Originally posted by Soraellion

I'll tell you a little story about cars;

Back in the day you had several manufacturers making cars, they weren't really professional manufacturers back then so they weren't at all standardised but one way of telling them apart was their colour. Some made blue cars, others made red ones and yet again other cars were green. People had a choice, a choice of the type of car they wanted and what colour they liked.

Then one manufacturer stood up and said; We're going to revolutionise the industry. We're going to mass produce cars while trying to maintain a certain quality, and all cars will be BLACK. And they did great, they made a good quality product and everyone bought one. Partly because of the quality of the product and partly because everyone else had one.

This made the other manufacturers think; all of a sudden there was one of them that did better than the others and they tried to figure out why. And instead of getting to the core reason (the car just WORKED and took no effort to use) they figured that it was because the car was black. Therefore they also started to make black cars and they sold ok since black was the new fad. Cars were black, that's how things were. Slowly but surely all cars became dull utility vehicles which required no effort and were black. People liked the black cars because it was an easy colour, didn't stand out too much and it kinda conformed to the majority.

But not everyone was happy, they liked the fact that cars just worked instead of being held together by spit but they weren't happy with the choice of colours, or rather the lack of choice. Also they wanted a bit more fun from their cars and for them, fun meant needing more effort to drive fast, needing more input. They wanted a RED car, mind you the group that wanted a red car wasn't too big but it was loyal and it was willing to pay a premium price for such a product, if there was a red car that was decent and fun they'd buy it and stick to it.

In comes an old manufacturer who before the big change make a decent car, different from most and it was RED and great fun. Some people liked it because it was different and was a great ride if you knew how to drive it, others didn't like the fact that driving it took a bit more effort and stayed away form it. For them it was far too loud, expensive and needing way too much attention and TLC.

Now this company announced that they'd make a new car. So they went to work and tried to figure out what would sell well. Should it be easy to drive but uninspiring or should it take effort and really cater for the proper drivers. In the mean time the people who remeniscened that old car which was fun to drive and was red got their hopes up. This might be the one chance they had to get some fun back and to get a non-black car. To them red meant fun, since that was how things were in their minds.

And the company started their campaign; "it's going to be a great car, it's going to be DIFFERENT, it's going to be RED!!!!". YES the people thought, it'll be red and I believe in this company, i believe based on their past performance that it will be a fun drive, it'll be cool different and red!

How dissapointed they were once the car got into the showrooms. Yes it was red, and yes from the outside it looked exciting and different. But the drive was dull and uninspiring since the company tried to cater to the vast majority instead of going back to their roots. Some people felt betrayed, others just gave up on cars alltogether and started riding motorbikes.

But they couldn't help themselves writing in car magazines how dissapointed they were with the product and how it failed to live up to their expectations regardless of the fact that it sold well. Some people pointed them to the fact that it was announced to be a high quality car without any hickups or problems and it NEVER said to be an entertaining car to drive. That might have been true but that didn't keep the few from hoping for a miracle.

 

I want a RED car and I want it to be fun, entertaining and taking effort to drive fast. I don't want ABS, TCS, 87 airbags and cruise control. I want it to have a loud engine and needing a steady hand, I want to always have the feeling that some time, at some point the car would probably kill me but at least I'd go out with a big grin on my face.

WAR is a car that has all the characteristics of a black car, while being painted red.

 

 

They SAID it would NOT be DaoC, now stop metaphoring, will ya, jesus?

(BTW RvR is MUCh, and I mean MUCH more fun in WAR, and I am an ex-DaoC player. Or to go with Yahtzee: "There's nothing great or shiny about old games, they're just - old.")

For a MMO launch I think it is very solid.

Some of the ciritism I have to this game are:

1. When I hit some other player I dont feel the impact. The animations are lacking really bad I often I dont know what the hell is happening. I dont see this is an issue since this can easily be fixed over time.

2. Clunkiness. The game right now is too clunky, or at least not smooth enough. But this can also be fixed over time.

3. Gameplay, this is my biggest fear. There is no reaction to the opponent in WAR. Everyone runs around doing their own business. As a WE I just run up to casters doing my combo without paying one single attention what the BW is gonna do because it doesnt matter what he does. He is going to die whatever button he presses. And this is a big turnoff. in WoW mage vs rogue I dont feel confident all the time despite playing rouge.

Frost mage can do good range with blink, frost nova and it is a 50/50 I will win. But here vs a BW it is 90% chance I will win. Where the hell is the reaction to the opponent?

WAR is a disappointment in combat area and what sounded good on paper with minimal CC and specialized classes has been executed really poorly.

@ Meridion:

Doesn't stop me from wanting to have DAoC 2 (or any similar 'old school' MMO) and being annoyed by the fact that (to me) Mythic made the wrong choice. Thisd is a discussion forum, if you don't want people to out their ideas and opinions that don't conform to the majority I suggest you visit the warhammer forums and stay there.

