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News & Features Discussion  » Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning: Correspondent - About Those Cuts...

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97 posts found
  JK-Kanosi

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/15/06
Posts: 1359

8/02/08 7:31:56 PM#81

Ravkeen,

You are so arrogant and ignorant that you can't even see that you are whining about other people whining and that your post is equally worthless as every other persons post in this thread.

MMORPG's w/ Max level characters: DAoC, SWG, & WoW

Currently Playing: WAR
Preferred Playstyle: Roleplay/adventurous, in a sandbox game.

  Ravkeen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/15/07
Posts: 311

I Salute U.

8/02/08 7:41:50 PM#82
Originally posted by JK-Kanosi

Ravkeen,

You are so arrogant and ignorant that you can't even see that you are whining about other people whining and that your post is equally worthless as every other persons post in this thread.

Thank you I needed that laugh . But on the real the only reason I'm on this forum is to was time why I'm at work I could really give a damn about these forum. But they entertain me why I'm at work bored out my mine. So am I whining nah because I could really care less about what people opinion are I'm here for the entertainment but thanks.

Hi I'm Ravkeen!

Ravkeen 50Nightshade 11L0
Now Playing : Dark Age of Camelot

"America is not at war, the US Military is at war, America is at the mall."

  yegnats

Novice Member

Joined: 3/01/07
Posts: 158

I get high without joints
I get drunk without booze
You should ask me why
What is there to lose?

8/03/08 7:35:57 AM#83
Originally posted by Oben
Originally posted by Magter

Originally posted by brostyn

I was really eager to play an Orc Choppa. From the day I heard about WAR I envisioned myself as an Orc. Now, I don't know what I'll play as I don't enjoy pure tanks. I'm disappointed to say the least.


 

Aww poor kid...what you didn't know is that it would have been boring to play WAR as a choppa or it would have been underpowered. Say thank you to Mythic for taking it away.

 

Actually from multiple people playing closed beta, they actually said it was too overpowered.  (Speculation, I haven't played it yet)

 

Hooray to Mythic for possibly cutting a class because it was overpowered and they needed more time to nerf it privately, rather than publically, royally pissing off people that play the class. It's no fun playing a game where certain classes can mop the floor with you, giving you no chance of fighting back, like Warlocks and Rogues in WoW, still, nearly 4 years after launch, they are still overpowered.

Once you go go whack, you'll never go back.

What is this "whack", you say? Check out the links!
http://www.thenewmystics.com
http://www.joyrevolution.com
http://www.thenewecstatics.co.uk

  tovin

Novice Member

Joined: 9/18/04
Posts: 4

8/03/08 11:00:01 AM#84

The only thing I can think  of is quoting Scott Hartsman's Blog:

Customers are orders of magnitude more forgiving about absent than they are about suck.

He's right, and while it's painful for me to have such a thing happen, as a gamer and Mythic fan, (ugh EA)...I can deal with it - IF when I play, it's done right.  Otherwise, it's an even bigger mistake, lol.

T

  Alienovrlord

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/28/07
Posts: 1528

8/03/08 11:08:31 PM#85

Excellent article that points out the whining of so many in the MMORPG community.

It's understandable why many MMORPG players can't grasp this.  They're used to paying for bug-filled, half-baked garbage and telling everyone else how great it is.    They'll buy junk no matter how bad and convince themselves how great their chosen game is.     So long as the developers keeps dishing out lies and false promises, they'll keep lapping it up. 

Mythic is trying something new, produce a quality MMORPG instead of making players pay to beta-test.   And they're trying to do it without expending the incredible amount of resources Blizzard did with WoW.     And they're trying to be open about it instead of dishing out lies. 

It's another example how the MMORPG industry is changing and change always upsets those can't cope because they're stuck in the past.    Imagine how upset they're going to be when MMORPGs stop being tedious, part-time job timesinks and are actually FUN?    That could happen sooner than they think.

  Nova62

Novice Member

Joined: 5/19/06
Posts: 8

Time heals all things give time time

8/04/08 1:38:40 AM#86

Great article. It sounds like Mythic is being honest with themselves and the public. I can’t fault anyone for being honest. I think mythic bit off more than they could chew, but I give them credit for not releasing something that they didn’t think was up to par. I will have no problem giving them my money.

