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Is there a point to pvp without full looting, the simple awnser is no. Theres no excitement without looting, how can there be? Even games like wow in mo the worst of all games, why? Epic gear no looting or housing/ poor crafting. In the end everyone has epic gear and then no gear is epic so why not loot. Without looting crafting becomes irrelevant since I lose nothing I need nothing. If I cant bandage in combat and can only drink 1 pot at most again irrelevant. Can mmorpg's break free from carebearitis, alas only UO in its heyday pre aos managed it. |
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7/22/06 5:32:43 PM#2
Then don't play it then. Its really that simple. How does looting make excitement? I thought the fighting was the excitement but obviously I'm ignorant. And you want to base just your opinion on how everyone should play.. Here I'll actually put logic into why you don't loot armor. In say real medieval fighting... Since... I don't know... You're doing full contact to armor! No matter where you hit and eventually kill someone that means... You've broken their armor beyond repair! The only spoils of war there would be their horse (If they had one) or their weapon if it didn't get screwed up badly. So... ummm... go a head have a weapon that ISN'T superior to yours. Since you won and everything.
 Yeah, thats right crafting is going to become crap since you can make the best stuff from crafting and there is permadecay... So you're right there will be a massive influx of people having to recrate good weapons and thusly gives the economy its boost.
Siehst du mich |
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7/22/06 5:49:56 PM#3
You are in the smallest market share, no one cares about hardcore ffa pvp because so few people like that game type. Go play eve, work up your character, then get snuffed out by someone who was gate camping while you were jumping in and lagging. Not fun. |
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7/22/06 6:40:08 PM#4
Just another cookie cutter oh well...think I'll go with darkfall instead in the year 3006 if I'm not too busy playg duke nukem never that year and still alive :D I'm thinking it'll be the next major mmo since WoW, but guessing it won't hold my intrest for long the same way WoW didn't lol. UO had meaningful gameplay which is why many that played it sware by it. I might try tabula rasa tho just for the fact that richard garriot is behind it. Even w/o the pvp uo had alot of fun parts to it compared to other mmo's it's really the only mmo that deserves the rpg part tagged onto the end of it. Crafting in other games just werent as in depth as uo's you didn't feel attatched to the character the same way. I miss the era and realism of items diminishing and breaking down from wear and tear which in return made crafting a real profession rather than a pesky task.
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7/22/06 6:42:22 PM#5
One more thing EA...hmm I predict a rushed buggy product or vaporware definatly lost my vote looked promising prior to that oh well.
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7/22/06 10:16:55 PM#6
I for one wouldn't play if I needed decent equipment to do well and lost all my stuff each time I lost a fight. It wouldn't matter how skilled any player is or how hard they work at the game- the people doing the best are going to be whoever was lucky enough to have most recently ganked the guy holding the equipment. Once people have looted the best armor or crafted the best weapons why would anyone go through the trouble of working to kill the megaboss mob or level up crafting for the best equipment when they can just get some buddies and take it from the people who did do all that hard work. Ultimately all items are devalued if not valueless since you are guaranteed to lose them. IMHO it's better to have a PvP reward system that rewards sportsmanship and hard work more than greed. I think that alot of the items your character accumulates become personal parts of the look you choose for your character, as well as being things you are proud to have accomplished getting- helping to make your toon your really feel like your own. Otherwise you can't really set a look for yourself beyond character creation.
Darwi & Vladymir- DAoC, WoW, others. Formerly officers of The Black Company. |
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7/22/06 10:56:15 PM#7
The thing that makes up for looting is "WAR" full scale war, taking territories and defending territories, you won't have time to think about looting the guy, it's about aiding your allies, and killing your enemies. Oh, and you can loot some stuff, like cities.  I'm sure if you die, you will lose experience. |
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waike
Novice Member
Joined: 6/28/06
" If a woman ever gave me crap, I''d say, HEY woman, you go do my laundry." Eric Cartman |
7/23/06 1:37:12 AM#8
darkfall anyone?
