I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

Almost all the other features of WoW seem to be superior to WAR's:

1.) Almost open world, with flying mounts where I can land wherever I want in Outland (and Northrend from level 77)

2.) Amazing PvE that is going to get a huge boost in WOTLK

3.) An economy with an AH

4.) A  huge world comparing to other MMOs

5.) Professions that finally became meaningful

In WAR's favour: PvP and that is about it.

Or are there more WAR features that will blow WoW out of the water that I don't know about? (not in the beta, only going on what I read here).

Please understand that I am not a WoW fanboy, in fact I desperately want to leave it for a superior MMO. Just have not seen one yet.

Wow's alot more polished than WAR is since its new and all *yes its unfair but thats how it is*

RvR is all its really got going for it, and I suppose players who want to see a diffrent world/scenery.

well for me personally you answered your own question....RvR. i love it..many love it. wow pvp just isnt cutting it. pvp gets no love on wow except for a new season every 5 months then its all over. wotlk will probably draw me back into wow but if i can do something even for 2-6 months and have fun (unlike in wow for me), WAR will be a sucess in my eyes..

edit: i'd just wait for a few weeks or get it right away and try it. it cant hurt. i mean it may be epic fail like AoC but i hear it's very polished...not wow polished but decent polished. i for 1 am excited for something new even if it is a small break...

Funny enough, one of the things I'm most looking forward to in WAR is the Tome of Knowledge. I'm really hoping that it's totally awesome.

WotLK has achievements coming up, but I don't think it's the same.

Originally posted by tuppe99

I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

Almost all the other features of WoW seem to be superior to WAR's:

1.) Almost open world, with flying mounts where I can land wherever I want in Outland (and Northrend from level 77) - so ?

2.) Amazing PvE that is going to get a huge boost in WOTLK wow will have had 2 expansions and has had longer time to develop...also WAR is not a PVE game

3.) An economy with an AH - will WAR will develop and econemy

4.) A  huge world comparing to other MMOs - WAR is huge

5.) Professions that finally became meaningful - WAR has professions

In WAR's favour: PvP and that is about it.

Or are the more WAR features that will blow WoW out of the water that I don't know about? (not in the beta, only going on what I read here).

Please understand that I am not a WoW fanboy, in fact I desperately want to leave it for a superior MMO. Just have not seen one yet.

i dont think your a fanboy :) i just think your more into PVE which WAR wont deliver as its pvp/rvr based.

war is for people into pvp/rvr

but some nice features in war are the tomb of knowledge. you might like that.

I agree that it will be a success. But it will not keep it's subs. There will be a dedicated group of PvPers that will keep WAR going for many years and expansions will also improve it, but to what extend we will have to wait and see.

I believe subs will follow the same trend as AoC but with a much larger player base.

Originally posted by tuppe99

I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

Almost all the other features of WoW seem to be superior to WAR's:

1.) Almost open world, with flying mounts where I can land wherever I want in Outland (and Northrend from level 77)

2.) Amazing PvE that is going to get a huge boost in WOTLK

3.) An economy with an AH

4.) A  huge world comparing to other MMOs

5.) Professions that finally became meaningful

In WAR's favour: PvP and that is about it.

Or are there more WAR features that will blow WoW out of the water that I don't know about? (not in the beta, only going on what I read here).

Please understand that I am not a WoW fanboy, in fact I desperately want to leave it for a superior MMO. Just have not seen one yet.

After many failed PVE games with PVP duct taped to it as an after thought, a game that is PVP centric is what I enjoy. I have never enjoyed WoW and Ive given it a fair shot many times.
 

Ive PVE'd my butt off in the last 10 years, and if you've PVE'd in one game youve PVE'd in them all. I like RvR because Im sick of AI fights. Heck I play shadowbane for my PvP fix, and its a terrible game. Im happy to see WAR out there. Not everyone wants to ride in the bandwagon that is WoW.

Originally posted by tuppe99

I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

Almost all the other features of WoW seem to be superior to WAR's:

1.) Almost open world, with flying mounts where I can land wherever I want in Outland (and Northrend from level 77)

2.) Amazing PvE that is going to get a huge boost in WOTLK

3.) An economy with an AH

4.) A  huge world comparing to other MMOs

5.) Professions that finally became meaningful

In WAR's favour: PvP and that is about it.

