Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

Originally posted by Theodgrim

Originally posted by Silvarch

I fail to understand why people think that making a game and making a decent video are mutually exclusive to the point where they have to significantly sacrifice one for the other. It's not a movie, they don't have to collect hours of footage to then edit it together into a cohesive mesh, not if the game is feature complete and working smoothly anyway.

Case in point, this video:

www.youtube.com/watch

Showcases a lot of the features of the game and consequently proves there's at least something to play, and the game wasn't even feature complete back then. Total preparation time for a video like this? About the time it takes to fetch a camera and go to a computer with the game installed, which I'd assume there are many of at the Aventurine offices. The footage is gameplay from the game they were already making and testing anyway, so that was there regardless of a video and needed no preparation. No need to touch up or edit or use special effect transitions or be extremely selective on the footage used, not if they're confident in their game and its quality 4 months (at most) before launch.

 

qft

Ah, but I cant help myself.  I have to actually add something to the discussion, sorry.  I think Silvarch makes a great point, and one that carries over to other aspects as well.  I speak of the false choice scenerio that is so often presented here.  As if there are ONLY two possible choices that are mutually exclusive.  "You want the video or the game".  "You want the game on time or bug free". etc...

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

And you can only assume what they are doing. 

 Still can't believe it takes them this long to make a video, after all they said they were only polishing the game up and is ready for beta (again).

Originally posted by mike470

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

Originally posted by Theodgrim

Originally posted by Silvarch

I fail to understand why people think that making a game and making a decent video are mutually exclusive to the point where they have to significantly sacrifice one for the other. It's not a movie, they don't have to collect hours of footage to then edit it together into a cohesive mesh, not if the game is feature complete and working smoothly anyway.

Case in point, this video:

www.youtube.com/watch

Showcases a lot of the features of the game and consequently proves there's at least something to play, and the game wasn't even feature complete back then. Total preparation time for a video like this? About the time it takes to fetch a camera and go to a computer with the game installed, which I'd assume there are many of at the Aventurine offices. The footage is gameplay from the game they were already making and testing anyway, so that was there regardless of a video and needed no preparation. No need to touch up or edit or use special effect transitions or be extremely selective on the footage used, not if they're confident in their game and its quality 4 months (at most) before launch.

 

qft

Ah, but I cant help myself.  I have to actually add something to the discussion, sorry.  I think Silvarch makes a great point, and one that carries over to other aspects as well.  I speak of the false choice scenerio that is so often presented here.  As if there are ONLY two possible choices that are mutually exclusive.  "You want the video or the game".  "You want the game on time or bug free". etc...

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

 

And you can only assume what they are doing. 

 Still can't believe it takes them this long to make a video, after all they said they were only polishing the game up and is ready for beta (again).

I dono gathering over 1 TB of raw footage could take a while.. and if they built a city from scratch with no gm cheats.. pure playtesting.. that could take a while
 

Resource gathering

building the city then

then taking time to prepare for war

crafting

then a siege yea.. its very possible..

Originally posted by Xxeon

Originally posted by mike470

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

Originally posted by Theodgrim

Originally posted by Silvarch

I fail to understand why people think that making a game and making a decent video are mutually exclusive to the point where they have to significantly sacrifice one for the other. It's not a movie, they don't have to collect hours of footage to then edit it together into a cohesive mesh, not if the game is feature complete and working smoothly anyway.

Case in point, this video:

www.youtube.com/watch

Showcases a lot of the features of the game and consequently proves there's at least something to play, and the game wasn't even feature complete back then. Total preparation time for a video like this? About the time it takes to fetch a camera and go to a computer with the game installed, which I'd assume there are many of at the Aventurine offices. The footage is gameplay from the game they were already making and testing anyway, so that was there regardless of a video and needed no preparation. No need to touch up or edit or use special effect transitions or be extremely selective on the footage used, not if they're confident in their game and its quality 4 months (at most) before launch.

 

qft

Ah, but I cant help myself.  I have to actually add something to the discussion, sorry.  I think Silvarch makes a great point, and one that carries over to other aspects as well.  I speak of the false choice scenerio that is so often presented here.  As if there are ONLY two possible choices that are mutually exclusive.  "You want the video or the game".  "You want the game on time or bug free". etc...

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

 

And you can only assume what they are doing. 

 Still can't believe it takes them this long to make a video, after all they said they were only polishing the game up and is ready for beta (again).

