I for one think that Mythic have indeed learnt every lesson going from their biggest MMO, DAoC.  Let's not forget that they had a massive task to try and balance 3 very seperate realms with quite different classes.  I defy any of the Mythic bashers to do any better.  Yes ToA broke the game for me as I was unable to devote the time necessary to farm and level the artifacts.  But as a previous poster said, Mythic actually listened to the customer base and while they were still trying to iron the kinks out of ToA they brought out the non ToA servers and brought a lot of us back.

They have taken on another huge project here and they have a wealth of IP with the GW material, so they have a huge responsibility not to mess things up.  I have faith that the 150 people working on this game are as rabid about it as I am and with a nut case like Paul barnett at the creative helm it will be great and loads of fun.

Fun, we remember fun, don't we?

Originally posted by silkensmooth
Mythic did a lot of stupid things, and they continue doing stupid things.

Toa.

New Frontiers.

Constantly overpowered expansion classes.

Battlegrounds that diluted the endgame playerbase.

On top of that they keep everything a big secret, and dont even bother to take a stance on things. Like telling the playerbase what their design intent is for each class in a definitive way.

If history is any indicator, this game will start out good, and mythic will run it into the ground.

They listen too much to the vocal minority, and dont seem to have a clear vision of where the game should go.

You cant balance a game based on player feedback the way mythic does, because the players aren't objective.

Lets also not forget that mythic doesnt  test anything, they make the players do it, on a server no one uses, and then they release things to live servers, and make you test them some more, and then they fix them after months or years of brokeness.

Still if this game does start out as good as daoc did, then it will be worth playing at least until they start mucking it up.

If I remember correctly Mythic outright said that TOA was a mistake. As for overpowered classes? Well guess what there is always an "overpowered" class because they can do something another class can't. Mythic learned all about the problems with gear based games that make people overpowered, they have made gear accessible through multiple sources to make RvR fair so I doubt you will see that mistake again. 

What has been a big secret about WAR until now? They aren't sure on decisions yet so they don't post information on it. They are constantly putting out new information on WAR classes, game progression, doing press events, etc.  They answer any questions they can when the idea is fleshed out and gets approval for release. No other game company that I have seen have put out as much information, videos, insights into what is going on with the game than EA Mythic.

DAoC was mythics own design, they now work with GW on the Warhammer IP so GW has to approve everything that goes into the game. So your not gonna see M1A1 Battle tanks get into the game because someone wants it. You might see numbers looked at because of player outcry but you wont see major things implemented. As for Player testing? Who hasn't used player testing? WoW Does, EQ2 does, SWG Does, etc. All the companies do it. Mythic was a smaller company so it wasn't like they could hire a bunch of QA testers. Guess what? Now they are with EA and guess what EA is? HUGE. They now have EA for internal testing and a budget for QA testing(EA probably already has QA testers that do multiple games). The main reason that they use player base for testing is because all people do different things in the game. You can never hire enough people to cover all your bases on play style. One person likes to run around to all areas to see the scenery, some like to try and get into places your not supposed it, some like to play the game straight and do the content.

Anyways that is just your opinion and this is mine. I believe that EA Mythic will do an awesome job at producing a PvP mmo. They have experiance with their own MMO's and now they also have seen what works and what doesn't with WoW, D&D, Vangaurd, etc. They have a good game plan so far and I have yet to see something that I hate. They are going for RvR and thats what they are basing everything around. I cannot see another company doing better than EA Mythic at the moment that is out there that will produce a PvP game. Everything that has been announced so far that we have seen has been spot on. They have yet to lie but we will see when it gets released. It could be another WoW which hyped PvP, siege weapons, player housing, and hero classes. WAR won't be the end all super MMO but it will definetly be good.

On another note. If they magus gets a disk for traveling and can cast spells from it does that mean that other classes can get mounts that they can cast from? Or from what I saw in another interview maybe that is just the magus's way of getting around and they get a special disk for mount speed? Mount combat would be fun though .

This game is making headway. I like the direction its going as usual.  For the naysayers that simply put down an entire project because of expansions of its other games, my response is simply : What game is perfect?

If I were establish credibility on these forums I would cite an example of a game that I think the subject would emulate after I criticize the subject post. For example:  I am never going to buy WAR because Mythic screwed up TOA. Unlike my favorite company SOE which has not messed anything up, expansions included.

Now, at least we know where you are coming from on what you perceive is a good company. You may be ignorant, but at least we know where you stand.

