It's obvious that we all at one point loved SWG, so here's the million dollar question:

Would you even ever consider going back and if you would, what would be the required changes?

Originally posted by JaydinBane

It's obvious that we all at one point loved SWG, so here's the million dollar question:

Would you even ever consider going back and if you would, what would be the required changes?

 

 

Well it's been asked before, but I don't mind answering again:

Smed would have to resign or get the boot at this point.  Can't trust anything the guy says, so I can't justify giving him my money for anything in advance.

Everyone who paid subscription money because they were promised a profession revamp, and then saw that same profession instead deleted with the NGE, should get all sub money back that was paid beyond Nov. 15/05 (note this refund isn't because the game was changed, it would be restitution for alleged false advertising).

Everyone who paid subscription money beyond Nov. 15 to play the new game expansion, should also get that money back, since the NGE (which gutted the expansion) wasn't mentioned at all in either of the two dev chats prior to its release (once again restitution for alleged false advertising).

Serious bugs and issues that have persisted for years would have to be actually fixed.  Especially the ones SOE said they would address.

An official apology from Lucasarts and SOE for misleading their customers regarding the profession revamps and the expansion, and for attempting to exchange one target audience for another, AFTER release.

All of that would have to happen before I even looked at the game again.  However, I'd still be wary that new RMT buffs and loot might render ingame buffs and loot obsolete, and that game mechanics might be systematically manipulated by SOE to increase demand for RMT items. 

You'll notice that most of these items have to do with ethical business practices and treating customers with basic respect.  In my experience, SOE is frankly abusive towards those that play their games.  That needs to stop, and SOE needs to take important steps to make amends for past actions.

I've alredy gone back and tried it a few times and regret each time that I did. The game is just boring... it would take an entire new game to have me stay a lengthy amount of time.

For me it would be:

1. Pre CU Combat - queuing up attacks, no over the should camera, no constant clicking to attack

2. Designated build areas so that every planet doesn't look like over grown abandon housing complex. Buildings are haphazard even when the best attempts are made to place them in an organized fasion. This is due, in no small part, to the fact that there are no 'roads' or tiled ground connecting the buildings so everything is dug into a hill and all the buildings are uneven, with grass, trees, or rocks jutting out between them. It makes the best town look like a demilitarized zone.

2. Quest lines for professions and diversified quest lines, not singular quests that lead all players to A to accomplish B and then go on to quest line C. Most decent MMO's have several quests and places to pickup quest lines so that not everyone is at the same place at the same time

3. Older crafting model (but I here tell they are actually going to do that!)

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable

2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.

3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels

4.  Return of decay

5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.

6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

1. Pre CU Combat - queuing up attacks, no over the should camera, no constant clicking to attack

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You should note that it's a checkbox to click on once to get rid of the over the shoulder camera angle, and you don't have to keep clicking to shoot.

Originally posted by SioBabble

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable

2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.

3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels

4.  Return of decay

5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.

6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.

Originally posted by JestorRodo

Originally posted by SioBabble

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable

2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.

3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels

4.  Return of decay

5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.

6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

 

  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.

 

 

Failcom should be given the SWG IP so they can remake the game into a 30GB piece of crap.

Nge (or CU) can never be a blip on my radar, have never been. It´s Pre CU or nothing. At first i was thinking Pre CU with some fixes, but after watching what happens when the amateurs at SOE start "fix" things, I prefer if they dont touch anything. Just Pre CU please, as it was, and I´m happy.

oooh only a few things.....like rollback to a time before the NGE, give us the content that was promised not the fiasco that was given.

On another note, i just found this while doing a little surfing, brings back memories

www.ugo.com/channels/games/features/starwars_galaxies/raphkoster.asp

Originally posted by jinxit

oooh only a few things.....like rollback to a time before the NGE, give us the content that was promised not the fiasco that was given.

On another note, i just found this while doing a little surfing, brings back memories

www.ugo.com/channels/games/features/starwars_galaxies/raphkoster.asp

Honestly I have to ask.   As I see this written often. Would you actually pay them money and remain subscribed for say a year minimum, making it worth their while and play the game?    Honestly since this happened now 3 years ago and most people refusing to play are refusing to pay them money due to "being lied to" and "fraud" and "broken promises" among the other things stated.  I have to wonder with this much distrust in a company would you actually pony up 15 bucks a month and remain in the game for a decent amount of time to make it worth this companies while?    Its a valid request, but with the amount of distaste many have who are asking this it makes me wonder if they would actually or could actualy bring themselves to play this game again no matter what state is was in even if it magically became 100% bug free, pre-cu 32 proffs and all requests filled.   I personally when I don't like what is happening with something that much no matter what they do never return. 

Originally posted by JaydinBane

It's obvious that we all at one point loved SWG, so here's the million dollar question:

Would you even ever consider going back and if you would, what would be the required changes?

