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General Discussion  » "Vet Content is Too Hard" - Upcoming changes

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105 posts found
  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15844

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/04/14 2:40:48 PM#21
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

For me the problem wasn't vet level difficulty, it was vet level boredom. There is no story after 50.. just go out (in "enemy" lands")and run boring quests with no backstory.  I got halfway through the first vet area and quit.

 

 

Maybe you should start reading / listening instead of skipping the story? Each zone has got an own story line that in addition is tied to the story arc of the faction.

 

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

 

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

 

 

The whole point of this change was in regard to the massive complaints about not being able to see it all on one character. It was not a smart change by any means, the same goes for the change to the starter areas. It's a pretty good lesson on not caving to every complaint your audience makes.

The added content was nothing but a bonus for Zenimax at least at the time. We see now though that it didn't make much difference in long term appeal.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  TankYou88

Novice Member

Joined: 6/25/14
Posts: 335

7/04/14 2:40:50 PM#22
Thats really disappointing. This is the how games go on a decline, they make it where everything is so easy to get and realize that the game gives no real content, anyone who cares about the actual journey of the game will be disappointed, which should be the majority of ES players...Very sad to see them dig a bigger grave for themselves.
  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15844

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/04/14 2:46:47 PM#23
Originally posted by TankYou88
Thats really disappointing. This is the how games go on a decline, they make it where everything is so easy to get and realize that the game gives no real content, anyone who cares about the actual journey of the game will be disappointed, which should be the majority of ES players...Very sad to see them dig a bigger grave for themselves.

Was it really difficult to begin with or was it overly tedious? There's a huge difference.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  Slackker

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/26/04
Posts: 225

7/04/14 2:54:36 PM#24
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

The whole point of this change was in regard to the massive complaints about not being able to see it all on one character. It was not a smart change by any means, the same goes for the change to the starter areas. It's a pretty good lesson on not caving to every complaint your audience makes.

The added content was nothing but a bonus for Zenimax at least at the time. We see now though that it didn't make much difference in long term appeal.

Exactly my feelings on the starter zones and VR content. This latest change, instead of adding faction-specific content for VR levels - which they could do a couple levels at a time over 6 months and still make me happy - is seriously making me consider uninstalling the game and forgetting about it. I haven't subscribed since the first 43-day period ended (early access, free apology time) but I'd been waiting for Thieves Guild and/or Dark Brotherhood to give it another try. Not so sure I'm interested now. Not that it matters, I'm just one person. Just venting!

I never found the veteran content difficult. By comparison I suppose it was, but I only died a few times per VR level. Not a big deal, given there's no real penalty for death. I'm happy they realized it needed a change, just not a fan of the one they came up with. Poor comparison, but it's like saying I don't like Peach Tea and having someone say "how about just half a cup then, so you can get through it faster?".

-Slackker

  TankYou88

Novice Member

Joined: 6/25/14
Posts: 335

7/04/14 3:00:43 PM#25
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by TankYou88
Thats really disappointing. This is the how games go on a decline, they make it where everything is so easy to get and realize that the game gives no real content, anyone who cares about the actual journey of the game will be disappointed, which should be the majority of ES players...Very sad to see them dig a bigger grave for themselves.

Was it really difficult to begin with or was it overly tedious? There's a huge difference.

If you had a good group of people you did it with then it was fun and adventurous with a slight difficulty. They already have people soloing the VR content so I dont see how its too hard for a group. Its just going to seem dumbed down.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5423

7/04/14 3:02:12 PM#26
Originally posted by fledur

I don't agree with the philosophy that solo content must be faceroll easy and if devs want to add any kind of challenge they should do it in instanced content.

Because thats exactly what ESO pre-vet solo content is: faceroll easy. Now they are going to make veteran easy....the word "veteran" itself already means something more than normal content.

 

So disappointed that they are already dumbing down stuff...

They aren't dumbing it down, they are trying to save the game.

 When a significant proportion of the player base hits VR levels and then quits the game, they know they have a problem to deal with. The problem really stems from Cyrodiil though, and that VR levels are needed to compete, that was probably a mistake they made in development, and given how much difference it does make to the PvP, i am totally surprised they did not see it coming, which kind of lends a lot of credence to the theory that the whole thing was just tacked on because they were facing player backlash due to the whole 'locked off areas' issue.

 So, they effectively have 2 choices, either change the PvP so that VR ranks did not give a significant advantage, or make gaining those VR ranks a less tedious experience.