Bottom line is for these broad criticisms on companies, simply compare what companies are great in your eyes so we know where you are coming from.

As for my opinion, (I know you all been waiting for it), WAR is shaping up to be fantastic. A MMO that will not focus on grind for gear, public quests, PvP with purpose, and a theme of a game which is greater than the individual. It will be a blast.

Originally posted by JK-Kanosi

I've played every big name on the list and some of the littler ones. I will draw upon my experience with WoW, DAoC, and SOE games when commenting on this article and game.

As simple as WoW is, the game is well polished in the way of minute details; think of the dressing rooms, being able to click on names in chat to send a /whisper and so on. We have seen companies trying to mimic WoW's success by adopting their model, but not quite getting it right. Make note that I do know that WoW took parts of previous games to make theirs. Anyways, if there is a game that can top WoW, whether or not that is WARs goal is irrelevent, it would be WAR.

WAR seems to be similar to WoW in art, some game play mechanics, and this is not a bad thing either. WAR seems to be taking what worked well in WOW and other games and incorporating it into a game that is built for PvP from the ground up. This gives the crowd that liked WoW, but wanted more PvP a game to call home.

I played DAoC for 4+ years and I can honestly say I feel confident in Mythics ability to create an awsome game. We all know that there are mixed feelings for Mythic; considering ToA and the different nerfs and introduction of super powered classes, but Mythic in my experience has learned to listen and communicate with its playerbase. It remains one of the best MMORPG companies out there. I can see EA-Mythic as being a good alternate to Blizzard for those looking for a quality game.

*Lifts mug of ale* So here's to WAR and the endless possibilities that it may offer us. *cheers*

Originally posted by Jowen
It all sounds really great.

Now I just need to know that they are not planning on implementing that horrible "bind on pick-up" system and then I would have a perfect game.

There's been a couple of titles which I have been keeping an eye on.  WAR happens to be one of them, and from this press conference, my interest has grown even further.

The other big title I was really hoping would be my 'Holy Grail' of MMO's was Lord of the Rings.  I have been graciously given a beta key, and at the time of writing I have only just started trying it, so I cannot give an informed comment about it, just yet.  I do know, however, that it is not going to be the phenomenom that I thought it might have been.  Which means that Turbine is now definitely not on my Christmas card list.  (What with them wasting another great MMO premise in Dungeons & Dragons Online).  That said, I still think LotR will be a good game, just not the revoloution which I thought it might have been.

So, a different publisher (thank God) is dealing with the third of my favourite childhood franchises, that being Warhammer.  I still have found memories of painting the little minitures, and having table-top wars.  Not to mention the superb pen and paper rpg, which I understand has been relaunched. 

Ever since I first played Warcraft 2 (I missed the first one), I always thought that it was a bit of a clone of Warhammer.  In the ensueing years, it has become a monstrous, marketing franchise, and whether you love it or hate it, there is no denying that World of Warcraft is a sensation.  I have been playing for over a year now, and that along with EQ2, are the only MMO's I've stuck with long term.

It would take something really special to get me to switch my 'virtual playgrounds' for a new one, and as my wallet is not too full, I would have to drop one of these subscriptions. 

What intrigues me about WAR is that it really is the 'daddy' of Warcraft.  I don't think it will be my 'Holy Grail', just because I don't think it will be heavily rp based.  However, neither is WoW.  So my dilema will be which one to choose.  Of course, it is too early for me to judge WAR yet, but I have a good feeling that this may give WoW a good run for its money.  The two games are so similiar in many ways, that in the end it will just boil down to which is the best.  A lot of people are proclaiming that this will be the unofficial 'WoW2', and I shall have to wait to find out for myself.  The signs are looking good though.  Players into their pvp are going to get plenty of reasons to battle it out with each other, as I doubt that there will be an 'uneasy' truce between the two opposing sides.  The game itself, although I do not think will be reinventing the genre, does have some very clever naunces, like the evoloution and aging of characters.

Also, because the original Games Workshop product was the inspiration behind Blizzard's Warcraft series, I think it feels more robust.  Almost like a more serious WoW.  I like this, and think that it lends it some feeling of gravitas, which is lacking in WoW. 

So basically, will this be a slicker, more advanced, better version than WoW?  I won't know until at least I get into beta.  One thing is for sure though, if this is done well, and by all accounts it seems to be, there is going to be a new heavyweight in town, just spoiling for a fight!