If you stay here you'll have to accept the fact that not everyone will go "yes sir, can I have another one SIR!" when they feel they got a slap in the face because of yet another middle of the road, non-effort requiring MMO.

Originally posted by Thunderous

This is exactly how the AoC forums were at launch.

Someone post a NEGATIVE review of the game and suddenly 100 fanbois come and flame him for hours.

Then, a week or so later, more and more negative reviews come out. 

Wait a second, this isn't just AoC, it's most of the crap games and forums that follow them.  WAR is (OK), it isn't great, it isn't horrible.  It's just there.

There is nothing inspiring about the game.  There is nothing innovative about the game.  Mythic took the WoW formula and just put a different skin to it.  That's all.  WAR is a very basic, easy, and typical MMO.

If you like WoW then WAR isn't going to be that bad to you.  If you like UO or Pre-CU SWG then WAR is going to be horrible to you.

As I said above, WAR offers nothing new to the genre.  It is a retread of all the grind-it-out and basic gameplay that we have grown accustomed to with WoW, AoC, and so many others.  If you're into that you will be glad you bought it.  If you want and expect more from the genre, this game will be a waste of your time.

lol wow thats funny...

pre cu swg jedi here and i loved swg when it was a good game...but you know i also love WAR and so do serveral of my swg guildies...

your generalization on uo or pre cu swg is wrong

Originally posted by Soraellion

@ Meridion:

Doesn't stop me from wanting to have DAoC 2 (or any similar 'old school' MMO) and being annoyed by the fact that (to me) Mythic made the wrong choice. Thisd is a discussion forum, if you don't want people to out their ideas and opinions that don't conform to the majority I suggest you visit the warhammer forums and stay there.

If you stay here you'll have to accept the fact that not everyone will go "yes sir, can I have another one SIR!" when they feel they got a slap in the face because of yet another middle of the road, non-effort requiring MMO.

 

 

So hold on, you knew full well what this MMO would be, you still tried and supported it until you realized "well they were right with what they told us about their game" and then you came here and bashed the game because you were disappointed with what you knew it would or better, would not be???

wow....

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

---

Originally posted by LethalBurst
He obviously doesn't understand that WAR is based on LARGE SCALE RVR. This is not a hardcore PvE game. The graphics are excellent, considering they allow 150+ people to be on the screen fighting at once, without a single hitch.
 

---

There are plenty of issues even with 20 vs 20 battles, like the very clunky combat. People not actually where they're shown on screen etc. And the occasional CTD... So pls refrain from using the term Without a single hitch.

Originally posted by Soraellion

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

Which is the inherent flaw here. To pick up that car sermon. Mythic said they would create an dark-red car. It would not be black, but ALSO, it would not be the 2003 red model.

So basically, you are like the guys who look at the new mercedes E-class and say "aw man, doesn't look and feel at all like the old mercedes C-class" (i honestly saw those guys). And then you start bashing a car for what it is, not because it is objectively flawed, or too expensive, or damaged, or because it was announced differently. No, you bash it because it's not what you want it to be.

That is the incarnation of "childish", you know? It's complaining about the wetness of water... sorry

M

PS: and its not at-all what I sum up under the term "discussion", because you don't have any valid arguments, and no "I don't like it" is NOT an argument

Tbh, the game is new, you can't expect it to be flawless.

Originally posted by Soraellion

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

Then there is totally no conflict.  Some gamers including me like WAR so far, for what it is.  I for one do not daydream and I do not want to pretend to know what things could be should be would be.  If I can have my dreams come true, I should be so rich that I do not have to travel and post here.

Sorry that your dreams do not come true.  Lucky for me I have no dreams, and I pick the games that I find most fun, when I have to log online to kill some time.

Originally posted by Meridion

Originally posted by Soraellion

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

Which is the inherent flaw here. To pick up that car sermon. Mythic said they would create an dark-red car. It would not be black, but ALSO, it would not be the 2003 red model.

So basically, you are like the guys who look at the new mercedes E-class and say "aw man, doesn't look and feel at all like the old mercedes C-class" (i honestly saw those guys). And then you start bashing a car for what it is, not because it is objectively flawed, or too expensive, or damaged, or because it was announced differently. No, you bash it because it's not what you want it to be.

That is the incarnation of "childish", you know? It's complaining about the wetness of water... sorry

M

PS: and its not at-all what I sum up under the term "discussion", because you don't have any valid arguments, and no "I don't like it" is NOT an argument

I'm a consumer, and as a consumer I ask for what I want. If I don't ask and not let the manufacturer know I will never get the product I want. Has nothing to do with being childish at all, it's me wanting a certain product. And your analogies don't make sense.

Why are you so hung up on the fact that the majority needs is all that matters, there's something called niche marketing. Not everything has to be bigger=better. There's a lot of niche products our there that cater for a small amount of customers who are willing to pay premium price to get the product they're looking for.