But seriously, this is just the beginning, if they want the fans of the Elder Scrolls games to play ESO, then they really need to start addressing those issues, and so far, they have barely touched the surface. The onus is very much on Zenimax now to deliver.

  keithian

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/06
Posts: 3029

7/04/14 3:31:14 PM#27
Originally posted by Iselin

Excellent news!

 

Anyone that knows my posting history here knows how I feel about the VR content. and the insignificant rewards considering the extra effort required just to clear trash.

 

There is a balance of group content (dolmens, the one public dungeon and one instanced dungeon per zone, world bosses) and solo questing 1-50. When that changes so dramatically in the VR "other faction" content it's a shock to the system. More encouragement for grouping should be focused on enhancing the quantity and quality of legitimate group content as well as the XP and loot rewards, not by morphing solo content into group content.

 

Say what you will about this game but you have to give big kudos to the team for listening and making needed fundamental changes.

I agree with you thats its good to see that they are listening, hopefully not too late, and they are making some fundamental changes. I'm also glad that I took my time, now 48 :-), so I wont have to experience what others have gone through hehe. HOWEVER, I still think the entire idea of 50+ and 50++ should be wiped so alts are encouraged instead as IMO the average MMOer prefers alts. This is especially due to the fact that the Class design is not the 'template' Zenimax made it out to be. Those class choices make a huge difference and is exactly why there are so many balance issues. If it was just a template as they made it out to be, then we wouldn't have all these balance issues.  Regardless, I agree its a very positive step in the right direction and now I don't have to dread getting to 50 very shortly :-). I'm still debating if I want to make an alt or not knowing that I have to play through Vet content if I want to PVE to the end...which is an annoying decision to have to make.

There Is Always Hope!

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4033

7/04/14 4:04:04 PM#28
Originally posted by keithian
Originally posted by Iselin

Excellent news!

 

Anyone that knows my posting history here knows how I feel about the VR content. and the insignificant rewards considering the extra effort required just to clear trash.

 

There is a balance of group content (dolmens, the one public dungeon and one instanced dungeon per zone, world bosses) and solo questing 1-50. When that changes so dramatically in the VR "other faction" content it's a shock to the system. More encouragement for grouping should be focused on enhancing the quantity and quality of legitimate group content as well as the XP and loot rewards, not by morphing solo content into group content.

 

Say what you will about this game but you have to give big kudos to the team for listening and making needed fundamental changes.

I agree with you thats its good to see that they are listening, hopefully not too late, and they are making some fundamental changes. I'm also glad that I took my time, now 48 :-), so I wont have to experience what others have gone through hehe. HOWEVER, I still think the entire idea of 50+ and 50++ should be wiped so alts are encouraged instead as IMO the average MMOer prefers alts. This is especially due to the fact that the Class design is not the 'template' Zenimax made it out to be. Those class choices make a huge difference and is exactly why there are so many balance issues. If it was just a template as they made it out to be, then we wouldn't have all these balance issues.  Regardless, I agree its a very positive step in the right direction and now I don't have to dread getting to 50 very shortly :-). I'm still debating if I want to make an alt or not knowing that I have to play through Vet content if I want to PVE to the end...which is an annoying decision to have to make.

Yeah. I've always disliked the VR+ and ++ with one character bit as well and always saw it as a kludge. But I also know that it's here to stay...and if that's the case, this is a good step to make it less tedious... hopefully even fun :)

 

And to those confusing tedium with difficulty... VR+ and ++ is not all that difficult as long as you have the hang of speccing (hint: for PVE you spec for AOE for those groups of 3 or 4 you always run into, with a dash of CC for mini bosses). With my VR7 Sorc I can solo even most of the group public dungeons... the problem is that after a while having challenging fights ALL THE TIME, with EVERY TRASH MOB gets to be tedious and old.

 

Maybe some were complaining because it was too tough for them...likely the spec-challenged. But the vast majority of complaining was about how tedious, unrewarding and seemingly pointless it was to do a part of the game that is required content to reach max level and worse, required to be truly competitive in PVP.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17527

7/04/14 4:04:57 PM#29
Originally posted by keithian
 

I agree with you thats its good to see that they are listening, hopefully not too late, and they are making some fundamental changes. I'm also glad that I took my time, now 48 :-), so I wont have to experience what others have gone through hehe. HOWEVER, I still think the entire idea of 50+ and 50++ should be wiped so alts are encouraged instead as IMO the average MMOer prefers alts. This is especially due to the fact that the Class design is not the 'template' Zenimax made it out to be. Those class choices make a huge difference and is exactly why there are so many balance issues. If it was just a template as they made it out to be, then we wouldn't have all these balance issues.  Regardless, I agree its a very positive step in the right direction and now I don't have to dread getting to 50 very shortly :-). I'm still debating if I want to make an alt or not knowing that I have to play through Vet content if I want to PVE to the end...which is an annoying decision to have to make.

