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Originally posted by Rikimaru_X

Is this article about what we all want in a mmorpg or breaking the sterotype that women don't play games? I don't see anything about women not playing games. Women has always been playing video games and the sterotype has been broken very long ago.

Besides, most of the other threads about female gamers is just females saying they play video games too. Nothing wrong with that. They don't say that things are not equal are anything like that...not much anyway.

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carbonel: Sexism in the industry is not all of a big deal. Think about it the opposite way. What would you think about the male game characters? Solid Snake (he was naked in MGS and my sister loved it btw), Duke Nukem, Link (Zelda), Leon (Resident Evil), etc. Male game characters have sex appeal too. Ever showed a girl a picture of em and ask if he's hot? Just like female game characters such as Lara Croft, Kasumi, Princess Peach (), Ada Wong, BloodRayne, etc. We would think many of these characters attract to us men as well.

Trying to attack sex appeal in video games is not a good way to go. Almost all girls grow up to have the appeal and desire to be perfect, like a princess. Men . . . humm...skip that. I would say Power Rangers, but don't take my word for it. There are magazines out there for women. Shows them how pretty and sexy they should be, how to have the best sex of your life, etc. If you want to deal with somthing like sex appeal in video games, you might need to start at the root of things. Men magazines, talks about men needs, buffness, working out, looking good for your woman, etc.

Women would like a strong man and men would like a fit woman (not stratching the surface of that opinion...it would go off topic). It's just natural. Like I said, this has been going on before video games and women should not be offened. They should actually be proud. Females game characters are doing more than just wating to be saved (like in many, many movies) Lara Croft is now in the Genius Book of World Records. Good looking and ass kicking women. Good looking and ass kicking men.

You don't see NO game where you see a woman in the kitchen...only in the movies my friend. Ya feel me?

Sorry for the grammar and spelling.

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Originally posted by Lissette

Being a girl (woman :p) gamer since the 80's and the Atari 2600 and Commodore 64.  I can tell you want I don't want.  I don't want any stupid girly, girl games like I saw on the eb games site once.  A shopping game, trumpeting that it was especially for the female gamer.  Pulease!  I felt like taking a shotgun to the game package.  :D   I agree one of the most important things is community.  When I played Wow we had a guild that had a family feel to it. 

I admit that I am not all that gung-ho on fps, I prefer rpg's.  But if you were in my house and saw the game selection, I think you would not be able to tell I am a woman from them.  I have everything from the Sims and Zoo Tycoon to Baldur's Gate II to Battlefield 1942.  :p  Right now I am obsessed with Oblivion!  And I recently preordered Auto Assault.  Do not think that you need to single us out to make a "special" game just for us....I can almost guarantee that it will fail.

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Originally posted by carbonel

One person can't speak for all women gamers, but this is an important topic. It is a big deal.

In addition to speaking with girl gamers, companies should be hiring more women as developers, designers, creative directors, and usability specialists.

As for those who question the predominance of sexism in the industry:

     Five years ago, a study released by the advocacy group Children Now found that "38 percent of female game characters had large breasts and 46 percent had unusually small waists." In a subsequent study, researchers reported that one out of five female characters displayed exposed breasts or midriffs. Even sophisticated and "woman-friendly" titles such as World of Warcraft and Everquest portray female avatars as pole-dancing airheads with enormous cleavage. In the words of one female gamer and researcher, many women hate their avatar choices in the game Everquest because "they have to wear chain-mail bikinis."

      Despite the game industry's sexist tendencies, women are an increasingly influential segment of the gaming community. According to a study conducted in 2001 by the Interactive Digital Software Association, women purchase approximately half of all software games. Although young men are more likely to play on home gaming consoles, the Pew Internet and American Life Project reports that 60 percent of all college-age women regularly play online computer games, compared to only 40 percent of their male counterparts.

For more information, see: http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15251543&BRD=2318&PAG=461&dept_id=550942&rfi=6

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If the above article is correct, then women in games is hardly a myth in 2006.  Sexism, however, does still exist in the art.  But sexism is not the same issue as whether or not we play games.

