Lord of the Rings Online

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

 

Originally posted by openedge1

 

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

considering the fact that my LOTRO server is constantly seeing new players join, and old players come back, I can't say the game is losing players. Seems to be growing rapidly.

Vanguard players say the same thing...

 

Interesting

  I wouldn't doubt it. Probably more people trying V out now that it has been out for a while, and has had some work done to it.

 

I've noticed a lot of ex-wow players lately starting up LOTRO. People are getting tired of it, and looking for other games.

I'm in that category. I decided to give Vanguard a try recently to see how it's coming along... and because it's one that I hadn't really checked out beyond beta.

I *did* see a fairly healthy number of low level players - I mean, in a game world that vast, there's going to be alot of space between regardless.. but I crossed paths and even shared mobs (read: competed for) a few times.

I think it has alot of promise. There's alot there to do and learn. It has some very interesting environments and some rather interesting little "touches".  The whole "3 Spheres" concept is just a fancy way of packaging what is already in many games... well the Adventuring and Crafting part anyway... the Diplomacy aspect is rather new in my experience; I wasn't that taken with it, personally.

Unfortunately, no matter how good or polished it might become with time, its history is going to create an ever uphill battle for it, I think. Same with Matrix Online, same with post NGE/CU SWG it would seem.

In the end... I don't know bout numbers.. .but I do know that I see people literally everywhere I go now in LoTRO. Always people in OOC or LFF, or what-not. They're not wall-to-wall, thankfully.. But the game is active as it's ever been in my experience.

As far as how a game is a rehash of all that's come before it.. I think it breaks down to two things:

1. Basic Mechanics
2. Implementation
3. Elusive sense of "what players want"

#1 The basic mechanics part can be seen in pretty much any game genre. Most all FPSs will have many basic game mechanics in common. Same with RPGs, same with RTSs, same with Adventure games, and same with MMOs, and so on.

I think the difference comes in #2 - implementation. This seems to be something more nebulous and not so easily "defined". Could almost describe it as how the game "feels".

LoTRO may well have many of the same, or similar, gameplay mechanics to WoW - just as WoW does to those before it and so forth. Arguing who stole what from who is pointless. They all borrow from each other, and always will. In a sense, it boils down to "if it works, why change it?"

That said... WoW bores me to tears - I'm not knocking the game. I acknowledge that it's a polished game and very well-executed. The gameplay, however - the implementation of those core mechanics that are common among MMOs - just doesn't grab me. It feels too "hurried", like despite my efforts to take my time and not level quickly, I am anyway. So many of the game's mechanics seem to conspire to that end. The world design feels "small" to me... very "game like". Again.. not knocking the game.. this is my opinion.

However.. in LoTRO, you have many of the same basic game mechanics as you see in numerous other MMOs - as others have said, Turbine isn't really breaking any new ground - though they are certainly implementing some new twists. I recognize that all too easily. So to me, it has to be something more.

To me, it's the implementation. How the game feels.. how it's designed. While WoW to me feels like a game environment that I'm playing in, LoTRO feels like another world that my character lives in. That's a huge difference for me, especially as I very much prefer the latter.

I don't feel like I'm being pushed along at all in LoTRO. Heck, I'm playing the same character for almost a year, with only a couple months away, and I just hit 35 today. Despite that, there's not a moment of my time online that hasn't been filled doing *something* entertaining. The world feels vast and begging to be explored. To me, LoTRO "feels right" for what I look for in a MMO.

Then there's point #3... Which basically, to me, seems that while many players will say they want "something new" - I don't think many really know what it is exactly that they want. I mean, have you ever asked someone arguing for something new and different to articulate exactly what that is? I have, and many times they can't. I don't think it's so much a longing for "new and different" than it is boredom, or becoming jaded, with the "old and familiar".

In many cases, I've seen games come out that try and push the envelope, or go against the typical mechanics of their given genre - only to be met with hostility by players, who then want the game to be more like the games they've been playing, even when they were those looking for "something new".

So I don't know... I think it's one of those "you don't know what you want, but you'll know it when you see it" type things.

Originally posted by openedge1

 

I do want to note that I think you may be wrong on AoC though. As this game may be the first to "revolutionize" the MMO, by allowing some features not available and never tried in MMO's

Drunken Brawling  - drunkenness is already implemented in a couple of games (e.g. lotro). Othern than the visual effects, if it has any affect on fight stats - that's - again - old story.

Real time combat - Neocron had it in 2002. Heck, EVE "almost" has it. A couple of smaller MMO's since. Needs heavy optimization, fragile subject.

Spell weaving - Saga of Ryzom, stanza system

Single player tutorial - Sorry?  Every single MMO I played had this. EQ2, WoW, Saga, Neocron, EVE, Lotro, Vanguard... every single one. That's the *least* revolutionary thing I could probably think of if I had a whole day to think about it....

