Originally posted by UncertaintyP

Way to talk about watching flamewars between fanbois while sounding like a fanboi and starting a flamewar.

how does i troll?

I've been in WAR closed beta for a while now, and if you lern2read what I wrote you'll see me stating that other games are great.   I was just putting out my reasoning for WoW not being in danger.

{ Mod Edit }

I wouldn't run off to War in a heartbeat anyway. All your going to hear is the same old whinners complain about end-game content and how crap doesn't work and balancing issues. It's the same ole stuff wherever you go.

Originally posted by deckatre

Originally posted by Krogg

Because people still have fun playing it.

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW.  IMO, and in 11 millions others minds.

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

 

The only thing that will effect WoW's subscriber base is it's subscribers becoming bored with the game and moving on.   Every day there are still new players coming in, and last time I was on, the bg's were full and the landscape was happening.

 

For all you nubs claiming mental superiority over WoW players... are you bloody serious???  LOL

IT'S A GAME, JUST A GAME, AND ONLY A GAME.

If you seriously put yourself higher on the intellectual ladder because you play one game over another...you have issues....

 

 

 

You forgot to add something, maybe the fact that most of WoWs subs are farmers, gold sellers, or bots and its a simple game with alot of popularity.

And also when you say every game has failed that has tried to compete against WoW,... I would like to tell you THAT IS BS. if everygame has failed that tried to compete with WoW we wouldn't have any other mmos, and this website would be called WoW not mmorpg.

heres some games as proof that every game hasn't failed:

1.CoH/CoV

2. LOTRO

3. Tabula Rasa

4. Guild Wars

5. just look at the list of mmos in the released section of the website.

Tabula Rasa was and forever will be, an EPIC FAIL!!!

To tell the truth, The only MMO's I would ever find myself playing other than WoW are Vanguard(even though it had a terrible launch it is starting to regain subs, most likely because of the AoC disaster and there will be a free trial to get more players back soon, because it has improved a lot) and EQ2, which is a great PvE game all around, and I really enjoyed playing it in the past. Also, Darkfall looks amazing, if it is ever even released.

These games are the only games to have PvE content that is difficult enough and fun enough for me to play the game, but one of the big reasons I play WoW is because there is lots of quality PvP and PvE content. However, I really believe I will be leaving WoW for darkfall.

All the fanboys frothing at the the mouth aside, i do hope WAR does well and dont really care if it takes as few subs away from wow. they say necessity is the mother of invention, and if this game gives Blizz that kick on its ass to work much harder to hold on to its player base then its a win win situation for us players.

I hope Warhammer does well so that game-hoppers and power-levelers will leave World of Warcraft to those of us who are interested in roleplay and community.  Else...back they come with whinings of how there's no 'good games' on the market.

Originally posted by AdvancedTech

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW.  IMO, and in 11 millions others minds.

11 million ... try 2.5 million in u.s. 2. million'ish in Europe, and the rest is Asia(and who knows many of those are gold sellers)  War will reach 2.5 million subs, maybe not pass wow, but it will definitely take a hit on some of wow's numbers, there are numbers of posts claiming they've already canceled in anticipation.

Many many people on wow have been waiting for a new game.. the damn games has been out for 4 years.. admitting that people will leave to play another game isn't admitting the game was a failure...get over yourself. 

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

 

The only thing that will effect WoW's subscriber base is it's subscribers becoming bored with the game and moving on.   Every day there are still new players coming in, and last time I was on, the bg's were full and the landscape was happening.

 

For all you nubs claiming mental superiority over WoW players... are you bloody serious???  LOL

IT'S A GAME, JUST A GAME, AND ONLY A GAME.

If you seriously put yourself higher on the intellectual ladder because you play one game over another...you have issues....

 

 

 

  Last report made by blizzard states that they had 10.9 million subs, so yeah you are wrong about that, you just said they have 2.5mil in US and 2mil in Europe, You didnt state how many they have in the Asian market which is like 90% of their income alone. So yes they do have 11 mil subs

actually you need to do your homework. A majority of their income is from NA/EU subscriptions. I'm not sure how Blizzard runs WoW in Korea but It only recieves royalties from China because the game is run by The9.
 

...they have roughly 5.5M+ subscribers in asia. This is just players that play in their region and not counting the players from asia playing NA/EU servers.

World of Warcraft's Subscriber Definition
World of Warcraft subscribers include individuals who have paid a subscription fee or have an active prepaid card to play World of Warcraft, as well as those who have purchased the game and are within their free month of access. Internet Game Room players who have accessed the game over the last thirty days are also counted as subscribers. The above definition excludes all players under free promotional subscriptions, expired or cancelled subscriptions, and expired prepaid cards. Subscribers in licensees' territories are defined along the same rules.

i got nothing against blizzard and think they have a done a good job bringing alot of players into the MMO genre, but subscription numbers can be twisted and usually is twisted to benefit a game so that it attracts more players.