Mother of 4 daughters and 2 stepdaughters.  We, the seven females in this family all game.  Most are into mmorpg's, one is dubbed by her male peers "Halo Queen" cuz she pwnz them all.  We do get tired of the same article re-hashed over and over.  We are not the holy grail. 

Now just convince the game developers so they'll start listening to what we want in games.

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Originally posted by carbonel

One person can't speak for all women gamers, but this is an important topic. It is a big deal.

In addition to speaking with girl gamers, companies should be hiring more women as developers, designers, creative directors, and usability specialists.

As for those who question the predominance of sexism in the industry:

     Five years ago, a study released by the advocacy group Children Now found that "38 percent of female game characters had large breasts and 46 percent had unusually small waists." In a subsequent study, researchers reported that one out of five female characters displayed exposed breasts or midriffs. Even sophisticated and "woman-friendly" titles such as World of Warcraft and Everquest portray female avatars as pole-dancing airheads with enormous cleavage. In the words of one female gamer and researcher, many women hate their avatar choices in the game Everquest because "they have to wear chain-mail bikinis."

      Despite the game industry's sexist tendencies, women are an increasingly influential segment of the gaming community. According to a study conducted in 2001 by the Interactive Digital Software Association, women purchase approximately half of all software games. Although young men are more likely to play on home gaming consoles, the Pew Internet and American Life Project reports that 60 percent of all college-age women regularly play online computer games, compared to only 40 percent of their male counterparts.

For more information, see: http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15251543&BRD=2318&PAG=461&dept_id=550942&rfi=6

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Sheesh what a tough crowd. Give the writer a break.

My husband actually started me as a gamer with Duke Nukem and Jill of the Jungle.  We downloaded alot of shareware in the early days.  I became addicted to games and he never really did.  While he was out of the house I'd sneak into the DOS help files trying to get games to run and taught myself alot. 

For me, the best games always had story and character.  I thought of them as sort of like a book and sort of like a movie, except, you were *in* the story, and had the ability to advance the plot and in some cases affect the outcome (non-linear games).  Exciting stuff!  I have always been able to place myself right there in all those dangerous adventures with Lara Croft or my Khajiit in Oblivion. 

 Playing Galaxies I really did write my own character stories and lead a separate bit of life.  The character customization with Galaxies has left me spoiled.  I have my Tailor's color chart with half of the 256 colors named my own way. 

 My Ranger, thanks to the Naritus rangers was learning all of the animals on all of the planets and what resources they dropped.  The generosity of that group, before they were removed from the game, and the good times I had early in the game with Ico and company, these are the great people and things that make mmorpgs worth anyones time.  More and more women will be drawn in, for their own reasons.  All of the reasons the op mentions in her article are valid.  The variety of responses to the article show how different we all are, yet here we all are in this gaming forum, talking games.

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Originally posted by Yamota

Excuse me but one women should know what "female gamers want"? Oh please, its like saying some guy would make an article saying what male gamers want when even in the realitevely small MMORPG genre there are thousands of different views on the best MMORPG. Male or female is too large of a group to generalise like that.

Also from my 10 years experience in MMORPGS female gamers are either reluctant to say that they are female or the portion of female gamers in MMORPGS is quite small compared to male gamers. (Sims Online excluded).

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Originally posted by Rikimaru_X

carbonel: Sexism in the industry is not all of a big deal. Think about it the opposite way. What would you think about the male game characters? Solid Snake (he was naked in MGS and my sister loved it btw), Duke Nukem, Link (Zelda), Leon (Resident Evil), etc. Male game characters have sex appeal too. Ever showed a girl a picture of em and ask if he's hot? Just like female game characters such as Lara Croft, Kasumi, Princess Peach (), Ada Wong, BloodRayne, etc. We would think many of these characters attract to us men as well.