Or are the more WAR features that will blow WoW out of the water that I don't know about? (not in the beta, only going on what I read here).

Please understand that I am not a WoW fanboy, in fact I desperately want to leave it for a superior MMO. Just have not seen one yet.

1) Key words... "Almost". And this only came after a couple years AFTER the release. Don't compare a new game to one that's been out for 3 years.

2) What's amazing about it? It's the same as every other MMO out there. What exactly is the "huge boost" coming with the expansion? Now we have to get 25 candles instead of 20??

3) LOL 'nuf said.

4) Did you actually measure this or you gaging it by "feel"?

5) Professions have and never will be useful in WoW. Alchemy/Enchanting are the closest useful trades and both of those are weak at best.

You also neglected to mention that basically WoW has NO end game. Raiding 100x to get a few pieces of gear just to start raiding 100x for the next set is not an "end game", it's a grind fest, period.

Other WAR items you may have missed:

Public Quests

Diversity in classes

Not just PvP, Realm vs Realm, siege equipment, multiple game play types. Wow has a couple and that's it.

Better graphics, higher resolution models and textures than WoW.

Anyway,  it's silly to compare or even ask why someone would change. Maybe they are just tired of playing WoW because it's been a long time and after 5 or 6 70's it's old. Maybe they like the lore better. Maybe they like some of the classes better, or the RvR etc.

It's good to have more options. it means more people playing MMOs in general which means more $$ being spent in the genre and therefore even better games still to come.

Originally posted by tuppe99

I agree that it will be a success. But it will not keep it's subs. There will be a dedicated group of PvPers that will keep WAR going for many years and expansions will also improve it, but to what extend we will have to wait and see.

I believe subs will follow the same trend as AoC but with a much larger player base.

AOC had allot of problems. thats why the sub number went down so quick,

WAR will do well... probably take place in the number 2 spot with a stable 500k-800k+ subs .

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by tuppe99

I agree that it will be a success. But it will not keep it's subs. There will be a dedicated group of PvPers that will keep WAR going for many years and expansions will also improve it, but to what extend we will have to wait and see.

I believe subs will follow the same trend as AoC but with a much larger player base.

 

AOC had allot of problems. thats why the sub number went down so quick,

WAR will do well... probably take place in the number 2 spot with a stable 500k-800k+ subs .

It won't be #2 with only 800k subs... Guild Wars has that beat.

Originally posted by Onecrazyguy

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by tuppe99

I agree that it will be a success. But it will not keep it's subs. There will be a dedicated group of PvPers that will keep WAR going for many years and expansions will also improve it, but to what extend we will have to wait and see.

I believe subs will follow the same trend as AoC but with a much larger player base.

 

AOC had allot of problems. thats why the sub number went down so quick,

WAR will do well... probably take place in the number 2 spot with a stable 500k-800k+ subs .

 

It won't be #2 with only 800k subs... Guild Wars has that beat.

how do you compare a f2p to a p2p?

Dark Age of Camelot didn't seem to have any problems keeping it's subscribers...well until the infamous expansion...

Mythic knows how to make good games. There was plenty of PvE in DAoC as well as RvR. I see the same thing going for Warhammer.

I don't think this game is going to have any problems keeping players around for a good long time.

Originally posted by tuppe99

I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

... "Except for RvR."

I think most people are in agreement that PvE in most active MMOs is a joke.  WoW is no exception to this rule.  Think about how fast the supposedly "hard raid bosses" go down in WoW expansions.

Thus, with PvE being mostly a trip to get to PvP the fact that WAR will have superior RvR, a fact which you brush asied with three words is an extremely major consideration.  It is why this game will succeed.