They did it because many elder scrolls players wanted to see the world with one character.

Having said that, if one likes alts then one only has to make an alt. they don't hinder players from making characters in other factions.

 

  Slapshot1188

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4190

7/04/14 4:26:23 PM#30
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

For me the problem wasn't vet level difficulty, it was vet level boredom. There is no story after 50.. just go out (in "enemy" lands")and run boring quests with no backstory.  I got halfway through the first vet area and quit.

 

 

Maybe you should start reading / listening instead of skipping the story? Each zone has got an own story line that in addition is tied to the story arc of the faction.

 

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

 

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

 

 

The whole point of this change was in regard to the massive complaints about not being able to see it all on one character. It was not a smart change by any means, the same goes for the change to the starter areas. It's a pretty good lesson on not caving to every complaint your audience makes.

The added content was nothing but a bonus for Zenimax at least at the time. We see now though that it didn't make much difference in long term appeal.

The issue is that you HAD to run the VR stuff to be competitive in the RvR.  The difference between a level 50 and a VR5 was insane (forget VR10).  So to really be effective in what was supposed to be the endgame you had to run the forced and tacked on VR areas... even though you had already saved the world..

 

To me it wasn't "hard", it was just DUMB.

 

 

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  keithian

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/06
Posts: 3029

7/04/14 4:55:00 PM#31
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by keithian
 

I agree with you thats its good to see that they are listening, hopefully not too late, and they are making some fundamental changes. I'm also glad that I took my time, now 48 :-), so I wont have to experience what others have gone through hehe. HOWEVER, I still think the entire idea of 50+ and 50++ should be wiped so alts are encouraged instead as IMO the average MMOer prefers alts. This is especially due to the fact that the Class design is not the 'template' Zenimax made it out to be. Those class choices make a huge difference and is exactly why there are so many balance issues. If it was just a template as they made it out to be, then we wouldn't have all these balance issues.  Regardless, I agree its a very positive step in the right direction and now I don't have to dread getting to 50 very shortly :-). I'm still debating if I want to make an alt or not knowing that I have to play through Vet content if I want to PVE to the end...which is an annoying decision to have to make.

They did it because many elder scrolls players wanted to see the world with one character.

Having said that, if one likes alts then one only has to make an alt. they don't hinder players from making characters in other factions.

 

It doesn't hinder someone as you wrote, but then if you do decide to continue leveling one of the level 50 (Vet 1), then you are forced to do the same content as one of your alts with another character as that is the only way to get to the end....to me thats annoying.

There Is Always Hope!

  keithian

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/06
Posts: 3029

7/04/14 4:58:56 PM#32
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by keithian
Originally posted by Iselin

Excellent news!

 

Anyone that knows my posting history here knows how I feel about the VR content. and the insignificant rewards considering the extra effort required just to clear trash.

 

There is a balance of group content (dolmens, the one public dungeon and one instanced dungeon per zone, world bosses) and solo questing 1-50. When that changes so dramatically in the VR "other faction" content it's a shock to the system. More encouragement for grouping should be focused on enhancing the quantity and quality of legitimate group content as well as the XP and loot rewards, not by morphing solo content into group content.

 

Say what you will about this game but you have to give big kudos to the team for listening and making needed fundamental changes.

I agree with you thats its good to see that they are listening, hopefully not too late, and they are making some fundamental changes. I'm also glad that I took my time, now 48 :-), so I wont have to experience what others have gone through hehe. HOWEVER, I still think the entire idea of 50+ and 50++ should be wiped so alts are encouraged instead as IMO the average MMOer prefers alts. This is especially due to the fact that the Class design is not the 'template' Zenimax made it out to be. Those class choices make a huge difference and is exactly why there are so many balance issues. If it was just a template as they made it out to be, then we wouldn't have all these balance issues.  Regardless, I agree its a very positive step in the right direction and now I don't have to dread getting to 50 very shortly :-). I'm still debating if I want to make an alt or not knowing that I have to play through Vet content if I want to PVE to the end...which is an annoying decision to have to make.

Yeah. I've always disliked the VR+ and ++ with one character bit as well and always saw it as a kludge. But I also know that it's here to stay...and if that's the case, this is a good step to make it less tedious... hopefully even fun :)

 

And to those confusing tedium with difficulty... VR+ and ++ is not all that difficult as long as you have the hang of speccing (hint: for PVE you spec for AOE for those groups of 3 or 4 you always run into, with a dash of CC for mini bosses). With my VR7 Sorc I can solo even most of the group public dungeons... the problem is that after a while having challenging fights ALL THE TIME, with EVERY TRASH MOB gets to be tedious and old.