Trying to attack sex appeal in video games is not a good way to go. Almost all girls grow up to have the appeal and desire to be perfect, like a princess. Men . . . humm...skip that. I would say Power Rangers, but don't take my word for it. There are magazines out there for women. Shows them how pretty and sexy they should be, how to have the best sex of your life, etc. If you want to deal with somthing like sex appeal in video games, you might need to start at the root of things. Men magazines, talks about men needs, buffness, working out, looking good for your woman, etc.

Women would like a strong man and men would like a fit woman (not stratching the surface of that opinion...it would go off topic). It's just natural. Like I said, this has been going on before video games and women should not be offened. They should actually be proud. Females game characters are doing more than just wating to be saved (like in many, many movies) Lara Croft is now in the Genius Book of World Records. Good looking and ass kicking women. Good looking and ass kicking men.

You don't see NO game where you see a woman in the kitchen...only in the movies my friend. Ya feel me?

Sorry for the grammar and spelling.

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Originally posted by RipperjackAU

Copied from my post at Tom's Hardare here:

http://forumz.tomshardware.com/games/Multiplayer-Melee-Female-Gamers-ftopict95654.html

You know what really makes me HATE female gamers??

The fact that they give us gamer nerds crap for years, then come to play our games and expect us to treat them with respect and as equals!!

I am a 35 year old computer geek virgin. Girls have avoided me like the plague for as long as I can remember. It's not because I am over fat, ugly or poor. On the contrary, I am a 6'4" hulk with reasonable looks and money to burn. However the fact that I spent more time playing games, tinkering with computers and in general living the life of a techie, that branded me one of those computer geek freaks.

Girls would make fun of me or just flatly refused to have anything to do with me during school, uni and work life. Any attempt to talk with them would end up with snide remarks about being a geek or the usual brush off because of [insert lame excuse here]. So in short women have pretty much disrespected me all my life.

What to I do to escape it, I immerse myself in my computer games. Getting online with my favourite MMO is like going down to the pub to mull over the troubles of the day with your mates.. in this case it was my online clan.

However, now I have to deal with women starting to play these games. No longer can I chat to my clan about the troubles of the day without someone reminding me to tone it down because so-and-so is a girl IRL and heaven forbid she might get offended.

Online games were once the boys only club that you could go to, as a refuge from the women that like to give is geeks grief. No longer this is the case.

What's worse is that these girls now demand that we respect them... they can go and get f'ed if they think they can dump insults and remarks on us guy gamers, then expect us to treat them like the prim and proper princesses they want to me made out to be.

The skanks should go back to "The Sims Online", and leave the REAL gaming to us men... like it SHOULD be.

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Originally posted by Athela
This topic really does get discussed everywhere.  My hero Seanbaby of EGM has a column in the May issue:  Salute to Girl Gaming.  If Seanbaby is thinking about this, *everyone* is thinking about this.  He plays a fair amount of My Little Pony and Barbie games so I think he knows whereof he speaks.

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Your kidding right. Seanbaby...In my head I know Seanbaby as "The Basher". He makes some funny comments about things.

WILL SOMEONE BANN THAT USER SPAMMING!

Seanbaby gets to review the stuff *noone else dares to review*....His article references Barbie and the Mary Kate and Asley games.  There's a stunning photo of one of the twins and a troll doll.  Definitely a separated at birth moment.  These type of games are supposed to get girls interested in gaming at a young age. *ick*  He is a funny writer, and you have to love that mohawk.

So no this isn't a serious article on women and gaming but if the idea is rolling around in Seanbaby's head...well there must be something to it, right?

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Originally posted by Znith
Personally I get really tired of the girl (woman) gamer myth rehashed over and over.  Myself being a woman I've been online gaming since MUDs were born, fragged since Doom and Duke Nukem was released and played mmo's since The Realm.  Just give me a great playable game, with immersion, good controls and a pc please.  If I like it I will continue to play.