  Thor_Leifson

Novice Member

Joined: 10/19/06
Posts: 85

I''m opinionated, literate, and a game designer. I''m liable to say something you won''t like.

8/04/08 6:53:33 AM#87

Some choice quotes and my choice responses...


Originally posted by grimfall
Why couldn't Mythic spend the time (aka money) to make these cities and other classes fun? (The article) comes off quite fanboyish.


Originally posted by Tyres100
Again we see the same thing happening where <insert game company> announces a release date and screws themselves. ... Taking mid development content out that was already stated for release does not help with bargaining.


Originally posted by DeserttFoxx
Sure some people will applaud them for their decision but i am not one of them, i read articles like this as just a fancy way of saying the game isnt finished but we are launching it anyway.

So, let's discuss the fault with this logic of "you're releasing too soon."

If every developer of MMOs held on to their title until it was polished to perfection, no game would ever be released. They would languish for eternity as the bleeding edge of technology continually forced them to update graphics or a shift in player demographics demanded new paradigms within a game.

At some point, and this is an incredibly important concept for everyone to grasp, a developer and a publisher HAVE to say, "Enough is enough. We've put in an amazing amount of work, the game is as polished as it's going to get until we have hundreds of thousands of active players trying to break the system. It's time to release and move on to the next stage of development."

This doesn't mean that the publisher and/or developer are throwing up their hands and saying "we're going to release an inferior products." What's being said is, "it's time to release what we have and let it grow organically from here on out."

In fact, the best companies, like Mythic, are constantly updating and modifying the game to fit player needs (note I say needs, not wants). Development of a MMO does not end when a game releases the way it does when a 'standard' title releases.

If you're holding your breath till a MMO is 'finished' to be released, you're going to die of asphyxiation. I don't care who the publisher or developer is.


Originally posted by Onecrazyguy
I'm not buying the "we're cutting 4 to give you 2 great ones"... The bottom line is they are running out of time and have to cut scope. I would highly doubt that they are putting more time into the other 2 cities, it's more likely the case that pulling the 4 saves them time they need to just finish the game.

Given the company's honesty in their press releases and the large numbers of players in the beta, it's fairly obvious that they ARE working to improve the two primary cities now. Equally obvious is that they deliberately dropped the other cities and classes exactly because it saves them the time they need to polish the game before release.

Wait...isn't that what the press release was all about? Oh, yeah, but then, you'd have to have read the press release to get that bit of info.


  Vortigon

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/12/06
Posts: 727

RMT is for weak people.

8/04/08 9:25:47 AM#88
Originally posted by fansede  

  I just can't wrap my puny brain around the fact they had the resources of EA behind them and they could not pull it off.

 

It's simple really, Games have budgets, and time scales and targets.  And money is not infinite.  They are running a business not a dream factory.

  User Deleted
8/04/08 10:29:55 AM#89
Originally posted by Order66
Originally posted by Arawon

Hope there is an open beta.

 

There will be

fileplanet though


 

Screw fileplanet, and screw War online for trying to force people to pay for accounts there to try the future open beta.

I for one will not be, because I refuse to pay for some fileplanet account I do not want.

  Jetrpg

Novice Member

Joined: 4/22/06
Posts: 2392

8/04/08 2:28:31 PM#90
Originally posted by Volkmar  

 Also, how nice will it be starting as an Imperial character and not having tanks in the newbie areas? "But people can travel from the other areas as well!"

Yes, indeed they can! But! first we do not know how easy it is to do so, reports talks of a long run to move zone, second, WHY would they?

 

Really, but they have said how fast it is.  Look it up.

However, the question on why would they is a good one.

 

Games are not about how much $$ you have (it helps) nor much of anythign else like that they are about magic. That is right i said magic.

Basically, the top dudes come of with rough ideas (and this concept play out largely effecting the entire game), and they choose what engine to use which also has giant effects on the game. Then you have all the rest of the people who work on it day to day. It often about the direction the tops lead these people, however, its also about how much they want what they are doing to be great. Its the care and love . Finally, you have luck somethings thing come together, sometimes they don't.