"The issue of buying in game loot or money in the secondary market also came up. Again Jeff got serious and said that EA Mythic is wholeheartedly against the sale of virtual currency. They are working very hard to combat the secondary market within game mechanics. Everything from the economy, loot, and crafting are being reviewed so that the secondary market won’t become a factor in the game. This was great to hear and it seems like the team is determined to keep gold farmers out through game design. Many other MMOs can learn a lesson from Warhammer if this tactic works."

What tactic? Wanting to deal with the secondary market by reviewing crafting, loot and economy isn't a tactic, thats the aim. Even eliminating it through game design is the aim, all companies say this prior to release for obvios reasons on potential customer nets. How are they going to do this, saying you want to means next to nothing tbh. I want this game to be great, but that doesn't mean it will be. Where are the mechanics, the details they should be refering to?

Anyhow I also am exited by the game even though its yet more orcs and elves.

Originally posted by mrw0lf

"The issue of buying in game loot or money in the secondary market also came up. Again Jeff got serious and said that EA Mythic is wholeheartedly against the sale of virtual currency. They are working very hard to combat the secondary market within game mechanics. Everything from the economy, loot, and crafting are being reviewed so that the secondary market won’t become a factor in the game. This was great to hear and it seems like the team is determined to keep gold farmers out through game design. Many other MMOs can learn a lesson from Warhammer if this tactic works."

What tactic? Wanting to deal with the secondary market by reviewing crafting, loot and economy isn't a tactic, thats the aim. Even eliminating it through game design is the aim, all companies say this prior to release for obvios reasons on potential customer nets. How are they going to do this, saying you want to means next to nothing tbh. I want this game to be great, but that doesn't mean it will be. Where are the mechanics, the details they should be refering to?

Anyhow I also am exited by the game even though its yet more orcs and elves.

What part might that be? the part where you meant no offense by refering to me as an ignoramus? I could easily retort with similar personal insults but I was well bought up so I'll leave that to people such as yourself. Aside from which I didn't insult the game in any way so why feel so hurt? It's just a game, chill.

I was not asking for the coding they were going to use regarding their method for dealing with gold sellers, just the method which according to the article they claim to have a basis of. As for not giving the farmers a head start? Seriously.... no seriously, go away, ... sit for a while and try real hard to think this one through for yourself.

The point of the post may not even have been so much to do with the comments made by the mythic guys in itself but the way it was interpreted in the article. As I stated, it's matter of fact that all devs will give a certain amount of rhetoric regarding secondary markets, but it rarely means anything. If there is going to be a market within the game (and if there is going to be even a half decent crafting mechanic, there will be), then myself, and I'm guessing many people, will remain sceptical as to any claim about erradicating it. Unless that is they are going to tackle the problem head on and sell ig currency themselves, thus eliminating the market.

Peace

Originally posted by silkensmooth
Mythic did a lot of stupid things, and they continue doing stupid things.

Toa.

New Frontiers.

Constantly overpowered expansion classes.

Battlegrounds that diluted the endgame playerbase.

Originally posted by Thedrizzle

Originally posted by SBE1

Oh yeah, this game is from the company that effectively destroyed a great MMO named DAOC with the Trials of Atlantis (ToA) expansion that turned the game into a loot arms-race from hell.

I'm sure Mythic will do the same thing in Warhammer.  After ToA, i'll never buy anything from these clowns ever again.

So you've ran a multi-million dollar mmo game developing company before?

I love these statements, they merely show the posters ignorance rather than any snippet of wisdom.  The MMO market is fairly new,(still) and companys make mistakes.  One cannot discount a company for a simple mistake, if this was the case none of the greatest companies in world history would have made past their infantile stage. 

The same people who make such half-assed comments about Sony repeatedly due to its follies with SWG are foolish as well.

swg... matrix... eq... eq2... and now the paytoplaybeta vanguard.

yeah, you're right, just one mistake in one game... a month? a quarter?

eq - classes, levels, raids (previous was uo, with the ability to be anything you want, sort of like old school swg...)

matrix - haven't seen anything by way of updates to say this has gotten better.

swg - 'nuff said.

eq2 - eq/wow wrapped up with different graphics, basically.

vanguard - "oh soe is only handling production of the game", and now, um everything else?  while you pay to pay the (dev stated) beta?

yeah, soe is just icky on many levels.

now back to the original topics.

the wife is hooked on wow being the one online game she'll play.. BUT, she loves pvp... doesn't care much for the anti-pvp stance of wow.

enter war....

yes, my hope to get her away from the ultra-alternative-lifestyleness, that is world of borecraft.