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7/23/06 2:32:28 AM#9
The thing that makes up for looting is "WAR" full scale war, taking territories and defending territories, you won't have time to think about looting the guy, it's about aiding your allies, and killing your enemies. Oh, and you can loot some stuff, like cities. I'm sure if you die, you will lose experience.You hit the nail on the head  The war in WAR is what is gonna push this game over the top. PVP will have meaning, it will be exciting and mean something,but if you dont wanna jump in you dont have to. And my god people EA is not gonna kill this game. Do you honestly see GW letting this go down the crapper?? I am sick of all the WOW comparisons. The art from Warhammer has ALWAYS looked like this. They are not copying Blizzard. The character art is kinda similar but not the same, and that is where the similarity in the games ends. Read the FAQ on the offical site and get the facts before you start spewing stuff about a game. Im glad Nitrock brought up the "war" aspect of the game which IMO will put this game above all others. |
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7/23/06 7:41:49 AM#10
i doubt that, if you die, you will loose experience. More likely, you will loose some kind of "will" points or something similar. The idea of corpse looting in pvp would generate a lot of griefers. That way Mythic avoids corpse-camping. |
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7/23/06 9:29:18 AM#11
I heard that when you kill an enemy you can "loot" the body. But the items you get don't belong to the person you just killed. They are created when the enemy avatar dies.
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VixenHeart
 Novice Member
Joined: 2/09/06
It is choice - not chance - that determines your destiny. |
7/23/06 9:36:59 AM#12
Likes think about what you're talking about. World of Childrencraft. Of course it's going to be carebear. Or people who bitch and cry that the game's too hard and it would fail like Shadowbane did. Yes I wish games were like UO, but come on... lets think about that for a minute, the babies would get upset. |
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7/23/06 1:54:56 PM#13
Likes think about what you're talking about. World of Childrencraft. Of course it's going to be carebear. Or people who bitch and cry that the game's too hard and it would fail like Shadowbane did. Yes I wish games were like UO, but come on... lets think about that for a minute, the babies would get upset. I'm glad that isn't the case with WAR. Though it was just another "OMG! I can't lootzorz the corpse to show how 1337 I am and laugh at them" post. Cause if he were to I don't know... Actually read up what WAR is going to be. There are no epic gears. There is the peremadecay system so crafting is always in high demand. I don't know about housing. But hey... If you want to not read about the game and make general assumptions that's your prerogative. He's just a troll that's why he hasn't posted anything in reply. I still say... Why would you loot something you beat to shit? And if you really think the looting is the part that makes PvP fun... Then there is something wrong with you. So the fact that you're going to die isn't fun? The fact that you might kill someone isn't fun? OK... That makes no sense unless you are a robber. And I'm pretty sure RL has the type of l00tz you're looking for then. But hey if you don't think PvP is fun for fighting someone who am I to make generalizations and assumptions. Oh wait... the same thing was done earlier.  Siehst du mich |
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Shayde
 Novice Member
Joined: 9/26/05
The game isn’t designed to keep people playing." - Smed NOW you realize that! - Shayde |
7/23/06 2:21:11 PM#14
Why loot when the Blood God demands BLOOD?!?!?!?!