Its funny now that Open Beta is out that people are less on the defensive about Warhammer because they see now how unpolished this game really is and the only thing it has going for it is RvR. I mean HONESTLY? This is from a person that does not play WoW but has played over 10 P2P Mmo's and itleast 20+ Free to play. I consider my self an experienced mmo player. And HONESTLY? The graphics in Warhammer look sub par they look  just like Knight Online's Graphics. I mean you can sit here all day and tell me Zomg its not all about the graphics!! *nerd rage!!!!*  But hell thats what women say about men its not all about the appearance which is bull shit you cant be attracted to someone without SOME SORT OF physical attraction. The Default Warhammer UI is obviously so obvious stolen right from WoW UI it sorta makes me wanna barf.  Why anyone would want to Leave wow for Warhammer for GOOD? Is so far beyond my average intellect it honestly is so far beyond me that I cannot even begin to comprehend why someone would do that. It would be like leveling a character on wow to 70 and then deleteing it and starting over for no reason. Thats an example of what it would be like leaving wow for Warhammer. Your essentially going to another company that has taken itleast 90% of their ideas straight from WoW. These companies are going to continue to create WoW clones because they have seen and are still seeing how succesful the game is. Im not a WoW Fanboi and not one person can deny that blizzard has done an AMAZING job with WoW. Either that or their marketing team deserve to get payed more than the CEO'S of Blizzard.  I will probably be returning to wow after the expansion is released because im not going to pay them for 2 or 3 months gaining gear thats going to be useless anyway.

Originally posted by Onecrazyguy

1) Key words... "Almost". And this only came after a couple years AFTER the release. Don't compare a new game to one that's been out for 3 years.

I've said it before and I will keep saying it.

When WAR launches (or Aion for that matter), they will compare to the WoW version that's online on WAR's release date, not vanilla WoW.

That's like starting a new car company and just require you to compete with a Ford-T.

All this, "but wow was like this and that in ver. 1.0" is simply put stupid and show a complete lack of understanding of the subject at hand as well as the industry trends.

---

WAR will not bring real PVP, as you cannot 'hurt' another player, to have a real economy you need to loose all your gear and items in your bags when you die (but have unlimited bank space). This puts consequence to your actions/PVP and doing away with 'soulbound' and making all items craftable, you build a solid foundation for a economy, as we loss of items you build a demand/need system.

CCP managed to introduce proper PVP and Economy in the MMO world with EVE-Online. The game has it's flaws but in terms of PVP no game comes even close. in EVE you can even do PVP without killing anything, as you can hurt your opponent financially, which is brilliant.

WAR's PVP will be a simple copy'n'paste from DAoC, which by itself isn't bad, it's just not real PVP but a halfhearted solution.

Originally posted by Unive

Its funny now that Open Beta is out that people are less on the defensive about Warhammer because they see now how unpolished this game really is and the only thing it has going for it is RvR. I mean HONESTLY? This is from a person that does not play WoW but has played over 10 P2P Mmo's and itleast 20+ Free to play. I consider my self an experienced mmo player. And HONESTLY? The graphics in Warhammer look sub par they look  just like Knight Online's Graphics. I mean you can sit here all day and tell me Zomg its not all about the graphics!! *nerd rage!!!!*  But hell thats what women say about men its not all about the appearance which is bull shit you cant be attracted to someone without SOME SORT OF physical attraction. The Default Warhammer UI is obviously so obvious stolen right from WoW UI it sorta makes me wanna barf.  Why anyone would want to Leave wow for Warhammer for GOOD? Is so far beyond my average intellect it honestly is so far beyond me that I cannot even begin to comprehend why someone would do that. It would be like leveling a character on wow to 70 and then deleteing it and starting over for no reason. Thats an example of what it would be like leaving wow for Warhammer. Your essentially going to another company that has taken itleast 90% of their ideas straight from WoW. These companies are going to continue to create WoW clones because they have seen and are still seeing how succesful the game is. Im not a WoW Fanboi and not one person can deny that blizzard has done an AMAZING job with WoW. Either that or their marketing team deserve to get payed more than the CEO'S of Blizzard.  I will probably be returning to wow after the expansion is released because im not going to pay them for 2 or 3 months gaining gear thats going to be useless anyway.

Id just like to point out that Blizzard comes up with very little innovation. The ENTIRE WoW experience is little more than a dumbed down ripoff of other MMOs before it. It is not the Alpha, it is the Omega of MMOs.

And again Ill say, if it wasnt for WoW, I think the MMO genre would be better off.

This thread: http://mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/196636 should help you decide. Take the poll, also.

Don't forget... these games are all about having FUN... which WAR provides and WoW does NOT provide (anymore).

And i'll say this again... please stop posting ridiculously moronic threads in general discussion if you haven't played the beta. ALL these questions can be answered by doing a quick search on the internet.

If you want a flavour for what's to come, look on youtube for warhammer vids-  the latest one. Look for videos by br3ntbr0

Check out wardb.com as well, great info on WAR.

