Originally posted by UberKnot

Question.

 

Slow combat , but lots of hardcore PvP players??

explain that one to me.

 

Also what you will find out is you dont get alot of casual hardcore PvP players.

If you get to 800,000 and can keep that after 3 months you will be doing good.

IMO slower combat instead of twitched based gives a little more room for strategy. If someone can run up to you, spam 2 insta DDs and one cast to kill you, there isn't much thought to it or reaction besides soaking and praying you have the HP.  That is just kinda dumb. I want longer epic battles where tides can turn from skill. Say one healer kiting, the other healing and switching off. Tanks peeling and dps taking out healers or casters before the tanks are taken out.  It all just seems more fulfilling that pushing 1 2 3 dead.

Again thats just me though.

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW and unless you've played DAoC before gear and ToA took a crap on RvR you don't know the potential fun of WAR. People keep bitching about easy mode and too much parity in the end game, but that's what made DAoC so awesome. Gear may give a slight edge, but it wasn't overpowered until artifacts. Anyone from oldschool DAoC should be cheering for WAR.

I just hope they don't ruin it by making another gamekiller like ToA.

<Old scholl DAoCer...

I'm just glad (rumor maybe) that they're waiting some 2 years before an expansion. One downfall(yet still really good) thing Mythic has done is listen to the consumers. People will always cry for more and have that "grass is always greener" kinda mindset, I don't care who you are. The problem was they would cater to that minority (or majority) and wind up shooting themselves in the foot and later realizing, lose money, and have to "fix" it.

Originally posted by Dreadlich

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW and unless you've played DAoC before gear and ToA took a crap on RvR you don't know the potential fun of WAR. People keep bitching about easy mode and too much parity in the end game, but that's what made DAoC so awesome. Gear may give a slight edge, but it wasn't overpowered until artifacts. Anyone from oldschool DAoC should be cheering for WAR.

I just hope they don't ruin it by making another gamekiller like ToA.

TOTALLY Agree..  ToA destroyed DOAC turning it into a greedy gear fest when before RVR was the most fun I'd ever had in a mmo.  I was even a rare earth wizard and still had fun!

honestly, what is the fucking point of these threads? YOU are the only person who can decide the verdicT, dipshit. 50$ is a small enough sum of money to buy and try. if you have a computer that can run todays games, then you can afford another $50. you are always going to get two sides of the spectrum. how have you not realized this yet?

<<Habitual AMG camper.... then came New Frontiers...

that was harsh.

Originally posted by Dreadlich

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW and unless you've played DAoC before gear and ToA took a crap on RvR you don't know the potential fun of WAR. People keep bitching about easy mode and too much parity in the end game, but that's what made DAoC so awesome. Gear may give a slight edge, but it wasn't overpowered until artifacts. Anyone from oldschool DAoC should be cheering for WAR.

I just hope they don't ruin it by making another gamekiller like ToA.

Amen brother!! I agree totally. I was old old school DAOC and I am excited about WAR. DAOC's style of PVP is a lot different from a lot of more modern players consider to be PVP. I am not saying its good or bad its just a different style and one that I, and I know many others, prefer.

People think its easy mode for many various reasons but in reality the PVP is harder because it relies on skill and not "I am better because I have the super-sword of pawning you". WAR is going to be like old school DAOC and I am very excited about that. And I seriously doubt they will ever do anything like ToA again since they realize how badly it killed DAOC.

Edit your post then...

Originally posted by thekid1

Originally posted by Manchine

Originally posted by Blodpls

By your logic Darkage of Camelot should be bigger then World of Warcraft because its got all those things if thats all that matters.

I don't quite understand that comment.

What I'm saying is when you get down to the core design they are pretty much the same. 

If you could take your character and gui out of WAR and put in WoW you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game. 

 

 

By that logic.  So you can do the same thing with Dark Age of Camelot take your WoW character and Gui and put it in DAoC you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game.  Why play WoW when you can play DAoC. 

 

WoW has a few more things then Dark Age of Camelot thats it.  WAR has a few more things then WoW.  Would the WAR character have the same or interesting story if I played WoW.  Not even close.  

I would rather play WAR.  I played 6 months of WoW and went back to CoH, I like the story behind the game.  WoW just doesn't have the story that other games have.  Even Conan has a better story then WoW.

