that "pushed to its limits"

Also, they're adding destructable buildings, siege weapons, "phased content" and some other new things that currently do not exist in the game. Is that another example of them hit "hitting the limits of what the engine can do"? I think not.

Second you're stating that somehow the engine's limits prohibit the addition of new mobs.. That has nothing to do with it.

They can add as many new creatures as they want to the game. Until they're actually being streamed into memory and rendered on your screen, they're nothing but data stored on your HD, whether there's 100, or 10,000 different varieties.

The technology, perhaps, limits how many unique creatures + characters + environment elements + effects, etc. can be rendered on screen at one time... though that's attributed more to memory and processing of the PC than the engine itself. And with WoW's graphics being pretty low on the "resource consumption" scale as it is, they have plenty of lee-way.

What they are doing is simply re-using assets as is practical. Why create something entirely new when something you already have fits the bill just fine? All games do this. MMOs, single player games... you name it.

So... Yeah, you're a bit in the weeds on what the tech's limitations are.

That said, the complaints about WAR's "graphics being out-dated". People tend to confuse "graphics tech" with "art style". Like Blizzard sticking to Warcraft's look/feel, Mythic chose an art style that matches that of the Warhammer universe. They chose to use lower-tech graphics because it makes it more feasible for larger-scale sieges and such to take place, where you can have potentially 200 players in the same area at the same time.

Look at the problem with AoC as an example.. Sure the game is bursting with high-tech, DX9 eye candy.. But at what cost? Their sieges are limited to what... 48 vs 48? And from accounts I've heard/read, that's enough to choke many people's systems.

There has to be a trade-off. You can't have bleeding edge graphics *and* massive amounts of players on-screen at the same time, at playable frame rates. There has to be some kind of balance or compromise.

So, what Mythic did was as much keeping with Warhammer's look/feel as it was a technical trade-off that *all* developers have to make in terms of balancing performance with eye-candy.

I agree with OP.

Personaly i cant play a game that i have been playing for the last 4 years(back and forth), Swg,EQ2, Vanguard and AO before that.

Compared to them, the pvp is awesome. Thats about it..

War is not about community,graphics, Rpg.

Its 100% Pvp/Rvr, nothing else.

So you can say that this is a game for the fast clicking kind.

To bad...

It just gives you head aces and stress.

Its not a workout im looking for, its fun fun pvp with guild cities and sieges aslo a VERY importans thing.

Crafting must be more of a challange, not just crafting for your self.

Being able to craft same sword but with diffrent outcomes, like diffrent stats, depending on the succes of the item u crafted.

Anyways, war is linear and booring in the end.. Realy sad.

Wow is also going the same path as war it seems..

All about pvp, forcing the arena. Sad there aswell..

Maby its time to stop play mmos for a couple years and get back to it at a later time when the current crowd has become more of an adult crowd.

Maby then the devs will make realy good mmos.

Originally posted by medafor

lol, vanguard better graphics than war...i dont think so. lotro has horrible character models, the world looks nice though. AOC, what good is graphics if theres no gameplay?

 

vangurd has the worse graphics ever! not even better than WOWs.

Two things...

1.  Suggesting that WAR has better graphics than VG is wrong and idiotic on an epic scale

2.  You need to get a real computer

Those numbers are meaningless. Always have been on mmorpg.com. The hype-machine make multiple accounts and give em max scores all the time. Doesn't reflect the game at all. I too find that score to be way inflated. Game got some serious stuff lacking, and ain't good enough yet. The potential is there though, but it need alot of work. Game hardly a month old now anyway, so still too early to say anything about it.

Originally posted by mate0377

Even 7 for graphic is too much. I would give max 4 for graphic. There are older mmo like war with superior graphic like LOTRO, Vanguard, AOC

So compared to them 4 for war graphic is more than appropriate

Vanguard? Superior graphics? Sorry, that made me laugh. I guess it points out how these things can be very subjective.

I put WAR a notch below AoC, on par with LotRO and light years ahead of Vanguard.

I lowered WAR to "Balanced" to maximize performance in RvR and I still find the graphics to be superb. And this is coming from a self professed "graphics snob". :)

Originally posted by fiontar

Vanguard? Superior graphics? Sorry, that made me laugh. I guess it points out how these things can be very subjective.

I put WAR a notch below AoC, on par with LotRO and light years ahead of Vanguard.

I lowered WAR to "Balanced" to maximize performance in RvR and I still find the graphics to be superb. And this is coming from a self professed "graphics snob". :)

 

AoC has awsome graphics.  Vanguard has awsome graphics.  WAR has cartoon graphics -- that's okay but definitely not my style.

"Now I consider myself a mature gamer who is fair when reviewing a game and I certainly don't bash for no reason. However seeing a user rating of 8.87 for WAR it really makes me mad as its so unrealistic and either we have a bunch of gamers who have only played one MMO aka WOW or they are desperately trying to attract more people by blatantly lying about the quality of the game. RATINGS AS FOLLOWS:

USER RATING MY RATING

GRAPHICS - 8.7 My Rating - 7

Considering the game has graphics that is not up to date, not bad but certainly not 8.7! Initially it was the key let down for me.

