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EVE Online

EVE Online 

Jita (General)  » EVE online is losing players, many lost in past year

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103 posts found
  mrmeloni

Novice Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 248

 
OP  7/14/14 2:23:27 PM#1

CCP used to reguarly release subscription numbers for EVE online

In February 2013, EVE Online reached over 500,000 subscribers

This was the last time CCP would reveal subscription numbers

In March 2011, CCP announced EVE online has over 360,000 subscriptions, at the same time, they recorded 63,170 players logged in to the game at one time. They would often hit the 55-60k mark at primetime on weekends.

These days, EVE online will see a max of about 40k players during primetime at weekends. During weekday, it's much less, 30,000 or so.

There's not a single word from CCP these days about sub numbers, or attempts to break the old concurrent user record of 61,170 players. They are not even trying to break it. Why would they do that? Because they will look bad when they fall hugely short of the previous record. They know they've lost a lot of players and don't want to look bad.

If in march 2011 they had 360k subs and made the record at that time with 63k concurrent users, and now they only get 40k users at prime time, how many subs would you estimate they have right now? I would guess around 250 to 300k, the 250k being the most likely and the 300k being very generous. That's about 200k less subs than February 2013, a drop from 500k to 300k or less.

These past few months the average user count has dropped faster than usual, an article on themitani website explains this in detail.

Griefing of players in hi-sec is rampant and nullsec is all controlled by a single group, many of whom seem bored with not having anyone to fight so many of them have formed organised groups who terrorize and grief players in hi-sec, adding to the problem.

During this past year, dust was a flop and they pulled the plug on World of Darkness, laying off many employees. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2014/06/06/eve-online-layoffs/ Many developers also left EVE online to work on other games and there was even a story in the press from an ex CCP developer that shed some light on what has been going on http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jun/05/world-of-darkness-the-inside-story-mmo-ccp-white-wolf

TDLR EVE is dying, for real this time. It was a good run.

  DamonVile

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4909

7/14/14 2:37:50 PM#2
Why have people suddenly got such a hard on for hating on eve?
  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7157

7/14/14 3:20:50 PM#3

Incarna in 2011 was their last successful expansion, since then the game is struggling to increase the player base or just add any (expanding) content at all.

The 500k mark is just a marketing gimmick as they added the numbers from chinese re-release.

Imo, the issues with development direction/management go long back to 2008(icelandic crisis and Quantum Rise failed expansion).

Current EVE is a very sad reminiscent of it's former glory...it was a blast, alas nothing lasts forever.

EDIT: I am in no way agreeing with OP, the numbers are off and ridiculous.

The game isn't dying, it is just a sailing ship without a captain...or a crew...

  Aeonblades

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

7/14/14 3:24:19 PM#4
Originally posted by DamonVile
Why have people suddenly got such a hard on for hating on eve?

I think it has to do with all the horror stories of players scamming/cheating/harassing others with no action taken by the company that owns the game. Basically in the eyes of most gamers, CCP condones cheating stealing and lying, which isn't going to sit well with most people.

 

Me personally, I dislike the community of Eve, but the game is solid. There is nothing wrong with the game at all, it's just mismanaged.

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12401

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

7/14/14 3:55:57 PM#5

The OP is a great example of one of the reasons why MMO devs don't give out sub numbers. As soon as they stop giving them out the assumption is that the game is losing players. "Many lost in past year." I must've missed that memo. ;)

 

The PCU records were often the result of multiple events at the same time in EVE, and were in no way indicative of peak averages at the time. If they were, the records probably wouldn't have been such a big deal. I think several of the records were on days when there was a tournament going on at the same time as a lot of activity in game. PCU records were always the result of player activity. CCP "aren't even trying to break it" because, to the best of my knowledge, they never did.

 

Anyway, it's July. EVE players are always less active in July. They're probably on a beach somewhere with their families or BBQing in their backyard. My educated guess is that the same is true for most MMOs. 

 

Whatever the case, welcome back from your 3.5-year hiatus. 

 

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7157

7/14/14 4:12:11 PM#6


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Anyway, it's July. EVE players are always less active in July. They're probably on a beach somewhere with their families or BBQing in their backyard. My educated guess is that the same is true for most MMOs. 


So many more are at beach than July last year...? :-P

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5909

7/14/14 4:17:39 PM#7
Originally posted by DamonVile
Why have people suddenly got such a hard on for hating on <insert the game of the week>?

I can't figure this one out either. I don't see EVE being the kind of game I would like, but for what it delivers how could it not be considered good?

The only thing I really fault CCP for is sometimes caving to power ploys buy some player groups. Maybe it's not really as bad as it appears from the outside, but it seems like it sometimes. The cash shop thing (monoclegate) comes to mind. I think they let themselves be bullied.

Curse you AquaScum!

  Wickersham

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/19/06
Posts: 2359

7/14/14 11:30:33 PM#8

If there is a drop, which I've not noticed, It's more likely due to the fact that the cost of PLEX has gone up from 550,000,000 to 800,000,000 in one year which might mean less alts payed for with PLEX.

Also, multiple character training with PLEX means that if you were inclined to train an alt you don't need to have 2 accounts.