Originally posted by Arcken

Originally posted by Unive

Its funny now that Open Beta is out that people are less on the defensive about Warhammer because they see now how unpolished this game really is and the only thing it has going for it is RvR. I mean HONESTLY? This is from a person that does not play WoW but has played over 10 P2P Mmo's and itleast 20+ Free to play. I consider my self an experienced mmo player. And HONESTLY? The graphics in Warhammer look sub par they look  just like Knight Online's Graphics. I mean you can sit here all day and tell me Zomg its not all about the graphics!! *nerd rage!!!!*  But hell thats what women say about men its not all about the appearance which is bull shit you cant be attracted to someone without SOME SORT OF physical attraction. The Default Warhammer UI is obviously so obvious stolen right from WoW UI it sorta makes me wanna barf.  Why anyone would want to Leave wow for Warhammer for GOOD? Is so far beyond my average intellect it honestly is so far beyond me that I cannot even begin to comprehend why someone would do that. It would be like leveling a character on wow to 70 and then deleteing it and starting over for no reason. Thats an example of what it would be like leaving wow for Warhammer. Your essentially going to another company that has taken itleast 90% of their ideas straight from WoW. These companies are going to continue to create WoW clones because they have seen and are still seeing how succesful the game is. Im not a WoW Fanboi and not one person can deny that blizzard has done an AMAZING job with WoW. Either that or their marketing team deserve to get payed more than the CEO'S of Blizzard.  I will probably be returning to wow after the expansion is released because im not going to pay them for 2 or 3 months gaining gear thats going to be useless anyway.

 

Id just like to point out that Blizzard comes up with very little innovation. The ENTIRE WoW experience is little more than a dumbed down ripoff of other MMOs before it. It is not the Alpha, it is the Omega of MMOs.

And again Ill say, if it wasnt for WoW, I think the MMO genre would be better off.

Ok I 50/50 agree with you on this one. Dumbed down? Not really its a massive step up from UO and Everquest and the failure Star Wars Galaxies.  If Blizzard took any ideas from these games itleast they did not bluntly make it so damn obvious when you watched a trailer it looked like Everquest with different skins...

Now the part I agree with you on. If World Of Warcraft was never made, I can honestly say I would imagine there would be more creativity in the future MMO's and less WoW Clones.  The genre as a whole would be better off without it but I still think its a genius of a game.. The numbers speak fro them selves..

Originally posted by Arcken

And again Ill say, if it wasnt for WoW, I think the MMO genre would be better off.

I agree there. I used to play MUDs and they are in fact superior to all the MMOs out there today. If only we can get them in decent graphics ;)

Originally posted by tuppe99

I know, you are all getting tired of these WAR vs WoW posts, but really, even though I am getting tired of WoW myself, I still have not seen anything to suggest that WAR will be a step up from WoW. Except for RvR.

Almost all the other features of WoW seem to be superior to WAR's:

1.) Almost open world, with flying mounts where I can land wherever I want in Outland (and Northrend from level 77)

2.) Amazing PvE that is going to get a huge boost in WOTLK

3.) An economy with an AH

4.) A  huge world comparing to other MMOs

5.) Professions that finally became meaningful

In WAR's favour: PvP and that is about it.

Or are there more WAR features that will blow WoW out of the water that I don't know about? (not in the beta, only going on what I read here).

Please understand that I am not a WoW fanboy, in fact I desperately want to leave it for a superior MMO. Just have not seen one yet.

It's all about personal taste I guess. I've stopped playing WoW simply because I'm bored of it. All the feature you list above are lovely and would likely keep any kind of player going for a while. But it's now become a real grind for me and as I love PvP, I'm hoping WAR will be good as I stopped playing WoW over a year ago and have no intention of returning.

WAR could have:

- A small game world

- No transport of any kind

- No crafting whatsoever

- No economy as such

- Little/no PvE

- Pants graphics

And I would probably enjoy it far more than I ever did WoW, providing it has:

- Great gameplay

- Challenging PvP/RvR

- Good interface/controls

- Minimal bugs

- Potential

I lived the last 6 months of my time with WoW in battlegrounds, as that was all that I enjoyed by that point. I then followed that up with about another 6 months playing CoD4 until that got dry. Now I'm bored to death and looking for some action, lol!