Serisouly OP you need to realise that some ppl like me played WoW ALOOOTT . We just cant handle it anymore weve done anything in the game etc .

WoW was great game for a while but im just done with it no mater what they release ( in fact BC pretty much killed it for me ) it will still be the same CONCEPT wich is gear grind till they release something beter and you have to do it all over again .

Because people still have fun playing it.

Some do indeed have fun playing it but others are bore and just going through the motions

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

For many people it isn't possible or feasible to play 2 games at once. $30 a month might be a lot or they like devoting themselves to one game.  Is it possible? yes but for many just not an option they want to entertain.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Again going back to my previous statement. Can you enjoy 2 games? Yes but when your friends out level you or you miss an event because you were playing another game enjoyment goes down.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Lots of games that "failed" still have funds to keep it going so no worries there.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Many wish WoW fails to spite Blizzard(myself included). Most don't want it to fail but rather for their new game to be succesful.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Failed in which sense? AoC is still going, LotR is doing well, EQII is still going strong. Failed is very subjective. Do they have the numbers as WoW? Nope but that doesn't mean they failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW. IMO, and in 11 millions others minds

Welcome to group think! Many people follow their friends regaurdless of how good a game actually is. WAR is a good game and thats why many view it as the new game to play leaving behind the old good game WoW.

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it

The Expansion will erase all of that time and will offer a perfect time to switch over to WAR.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

All my friends quit for 1 of 2 reasons. Blizzard(nuff said) or for WAR.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

A post shows that you care and are trying to convince others to remain with WoW.

Many of WoWs subscribers have been bored with WoW for years. Just there is no alternative. WAR is the first major alternative that looks to have promise. As older players leave they will take others with them. Once new players see the old players leaving they will wonder if they know something and follow suit. Snowball effect.

Play the game you like. I have played WoW and experienced everything that Blizzard had to offer.

As for interllectual statements. There are idiots in every game. The problem is that Blizzard panders to them and gives them a home in the name of money.

Originally posted by Distaste

As for interllectual statements. There are idiots in every game. The problem is that Blizzard panders to them and gives them a home in the name of money.

Although I agree communities are pretty much the same in just about every game, I can say that the reporting system works very well in World of Warcraft.  Last Friday there was some spammy non-rp along with swearing on an RP server.  I'd reported 5 and within a half hour, they were gone and I had a resolution letter in my mailbox.  If more players would man-up / woman-up to community responsibility, it would be an even better game.

Originally posted by Distaste

Because people still have fun playing it.

Some do indeed have fun playing it but others are bore and just going through the motions

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

For many people it isn't possible or feasible to play 2 games at once. $30 a month might be a lot or they like devoting themselves to one game.  Is it possible? yes but for many just not an option they want to entertain.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Again going back to my previous statement. Can you enjoy 2 games? Yes but when your friends out level you or you miss an event because you were playing another game enjoyment goes down.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Lots of games that "failed" still have funds to keep it going so no worries there.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Many wish WoW fails to spite Blizzard(myself included). Most don't want it to fail but rather for their new game to be succesful.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Failed in which sense? AoC is still going, LotR is doing well, EQII is still going strong. Failed is very subjective. Do they have the numbers as WoW? Nope but that doesn't mean they failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW. IMO, and in 11 millions others minds

Welcome to group think! Many people follow their friends regaurdless of how good a game actually is. WAR is a good game and thats why many view it as the new game to play leaving behind the old good game WoW.

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it

The Expansion will erase all of that time and will offer a perfect time to switch over to WAR.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

All my friends quit for 1 of 2 reasons. Blizzard(nuff said) or for WAR.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

A post shows that you care and are trying to convince others to remain with WoW.

 

Many of WoWs subscribers have been bored with WoW for years. Just there is no alternative. WAR is the first major alternative that looks to have promise. As older players leave they will take others with them. Once new players see the old players leaving they will wonder if they know something and follow suit. Snowball effect.

Play the game you like. I have played WoW and experienced everything that Blizzard had to offer.

As for interllectual statements. There are idiots in every game. The problem is that Blizzard panders to them and gives them a home in the name of money.

Dude, Warcraft owns the MMO industry, counter my points all you like.. draw a sigil and medittate on it for all I care.... if you read all Ive written youll see wow isnt even my favorite game to play, it just kills all the others because its so damn well rounded.