From my perspective the real danger to eve online is CCP's modern notion that end game for eve is null sec and their attempt to get people to move out there.  When someone pees in the pool you have two choices - move to the other end of the pool (null sec) or get out of the pool (quit the game).  Be very careful CCP.

"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5746

7/14/14 11:40:38 PM#9
Originally posted by Loktofeit

The OP is a great example of one of the reasons why MMO devs don't give out sub numbers. As soon as they stop giving them out the assumption is that the game is losing players. "Many lost in past year." I must've missed that memo. ;)

 

The PCU records were often the result of multiple events at the same time in EVE, and were in no way indicative of peak averages at the time. If they were, the records probably wouldn't have been such a big deal. I think several of the records were on days when there was a tournament going on at the same time as a lot of activity in game. PCU records were always the result of player activity. CCP "aren't even trying to break it" because, to the best of my knowledge, they never did.

 

Anyway, it's July. EVE players are always less active in July. They're probably on a beach somewhere with their families or BBQing in their backyard. My educated guess is that the same is true for most MMOs. 

 

Whatever the case, welcome back from your 3.5-year hiatus. 

 

 

I agree on the PCU records not being indicative of the peak average users, and depending on which MMO sometimes not even indicative of overall population.

PCU varies depending on seasons, expansions, and lots of other factors that are game specific too.

My guesstimate - EvE is here to stay for a LONG time

  jpnz

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/29/06
Posts: 3565

7/15/14 1:22:51 AM#10

The 'it is Summer!' excuse doesn't really work if you look at the trends though.

http://themittani.com/features/graphing-eve-online-history-retribution-kronos

Doesn't look that great.

Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  kosac

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/05
Posts: 192

7/15/14 1:27:57 AM#11
its easy its not for ppl its just for few multibox maniacs... and if CCP wants make something to interest new players there is CSM who stops it.. EvE players dont want Walking in the Station etc its shame.. :) i was EvE player but game is not growing as i want so i left .. 
  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7157

7/15/14 1:45:35 AM#12


Originally posted by kosac

and if CCP wants make something to interest new players there is CSM who stops it.. EvE players dont want Walking in the Station etc its shame.. :) i was EvE player but game is not growing as i want so i left .. 

Good example how fast "listening to players" can ruin your business...

  SpottyGekko

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 2956

7/15/14 1:46:21 AM#13

Yes, EVE may be losing players.

So is WoW and just about any other MMO that has been released, ever.

 

Will EVE last a thousand years ? Probably not. I doubt that EVE will last another 10 years, but it's not entirely impossible...

 

All MMO's eventually die, but at least EVE has been one of the great success stories in the western MMO market. EVE remains as enduring proof that catering to a well-defined niche market can be a profitable business model.

 

 

  Solar_Prophet

Elite Member

Joined: 11/10/13
Posts: 678

WAAAGH!

7/15/14 2:07:00 AM#14

If there is a loss, then it's most likely because the game has stagnated. CCP had a much bigger vision for their game, but unfortunately the narrow minded player base weren't having any of it. They lacked the vision and wisdom to understand that the WIS content which was released was merely the tip of the iceberg, a quick sample of things to come. The game could have had avatar-based content rivaling that of the ship content... but alas, the players whined, stamped their feet, and cried about their internet spaceships, and CCP sacrificed their vision of turning EVE into a fully realized virtual universe instead of just a series of black, empty areas which generally amount to no more than dots on a map.

Also, don't forget that training several characters on one account is possible now. Since it's considered an additional paid feature on an account it probably isn't factored into the number of subscribers, and a reasonable amount of people probably dropped extraneous accounts in favor of having all their characters on one.

MMORPG's are thriving. There are hundreds available today, with different settings, mechanics, and even payment models to suit anyone's gaming needs. If you can't find one to call your own, then the problem isn't the genre... it's YOU.

  mrmeloni

Novice Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 248

 
OP  7/15/14 6:11:14 AM#15

I never said EVE was going to die soon, just that it's dying. It will be a slow death.

Makes sense why the sub numbers suddenly jumped to 500k, CCP included the china server subs into that number, even though a sub on that server costs a fraction per month of a sub on the main server.

Did they also include dust players into the 500k number? Either way just forget the 500k number because it's not actual subs of the EVE online server.

To those who say the record means nothing. They used to hit 50k, nearly 60k every primetime without trying. Now they are lucky to get 40k. That's a big drop in players.

The link posted by the poster above explains it in more detail and proves my point that EVE is losing players.

If you read the guardian news article by ex CCP dev Nick Blood, you'll see that CCP are looking for positive press, to make them stand out about other game companies in a favorable way, they don't want negative press, which is exactly what they get if they reveal that EVE online subscribers are a lot less than they announced last time. They've decided it better to keep quiet about the numbers rather than have news articles about how EVE online is finally losing players after ten years of reported higher sub numbers every year.