 

Maybe some were complaining because it was too tough for them...likely the spec-challenged. But the vast majority of complaining was about how tedious, unrewarding and seemingly pointless it was to do a part of the game that is required content to reach max level and worse, required to be truly competitive in PVP.

That is how I specd. I have one skill line for basically single target, and then another  skill line for AOE with one heal within the Dragonknight skill line for emergencies. I also have a couple of matrixed DPS/heals in the single target line with a vampire skill and one mage skill. Both use a DPS Staff. I would prefer yet a 3rd skill line for my healing staff, but oh well lol.

There Is Always Hope!

  shadylurker

Novice Member

Joined: 11/09/08
Posts: 55

7/04/14 5:06:30 PM#33
Originally posted by DamonVile
people can ask for challenging content on forums all they like but in the end wow was right. Easy is what really sell.

Who has ever said they want their endgame to be a quest grind?

Lets rehash content but make it harder and call it end game. No thank you.  I'm still not interested in playing other faction quests.

I don't know where game developers get the idea to leave meaningfull pve endgame content out of thier games.  People like mmos because they involve other people, so give big groups of people something to do and reward them for it......perhaps with veteran ranks?!!!??  Is it really that hard?

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6907

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

7/04/14 5:17:06 PM#34
Originally posted by Sovrath

It's "stupid" they way they did it.

You want people to group? Make areas/dungeons/encounters that are group specific.

Even go as far as to make an entire quest line group specific. People want to do this content? They group.

Additionally (and maybe they did someone can tell me though I highly doubt it) they can keep difficutly but add an xp bonus for groups.

Just making things difficult and having players "figure it out" after they have played 1-50 a certain way is not the way to do it.

 

This is EXACTLY why i laughed at Blizzard's design.You don't make a game solo 1-50 then expect players after soloing every single minute of every single day to all of a sudden know how to or want to group.So what did Blizzard do ,they made the best rewards at end game grouping content,lol because your not even leveling anymore so why even bother?

Devs need to quit with the lazy game designs, make an mmo then make it play like a MMO>>>GROUPING,you know interacting with other players.

All we have heard for the past 10 years is gaming needs to be >>>>>FUN.Well ok i can buy into that concept,then why are people complaining about too much time or i have to group,i thought if it was FUN that was the main goal?

Personally i know it was always bs the majority of gamer's don't belong in MMORPG's because truth is they are NOT playing for Fun but are instead playing a single player game that they think is all about attaining levels and as fast as possible.Then after they bored themselves to death running around doing quests,they wanted them to auto update,like that has ANY realism to it at all.../not.

Developers should ONLY be making changes that encourage interaction and to bring back the MMO in MMORPG's.Oh and what the heck might as well put the ROLE into the RPG aspect as well.Oh ya players don't want roles anymore,so they don't want the MMO nor the RPG aspect,why the heck play a mmorpg?The whole complaining and whining by gamer's baffles the heck out of me,it's like they want a rollercoaster, a theme park,an automatic self playing game,play for free,tons of friends without interacting with anyone,idk i am just baffled.Oh yes and can i please have a maximum level player and the best gear if i give you an extra 50 bucks for my preorder?

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Quesa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 1265

7/04/14 5:26:40 PM#35
Nobody should be surprised about this.  I can't think of any major MMO released in the past decade that hasn't tuned their hardest content in this manor, WS will probably do it as well, despite their statements to the opposite.
  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7531

 
OP  7/04/14 5:35:34 PM#36
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

For me the problem wasn't vet level difficulty, it was vet level boredom. There is no story after 50.. just go out (in "enemy" lands")and run boring quests with no backstory.  I got halfway through the first vet area and quit.

 

 

Maybe you should start reading / listening instead of skipping the story? Each zone has got an own story line that in addition is tied to the story arc of the faction.

 

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

 

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

 

 

The whole point of this change was in regard to the massive complaints about not being able to see it all on one character. It was not a smart change by any means, the same goes for the change to the starter areas. It's a pretty good lesson on not caving to every complaint your audience makes.

The added content was nothing but a bonus for Zenimax at least at the time. We see now though that it didn't make much difference in long term appeal.

I don't think they should have added levels associated with the added content though. I think that's where they went too far. 

 

If you are 50, you should have the option of doing the other areas for gold or maybe skill points imo. 