 

 

I am an old pre-cu vet and could care less what they do.I play a game for me and if I enjoy it I continue to play it. If they do something I do not like I cancel simple as that and go play another game.This buisness about what would they have to do is getting old. Whats done is done and there is nothing that will bring players back unless they are bored and looking for something different to do. I am one that decided to come back to swg because I got sick of playing wow. I have found it to be enjoyable again(Not Pre-CU or CU mind you) but it is still fun in its own way now. It will tied me over until Warhammer releases.

Originally posted by JestorRodo

Originally posted by SioBabble

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable

2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.

3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels

4.  Return of decay

5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.

6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

 

  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.

 

 

Why not add Lucas Arts to the give up statement as well since how they had a great deal to do with the NGE as well.
 

Personally, I feel that by not changing their ways over the time since the NGE, by contunuing to erase past efforts of players without a care, by continuing to make wholesale changes to combat forcing players to learn a new game time and again, by continuing their dishonest development process, they have destroyed any possible opportunity to rebuild credibility since the NGE.

That being said, if I were in their shoes, as a show of good faith, in an attempt to rebuild a destroyed reputation they would have to: publically fire Smed; announce that their old methods were wrong and a issue a sincere apology; open up classic servers that were fully operational, and had all the bugs people already complained about already fixed, classic servers that were complete with all the new content that has been added. Essentially it would be launching an entirely new game in the old pre-CU skin --- the game as it always should have bee -- a working, smooth sandbox FULL of toys.

It would be no bigger than the task it was to make EQ2, so I know they are fully up to it, they just don't, under Smedley, have the will to fix their tarnished reputation; because, quite frankly, he CAN'T do this because the current course is what keeps him IN his job. Only the current course enables him to shift blame to others.

Will any of this sver happen? Nope, not with SOE.

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by JestorRodo

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Originally posted by SioBabble

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable
2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.
3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels
4.  Return of decay
5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.
6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

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  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.
 
 

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Why not add Lucas Arts to the give up statement as well since how they had a great deal to do with the NGE as well.
 

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Because that would be untrue. They had very little to do with the NGE as such. They had everything to do with wanting the game to be successful; for wanting SOE to fix it; for believing that SOE knew what they were doing and were acting in good faith and being honest about WHY the game was not as successful as it should have been (instead of blaming bugs and mismanagement, they blamed the complexity if the game vs WoW's simplicity); and for trusting SOE in that the NGE, a completely 100% SOE plan, would work.

Perhaps they should apologise for trusting SOE, but that wouldn't amount to much.

Originally posted by Fishermage

 

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by JestorRodo

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Originally posted by SioBabble

 

1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable
2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.
3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels
4.  Return of decay
5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.
6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

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  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.
 
 

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Why not add Lucas Arts to the give up statement as well since how they had a great deal to do with the NGE as well.
 

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Because that would be untrue. They had very little to do with the NGE as such. They had everything to do with wanting the game to be successful; for wanting SOE to fix it; for believing that SOE knew what they were doing and were acting in good faith and being honest about WHY the game was not as successful as it should have been (instead of blaming bugs and mismanagement, they blamed the complexity if the game vs WoW's simplicity); and for trusting SOE in that the NGE, a completely 100% SOE plan, would work.

Perhaps they should apologise for trusting SOE, but that wouldn't amount to much.
 

Post your proof here that Lucas Arts had nothing to do with the NGE here.Last I heard everything that SOE does to SWG had to 1st be approved by Lucas Arts. I could be wrong,but since Lucas Arts is the owner of the Star Wars IP,it makes sense. I am not defending SOE,I just hate that everyone pins the entire blame on them,when you have Lucas Arts allowing things like the NGE to happen. So do not come on here saying Lucas Arts had nothing to do with it,when they most certainly had a hand in it.

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by Fishermage

 

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by JestorRodo

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Originally posted by SioBabble
 
1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable
2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.
3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels
4.  Return of decay
5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.
6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

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  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.
 
 

---

Why not add Lucas Arts to the give up statement as well since how they had a great deal to do with the NGE as well.
 

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Because that would be untrue. They had very little to do with the NGE as such. They had everything to do with wanting the game to be successful; for wanting SOE to fix it; for believing that SOE knew what they were doing and were acting in good faith and being honest about WHY the game was not as successful as it should have been (instead of blaming bugs and mismanagement, they blamed the complexity if the game vs WoW's simplicity); and for trusting SOE in that the NGE, a completely 100% SOE plan, would work.
Perhaps they should apologise for trusting SOE, but that wouldn't amount to much.
 

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Post your proof here that Lucas Arts had nothing to do with the NGE here.Last I heard everything that SOE does to SWG had to 1st be approved by Lucas Arts. I could be wrong,but since Lucas Arts is the owner of the Star Wars IP,it makes sense. I am not defending SOE,I just hate that everyone pins the entire blame on them,when you have Lucas Arts allowing things like the NGE to happen. So do not come on here saying Lucas Arts had nothing to do with it,when they most certainly had a hand in it.