Originally posted by stryker31

Originally posted by mrw0lf

"The issue of buying in game loot or money in the secondary market also came up. Again Jeff got serious and said that EA Mythic is wholeheartedly against the sale of virtual currency. They are working very hard to combat the secondary market within game mechanics. Everything from the economy, loot, and crafting are being reviewed so that the secondary market won’t become a factor in the game. This was great to hear and it seems like the team is determined to keep gold farmers out through game design. Many other MMOs can learn a lesson from Warhammer if this tactic works."

What tactic? Wanting to deal with the secondary market by reviewing crafting, loot and economy isn't a tactic, thats the aim. Even eliminating it through game design is the aim, all companies say this prior to release for obvios reasons on potential customer nets. How are they going to do this, saying you want to means next to nothing tbh. I want this game to be great, but that doesn't mean it will be. Where are the mechanics, the details they should be refering to?

Anyhow I also am exited by the game even though its yet more orcs and elves.

no offense but again more ignoramus people spouting off. of course they arent going to tell you how they are going to try to stop the farmers.  that would only give the farmers a head start on figuring it out.  also im sure they dont have anything down in stone yet given they dont have the mechanics of the important stuff( like gameplay) down pat yet.  also if any of you actually looked at the screen shots that were in the article you would realize how much different the graphics are starting to be from wow. from those last screenshots it looks much less cartoony and more dark and somewhat realistic.  like many others here i am not saying this is the end all mmo, i have high hopes for it and really for some people if you just quit speculating and just take things for what they are youll be better off.  and if you really think everything is that dire go make your own game, and then we can all criticize you just because we feel like it.  and mrwolf much of what i said was not towards you, other than the first sentence or two

um, if they have a tactic/ploy/plan to eliminate gold farming.  wouldn't that mean that they hope to eliminate it?  and finding out that it doesn't work, wouldn't that give them time to revise their anti-gold-farming plan?

not to call the post i'm replying to ignorant, or anything.  but doesn't ignorant mean something along the lines of, "uneducated on a particular topic"?

for me, more orcs and elves doesn't mean more cartoons, eq, eq2, uo, all have orcs and elves, and all look different.  maybe it's the fact that it's just another fantasy game, utilizing a lot of the same old, established fantasy races, again, in yet another fantasy mmo...

keep in mind, wow is based off warhammer, and they got their inspiration for races from warhammer.  so, we just have to  deal with the same old races, because warhammer is one of the first ones to use said races, being one of the older companies around.

Originally posted by silkensmooth
Mythic did a lot of stupid things, and they continue doing stupid things.

Toa.

New Frontiers.

Constantly overpowered expansion classes.

Battlegrounds that diluted the endgame playerbase.

Mornin sports fans. Just going to chime in with my 2 cents.
Quotes like these have made me scratch my head for the past 3 years. People will complain about trials of atlantis, complain about BG's but love world of warcraft. Hate to break it to you (actually i love slaying people with the truth because I am evil) but going on 10 large raids to gain lateral advancepent powers, and 3-5 small group raids to attain loot to make you more powerful...... isnt that exactly what WOW is only toned down a ton?

My first run ever in molten core took 5 hours and we only killed 2 bosses

My first run doing a master level in Trials of atlants we where able to finish level 1 and level 2 in 3 hours and also get an artifact to drop for our Warrior.

BG's and pvp got gold and XP killed end game content somehow in daoc, yet having to grind inside of Arathi basin for  hours upon hours and weeks upon weeks just to get an epic dagger and cloak is much more progressive?

Lastly about New frontires. It was just too much of a shock at the wrong time and all at the same time, the community revolted and the game died.  There was never an actual content problem with DAoC. The designers never did anything wrong, nor the testers and Devs. It was just the community revolting because of too much of a dramatic change at one time.
Think im wrong for a minute, but stop and rethink about it and go over it again in your mind for me.