"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine

  WarOnslaught

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/08
Posts: 12

Women are like stones, skip the flat ones.

8/04/08 4:30:19 PM#91

Ok, so yea the classes cut sucked especially because I really wanted to play  a Black Guard.  I have even posted a few topics of them in the forums.  I move on, i'll just have to play a Chosen or a Disciple no biggy because according to Mythic they are all fun classes and if its as easy to get to tier 4 content as they say I can have a few alts. 

The reason I am posting though is I am tired of reading through all of these QQ  whiny people posting about the class cuts.  They dont know anything about the game and have not been following it and some even claim to have been in the beta but know less about the game they where "playing" then I do.  The cites are all there and are HUGE, but you can not siege them.  The Order wont be allowed in that area, same for destruction.  So it is in fact really really easy for Mythic to put the siege content in because they moved what was the final cities to tier 3 areas.  That is what  really pisses me off.  They didnt "cut" anything they moved what was gonna be tier 4 into tier 3.  Then they  worked their asses off to make what is now tier 4 which is according to dev. videos and posts  more then twice as large with many unlockables that make them "living".  Like unlocking sewers as a dungeon. 

I know most of you play WoW so I will put it in little kids terms, in order to run Black Temple you have to win in PvP.  That system is a thousand times better, you wont see elite guilds running around in the best gear and being elitiests in PvE and not give a shit about PvP because you HAVE to PvP to get the good PvE gear which will obviously dropped from the King in Altdorf and Destruction equiv.   

So, in case you missed anything, they did not "cut"  content from the game  to release later its all still there in tier 3 and made from scratch tier 4 with wayyyy  more stuff in it then they could have dreamed that the original final 6 sieges would have had.  Personally I wouldnt want to invest time in a Black Guard only to find them weak and get buffed so much only to get nerfed again and so on.   So stop crying and get ready for what appears to be the best release an MMORPG can get. 

War is coming, are you ready?      

Waaaagggghhhhhhh!!!!!!

Never say "opps" in raid chat, say ahhhhhh interesting.

  Belsameth

Novice Member

Joined: 3/06/04
Posts: 195

8/04/08 4:45:06 PM#92

Haven't rad all replies so mine might be redunent. Sorry if that's the case :)

First all, nice article. I agree completely with your sentiments about the expectations of the average gamer.

One of the forum posters here has the sig "Nerf Paper, Scissors are fine" - Rock.

Which I think aptly describe most of us.

 

Anyway, I do worry a lot for the pulling out of the classes.

Mostly because this game is based around racial pairings.

Orcs vs Dwarfs will be fine. They both lost their melee dps so we have balance there (Tho 2 gobs and only 1 orc career?)

 

Dark Elves vs High Elves and Empire vs Chaos will suffer tho, because those pairings are unbalanced and require assistence from other realms. Lower levels wil be more difficult because of it.

Mostly it seems the DE that gets shafted. Empire still has Altdorf to draw people to their pairing. The DE's however...

 

Either way. A bold move and I really hope it works out for them.

(I agree with pulling the cities btw. no bad word from me on that front)

belsameth Xfire Miniprofile
  Typhyny

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/06
Posts: 21

8/05/08 1:07:18 PM#93

Your article was great and well said.  Quality should always come first.  Quantity can always be added.

Their PvP model of RvR has always been my favorite aspect of DAoC. It is so well done that even those who generally don't like PvP still ike RvR.

I was a longtime DAoC player and I would play any game made by Mythic.  They are one of the few game companies that truly impresses me.  Unlike many other companies they listen and care about their gaming community and the lines of communication with them are always open. 