You said you have experienced everything Blizzard has to offer?  Thanks for proving me right.  Have you experienced everything Sony has to offer?  Funcom?  Turbine?  Probably not, if you have you must be cloned.   But Blizzard did enough to keep you through all their content, quit giving them shit for being so good at building a fun game.

{ Mod Edit }

Originally posted by Philss

Serisouly OP you need to realise that some ppl like me played WoW ALOOOTT . We just cant handle it anymore weve done anything in the game etc .

 

WoW was great game for a while but im just done with it no mater what they release ( in fact BC pretty much killed it for me ) it will still be the same CONCEPT wich is gear grind till they release something beter and you have to do it all over again .

See this is what Im looking for, honesty.

I am one of those people like you, started on day 1 and have burned myself out countless times.  But I don't lie to myself and say it's Blizz's fault.  They did a kick ass job, and Ive had months of realtime fun in their game... this thread was just me kinf of giving them props.

Just after WAR beta Im not sure anything is coming to challenge the fun aspect.  War was just as gear based in beta IMO, even at low levels, you have you methods of getting the best gear available...and all that shit about the battles being based on skill is crap, its all charge and zerg from the many fights I was in.

What do you mean "danger" to subs, why do you care? Even if WoW's sub base dropped by half (which i doubt will happen for a while) they would still be EASILY earning enough to finance their business.. One server can only hold so many players so if your on a highly populated one why would you be worried anyway? It's not like suddenly there will be no1 to play with... So what is this post about? nothing? I have WAR pre-ordered and have never cared for WoW, but it's not like as soon as WAR goes live everyone will just drop their WoW sub and leave. This post is stoooopid.

Originally posted by Bruticus_XI

Originally posted by Krogg

Because people still have fun playing it.

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW.  IMO, and in 11 millions others minds.

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

 

The only thing that will effect WoW's subscriber base is it's subscribers becoming bored with the game and moving on.   Every day there are still new players coming in, and last time I was on, the bg's were full and the landscape was happening.

 

For all you nubs claiming mental superiority over WoW players... are you bloody serious???  LOL

IT'S A GAME, JUST A GAME, AND ONLY A GAME.

If you seriously put yourself higher on the intellectual ladder because you play one game over another...you have issues....

 

 

It's just the WoW reputation. For instance:

Blizzard lets you link skills in chat channels, so a Warrior could link [Pummel] - one of his skills.

So what does the mature WoW community do? They go and say "anal" in the chat channel and link skills after it. So trade is flooded with 10 year olds going "Anal [Pummel]" like they just learned a new dirty word.

I'm sorry, it's pathetic. You're right though, I want both games to succeed because they're both fun and the more competition/variety we have in ANY game genre, the better for us. Competition means both companies want to do their best.

We'll that level of immaturity is to be expected as there's no denying the fact that WOW main appeal is to the kids born in the late 1980's and early 1990's. The game is full of this generation, hence all the Chuck Norris stuff. You either got put up with it or leave to MMO's where a more mature community reside. No point complaining. As that's like going to bench in a kids playground to read a good book then complaining about all the kids and the noise.

Originally posted by IAmMMO

 

We'll that level of immaturity is to be expected as there's no denying the fact that WOW main appeal is to the kids born in the late 1980's and early 1990's. The game is full of this generation, hence all the Chuck Norris stuff. You either got put up with it or leave to MMO's where a more mature community reside. No point complaining. As that's like going to bench in a kids playground to read a good book then complaining about all the kids and the noise.

Tx for making me 20 years younger :)))

Our guild leader is 41 and his father 61 and playing every day for4 hours.

Average age in our 200+ guild would be around 30.

About 25% women also.

Again one of those completely USELESS statements based on NOTHING

You know : choose a guild of your liking. That's what guild are for.

Originally posted by IAmMMO

Originally posted by Bruticus_XI

Originally posted by Krogg

Because people still have fun playing it.

Because it is possible to play more than one game.

Because it is possible to enjoy more than one game.

Because they have the funds to keep it going.

Because it doesn't matter that you 'wish wow fails'.

Because every game that has been set to compete with WoW has failed.

Because WAR is a good game, but so is WoW.  IMO, and in 11 millions others minds.

Because people have time invested, and a lot of it.

Because some of my friends still play it, and so do some of yours.

Because those of us having fun playing WoW could care less about the back and forth flamewars between fanbois on sites like this....

 

The only thing that will effect WoW's subscriber base is it's subscribers becoming bored with the game and moving on.   Every day there are still new players coming in, and last time I was on, the bg's were full and the landscape was happening.