FUN - 9.4 My Rating - 7

Ok who am I to say if people think the game is fun or but 9.4 Are you freaking kidding me? Is this seriously the most fun in an MMO that you have ever had? GET OUT MORE!

SOUND - 8.8 My Rating - 4

8.8 for sound? Ok now this rating has donkey crap all over it. The sound in WAR is borderline pathetic compared to most MMO's out there. AoC has movie quality ambience, EVE even Tabula Rasa crap all over WAR. All I seem to hear are dull drums going off and an odd screech. 8.8 rating? I must be playing a different game.

COMMUNITY - 8.6 My Rating - 4

Community may differ on each server but this game has the worst community I have ever come across. Is it the players fault? No. Its the set up of the game. There is no default global chat and unless you are in a guild there is no way of knowing what the hell is going on. Met some nice people but the game does not have an overall community feel.

ROLE PLAYING - 8.5 My Rating - 2

Now this is funny. Role Playing 8.5? Based on a 1000 votes as well. Come one people are you seriously giving this game 8.5 for RP?

PERFORMANCE / LAG - 8.8 My Rating - 7

I give this game 7 which is pretty good for a new release but once again 8.8 is so overinflated its funny. What about the lag? The 60 second lock ups? The graphic glitches? The reboots?

VALUE - 9.2 My Rating 7

If WAR was free then I would give it 9.2 but unless you have mummy and dadddy paying for the sub then there is no way in hell this game gets 9.2 Value rating. If this was true I would cancel my 2 EVE subs and my AoC sub because I am yet to see a game get close to 9!

SERVICE - 8.8 My Rating - 6

I have not needed to contact service in-game yet but I give it a 6 purely for the pain of registering and trying to work out how to log in. No instructions and for the first time I even had to call a mate to find out why it wasn't working. He had spent 2 hours working it out as well.

Is this a WAR bash thread? Not really but the concept of WAR having 8.87 rating is laughable and anyone that voted stupidly should be tied at a stake and have tomatoes thrown at them.

For the record I played table top Warhammer for almost 15 years so if there ever was a fan I should have been it. Unfortunately they have gone to the mass market and dumbed down the game...IMO"

So glad you are here to tell me what is up. I mean, I might have spent money on this game, but because you and your review were here to guide me, I might save myself some cash.

I mean, your review is based on total fact...not opinion...is it?

user ratings always tend to be high on this site so they really arnt anything i pay attention to anymore . as for warhammer it still needs a little polishing but essentially its a lot of fun and does have that addictive quality that all the best mmos have . it gets more things right than it gets wrong . its not perfect but its also in no way another vanguard or conan . if you like warcraft but get bored with it , you would feel at home here .

Go wait for Darkfall!

That's how mature this thread is.

Originally posted by chryses

Now I consider myself a mature gamer who is fair when reviewing a game and I certainly don't bash for no reason.  However seeing a user rating of 8.87 for WAR it really makes me mad as its so unrealistic and either we have a bunch of gamers who have only played one MMO aka WOW or they are desperately trying to attract more people by blatantly lying about the quality of the game.  RATINGS AS FOLLOWS:

USER RATING                   MY RATING

GRAPHICS   - 8.7                               My Rating - 7

Considering the game has graphics that is not up to date, not bad but certainly not 8.7!  Initially it was the key let down for me.

FUN  - 9.4                                My Rating - 7

Ok who am I to say if people think the game is fun or but 9.4 Are you freaking kidding me?  Is this seriously the most fun in an MMO that you have ever had?  GET OUT MORE!  

SOUND - 8.8                            My Rating - 4

8.8 for sound?  Ok now this rating has donkey crap all over it.  The sound in WAR is borderline pathetic compared to most MMO's out there.  AoC has movie quality ambience, EVE even Tabula Rasa crap all over WAR.  All I seem to hear are dull drums going off and an odd screech.  8.8 rating? I must be playing a different game.

COMMUNITY - 8.6                    My Rating - 4

Community may differ on each server but this game has the worst community I have ever come across.  Is it the players fault? No. Its the set up of the game.  There is no default global chat and unless you are in a guild there is no way of knowing what the hell is going on.  Met some nice people but the game does not have an overall community feel.

ROLE PLAYING - 8.5                My Rating - 2

Now this is funny.  Role Playing 8.5?  Based on a 1000 votes as well.  Come one people are you seriously giving this game 8.5 for RP? 

PERFORMANCE / LAG - 8.8    My Rating - 7

I give this game 7 which is pretty good for a new release but once again 8.8 is so overinflated its funny.  What about the lag? The 60 second lock ups? The graphic glitches? The reboots? 

