General Discussion

Having been amused by Serling's wall-of-text commentary on CoH/V, I feel the need to comment on them.

Serling is a good vocal representation of how some players felt about the power nerfs that occurred for some archetypes (ATs) over two years ago. The biggest problem the game faced then was the ATs were horribly unbalanced in some instances. Fire Tanks could take on a whole map of spawns by themselves with no risk. Post lvl 30 or so, Fire Controllers were unstoppable due to their Fire Imps (which has already been mentioned in another post). And there were other overpowered behaviours.

At the same time, other ATs couldn't keep up - as Serling comments, Blasters (although popular) couldn't keep up with certain Tank / Controller damage outputs and had trouble surviving the same situations. So a number of game changes were made that flattened this powergap difference considerably. Some players really, really hated the changes and left. Typically they said that CoH no longer let them be superheroes anymore.

However, imo, the fact that a Tank actually now requires a team to take on a map full of enemies is a good thing and good to the long-term game health of CoH. Yes, some overpowered builds still exist, but they aren't as exceptionally overpowered as they once were. And imo you still feel like a superhero when taking on 3 (or more) enemies at the one time and winning, or sending an opponent spinning over a bannister in full ragdoll mode.

Stealth suppression is no big thing. It just means you can't 'click the glowie' while an enemy is standing right next to you. Serling's comparison of the 'free xp' of stealth supression to the drop-a-mission option isn't valid, given that you have to wait 7 days between a single automatic mission drop (which was put in place to help players out of bugged / problematic missions) but could conceivably run 10 stealth missions an hour, especially with the radio / newspaper mission systems in place. Even with stealth suppression, you could probably do very well if you just wanted to grind out stealth missions.

As for Serling's comments on the state of the game today based on 5 minutes of play: seriously, that's a weaksauce argument. A short-resub after a (long?) break isn't enough to say, "OMG, this game is broken because I can't pwnzz0r the first mobs I came across!". CoH is no longer for Serling - that's fine. But talking about the game two years ago (as well as the tired, tired commentary on Jack Emmert) has little do to with what CoH/V is today.

Also, comparing GW to CoH/V is another weak comparision, since GW is a F2P (after box purchase) PVP orientated game, while CoH/V is a sub-based PVE game. GW can say they have 4 million players since they sold 4 million boxes, but I don't believe they have ever released an active player number. CoH/V has never released  its number of box sales so a direct comparison with GW isn't possible, but they do have (at last measure) 150k odd subs as well as releasing 10 free content updates since launch (I6, or the CoV launch, did have some features that were free to all players, even if they didn't buy CoV). Sub numbers for CoH/V have actually gone up in the past year. Virtue and Freedom are the most populated servers.

So, all in all (and imo) CoH/V isn't the awful nerfed game that Serling likes to make out. Sure, it's not perfect - if all you do is grind missions, then you are going to get very bored - but I've found playing it a few hours a week is pretty fun (and I've been doing that since beta). The community is pretty good, so most pick up groups are at least functional (if not fun to be in) and you can solo as easily as group (and may prefer to solo if you want to maximise your changes of getting salvage drops).

If you are at all interested in CoH/V, do the trial 14 days. At least you can then decide for yourself.

Originally posted by Serling

And yes, there are people addicted enough to the super hero genre that they would pay to play Pong if the ball wore tights.  Such are the kind of people who continue to pay to play that nerfed-up piece of crap called CoH.

It didn't, and your overgeneralisation is wrong. I'm sure there are some people who obsessively buy every superhero game that comes out. But enough to support an allegedly awful MMO for 2+ years such that it is profitable? That seems very unlikely.

Originally posted by Stradden

 

Originally posted by lmzz

Now, why does MMORPG decide to make an article about the free trial of game as old as CoH? It´s called purchased editorial content. PlayNC obviously paid to get this story out. Not that I care but that´s how it´s gotta be

I'm going to stop you right there. I take major exception to this accusation. Never before has ANY feature content been paid for by ANY game company here at MMORPG.com. The fact that you would imply it is, frankly, insulting.  I take pride in my work and the fact that MMORPG.com doesn't take money for editorial content.

 

I wrote this article because I was playing the game, and thought that it would make a good "At A Glance".  Also, it's my job.

The only "paid for" parts of this site are the advertisements.

I hope that clears things up for you.

Now, you state that I´m wrong and if I am I stand corrected and I apologize. In my line of work, which is the advertisment business, buying editorial content occurs all the time though and that´s not nec. a bad thing in my world and I just called it as I saw it.

So a number of game changes were made that flattened this powergap difference considerably.

"Devspeak" and "Fanboy spin" aside, we agree: the game was nerfed to hell.  

BTW, stealth suppression - like travel suppression - was a mechaninc the devs originally created and let the players use FOR MORE THAN A YEAR before deciding it was an "exploit."  I wrote this before, and I'll write it again for your benefit: if it were such a "game-breaking" exploit, as Emmert & Company alleged, why the hell wait MORE THAN A YEAR TO FIX IT???

If you're going to charge a monthly sub for a game, you damn well better have issues like this fixed BEFORE you start charging people to play it.  And if you can't, you better just swallow your pride and think of something else to fix, NOT wait more than a year and decide it's "broken"!

See, what you don't seem to "get" is that when you create a series of expectations, let them become "reality" (in a completely virtual sense), then start charging money to let people play the game, THEN more than a year later completely change how the game is played by TAKING THINGS AWAY FROM THEM, then people should have a right to get pissed about that!