I dono gathering over 1 TB of raw footage could take a while.. and if they built a city from scratch with no gm cheats.. pure playtesting.. that could take a while
 

Resource gathering

building the city then

then taking time to prepare for war

crafting

then a siege yea.. its very possible..

Since when was all of this going to be in the video?

Also, this should be happening daily these tests.  So it SHOULDN'T take 3 weeks to make a video of a feature complete game.

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

We all have an excellent idea of what they aren't doing though, which is finishing their game.

7 years. No game. No beta. And at the end of this month... take a wild guess... Yup, no Footage.

Originally posted by mike470

Originally posted by Xxeon

Originally posted by mike470

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

Originally posted by Theodgrim

Originally posted by Silvarch

I fail to understand why people think that making a game and making a decent video are mutually exclusive to the point where they have to significantly sacrifice one for the other. It's not a movie, they don't have to collect hours of footage to then edit it together into a cohesive mesh, not if the game is feature complete and working smoothly anyway.

Case in point, this video:

www.youtube.com/watch

Showcases a lot of the features of the game and consequently proves there's at least something to play, and the game wasn't even feature complete back then. Total preparation time for a video like this? About the time it takes to fetch a camera and go to a computer with the game installed, which I'd assume there are many of at the Aventurine offices. The footage is gameplay from the game they were already making and testing anyway, so that was there regardless of a video and needed no preparation. No need to touch up or edit or use special effect transitions or be extremely selective on the footage used, not if they're confident in their game and its quality 4 months (at most) before launch.

 

qft

Ah, but I cant help myself.  I have to actually add something to the discussion, sorry.  I think Silvarch makes a great point, and one that carries over to other aspects as well.  I speak of the false choice scenerio that is so often presented here.  As if there are ONLY two possible choices that are mutually exclusive.  "You want the video or the game".  "You want the game on time or bug free". etc...

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

 

And you can only assume what they are doing. 

 Still can't believe it takes them this long to make a video, after all they said they were only polishing the game up and is ready for beta (again).

I dono gathering over 1 TB of raw footage could take a while.. and if they built a city from scratch with no gm cheats.. pure playtesting.. that could take a while
 

Resource gathering

building the city then

then taking time to prepare for war

crafting

then a siege yea.. its very possible..

 

Since when was all of this going to be in the video?

Also, this should be happening daily these tests.  So it SHOULDN'T take 3 weeks to make a video of a feature complete game.

like I said maybe the vid well be decent think about it over 1 TB of raw game play footage meaning no picky choosy. like the other vids have been (plus they been gathering  footage from the last few months. of the playtesting going on. you really have to kinda firgure this out on your own because i doubt your going to understand where im coming from.

its should be comprehensive. i think they just wanted to wait until they had a complete game before showing us most of the stuff. which i believe they said in a faq some where. would make sence..

would you just give this year. i almost prefer it thsi way than the way funcom did it. because advertising and hyping the game sure doesnt make for a good game it seems

Originally posted by Xxeon

would you just give this year. i almost prefer it thsi way than the way funcom did it. because advertising and hyping the game sure doesnt make for a good game it seems

neither does developing your game for 7 years...

If this project were being developed by anyone else it would have been cancelled years ago.

Originally posted by hakubylicks

Originally posted by Xxeon

would you just give this year. i almost prefer it thsi way than the way funcom did it. because advertising and hyping the game sure doesnt make for a good game it seems

 

neither does developing your game for 7 years...

If this project were being developed by anyone else it would have been cancelled years ago.

then go post on fallen earth forums. seems to be working just fine for them thats 7-8 years in dev

Fe is my backup game i kinda watch that.

O there engine might be better than dfs because they dont have pocket poneys or anything like that.. and no loading times at all.

only thing darkfall has a few more features than FE Im going to try bothg ames : 0 going to try to get into alpha testing too

I have no idea if this game will ever release.  Some of you people need to think a bit though.  Why would a company continue to go at such lengths to just make models to show off?  That really just does not make sense to me and probably most of you if you think about it. 

Now on to the tecnical viability I have no idea and figure this is prob the biggest hold up.

I don't really appreciate how the devs are treating us, but there could be reasons for it.  This is the main reason I do not look at this game much and possibly never even play it if it does come out.  In the end if there is good reason, then it's cool.  Right now I look at this game with caution.  If they treat us the way they do now, how can we expect them to treat us after the game releases?

completly diffrent time frames for the game esspiccly if they hired some customer support people

It is releasing this year, right?  I know that comes off in a smart ass kind of way, but you need to think more about that.