Shayde - SWG (dead)
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Nihilis
 Novice Member
Joined: 10/22/04
The wind, sharp as razors, whispers your name in its invisible labyrinth of hidden mystery. |
7/23/06 4:12:04 PM#15
Likes think about what you're talking about. World of Childrencraft. Of course it's going to be carebear. Or people who bitch and cry that the game's too hard and it would fail like Shadowbane did. Yes I wish games were like UO, but come on... lets think about that for a minute, the babies would get upset. Actually I'd think that children would prefer full looting since children like being immature and mischevious, and they also have all the time in the world to get back equipment they've lost. Adults have jobs (usually) and don't have as much time to earn back the gear they strived hard to acheive. "Time.." I chuckled "I hold no secret to time, though it's mystery puzzles me. Deny it's existence and lie to myself not with hopes of a quickened pace." |
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7/23/06 8:04:28 PM#16
PvP doesn't need looting to be fun. It just needs some purposeful form of faction/guild-based rivalry,like a city or bragging rights or taking control of something that belongs to them. (Looting is just a nice bonus for the winner,and a pain for the loser.) Then people will form in-game politics around that,and the result is competitive PvP. No looting in WAR? Fine. It sounds like it has capturable territories,seige wars and massive scale battles to compensate; why loot the one when you can sack an entire town and cut them off from their favourite levelling site. Sadly,I'm no longer bothering to hype up with WAR. Well,rather to say I've pinned all my hopes on Darkfall's beta later this year. But I'll always try out a beta if WAR has any; it could be a promising cushion should Darkfall take more time to release a beta. Should out-do WOW anyway if all goes well,its immediate comparison. At least Mythic knew what decent PvP was. EA-Mythic might be greater still; they'll have to pin a lot of hopes on making this game right or AOC/DFO/and the rest will steal people away. |
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7/23/06 8:57:14 PM#17
If some loot takes significant time to get you can't have looting in PvP. Why? Because most people are not high rollers. They do not like gambling with huge amounts of their resources. In fact such people are generally thought to have a problem. Even if its possible to hit the jackpot and kill someone for good loot, if that loot is any good that is still very much analogous to the odds of hitting jackpot. Its just a crazy casino. There is a reason insurance is a lucrative industry. This has nothing to do with carebearness. You can't have someone lose months worth of work in 30 seconds and expect to like. Its not a healthy model. I don't know what WAR's item model will be, but once the items take a certain threshold of time to obtain you simply can't have corpse looting and expect any but a few to stick around. Some loss is acceptable and even good, but total wipe outs are not generally tolerated. Here I have good idea to put the thrill in PvP for you. Everytime someone kills you I will come over to your house and chop off a limb starting with the hands. This is nice and hardcore. And even more its essentially a perma-death implementation because once you die about 4 times you won't be able to play since you'll play without hands or feet. Hey since I'm feeling nice I will even put the severed limnbs on ice and if you can manage to kill whoever killed you I will give you back yoru limb so you can have them sewn back on. There is a chance this might work, its not great chance but hey its better than nothing. I'm sure since you are a real man that these risks are acceptable. |
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7/25/06 2:28:50 AM#18
What is fun about a handful of regulars per server who gank any newbies who join until they quit? MMOs are there to make money, if you think there is such a high demand for a full looting PVP game, then why not put up some of your capital and finance one?
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7/25/06 2:48:10 AM#19
Hello I think PvP looting has some merits, and some downfalls. I play EvE, where as you all know there is looting and loss of items. This does two very cool things, One it makes combat a real adrenalin rush and Two it gives crafters a steady income stream. However there are also pitfalls with it as well, It can be very discuriging to a new and old players and it can actully limited the amount of PvP. I beleive if it is set up right limited PvP looting can be great in the right game. If there is limited 'epic' gear and if most of the gear is crafted then it adds to the game. However I do not think any large dev. game will implement Full PvP looting and trully opean PvP just becouse it would turn away to many customers, inaddition it takes a well devloped game to do it correctly, at least in my limited knowledge of MMO's. One of the dissapointments in WoW was the fact that the worst part of dieing was walking back to your stuff. Maybe if there would be some limmited Looting rules.... But what ever a Dev. does it will never make every one happy. Welcome Home rev
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7/25/06 7:23:50 AM#20
WoW has loot because PvP is boring, You lvl 60 with uber epic stuff, the enemy is far to often a lvl 20 with one green, the PvP in WAR should come down to reflex, gear, skill and luck, a bit of all these makes it fun, not just one of them |
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