General Discussion

Ok I've played a number of games and not one came even close to the raids EQ had. EQ is a hackfest now so that's out.

Lately though, games seem to make raids where 1 person completely slacking off or going LD or just plain sucking does not affect your raid at all.

I think one raid member messing up should be visible and clearly indicated and these mistakes should not just go unnoticed.

There's a huge difference between Zerg Raiding whereby mistakes do not influence the outcome and Scripted Raiding whereby every individual player carries the responsibility to perform well under pressure from scripts or adds or AE's.

I don't think raids should require a lot of time to perform though, 2 or 3 hours per raid day is fine for me, it doesn't have to be really long.

Do you feel raids should be made harder or not?

The problem I have with raids where everyone has to be close to perfect is that they cease to be fun anymore.  When raids are like that you  just have a leader dictating what you should do at every turn.

not everyone is a great gamer but they still shoul be able to have fun an raid. raids shoul no be exclusive to elite players

Originally posted by Waterlily 

Do you feel raids should be removed or not?

 

Edited for my own personal fun.

Yes

Yup raiding is one of the few things SOE actually got right in EQ1. Plenty for the hardcore raider to cut their teeth on while still being able to let more casual players eventually see the same content.

I don't like large raids being that maticulas in detail.

But i don't do 25+ man raids much anymore.

Its a lot easier to find 9 other good players that are going to pay attention, then 25.

10 man raids are the future.

Originally posted by SgtFrog

not everyone is a great gamer but they still shoul be able to have fun an raid. raids shoul no be exclusive to elite players

i wish a developer would actually come out and say hey if you suck at games or can't spend more than an hour a week in game than raiding in this game is not for you. I know thats going to sound elitist but heres whats happening in EQ2.

The latest expac  opened up 5 "tiers" of raiding

Tier 1 - is for the casual raiders, the weekend warriors those like you said that aren't the greatest at games.

Tier 2 - a bit more of a challenge casual gamers can probably get the first couple named mobs down with ease but the final fights are definately tough

Obviously 3 - 5 scale from hard to good lord thats a pain.

which i think is fine, However casual weekend warrior gamers constantly complain that they can't get past tier 3 (especially venril sathir). and SOE is giving in nerfing those raids so the casual gamers who suck at the game can feel good about themselves.

Originally posted by XApotheosisX

Originally posted by SgtFrog

not everyone is a great gamer but they still shoul be able to have fun an raid. raids shoul no be exclusive to elite players

 

i wish a developer would actually come out and say hey if you suck at games or can't spend more than an hour a week in game than raiding in this game is not for you. I know thats going to sound elitist but heres whats happening in EQ2.

The latest expac  opened up 5 "tiers" of raiding

Tier 1 - is for the casual raiders, the weekend warriors those like you said that aren't the greatest at games.

Tier 2 - a bit more of a challenge casual gamers can probably get the first couple named mobs down with ease but the final fights are definately tough

Obviously 3 - 5 scale from hard to good lord thats a pain.

which i think is fine, However casual weekend warrior gamers constantly complain that they can't get past tier 3 (especially venril sathir). and SOE is giving in nerfing those raids so the casual gamers who suck at the game can feel good about themselves.

While I do agree that nerfing content for people is not the way to go, I also think that if casual raiders are hitting the end of the game and nothing else is designed for them, then the developers have failed to deliver enough content for a large chunk of their subscribers. 

Maybe they need to design more tier 1 and 2 content to keep these people happy. 

Personally my idea for raids has always been, to require other previously completed quests, and gathered items in order to suceed in the raid. For instance, having to send a few members to some dungeon to recover a weapon or power, in order for them to be able to kill a certain mob in the raid itself.

As it is now, raids just require time and players, after thats its just a matter of grinding through it. I think future mmo's should throw in puzzles, and similar ideas to the one explained above.

If raids become too complex you turn it into some strict dance like a ballerina type thing.  Always the same thing the same exact way.

Which is the worst thing you could do for a raid being fun.   Also being the reason why people hate them so.