 

To close its not even close to the same game.

Can you ellaborate?
I don't play WOW because crafted stuff costs less then the resources, and the economy part is a bit dumbed down, but the game is pretty packed with stuff to do.
 

The resources in WoW are free.
 

Originally posted by grimfall

Originally posted by thekid1

Originally posted by Manchine

Originally posted by Blodpls

By your logic Darkage of Camelot should be bigger then World of Warcraft because its got all those things if thats all that matters.

I don't quite understand that comment.

What I'm saying is when you get down to the core design they are pretty much the same. 

If you could take your character and gui out of WAR and put in WoW you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game. 

 

 

By that logic.  So you can do the same thing with Dark Age of Camelot take your WoW character and Gui and put it in DAoC you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game.  Why play WoW when you can play DAoC. 

 

WoW has a few more things then Dark Age of Camelot thats it.  WAR has a few more things then WoW.  Would the WAR character have the same or interesting story if I played WoW.  Not even close.  

I would rather play WAR.  I played 6 months of WoW and went back to CoH, I like the story behind the game.  WoW just doesn't have the story that other games have.  Even Conan has a better story then WoW.

 

To close its not even close to the same game.

Can you ellaborate?
I don't play WOW because crafted stuff costs less then the resources, and the economy part is a bit dumbed down, but the game is pretty packed with stuff to do.
 

The resources in WoW are free.
 

That damn AH has been ripping me off!
 

Seriously though, time = money in WOW. Harvesting takes time, so either way you're gonna pay for those resources.

Originally posted by Dreadlich

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW

This.

Even if WAR is just a slip below WoW it will take off anyway because there are a whole hell of a lot of people out there looking for something different and are willing to compromise if they have to. Rest assured, WAR is definitely several steps above WoW and that is why I am going out on that ideological limb here to say that WAR is the WoW-Killer if there will ever be one anytime soon.

I think a lot of people are low-balling WAR after AoC because they are afraid of being wrong, but they forget that even AoC has something like 300k+ subscribers. AoC was a crappy game, with a weak and unattractive IP While WAR is a familiar face. I think we can all safely estimate that WAR is going to do, minimum, 20% better than that with higher retention.

Originally posted by sabutai22

Originally posted by Brahmd

There is not one aspect of WoW that WAR has not done better. The WoW troll will undoubtedly play.

Until you play the game you really have no ground to stand on. And if you say you have played the game. Then one of two things happend:

1: You are lying.

2: You are just being a fanboi. Like i said earlier in this post. There is not one aspect of WoW that WAR did not improve.

 

Like what? i play CB and with the exception of RvR all of it is the same exept dressed up in a different skin;

PvP/RvR - Same.

Quests - Same.

Gear - Same.

Levels - Same.

Abilities - Same, even cool downs!

The so called Masteries - Same, they even have 3 TABS like WoW has 3 per class! Geeez

I could go on, but im afraid you may not understand the point im trying to make ... Then again, ill put it out for you and help you 'grow' abit more;

Companies that get paid MILLIONS to produce a product should deliver more than a cookie-cut product.

Not sure you may understand that, chances are you still drive the first car you purchased (if your even old enough) as progression may be out of your intel scope.

 

You come to the WAR forums, post nonsense, claim you have played the beta, claim that WAR has cloned WoW in many ways and still continue to evade questions that could possibly prove you wrong.

You sabutai22 are completely and utterly full of

Now, on to the quoted post.

PvP/RvR - Same.

No, you are completely wrong. WoW in no way has Realm vs Realm combat (guessing your definition of realm versus realm conflict is Horde vs Alliance). Go play DAoC, you clearly have no idea what RvR is.

Quests - Same.

Congratulations, you are wrong again. In addition to the basic Kill Collector quests (which almost every MMO includes in thier game), WAR offers Public Quests / Exploration Quests / Tome Quests / RvR Quests.

Gear - Same.

Every MMORPG has gear, what do you expect to be put in its place? I expect an answer to this question.

Levels - Same.

Wrong, WARhammer has 40 levels which are divided into 4 tiers. Though, If by chance you are arguing that WAR is a clone because you can level up, you have entered the realm of trolldom. The purpose of playing an MMO is to level something up, to improve your character in some way.

