Originally posted by citan79

I am still angry about it very angry.  they had a gem .   It would have beat WoW in the long run 

You can't be serious since WOW was the reason combined with bugs and other techincal problems that SWG started to lose players. And you think SWG would beat WOW in long run? no body likes to ruin a perfectly profitable game but hard truth is that SWG was bleeding subs and SOE/LA made a last ditch effort to make SWG profitable by following more casual friendly approach but they went too over board with it. They tried and failed, time to get over i thinK.

Originally posted by Supersoups

Originally posted by citan79

I am still angry about it very angry.  they had a gem .   It would have beat WoW in the long run 

You can't be serious since WOW was the reason combined with bugs and other techincal problems that SWG started to lose players. And you think SWG would beat WOW in long run? no body likes to ruin a perfectly profitable game but hard truth is that SWG was bleeding subs and SOE/LA made a last ditch effort to make SWG profitable by following more casual friendly approach but they went too over board with it. They tried and failed, time to get over i thinK.

I don't know if SWG would've ever beat WoW in any situation, but where would SWG & SOE be if SOE stuck to their guns and fixed and expanded upon the original Pre-CU vision of the game?

Outside the eventual CU and then the NGE driving everyone away, there were really 2 significant things that made people disgruntled in SWG:

1.  "Lack of a space game in a Star Wars game" when SWG was released.  The game was regularly roasted by reviews because of that very basic fact.  Eventually partially resolved with JTL, but SOE didn't expand on JTL any further, and it seemed the engine couldn't handle big fights in space.

2.  Longstanding Bugs.  Basically SOE not fixing the game.

Now, let's imagine this.  Where would SWG have gone if it remained faithful to its original vision and SOE resolved those 2 listed issues?  Where would the game be if SOE expanded the game more on top of a more refined game?

If that was so, I would still be playing SWG and forking money every month to SOE.  If that was so, I would never have been hopping along numerous MMORPGs after departing SWG, from 2005-2009, and experiencing some horrendous big name releases in the genre (AoC, WAR, STO, etc, I unfortunately dealt with most of them).

If... SOE just fixed the d*mn game, that would've been good reason enough to stay.

Edit to add:  A healthy SWG would still be viable enough to exist in a WoW or maybe eventually SWTOR dominated MMORPG genre.  SWG's gameplay is more old school and very, very different from WoW and later titles (EvE doesn't count as a "later" title, it came out in about '04).  Different enough to have players of a different gaming taste still have their own "home."

Originally posted by Warmaker

Originally posted by Supersoups

Originally posted by citan79

I am still angry about it very angry.  they had a gem .   It would have beat WoW in the long run 

You can't be serious since WOW was the reason combined with bugs and other techincal problems that SWG started to lose players. And you think SWG would beat WOW in long run? no body likes to ruin a perfectly profitable game but hard truth is that SWG was bleeding subs and SOE/LA made a last ditch effort to make SWG profitable by following more casual friendly approach but they went too over board with it. They tried and failed, time to get over i thinK.

I don't know if SWG would've ever beat WoW in any situation, but where would SWG & SOE be if SOE stuck to their guns and fixed and expanded upon the original Pre-CU vision of the game?

Outside the eventual CU and then the NGE driving everyone away, there were really 2 significant things that made people disgruntled in SWG:

1.  "Lack of a space game in a Star Wars game" when SWG was released.  The game was regularly roasted by reviews because of that very basic fact.  Eventually partially resolved with JTL, but SOE didn't expand on JTL any further, and it seemed the engine couldn't handle big fights in space.

2.  Longstanding Bugs.  Basically SOE not fixing the game.

Now, let's imagine this.  Where would SWG have gone if it remained faithful to its original vision and SOE resolved those 2 listed issues?  Where would the game be if SOE expanded the game more on top of a more refined game?

If that was so, I would still be playing SWG and forking money every month to SOE.  If that was so, I would never have been hopping along numerous MMORPGs after departing SWG, from 2005-2009, and experiencing some horrendous big name releases in the genre (AoC, WAR, STO, etc, I unfortunately dealt with most of them).

If... SOE just fixed the d*mn game, that would've been good reason enough to stay.

Edit to add:  A healthy SWG would still be viable enough to exist in a WoW or maybe eventually SWTOR dominated MMORPG genre.  SWG's gameplay is more old school and very, very different from WoW and later titles (EvE doesn't count as a "later" title, it came out in about '04).  Different enough to have players of a different gaming taste still have their own "home."

I agree 100000000%. All people wanted was for SOE to just fix the damn bugs, fix the broken professions, and add content. But for some reason, that simple concept flew over SOE's collective heads. Oh well. Whatever. Game is finally dead now. None of it matters anymore.

I posted this in the other thread about this topic:

With the introduction of Jedi the focus of the game shifted from living in the galaxy of starwars to grinding out your jedi character.

To be competitive in PvP you had to be a Jedi because if you weren't Jedi you were the victim of a Jedi.

If you were fighting an elite mob the jedi would come up and steal it right from under you because they put out more DPS in seconds than your entire group could in minutes.

Jedi were gods that made "masters" of combat professions look like as if they were holding a sharped stick by the wrong end.

When Jedi became too numerous to count everybody (even those that didn't want to) was forced to either join the jedi or quit for the reasons I gave above.

So in the end you had jedi on one side and chefs, medics, entertainers, and mineral harvestors (the only professions that catered to jedi) on the other and that's all that was left of pre-CU SWG. SWG wasn't just bleeding subs - it was hemorrhaging fast and something needed to be done about it.

The combat rebalance was the cure, but instead they gave us the combat upgrade and before we were comfortable with it they dropped the NGE on us - it broke the spell this game had on many of us and that was the final bullet in the head that stopped the bleeding once and for all.

That was Publish 9, IIRC.  That was when the Jedi started getting all the patch attention.  That was the day Jedi came out of hiding to parade around and have duels in major cities, in front of Starports, right out in the open for all the Empire to see.  When this patch hit, my heart for Star Wars canon sank.

Originally posted by stevesmithjr

At this point, you could probably publish a book about all that went wrong with this game.

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED.

... or not. :P

It simply wasn't good enough at anything over and above the pure act of crafting.

Originally posted by Warmaker

That was Publish 9, IIRC.  That was when the Jedi started getting all the patch attention.  That was the day Jedi came out of hiding to parade around and have duels in major cities, in front of Starports, right out in the open for all the Empire to see.  When this patch hit, my heart for Star Wars canon sank.

Yep publish 9.

Here's the first real stab that ended in a bloodbath:

http://swg.wikia.com/wiki/Publish_9_Notes_for_29_June_04

Almost 10 months later April 27th 2005 the CU was dropped on us.

Then on Nov 15th the NGE and game over.

 Almost a year later the CU hit.

What really went wrong was that World of Warcraft launched and showed SOE/LA that the MMO market was potentially larger than they had thought, and that they wanted a larger part of it.

All of their efforts after that were to expand the reach of the game, instead of trying to fix/improve the game they already had. The cost was that they alienated most of their subscribers in the process.

You can cite specifics, but on the highest scale this is the genesis of all of their problems. If WoW only had 400,000 subscribers (like people thought SWG had at its height) I think SOE/LA would have tried to improve what they already had instead of trying to replace it in the middle of its run.

Yep.

DJMTOTT is correct.

LA/LEC and SOE saw the explosion of "1m+ subscribers" and 2m and 3m and 4m Numbers that WoW was Bragging about.

And they forgot that Star Wars is a Niche Market and nothing like the Nerd Draw to Fantasy genre games.