VALUE - 9.2                            My Rating 7

If WAR was free then I would give it 9.2 but unless you have mummy and dadddy paying for the sub then there is no way in hell this game gets 9.2 Value rating.  If this was true I would cancel my 2 EVE subs and my AoC sub because I am yet to see a game get close to 9! 

SERVICE - 8.8                         My Rating - 6

I have not needed to contact service in-game yet but I give it a 6 purely for the pain of registering and trying to work out how to log in.  No instructions and for the first time I even had to call a mate to find out why it wasn't working.  He had spent 2 hours working it out as well.

Is this a WAR bash thread?  Not really but the concept of WAR having 8.87 rating is laughable and anyone that voted stupidly should be tied at a stake and have tomatoes thrown at them. 

For the record I played table top Warhammer for almost 15 years so if there ever was a fan I should have been it.  Unfortunately they have gone to the mass market and dumbed down the game...IMO

 

I agree with a lot of the things you said and would prolly rate it the same as you but you have to remember that your taste will differ from another and what seems crap to you may seem the shit for some 1 else, maybe a lot of ppl have merged from F2P games and that is why they give it a high rating or maybe they just like the damn game and give it a good rating to boost there ego's who know's in the End it does not really matter what the ratings here say they really dont mean a thing officially so meh why get so worked up.

Originally posted by Deathstrike2

Originally posted by fiontar

Vanguard? Superior graphics? Sorry, that made me laugh. I guess it points out how these things can be very subjective.

I put WAR a notch below AoC, on par with LotRO and light years ahead of Vanguard.

I lowered WAR to "Balanced" to maximize performance in RvR and I still find the graphics to be superb. And this is coming from a self professed "graphics snob". :)

 

 

AoC has awsome graphics.  Vanguard has awsome graphics.  WAR has cartoon graphics -- that's okay but definitely not my style.

I agree on AoC.

Vanguard is a horrible mish mash of art assets. There are some elements that look worse than the original, pre-engine update EQ, others that are close to AOC and a lot in between. It's a game where you can selectively find some nice screen shots, but the in game experience is very different. Also, like EQ2, you just can't escape the "plastic effect".

WAR is the opposite. Everything is well done and everything matches superbly for improved immersion. You can make some nice screen shots, but it actually looks and feels better during play than a screen shot can express.

One problem with WAR is many people seem to fall in the trap of 90% scenarios and they never really go out and immerse in the world. I came close to that trap myself. Now, I strike a balance and am becoming very impressed with the immersive world.

As to the ratings produced by this site, I agree on most of them. I disagree on sound and community though.

The community lacks the noxious poison seen among too many MMORPG fan bases, but it also has way too many soloists who never speak and seem allergic to any form of interaction with others.

On sound. It's not that there are bad sounds. Nothing that annoys me or has me looking to turn of the sound effects. However, it severely lacks in memorable music and ambient sounds.

Mythic really should have contracted with a top game score composer. There are some great talents in the field. Hopefully they will correct this. They also should consider sprucing up the ambient sounds as well. Very wierd to have such a great game, done so well in most areas, lack in this one area.

I have to say I pretty much agree with the Original Poster.

The Music and the Sound especially.  The sound in this game is pretty bad.

A 7 isn't a bad score, btw.  That's what this game deserves.  It's not a bad game, but if this is what passes as a great game.... I need to find myself some investors.

I hate plastic looking graphics.  Everquest 2, Vanguard... both decent games that I just couldn't stand looking at anymore.  Too much technical, not enough aesthetics.

I have gone back to AoC after I quit WAR this week and the sound is the first thing that really struck me.  The difference a great score being played in the background can make is substantial.  

Its funny how opinions go but a friend of mine in Australia is loving WAR but he is in a very large guild that already has 20-30 on at any time.  The game needs 1000's of people to play and not in Scenarios either.

Improvements WAR can make semi easily

* Global channel for both sides!!!!  Its great to be back in an MMO where I can see chatter scrolling and sense a real community.  If any MMO needs a global channel its WAR.  Imagine people writing "Keep at X spot is under attack!" Maybe it would concentrate players and same goes for PQ's.

* Sound - get a composer in and sort it out...done

* Graphics - not bad, not great but they could do with smoothing it out and putting some decent lighting in.  I personally rate Vanguard above WAR but I played it a year ago so I cant be sure now.  I do like the trees in WAR though.

* Limit Scenarios or make them unavailable when a milestone is reached.  Imagine if points added up and once 5000 is hit they turn off but the overall winner has a monster turn up like a giant or a griffon that attacks the enemy and their keeps.

* Create a crafting bag then trader and start a player driven industry.  Vanguard had an amazing setup but suffered due to population.  Give people the opportunity to support the war and not participate.

* Make combat mean something.  Dont limit RvR to a small box.  Let players overrun areas and cause mayhem.  Like most I stand on the boundary unless you outnumber the enemy by huge amounts.  

If I gave a straight number out of 10 it would be 7. Unfortunately I cant stand the combat as its too basic and mundane so unless they overhaul that its over for me.