Would it also be a viable to say WAR cloned WoW because you can earn currency?

This is bogus, I would love to see an explaination of how this is cloning.

Abilities - Same, even cool downs!

.......... I'm sorry, what do you expect abilities to have? Warm-ups?

Get yourself together man, you are an embarrasment to all Americans who browse this forum.

The so called Masteries - Same, they even have 3 TABS like WoW has 3 per class! Geeez

DAoC was released before WoW, each class had three or more specializations (masteries).

Example: Wizard - (Fire) (Ice) (Earth) / Scout - (Stealth) (Bow) (Shield) (Slash/Thrust Weapon)

etc. etc.

WoW was most definitely not the first to use this idea in an MMO.

Feel free to reply rather than evade with a short comment.

Though, I doubt you will bring anything useful to the table.

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by Dreadlich

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW

This.

Even if WAR is just a slip below WoW it will take off anyway because there are a whole hell of a lot of people out there looking for something different and are willing to compromise if they have to. Rest assured, WAR is definitely several steps above WoW and that is why I am going out on that ideological limb here to say that WAR is the WoW-Killer if there will ever be one anytime soon.

I think a lot of people are low-balling WAR after AoC because they are afraid of being wrong, but they forget that even AoC has something like 300k+ subscribers. AoC was a crappy game, with a weak and unattractive IP While WAR is a familiar face. I think we can all safely estimate that WAR is going to do, minimum, 20% better than that with higher retention.

Not if the combat is slow.

people like action if the combat is slower than games out now hows that going to hold people?

Originally posted by UberKnot

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by Dreadlich

WAR >>>> WOW

Lots of people are dying for something new to replace WOW

This.

Even if WAR is just a slip below WoW it will take off anyway because there are a whole hell of a lot of people out there looking for something different and are willing to compromise if they have to. Rest assured, WAR is definitely several steps above WoW and that is why I am going out on that ideological limb here to say that WAR is the WoW-Killer if there will ever be one anytime soon.

I think a lot of people are low-balling WAR after AoC because they are afraid of being wrong, but they forget that even AoC has something like 300k+ subscribers. AoC was a crappy game, with a weak and unattractive IP While WAR is a familiar face. I think we can all safely estimate that WAR is going to do, minimum, 20% better than that with higher retention.

 

Not if the combat is slow.

 

people like action if the combat is slower than games out now hows that going to hold people?

Combat isn't slow and I swear it is all the people who played to level 20 and base their opinion at level 11 RvR.

At level 11  people live longer then at 20 and at 30 they live even shorter. At 40 it is possible to be 2-3 shot if correct morals are used. How is that slow again? The only time fights take longer are when you have tons of healers on 1 target or its a 1v1. At 40 people get healing reduction so people die even faster still.

There is absolutely 100% no lack of action. Fights last an enjoyable amount of time and the tides of the battlefield turn very quickly in a 30 second window.

Originally posted by grimfall

Originally posted by thekid1

Originally posted by Manchine

Originally posted by Blodpls

By your logic Darkage of Camelot should be bigger then World of Warcraft because its got all those things if thats all that matters.

I don't quite understand that comment.

What I'm saying is when you get down to the core design they are pretty much the same. 

If you could take your character and gui out of WAR and put in WoW you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game. 

 

 

By that logic.  So you can do the same thing with Dark Age of Camelot take your WoW character and Gui and put it in DAoC you wouldn't have any problems playing the resulting game.  Why play WoW when you can play DAoC. 

 

WoW has a few more things then Dark Age of Camelot thats it.  WAR has a few more things then WoW.  Would the WAR character have the same or interesting story if I played WoW.  Not even close.  

I would rather play WAR.  I played 6 months of WoW and went back to CoH, I like the story behind the game.  WoW just doesn't have the story that other games have.  Even Conan has a better story then WoW.

 

To close its not even close to the same game.

Can you ellaborate?
I don't play WOW because crafted stuff costs less then the resources, and the economy part is a bit dumbed down, but the game is pretty packed with stuff to do.
 

The resources in WoW are free.
 

I can sell the resources for a shitload more money then the stuff I craft with it.
So crafting looses you money. Except if you craft only a few particular items that are in demand.