  Agent_Joseph

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/11/06
Posts: 913

7/15/14 9:00:35 AM#16
Originally posted by kosac
its easy its not for ppl its just for few multibox maniacs... and if CCP wants make something to interest new players there is CSM who stops it.. EvE players dont want Walking in the Station etc its shame.. :) i was EvE player but game is not growing as i want so i left .. 

walking in stations is crap,waste of time & resources,CCP are good in  making failed/crapy project

I am paused 5 years ,after back noticed game is very different and friendly for new players , I am retired my old character(50+mil sp) and now playing with new one(low sp but can do pvp stuff very good ,same as my old 50 mil sp character) ,just for re-learning how play game and use stuff.After meet and making friendships in game ,I am stick with main new  character.

EVE is very improved  & game growing all time nice,than I have no idea what about you talking

Yes,EVE dying last 11 years and have to dying in next decades .

 

 

 

 

only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW

  Phaserlight

Novice Member

Joined: 7/18/04
Posts: 707

Do you want to improve the world? I don't think it can be done. -Lao Tzu

7/15/14 9:28:51 AM#17
Originally posted by SpottyGekko

 All MMO's eventually die

Evidence has shown otherwise.

To quote Dr. Ralph Norcio, (my graduate program advisor),  "corporations can drink from the fountain of youth".  Look at how Nintendo started out producing playing cards, etc.  I think the same thing applies to MMORPGs.  The question is not 'when will this MMO die', but 'will this MMO continue reinventing itself while there are empowered, interested parties'?

/2c

"To be what you are not, experience what you are not." -Saint John of the Cross
Authored 110 missions in Vendetta Online
Check it out on Steam

  Asariasha

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/05/11
Posts: 215

7/15/14 9:31:30 AM#18
Originally posted by mrmeloni

I never said EVE was going to die soon, just that it's dying. It will be a slow death.

Makes sense why the sub numbers suddenly jumped to 500k, CCP included the china server subs into that number, even though a sub on that server costs a fraction per month of a sub on the main server.

Did they also include dust players into the 500k number? Either way just forget the 500k number because it's not actual subs of the EVE online server.

To those who say the record means nothing. They used to hit 50k, nearly 60k every primetime without trying. Now they are lucky to get 40k. That's a big drop in players.

The link posted by the poster above explains it in more detail and proves my point that EVE is losing players.

If you read the guardian news article by ex CCP dev Nick Blood, you'll see that CCP are looking for positive press, to make them stand out about other game companies in a favorable way, they don't want negative press, which is exactly what they get if they reveal that EVE online subscribers are a lot less than they announced last time. They've decided it better to keep quiet about the numbers rather than have news articles about how EVE online is finally losing players after ten years of reported higher sub numbers every year.

 

Talking about a slow death is a bit exaggerated.

 

Eve Online is a 11 year old online game. Being a niche game, Eve Online never managed to reach player numbers like WoW or other casual friendly online games, but I doubt CCP Games ever aimed to become the king of MMOs. More of importance is that CCP Games managed to constantly increase player numbers for almost a decade by continuously developing their vision of a huge sandbox universe.

 

I think Eve Online simply leaves the phase of growth and enters the stage of maturity. An absolutely normal change when it comes to product lifetime cycles. Who knows, maybe they manage to deliver another state-of-the-art expansion that results in more growth. We will see.

  Thane

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/03
Posts: 1919

I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar.

7/15/14 9:37:48 AM#19

"uh look mommie, another [enter mmo name here] is dying thread!"

"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19228

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

7/15/14 10:54:20 AM#20
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by mrmeloni

I never said EVE was going to die soon, just that it's dying. It will be a slow death.

Makes sense why the sub numbers suddenly jumped to 500k, CCP included the china server subs into that number, even though a sub on that server costs a fraction per month of a sub on the main server.

Did they also include dust players into the 500k number? Either way just forget the 500k number because it's not actual subs of the EVE online server.

To those who say the record means nothing. They used to hit 50k, nearly 60k every primetime without trying. Now they are lucky to get 40k. That's a big drop in players.

The link posted by the poster above explains it in more detail and proves my point that EVE is losing players.

If you read the guardian news article by ex CCP dev Nick Blood, you'll see that CCP are looking for positive press, to make them stand out about other game companies in a favorable way, they don't want negative press, which is exactly what they get if they reveal that EVE online subscribers are a lot less than they announced last time. They've decided it better to keep quiet about the numbers rather than have news articles about how EVE online is finally losing players after ten years of reported higher sub numbers every year.

 

Talking about a slow death is a bit exaggerated.

 

Eve Online is a 11 year old online game. Being a niche game, Eve Online never managed to reach player numbers like WoW or other casual friendly online games, but I doubt CCP Games ever aimed to become the king of MMOs. More of importance is that CCP Games managed to constantly increase player numbers for almost a decade by continuously developing their vision of a huge sandbox universe.

 

I think Eve Online simply leaves the phase of growth and enters the stage of maturity. An absolutely normal change when it comes to product lifetime cycles. Who knows, maybe they manage to deliver another state-of-the-art expansion that results in more growth. We will see.

if they could somehow deliver a form of ship to ship or in station combat within the EVE game (not DUST514) I think it would really revitalize the interest, however I think they've discounted that possibility previously.

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, "Meany", you speak as if these are bad things?
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

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