How would you like it if I charged you hundreds of dollars to let you rent my Viper for a week, let you drive it the way YOU wanted for the first hour, THEN replaced it with a Yugo and said, "now go have fun!" 

I'd be willing to bet you'd be b!tching on every auto rental site in the country and - it goes without saying - you'd be awfully pissed at me for screwing you!

You're right: people who start playing the game now won't know how badly the game has been nerfed, and I'd be willing to bet the "brain surgeons" at Cryptic are glad customers - like me - left, so they don't have to read it anymore. 

But my advice to anyone looking to play this game is simply this: don't pay for more than a month at a time, and DON'T let them auto-bill your credit card!  You'll never know when you'll end up feeling the same way I did about this POS and the idiot devs who screwed people like me out of hundreds of dollars, because it WILL happen!  It's only a matter of time.

/end rant

P.S. 42 posts in 3 years?  Is this the name and account you use to refute your critics, Jack???  Just wondering...

Originally posted by Serling

If you're going to charge a monthly sub for a game, you damn well better have issues like this fixed BEFORE you start charging people to play it.  And if you can't, you better just swallow your pride and think of something else to fix, NOT wait more than a year and decide it's "broken"!

See, what you don't seem to "get" is that when you create a series of expectations, let them become "reality" (in a completely virtual sense), then start charging money to let people play the game, THEN more than a year later completely change how the game is played by TAKING THINGS AWAY FROM THEM, then people should have a right to get pissed about that!

How would you like it if I charged you hundreds of dollars to let you rent my Viper for a week, let you drive it the way YOU wanted for the first hour, THEN replaced it with a Yugo and said, "now go have fun!" 

I'd be willing to bet you'd be b!tching on every auto rental site in the country and - it goes without saying - you'd be awfully pissed at me for screwing you!

You're right: people who start playing the game now won't know how badly the game has been nerfed, and I'd be willing to bet the "brain surgeons" at Cryptic are glad customers - like me - left, so they don't have to read it anymore. 

But my advice to anyone looking to play this game is simply this: don't pay for more than a month at a time, and DON'T let them auto-bill your credit card!  You'll never know when you'll end up feeling the same way I did about this POS and the idiot devs who screwed people like me out of hundreds of dollars, because it WILL happen!  It's only a matter of time.

/end rant

 

This should be required reading for all MMO fans wanting to be taken seriously when debating games:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_fallacy

 In addition, I would be quite curious to know if anyone can mention a MMO that lasted over 3 years that did *NOT* have a serious re-tuning at some point in the game's life post-beta.

 Here is another link for those of you who are actually (astonishingly) interested:

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/

 I respect the right for everyone to have their opinion, and concede that I am not, in any way, an MMO 'expert'.

However, respectfully,  someone thinking that a large 'nerf' or 're-tooling' is unexpected.... perhaps  you should re-evaluate whether or not your 'expectations' are rational.

For the record, I have played at least 3 games that were 're-tooled' whilst i played them & hurt so bad I can remember all 3 situations vividly, and remember being angry.

However, IMHO, in all 3 instances, the overall 'health' of all 3 games was better off after the changes.

In addition, I also think it is implausable to expect devs to figure out all the deviant ways us genius malcontents can break a game using a skill they have handed us by day #1 gold.

/2cents

EVE Online
Time VS Bucks
It airily entered my life. I made the first character on EVE online in 2005. The amazing interface, control, the stars distribute in the galaxies. Everything lets me infatuated. The auto update saved my time a lot. However I need plenty of ISK to buy ships, I have not enough time to rush pirates or mining to get much ISK. The GTC was the best way to change my bucks to ISK. I was told some guys have the better ways to get ISK, I mean the cheaper and quickly transfer, anyone knows?

Congratulations!  You can cut and paste links!  Kudos!  Now, please lower yourself for a moment to tell us why you think there are logical fallacies in my argument. 

Your defense of this nerfed-up POS is no more objective than my disdain for it and the people who screwed their customers.  Play it if you will, but let others read my warning and take it for what they paid for it.

Originally posted by Serling

Face it if they really wanted your money there is so much more they could do to get every cent out of you.

Besides the fact that no one would pay, they've started doing this very thing with server and name changes.  Ten bucks a name change or to move a toon to another server???  Ouch!

But the point you seem to be missing is that with a subscription-based product, you just need to keep the subs going.  You can do that by making a great game everyone would gladly pay twice as much to play, or you can do it by making a mediocre game that just so happens to be the only one of its kind around (and the fanboys will never let you forget it).

CoX is a mediocre product at best and - if you read any of the other comments about the game on this thread -  you'd notice I'm not the only one writing that it's a horrible grind.  It has no end game for people who get to 50 because - according to Emmert himself - the game isn't about arriving, it's about the journey.  I see.  So then why make it a level-based game at all???

It's because when you create a goal people are going to want to achieve it.  And if you charge a sub and make achieving that goal take as long as you feasibly think you can, you're going to get more money out of people.

Cryptic could care less whether the customers have fun, because it's ultimately all about the marketing.  Sell people on the idea that you can be a virtual super hero, and some people will pay to play no matter how badly the product sucks. 

So they produce a grinder that lets people think they're playing super hero, and they get away with it because - after all - it's "the only super hero MMO in town."  And the reason they can continue to charge subs for this gawd-awful snoozer is because there are just enough people - like you - willing to pay for garbage.

Enjoy!

P.S.  Guild Wars charges no monthly sub and - based solely on sal