 

For all you nubs claiming mental superiority over WoW players... are you bloody serious???  LOL

IT'S A GAME, JUST A GAME, AND ONLY A GAME.

If you seriously put yourself higher on the intellectual ladder because you play one game over another...you have issues....

 

 

It's just the WoW reputation. For instance:

Blizzard lets you link skills in chat channels, so a Warrior could link [Pummel] - one of his skills.

So what does the mature WoW community do? They go and say "anal" in the chat channel and link skills after it. So trade is flooded with 10 year olds going "Anal [Pummel]" like they just learned a new dirty word.

I'm sorry, it's pathetic. You're right though, I want both games to succeed because they're both fun and the more competition/variety we have in ANY game genre, the better for us. Competition means both companies want to do their best.

 

We'll that level of immaturity is to be expected as there's no denying the fact that WOW main appeal is to the kids born in the late 1980's and early 1990's. The game is full of this generation, hence all the Chuck Norris stuff. You either got put up with it or leave to MMO's where a more mature community reside. No point complaining. As that's like going to bench in a kids playground to read a good book then complaining about all the kids and the noise.

You know, with the size of WoW, the community is pretty much different from server to server. Many people focus on the bad side to WoW's community, but I've been on servers where a majority of the people were nice, and mature.

It really depends on what server you're on. WoW does have a lot.

Originally posted by TeamFortress

Originally posted by IAmMMO

 

We'll that level of immaturity is to be expected as there's no denying the fact that WOW main appeal is to the kids born in the late 1980's and early 1990's. The game is full of this generation, hence all the Chuck Norris stuff. You either got put up with it or leave to MMO's where a more mature community reside. No point complaining. As that's like going to bench in a kids playground to read a good book then complaining about all the kids and the noise.

Tx for making me 20 years younger :)))

Our guild leader is 41 and his father 61 and playing every day for4 hours.

Average age in our 200+ guild would be around 30.

About 25% women also.

Again one of those completely USELESS statements based on NOTHING

You know : choose a guild of your liking. That's what guild are for.

 

See that's where you don't understand people's arguments.  Just because he said it was filled with kids doesn't mean there aren't adults as well.  He said main appeal no only appeal. L2R pls.

You can definitely see there are a lot of kids around when server is about to go down and they start spamming Org.  That's just sad.  Or start linking items in the form of jokes for hours.

Possibly other games may be like this and have their share of kids but it's obvious that WoW has them as well.  My nephews both 10 and 12 both play the game and actually do very well.  It appeals to kid because its child friendly and has cartoony graphics.  Very smart imo.  In my cybercafe there are a bunch of 14 year olds who have a guild and come in to play almost everyday.

I will contend that other MMOs may have the same problem.

Originally posted by fuzzylojik

Originally posted by TeamFortress

Originally posted by IAmMMO

 

We'll that level of immaturity is to be expected as there's no denying the fact that WOW main appeal is to the kids born in the late 1980's and early 1990's. The game is full of this generation, hence all the Chuck Norris stuff. You either got put up with it or leave to MMO's where a more mature community reside. No point complaining. As that's like going to bench in a kids playground to read a good book then complaining about all the kids and the noise.

Tx for making me 20 years younger :)))

Our guild leader is 41 and his father 61 and playing every day for4 hours.

Average age in our 200+ guild would be around 30.

About 25% women also.

Again one of those completely USELESS statements based on NOTHING

You know : choose a guild of your liking. That's what guild are for.

 

See that's where you don't understand people's arguments.  Just because he said it was filled with kids doesn't mean there aren't adults as well.  He said main appeal no only appeal. L2R pls.

You can definitely see there are a lot of kids around when server is about to go down and they start spamming Org.  That's just sad.  Or start linking items in the form of jokes for hours.

Possibly other games may be like this and have their share of kids but it's obvious that WoW has them as well.  My nephews both 10 and 12 both play the game and actually do very well.  It appeals to kid because its child friendly and has cartoony graphics.  Very smart imo.  In my cybercafe there are a bunch of 14 year olds who have a guild and come in to play almost everyday.

I will contend that other MMOs may have the same problem.

You again presume things. I know what I see IN the game and in RL.
 

You can't stumble into a comics book shop or they are talking about WOW. Like I said earlier WOW is cult : you can't kill CULT btw. The vendor = 40 years old and the guy who just kept rattling was 42 (asked their ages). These guys found the hobby of their life in these last 2 years and they hadn't played computer games for 10 years. That's the kind of audiance WoW attracks also.

And CULT is everywhere, just like Presly or the Beatles it is everywhere.

And MOST of the people I know and meet in RL that play Wow are far more mature than you would like to believe.