I find it very interesting so many people here are playing WoW and actively hate the experience. When you say "so many people are playing WoW just waiting for something new to replace it with" what you actually mean is "I am playing WoW and I am waiting for something to replace it with".

Which is occasionally accompanied by a derogatory comment about WoW gameplay or WoW community.

Originally posted by thekid1

Originally posted by Emotions

First off I doubt it will dent wow population cause wow is still growing.
Second, if you read up on the forums you would know that pvp players from wow don't like the "slow" combat in this game. So I doubt those people will come here.

My gueses this game will get about 2 million max people (hopefully more)

And no it is not a wow killer. Cause wow is to casual based pve and warhammer is more of a casual/hardcore based pvp game.

 

2 Million?
Everquest 2 and Lord of the rings online only have about 200k.
Half a million would already be extremely positive.
http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart7.html
 

My bet is 100k in six months because there is only PVP and PVE and nothing else to do.

Only PvE and PvP in an MMO? GET OUT! I guess you forgot about crafting. Seriously..most ridiculous thing I've seen in a while as if somehow other MMO out there is much more to do then PvE/PvP. Let's not forget about progression within guild ranks, renown and so on.

Originally posted by UOvet

Originally posted by thekid1

Originally posted by Emotions

First off I doubt it will dent wow population cause wow is still growing.
Second, if you read up on the forums you would know that pvp players from wow don't like the "slow" combat in this game. So I doubt those people will come here.

My gueses this game will get about 2 million max people (hopefully more)

And no it is not a wow killer. Cause wow is to casual based pve and warhammer is more of a casual/hardcore based pvp game.

 

2 Million?
Everquest 2 and Lord of the rings online only have about 200k.
Half a million would already be extremely positive.
http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart7.html
 

My bet is 100k in six months because there is only PVP and PVE and nothing else to do.

 

Only PvE and PvP in an MMO? GET OUT! I guess you forgot about crafting. Seriously..most ridiculous thing I've seen in a while as if somehow other MMO out there is much more to do then PvE/PvP. Let's not forget about progression within guild ranks, renown and so on.

How about Star Wars Galaxies or Eve online.
Crafting and economy are a huge part of those games, so yes there is more to a mmorpg then pvp and pve. In SWG you can buy factories, survey for resources, make business partners for various transactions, build shops and decorate them, craft hundreds of different items with different stats and upgrade them, etc. etc.





What about fishing, housing (and decorating your house with loot whatever), taming wild animals (and training/upgrading them), upgrading your vehicle, etc. etc.
All those things are (mini) games in them selves and offer much variety.

 

Originally posted by grimfall

Originally posted by Rabenwolf

First off, you have to keep in mind one simple fact.

The only game that will beat WoW, is Blizzard's next MMORPG.

 

That said, WAR will most likely win in terms of Sub numbers compared to the rest of the mmorpgs since WoW, but as for WoW itself, not even close.

War might be able to net a Million or 2 in 2-3 years, but very few mmorpgs have been able to get up to that point.

BIOWARE might become the next blizzard if they do well with their KOTOR mmorpg, since they share Blizzards work ethic, but that is still years away.

 

 

Funny thing is people were saying this about EQ and EQ2.

They also said it about Ford and then General Motors

They also said it about Doom and then Half-Life

I will say one thing though, MMORPG's have to be very careful with barriers to entry.  WoW was able to cream EQ because you could get to max level in WoW in 15 days and in EQ it took about 60, at the time.  With each expansion and level cap raise, you are raising your barriers to entry for players who want to join the game.  WoW with it's 2nd expansion is going to be catering to it's existing customers, but making it more difficult for new customers.  That's the same thing that EQ did, which helped topple it from the throne, and probably restricted it's popularity.  It was extremely daunting for a new player to come into EQ and see that he was 64 levels, 500 AA points and 9 planar flags  behind the 'end game content' players.  Now WoW is going to put their new players 79 levels behind.

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario.  WoW tried to address it by increasing the experience gain for players levels 1-60 (I think), but they didn't balance other parts of the game with that increased experience rate - like crafting and aquiring gear.  EQ has done the same thing, now, with their Hot Zones.

That is a very good point.

On the other hand, I hope War isn't a WoW killer for many reasons.  One of them is, I don't want that sort of crowd piling onto the servers and turning it into Battle2.net.