If Mythic had first given us a new map with  Albion Midgard and Hibernia seperated by the body of water and everything, but kept the old guard patrols and the old fashioned keeps.  We would have all been playing the same game with the same rules on a new map. People dont get too upset about not plying in emain everynight, remember sometimes we had attacks in albion and midgard as well. They where just seperate maps but we played the same game.
Now if they waited a few months after that, lets say six months, and then introduced The New Epic sized keeps, Siege engines and Towers. We would have all been able to adapt slowly and many people would still be playing Dark age.  However this was not what happened, and while still reeling from Trials of atlantis we get a massive change in New Frontires and the straw just broke the back of the playerbase. Thats all.

So to wrap up. In my eyes Mythic as a development team and a content team have never let me down. Infact they are the only company I have seen in recent history that ADMITS when they made a mistake with a class, skill, patch or content release and will undo or rework them to ballance the game. Review past patch notes on camelot herald and see how many times they have undone changes they made or even going as far as making whole servers without content they felt was a mistake as with  the classic servers.
I am more than happy to put my money with someone who has shown they are able to be innovative, competitive and correct things that are going wrong insted of looking for more ways to keep you online for longer and longer durations.

I look Forward to Warhammer online and the EA-Mythic dev team. As I have said before, it dosent have to be the best rpg on the market, it just has to be the best for me. Id take 10 servers with 300 like minded people playing rather than a game with 60 servers 5000 people online per server, and 90% of them locked away in instances.

My money is with mythic

-Hasani-

Originally posted by kraiden

Originally posted by silkensmooth
Mythic did a lot of stupid things, and they continue doing stupid things.

Toa.

New Frontiers.

Constantly overpowered expansion classes.

Battlegrounds that diluted the endgame playerbase.

Mornin sports fans. Just going to chime in with my 2 cents.
Quotes like these have made me scratch my head for the past 3 years. People will complain about trials of atlantis, complain about BG's but love world of warcraft. Hate to break it to you (actually i love slaying people with the truth because I am evil) but going on 10 large raids to gain lateral advancepent powers, and 3-5 small group raids to attain loot to make you more powerful...... isnt that exactly what WOW is only toned down a ton?

My first run ever in molten core took 5 hours and we only killed 2 bosses

My first run doing a master level in Trials of atlants we where able to finish level 1 and level 2 in 3 hours and also get an artifact to drop for our Warrior.

BG's and pvp got gold and XP killed end game content somehow in daoc, yet having to grind inside of Arathi basin for  hours upon hours and weeks upon weeks just to get an epic dagger and cloak is much more progressive?

Lastly about New frontires. It was just too much of a shock at the wrong time and all at the same time, the community revolted and the game died.  There was never an actual content problem with DAoC. The designers never did anything wrong, nor the testers and Devs. It was just the community revolting because of too much of a dramatic change at one time.
Think im wrong for a minute, but stop and rethink about it and go over it again in your mind for me.

If Mythic had first given us a new map with  Albion Midgard and Hibernia seperated by the body of water and everything, but kept the old guard patrols and the old fashioned keeps.  We would have all been playing the same game with the same rules on a new map. People dont get too upset about not plying in emain everynight, remember sometimes we had attacks in albion and midgard as well. They where just seperate maps but we played the same game.
Now if they waited a few months after that, lets say six months, and then introduced The New Epic sized keeps, Siege engines and Towers. We would have all been able to adapt slowly and many people would still be playing Dark age.  However this was not what happened, and while still reeling from Trials of atlantis we get a massive change in New Frontires and the straw just broke the back of the playerbase. Thats all.

So to wrap up. In my eyes Mythic as a development team and a content team have never let me down. Infact they are the only company I have seen in recent history that ADMITS when they made a mistake with a class, skill, patch or content release and will undo or rework them to ballance the game. Review past patch notes on camelot herald and see how many times they have undone changes they made or even going as far as making whole servers without content they felt was a mistake as with  the classic servers.
I am more than happy to put my money with someone who has shown they are able to be innovative, competitive and correct things that are going wrong insted of looking for more ways to keep you online for longer and longer durations.

I look Forward to Warhammer online and the EA-Mythic dev team. As I have said before, it dosent have to be the best rpg on the market, it just has to be the best for me. Id take 10 servers with 300 like minded people playing rather than a game with 60 servers 5000 people online per server, and 90% of them locked away in instances.

My money is with mythic

-Hasani-

*Stands and claps*

I hope the game lives up to the hype. Seems like there going in the right direction so far. In regards to other people complaining they havent released strategies on gold farming, or game mechanics yet; that would be releasing proprietary information. I couldnt imagine working for months on one aspect of a game only to find it bundled into some other mmo's patch. I cant wait to try this game it!