  Quesa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 1265

7/04/14 5:38:10 PM#37
Well, 50 should have been level cap.  Vet ranks are just their way of hiding that you've only really completed about half of your leveling but that they ran out of story to compel you to keep going.
  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17527

7/04/14 5:38:41 PM#38
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

For me the problem wasn't vet level difficulty, it was vet level boredom. There is no story after 50.. just go out (in "enemy" lands")and run boring quests with no backstory.  I got halfway through the first vet area and quit.

 

 

Maybe you should start reading / listening instead of skipping the story? Each zone has got an own story line that in addition is tied to the story arc of the faction.

 

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

 

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

 

 

No, they did it because many die hard elder scrolls players wanted to see the entirety of Tamriel with the character of their choice. They didn't like the idea of segregated factioned areas.

So as a concession Zenimax created this solution. Not really what many wanted but it was better than nothing for some.

  Slapshot1188

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4190

7/04/14 5:44:39 PM#39
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Slapshot1188
Originally posted by Asariasha
Originally posted by Slapshot1188

For me the problem wasn't vet level difficulty, it was vet level boredom. There is no story after 50.. just go out (in "enemy" lands")and run boring quests with no backstory.  I got halfway through the first vet area and quit.

 

 

Maybe you should start reading / listening instead of skipping the story? Each zone has got an own story line that in addition is tied to the story arc of the faction.

 

Yes which makes no sense that I am suddenly befriending the Queen of the AD who is my mortal enemy...

 

The whole vet concept of doing the other zones was obviously just tacked on at the end of development and it shows.  If I want to experience the other 2 areas I'll make a character there.  The whole setup screams of a desperate last minute decision by the developers when they realized the content would only hold people for a few weeks.

 

 

No, they did it because many die hard elder scrolls players wanted to see the entirety of Tamriel with the character of their choice. They didn't like the idea of segregated factioned areas.

So as a concession Zenimax created this solution. Not really what many wanted but it was better than nothing for some.

Well... it may have been better for "some" but there sure are a lot of people who hated it.  As others said, it should have been an OPTION for those that wished instead of forced on everyone to be competitive in the real endgame which is the RvR.

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15844

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/04/14 5:45:16 PM#40
Originally posted by Wizardry
Originally posted by Sovrath

It's "stupid" they way they did it.

You want people to group? Make areas/dungeons/encounters that are group specific.

Even go as far as to make an entire quest line group specific. People want to do this content? They group.

Additionally (and maybe they did someone can tell me though I highly doubt it) they can keep difficutly but add an xp bonus for groups.

Just making things difficult and having players "figure it out" after they have played 1-50 a certain way is not the way to do it.

 

This is EXACTLY why i laughed at Blizzard's design.You don't make a game solo 1-50 then expect players after soloing every single minute of every single day to all of a sudden know how to or want to group.So what did Blizzard do ,they made the best rewards at end game grouping content,lol because your not even leveling anymore so why even bother?

Devs need to quit with the lazy game designs, make an mmo then make it play like a MMO>>>GROUPING,you know interacting with other players.

All we have heard for the past 10 years is gaming needs to be >>>>>FUN.Well ok i can buy into that concept,then why are people complaining about too much time or i have to group,i thought if it was FUN that was the main goal?

Personally i know it was always bs the majority of gamer's don't belong in MMORPG's because truth is they are NOT playing for Fun but are instead playing a single player game that they think is all about attaining levels and as fast as possible.Then after they bored themselves to death running around doing quests,they wanted them to auto update,like that has ANY realism to it at all.../not.

Developers should ONLY be making changes that encourage interaction and to bring back the MMO in MMORPG's.Oh and what the heck might as well put the ROLE into the RPG aspect as well.Oh ya players don't want roles anymore,so they don't want the MMO nor the RPG aspect,why the heck play a mmorpg?The whole complaining and whining by gamer's baffles the heck out of me,it's like they want a rollercoaster, a theme park,an automatic self playing game,play for free,tons of friends without interacting with anyone,idk i am just baffled.Oh yes and can i please have a maximum level player and the best gear if i give you an extra 50 bucks for my preorder?

 

 

Not sure how adding tons of scripted events is the lazy route (which is what a large chunk of ESOs design is comprised of), but anyway, WOW is your example of a failed design? Really?

AOC and SWTOR both had group based content for just about every level range, in AOC's case you could play all content in such a manner. Ever visit any of those areas? They were all but empty. Group based content isn't the obvious fix you think it is, if players don't run it it's a pointless addition. Devs can only do so much in terms of forcing players to do something, it's still up to whether players in large part are seeking that or not. In those two examples above they obviously weren't.

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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