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We know that LA approved of ot and allowed it to happen, but the question is: were they in a position to know better? No, they were not the person that was a game developer in general and an MMORPG developer in particular. The proof is all over these forums; but let me switch computers and have saved most of everything; and for the 474856585994904003003003049484747849292th time, share it with you.

Originally posted by Fishermage

 

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by Fishermage

 

 
 

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Originally posted by Battleskar

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Originally posted by JestorRodo

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Originally posted by SioBabble
 
1.  Smedley's head on a pike.  Non-negotiable
2.  Bring back all the old professions, bring back the skill system.  This means, very definitely, CH the way it was.  I want three greater sludge panthers out following me across the plains of Naboo back again.  I want persistent mounts again.  I want full sized rancors, tortons, fambaa, grauls in combat again.  I want /pet /scold animations again.
3.  Commitment to restoration of the virtual world; death to levels, and the artificiality of levels
4.  Return of decay
5.  Restoration of wounds, battle fatigue, and medical crafting for all medical heals and buffs.  No more magic healing spells, except for Jedi.  Oh, and if Jedi use their healing spells on others, yes, viz hit.
6.  I can live with post NGE Jedi being grandfathered into their flashlighthood.  But I want visiblity back, and, yes, I want back some means of controlling the population of maxed out Jedi.  It can be a loss of skill boxes on death system or something similar, but asshats with sabers in Theed dueling has to go.  In fact, some method of severely punishing dueling with sabers asshats in Theed has to be part of the deal.

 

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  I approve off all of your reasons but iIwould like to see SOE give up control of SWG all together as well.
 
 

 

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Why not add Lucas Arts to the give up statement as well since how they had a great deal to do with the NGE as well.
 

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Because that would be untrue. They had very little to do with the NGE as such. They had everything to do with wanting the game to be successful; for wanting SOE to fix it; for believing that SOE knew what they were doing and were acting in good faith and being honest about WHY the game was not as successful as it should have been (instead of blaming bugs and mismanagement, they blamed the complexity if the game vs WoW's simplicity); and for trusting SOE in that the NGE, a completely 100% SOE plan, would work.
Perhaps they should apologise for trusting SOE, but that wouldn't amount to much.
 

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Post your proof here that Lucas Arts had nothing to do with the NGE here.Last I heard everything that SOE does to SWG had to 1st be approved by Lucas Arts. I could be wrong,but since Lucas Arts is the owner of the Star Wars IP,it makes sense. I am not defending SOE,I just hate that everyone pins the entire blame on them,when you have Lucas Arts allowing things like the NGE to happen. So do not come on here saying Lucas Arts had nothing to do with it,when they most certainly had a hand in it.

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This has been admitted by Brenlo, communications dirtector of SOE, by Jeff Freeman, former lead gameplay designer of SWG and co-creator of the NGE, and by Dan Rubenfeld, Lead Designer of SWG and co-creator of the NGE.

 

We know that LA approved of ot and allowed it to happen, but the question is: were they in a position to know better? No, they were not the person that was a game developer in general and an MMORPG developer in particular. The proof is all over these forums; but let me switch computers and have saved most of everything; and for the 474856585994904003003003049484747849292th time, share it with you.

Thats like saying we at Lucas Arts have no clue about our games. You need to rethink your reply.SOE and Lucas Arts brought about the NGE.

It is also my Opinion that the constant whining in the forums about the state the game was in brought about the Combat Upgrade.Then if memory serves me right I remember all the protetsts about the CU and that we all needed to bombard Lucas Arts about our (The Communities Dissatisfaction to what SOE did with the CU) It was not long after CU the NGE came and was dumped on the players. Its my opinion that Lucas Arts saw the dis content and then made SOE come up with something fast and that somthing was the NGE. Thats my opinion.

Okay here we go. Once we were having just such an argument as to who was responsible for the NGE -- this being in response to Smed seemingly trying to shift blame as he does onto LEC, and people were having a rather vicious forum fight, with all the available evidence on the side that blamed mostly SOE for doing it, and LEC for allowing it to happen and for trusting SOE.

In response to this, Brenlo of SOE came forward and said the following:

"First a request, to those of you using this thread as your personal battleground, please take it to PM's.

So, I wanted to clarify that we did, here at SOE conceive and develop the NGE. We did so with the best of intentions, to try and make a better game. No blame or buck is being passed. =)
We can, and I am sure many of us will, debate for years on end whether this was a good idea. Personally, I believe the concept of the NGE was sound. Some smart guys had some good ideas to make the game better, Jeff being one of them, and they went for it. A bold move and honestly, I am happy to be a part of a company that is not afraid to try something different.

Where did we go wrong? Delivery, we failed in our timing and communication. That is where we let you down most, SWG faithful, and for that I truly apologize. "

Now note carefully he takes all blame for the NGE, and in fact, says he was PROUD of it and the company that did it, which is/was SOE. Okay, that's the first piece, a blanket admission and a denial that it was LEC's doing. He is taking FULL credit for it and assuming a mantle of pride here.