Considering the state of arrival of most new games to come out lately I am glad that Mythic is not following in their footsteps.  I don't believe anyone wants to pay to beta test a game and that is the state of some of the popular currently released games.  As a consumer I expect that when that long awaited box arrives I can install my game, log in, and play.  That is not to say that an unxpected bug or two might not show up and that would be acceptable.  However, if it were frought with bugs, broken quests, NPC's, crafting, etc... that is unacceptable. (For those out there that say, "Almost every game comes out that way."  That may be true but that doesn't mean we should make it OK for game companies to do it.  If we do they will never stop and we will continue to pay to beta test games.)  I for one am through paying to beta test games.  After several bad experiences I vowed to never pre-order a game again.  I did break that vow and pre-ordered the WAR CE.  Why?  Because I trust Mythic.  That's it.  There is no other reason.  There are only 1 or  2 other game companies I would break that vow for.  I don't expect perfection from any game at release but I expect it to be adequate.  Unfortunately the release state of some current games doesn't even qualify as barely passible much less adequate.  Mythic has made some mistakes but they learned from them and fixed them.  They didn't just throw up their hands and say, "Oh well, deal with it or don't play" as some other companies have done.  I trust Mythic because of my past experience with them and because I know that they care about the quality of the game and my enjoyment of it. 

I'm excited for the release of WAR and couting the days till my box arives.

My IQ is 145 - Free-IQTest.net - MENSA Test

  Deadzo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/11/07
Posts: 30

8/06/08 12:57:32 AM#94

 

I like how you give credit to mythic for being so "honest and true to the players", for simply stating cuts in a pre-meditated and pre-planned anouncement. 

You take his statement as fact and gospel, and don't even assume anything else could be going on behind the scenes.

If they wanted you to wait until retail and then pull the content out, they would have

If they wanted you to think they were being "honest and upfront" by announcing it ahead of time, they would have.

 

Companies lie and manipulate: its what they DO

Your accolades are equivalent to giving out participation trophies.

 

Then you turn around and scold the players, (the consumers who buy these pigs-in-pokes, and finance these monkey-buisnesses, blindly hoping the product will be 1/1000th as good as it's billed to be)  for asking too much from the poor company.

Right, because it was me saying that the game would have this and that, and that it would be the new god, so preorder now.    How dare I assume I might actually get what I'm paying for.  How glib to think I'll have the fun that the company is enticing me with.

 

I still say it indicates that they don't know what they're doing/what they want the game to be, but they'll nevertheless have 3+ expansions with the removed content.  That's not something applaudable.

L2Hump Mythic Leg more.

  Axum

Novice Member

Joined: 7/17/06
Posts: 896

What if?

8/06/08 1:04:22 AM#95

Ahem..........

 

Deadzo

 

On the case of content cuts. Might i ask if you have played WoW?...nvm i don't even have to ask cause we all know that everyone has atleast tried it. There was a time in WoW when i was logged onto a server and Darnassus came under attack...I told everyone about it, and they said "Who cares, we don't even use that city."

Now that is what makes me see the 2 capital cities as a good thing, because although it may not look like a High elf or Dwarf city, it is YOUR countries city. You must work together as a Community , as a REALM to defend it.

This draws the community close together.

Which i find more important than two measly cities which i will barely visit because i have no affiliation to them.

 

On the case of the cut out classes,

Why give the players a chance to be dissapointed with something?

I would rather them take the classes out and try to fix them, instead of leaving them in and having no one want to use them.

  User Deleted
8/06/08 5:05:00 PM#96

Haha People can grumble all they want..I just want to know how much is that expansion pack? Oh u didnt know? What they cut will be in the expansion pack.. Really polish this time..

  Lithdov

Novice Member

Joined: 1/19/07
Posts: 174

Wow. This is graphic.

8/17/08 8:46:54 PM#97

The problem with this whole "Defender Guy," z0mg stop complaining, bitching editorial is that it's based on the assumption that the four cut cities and classes will later be implemented, when there is nothing to support that belief. In fact, all that Mythic has said in regards to this cut content is that it will not be making its way into the game at any point in the future. The latest developer diary on the front page of the Warhammer Online website all but confirms that the other capitals will never make it into the game, as the dev team has decided that they want to force all end-game RvR to be focused on two capitals instead of spread out across six. As far as the classes go, they've provided absolutely no real information as to why the classes were cut in the first place (sorry, if you want me to buy your game and pay for it every month, just saying "They weren't cool enough to us, cry moar," doesn't cut it), and no information has been provided to indicate that they will ever be reinstated in the game or replaced with new classes instead. Rather, all we've heard from Mythic and from the parade of Defender Guy posts in response to this question is that we should just be happy with the fact that we're getting twenty classes and to quit bitching.

If you want a real harsh death penalty, go play Russian Roulet. - Hamzal

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