Would you do stuff like this if you were a company about to release a game in 6months?

Originally posted by slippyC

It is releasing this year, right?  I know that comes off in a smart ass kind of way, but you need to think more about that.

Would you do stuff like this if you were a company about to release a game in 6months?

yep if im suppose to be working on the game and not babying forums members..

Somebody needs to.

That's what companies do...

Anyway, there is a difference between babysitting and not doing what you say you are or continually making up excuses why you aren't going to do what you said.  

You can not dispute that bro....

Originally posted by slippyC

You can not dispute that bro....

XXeon will tell you on Jan 1st 2009 that the game will ship in 2008.

Its how the faithful are about DF.

Originally posted by mike470

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by Polarization

Originally posted by Theodgrim

Originally posted by Silvarch

I fail to understand why people think that making a game and making a decent video are mutually exclusive to the point where they have to significantly sacrifice one for the other. It's not a movie, they don't have to collect hours of footage to then edit it together into a cohesive mesh, not if the game is feature complete and working smoothly anyway.

Case in point, this video:

www.youtube.com/watch

Showcases a lot of the features of the game and consequently proves there's at least something to play, and the game wasn't even feature complete back then. Total preparation time for a video like this? About the time it takes to fetch a camera and go to a computer with the game installed, which I'd assume there are many of at the Aventurine offices. The footage is gameplay from the game they were already making and testing anyway, so that was there regardless of a video and needed no preparation. No need to touch up or edit or use special effect transitions or be extremely selective on the footage used, not if they're confident in their game and its quality 4 months (at most) before launch.

 

qft

Ah, but I cant help myself.  I have to actually add something to the discussion, sorry.  I think Silvarch makes a great point, and one that carries over to other aspects as well.  I speak of the false choice scenerio that is so often presented here.  As if there are ONLY two possible choices that are mutually exclusive.  "You want the video or the game".  "You want the game on time or bug free". etc...

The logical fallacy of a false dichotomy in my opinion has been the basis of most or nearly all of the excuses and justifications made about this game and its company’s by the developers and their supporters for the last 7+ years.

For example apparently as has already been mentioned

They cant make video’s or update the community regularly because they are to busy working on the game.

Or they can either release the game when they said they would or when its perfect and totally amazing and revolutionary.

Which of course is clearly absurd, but this has been applied to defend against almost every conceivable criticism imaginable.

They don’t have pre launch advertisement because they will start to advertise after launch or at launch.

They don’t have any form of marketing because the game will market itself.

They don’t have any mainstream media coverage because they can release information themselves.

They don’t need publishers/distributors because they can self publish/distribute.

They don’t have to be in public beta because they are in internal beta.

They don’t have outside investment because they are privately financed.

They don’t have to show the game before its launched or starts open beta because we will see it then.

They don’t announce any definite time frames because they are making the best game they can that will only be released when they say its ready.

They don’t have to conform to normal industry practices or even normal business practices because they are doing things their own way.

They don’t have good pre launch community/customer relations because they will have good post launch community/customer relations.

The developers don’t need to have previous experience and credentials in game development because they are passionate and dedicated.

Razorwax/Aventurine don’t need significant resources and/or partners to develop Darkfall because they are efficient and revolutionary.

And they don’t need to already of done or be doing most of the things related to an expected launch schedule in 5 months time because they still have 5 months to do all those related things.

 

You haven't a clue what the are doing, and can only assume what they aren't. So what is the point of this rant 90% of it is off topic.

 

And you can only assume what they are doing. 

 Still can't believe it takes them this long to make a video, after all they said they were only polishing the game up and is ready for beta (again).

Thats right but I am not assuming.... Another Vid would be nice but , I don't support the conspiracy theory theres no rush .

Just remembered I need to get over to COS and have a look at how it is going.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by slippyC

You can not dispute that bro....

 

XXeon will tell you on Jan 1st 2009 that the game will ship in 2008.

Its how the faithful are about DF.

 

When have i said it will ship in 2008 ?

Originally posted by Isane 

 I don't support the conspiracy theory .

Can I  laugh at you when Darkfall fails miserably?

Actually it already failed a long time ago. It's just that the people building it haven't let anyone know yet.

Originally posted by GMny

Originally posted by Isane 

 I don't support the conspiracy theory .

Can I  laugh at you when Darkfall fails miserably?

Actually it already failed a long time ago. It's just that the people building it haven't let anyone know yet.

to bad you like just making thing sup and have no idea what your saying