I enjoy games just as much as the typical male. It's the competition, working together for a common goal on a quest, chatting it up about equipment, taking you out with my shotgun in Quake, or just forming online friendships.   I'm tired of people trying to put us in a category all of our own.  Sure more of us might like the SIMs, but then the SIM's was in a league of it's own with no similar competition when it released.

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Whatever happened to the days of Sierra & Strategic Simulations Games? Doesn't anybody remember the Hero's Quest series, Gabriel Knight series, or Phantasmagoria I or II?

I've been gaming since the early 80's. I remember R.O.B. (Robotic Operating Buddy System) for Nintendo before the Light Gun or Power Glove even came out.

The idea that females don't game is stupid and always has been. I have an older sister and our sibling rivalry largely revolved around whose turn it was on the computer or the Nintendo, fighting over this or that new game. Even my technophobe mother would play the computer. Granted it was early Mah Jhongg in the 80's or casino games -but even the old lady does it! Her girlfriends used to come over to play the less interesting (IMHO) games together.

Heck my first time touching The Legend of Zelda, I beat Gannon when my dad got to the end and was so frustrated he was going to give up.

Whoever thought female:male ratio is unbalanced is misleading themselves. There's nothing more strange to me than a technophobe femme or a woman whom has never played a video game.

A few days ago on DDO: Stormreach there was a party I was in where we all asked ages and sexes. Half the six were female. I find this average there and those are only the ones who tell you. My characters are sometimes male and you'd be surprised how many people assume I am simply because of my toon, too! Interestingly, the example party mentioned above was 27-32 except for one 15 yr-old young man.

I used to MUD, MOO, MUSH, FFRPG, etc. but being a player online doesn't mean you're a gamer. Being a gamer originally meant you played tabletop RPG's. These days the meaning has changed for those who haven't or weren't around when it started being called that. It doesn't matter to me, I do both and have for over a decade.

BTW -anyone remember Zork?? Or the original LucasArts games like Loom?

As far as SIMs, Quake, or Duke Nukem -I never liked them myself. Of course, it's like MMO's are lacking in plot, what a lot of PC games in the 386 era had in abundance. Sure they have setting and little substories, the overall plot is never influenced by the players though. It gets repetitive and dull after a while and then it's off to the next Civilization game or back to Age of Wonders I or II. Rome: Total War? No? Okay then, back to Guild Wars where you get a voice in the cut scenes, etc. Too cool!

Myself, I'm 27 and I've been gaming as far back as I can remember. 3, 4, or 5? Something like that. My sister with me. We used to play the little girl down the street on Gameboy too, on Tetris. Remember the original Prince of Persia for the PC? I tell ya, there were maybe two boys in my neighborhood that played and when they did it was at my house and I was kicking their arses then, too.

I've owned Gameboy, Nintendo, SNES, PS, PS2, 3D0 Gold Edition, Sega Genesis, SegaCD (b4 it was 1 unit). I had wanted but didn't get Turbo Graphix 16, the Jaguar, and that's about it. I wasn't really impressed with systems I tried outside that range. Now it's mostly PC & PS2 for me.

Oh, and being a housewife or an employed woman doesn't make a difference -I always find time for my gaming. And when I'm not playing video games, I'm playing tabletop RPG's.  It seems most female players I run into online are around 16-18 and from Australia or America and sometimes from Europe. I doubt that's even a basis of comparison, but it's from my experience. Some games don't even allow international server mixing, so it's impossible to say what the ratio is like in some games like that, even if they did know if every player was male or female.
I hear there's a massive explosion of Korean online gamers now and they're both sexes, too.

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Originally posted by Athela

Seanbaby gets to review the stuff *noone else dares to review*....His article references Barbie and the Mary Kate and Asley games.  There's a stunning photo of one of the twins and a troll doll.  Definitely a separated at birth moment.  These type of games are supposed to get girls interested in gaming at a young age. *ick*  He is a funny writer, and you have to love that mohawk.

So no this isn't a serious article on women and gaming but if the idea is rolling around in Seanbaby's head...well there must be something to it, right?

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