I know ONE thing: a lot of kids would LIKE to play WOW but they can't because they have to PAY to play it and so the real younger kids (the 10-14 year old) go to free to play MMORPG's. Like GW or the terrible CABAL.

In CABAL you see the stuff you mention, hardly on EU WOW servers tbh. Unless you were in a kids guild, which btw doesn't survive very long.

The secret to WOW's adult behaviour in BIG parts of the game?

Guild Masters are for 95% very adult people that need to work really HARD to get their guild going or they won't survive long.

So youngsters hop in get to 40 or to 60 or to 70 and then leave Wow.

They'll all go to WAR now. Happy for that btw. :)))

Originally posted by TeamFortress

You again presume things. I know what I see IN the game and in RL.
 

You can't stumble into a comics book shop or they are talking about WOW. Like I said earlier WOW is **** : you can't kill **** btw. The vendor = 40 years old and the guy who just kept rattling was 42 (asked their ages). These guys found the hobby of their life in these last 2 years and they hadn't played computer games for 10 years. That's the kind of audiance WoW attracks also.

And **** is everywhere, just like Presly or the Beatles it is everywhere.

And MOST of the people I know and meet in RL that play Wow are far more mature than you would like to believe.

I know ONE thing: a lot of kids would LIKE to play WOW but they can't because they have to PAY to play it and so the real younger kids (the 10-14 year old) go to free to play MMORPG's. Like GW or the terrible CABAL.

So youngsters hop in get to 40 or to 60 or to 70 and then leave Wow.

They'll all go to WAR now. Happy for that btw. :)))

I don't presume things.  I never said there weren't mature people in the game.  The whole premise of my post was that kids do well which you invariable missed.

I see:

1) Chuck norris spam

2) spam before server goes down

3) actual kids who I know succeed in the game getting into good guilds and arena teams.

My nephews are all 70, in the 2nd best guild in the server and do better than many of adults in both PvE and PvP.  Kids just have an aptitude for the game.  They haven't left WoW.  Again blanket statements by you turns out to be wrong.

Most kids have parents or relatives who pay with their credit card.  Oh you know there is this system too in WoW. You may have heard of it... it's called game cards.  Some kids use those to pay.

Why would they all go to WAR?  Some of them may but alot will stay in kid friendly WoW.

Originally posted by fuzzylojik

Most kids have parents or relatives who pay with their credit card.  Oh you know there is this system too in WoW. You may have heard of it... it's called game cards.  Some kids use those to pay.

Why would they all go to WAR?  Some of them may but alot will stay in kid friendly WoW.

 

And many parents don't pay or forbid them to play (because of school reports). Even gaming cards have an initial credit card requirement.

While GW and Cabal are FREE to play. Install it and hop you play.

Of course there are these youngsters in WOW, but I guess they are even more attracted to GW or WAR.

Now why would these boys come to WAR?

---> Limited mmoRPG elements: bashing on heads without an economy and lacking professions and no boring fishing and boring open seamless worlds you do things like barbeques or weddings in the Cathdral of Holy Light.

Just look at the forums in WAR. "Economy : a waste of time". professions ? "who needs them I want to bash some heads instead".

"I just want to have fun fighting," who needs open seemless worlds and boring fly paths.

Does this ring a bell ???

Full of them

Originally posted by TeamFortress

Originally posted by fuzzylojik

Most kids have parents or relatives who pay with their credit card.  Oh you know there is this system too in WoW. You may have heard of it... it's called game cards.  Some kids use those to pay.

Why would they all go to WAR?  Some of them may but alot will stay in kid friendly WoW.

 

And many parents don't pay or forbid them to play (because of school reports). Even gaming cards have an initial credit card requirement.

While GW and Cabal are FREE to play. Install it and hop you play.

Of course there are these youngsters in WOW, but I guess they are even more attracted to GW or WAR.

Now why would these boys come to WAR?

---> Limited mmoRPG elements: bashing on heads without an economy and lacking professions and no boring fishing and boring open seamless worlds you do things like barbeques or weddings in the Cathdral of Holy Light.

Just look at the forums in WAR. "Economy : a waste of time". professions ? "who needs them I want to bash some heads instead".

"I just want to have fun fighting," who needs open seemless worlds and boring fly paths.

Does this ring a bell ???

Full of them

 

Many parents I know are less strict.  They have the it's a game mentality, they can have fun as long as they do their homework.

I know a lot of kids who like the upcoming barber shop, actually getting BBQs, and marriages too (cos they can't do that IRL yet.)

The kids are know also all are excellent crafters with many good recipes and have quite a bit of gold.

They like the nice colors and have no plans to leave WoW currently.

Full of them.