Cartoony??? Hmmm,I disagree:

Originally posted by Orthedos

Originally posted by Soraellion

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

 

Then there is totally no conflict.  Some gamers including me like WAR so far, for what it is.  I for one do not daydream and I do not want to pretend to know what things could be should be would be.  If I can have my dreams come true, I should be so rich that I do not have to travel and post here.

Sorry that your dreams do not come true.  Lucky for me I have no dreams, and I pick the games that I find most fun, when I have to log online to kill some time.

So do I, and since I don't like what WAR is (has become) I vote with my wallet and play something else. Doesn't mean that my ideas and concerns are any less valid.

Originally posted by Soraellion

Originally posted by Meridion

Originally posted by Soraellion

You seem to be stuck in your reasoning (perhaps because you can't come up with anything decent).

I dislike WAR not for what it is, but for what it could (and in my eyes should) have been.

Which is the inherent flaw here. To pick up that car sermon. Mythic said they would create an dark-red car. It would not be black, but ALSO, it would not be the 2003 red model.

So basically, you are like the guys who look at the new mercedes E-class and say "aw man, doesn't look and feel at all like the old mercedes C-class" (i honestly saw those guys). And then you start bashing a car for what it is, not because it is objectively flawed, or too expensive, or damaged, or because it was announced differently. No, you bash it because it's not what you want it to be.

That is the incarnation of "childish", you know? It's complaining about the wetness of water... sorry

M

PS: and its not at-all what I sum up under the term "discussion", because you don't have any valid arguments, and no "I don't like it" is NOT an argument

 

I'm a consumer, and as a consumer I ask for what I want. If I don't ask and not let the manufacturer know I will never get the product I want. Has nothing to do with being childish at all, it's me wanting a certain product. And your analogies don't make sense.

Why are you so hung up on the fact that the majority needs is all that matters, there's something called niche marketing. Not everything has to be bigger=better. There's a lot of niche products our there that cater for a small amount of customers who are willing to pay premium price to get the product they're looking for.

Because I'm a communist bastard and want every single soul in the world to play "comrade online" . Seriously, I don't think this is getting anywhere, because I understand this as a discussion platform for players and you obviously want to be entitled to express your opinion here, which is - by nature - detached from any form of discussion (because opinions are subjective, emotional and mostly not reasonable).

If I insisted on stating my opinion, man that would be one hell of a rant, because nobody is developing an aircraft action combat MMO with decals and paintshops and own hangars and miniguns and rockets. Would be cool, will not be made, gotta stick to reality... maybe I'm just a buddhist and not a communist. "try not to bend tree, try to bend yourself to the flow of the universe"...

Appreciate that you stayed serious here though, 95 of 100 argument exchanges like this end up in a flamewar.so to you

M

I like discussions, not neccesarily to win them (there doesn't have to be a winner or a loser) but to exchange ideas. While not being happy with what WAR has become that doesn't mean I want to bash it or state "it's all crap". I will however express my opinion and as long as my 'adversary' (if you want to call it that) keeps to reasoning instead of mindless drivel it's all good.

One can agree to disagree without it resulting in a flamewar.

Originally posted by Soraellion

Originally posted by _Shadowmage

You dont want a car - you want a motor bike.

 

No, I want an old school sports car, just as the one the company made before. And when they said to make a new car I hoped for a sports car, sinec that is what they had been making in the past and making so well.

 instead it was a people carrier, dull and uninspiring. Good quality and value for money, but dull nonethless.

You dont want a car, or a bike, you want to get laid, plz go outside....you must have an incredible amount of free time to write that shit about cars which i read the last paragraph of...

Originally posted by WOTDOUPLAY

Originally posted by Soraellion

Originally posted by _Shadowmage

You dont want a car - you want a motor bike.

 

No, I want an old school sports car, just as the one the company made before. And when they said to make a new car I hoped for a sports car, sinec that is what they had been making in the past and making so well.

 instead it was a people carrier, dull and uninspiring. Good quality and value for money, but dull nonethless.

 

You dont want a car, or a bike, you want to get laid, plz go outside....you must have an incredible amount of free time to write that shit about cars which i read the last paragraph of...

I'm sorry you have the attention span of a fruit fly and the mental capacity of a cabbage. Now go play your Marauder or Witch Elf.

Wow you people do a good job of keeping this thread alive don't you.

It just looks so wrong to have such a stupid thread name on the front page. Makes me wonder what kinda mods there are here around not deleting such a troll bait-friendly thread name.

FFS is there no mods around that give a crap about MMORPG.com's forums being filled with this trolling crap? 80% of every forum is filled with useless trolling threads that say nothing but why every game on the market sucks. This place is a boil on the ass of the MMORPG community. Get the trolls under control please.