More mature material (kinda like M&M's with an extra M...YUM)

Maturity as revolutionary? C'mon..... also, I'd much more prefer maturity in the playerbase, than in the subject. It is just another fantasy/comics IP!

All in all, there is absolutely nothing revolutionary in what you have listed above. Sorry to break your bubble.....

DB

Revolutionize is a relative term to be sure and I am not keen of turning this into one game vs another game. Tastes are a subjective matter.

AoC does have a zoned world with multiple copies of a zone if too many people are in one zone. There is no free roaming and there are indications from beat leaks that invisible and visible walls are heavily used to channel play and questing. NPC's taking a leak, topless females (aka soft pr0n) and looped off heads are different but I hardly see it as a big revolutionizing plus.

Then again I am one of those that are happy playing LOTRO.

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

 

Originally posted by openedge1

 

I do want to note that I think you may be wrong on AoC though. As this game may be the first to "revolutionize" the MMO, by allowing some features not available and never tried in MMO's

Drunken Brawling  - drunkenness is already implemented in a couple of games (e.g. lotro). Othern than the visual effects, if it has any affect on fight stats - that's - again - old story.

Real time combat - Neocron had it in 2002. Heck, EVE "almost" has it. A couple of smaller MMO's since. Needs heavy optimization, fragile subject.

Spell weaving - Saga of Ryzom, stanza system

Single player tutorial - Sorry?  Every single MMO I played had this. EQ2, WoW, Saga, Neocron, EVE, Lotro, Vanguard... every single one. That's the *least* revolutionary thing I could probably think of if I had a whole day to think about it....

More mature material (kinda like M&M's with an extra M...YUM)

Maturity as revolutionary? C'mon..... also, I'd much more prefer maturity in the playerbase, than in the subject. It is just another fantasy/comics IP!

All in all, there is absolutely nothing revolutionary in what you have listed above. Sorry to break your bubble.....

DB

Heck the opening instance for a new character in LoTRO is single player; just you and the NPCs you're going through it with. That's in the form of a tutorial.

Again there is very very... very... little that can clearly be thought of as new or unique in the MMO genre - Designers/Developers are merely finding different ways of packaging it.

I was thinking on trying it out but I found I can't buy it in my country. Is not on stores and is not for digitall download or only key purchase so, why to try a game I can't purchase?

Originally posted by Illyrian

Revolutionize is a relative term to be sure and I am not keen of turning this into one game vs another game. Tastes are a subjective matter.

 

AoC does have a zoned world with multiple copies of a zone if too many people are in one zone. There is no free roaming and there are indications from beat leaks that invisible and visible walls are heavily used to channel play and questing. NPC's taking a leak, topless females (aka soft pr0n) and looped off heads are different but I hardly see it as a big revolutionizing plus.

 

Then again I am one of those that are happy playing LOTRO.

Naw... I agree with you. I look at the topless women thing and all that and it just says "Gimmick" to me. Like the ability to beat up prostitutes and all that in GTA games. It's fluff - it might help the "setting" of the game - or rather serve it and bring some authenticity, but it isn't critical to the gameplay, and it isnt' revolutionary. Now, AoC might be a helluva lot of fun *besides* that - and that's what matters in the end.

If drunken brawling is revolutionary then I guess so is drunken fence running in LoTRO's "Bullroarer's Run".

I have faith in Funcom to create an interesting game, having been a fan of theirs from Anarchy Online and their *brilliant* single player games "The Longest Journey" and "Dreamfall". If Ragnar Tornquist is involved in any way, you can almost guarantee the writing is going to be very good... at least I think so.

But yeah, I don't see topless women as "revolutionary" at all. At most, it serves the setting and helps with authenticity.

 Personally, I'm much more interested in another MMO they're working on, "The Secret World", but that's neither here nor there.

Originally posted by alakram

I was thinking on trying it out but I found I can't buy it in my country. Is not on stores and is not for digitall download or only key purchase so, why to try a game I can't purchase?

By the way, I actually bought my copy online and shipped from UK to Hungary. It was actually cheaper this way then buying it in a local store here. Up until today, LOTRO can be freely bought in practically every games shop or supermarket in Hungary (Media Markt, Tesco, Auchan etc - all of them are selling it)

DB

Originally posted by DonnieBrasco

 

Originally posted by alakram

I was thinking on trying it out but I found I can't buy it in my country. Is not on stores and is not for digitall download or only key purchase so, why to try a game I can't purchase?

LOTRO can't be bought in Spain?
Allow me not to believe this... :)

 

By the way, I actually bought my copy online and shipped from UK to Hungary. It was actually cheaper this way then buying it in a local store here. Up until today, LOTRO can be freely bought in practically every games shop or supermarket in Hungary (Media Markt, Tesco, Auchan etc - all of them are selling it)

DB

Anyways, alakram might have been talking of AoC as that game was mentioned above.