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ArcheAge

ArcheAge 

General Discussion  » Everyone Fight for 1.0 Changes during Beta!!! Bombard Trion to make the right changes!!

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105 posts found
  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:09:15 AM#21
Originally posted by kridak
Originally posted by Madimorga
Originally posted by eyesadi

Totally agree.....So, I repeat.....Pirate attacks....loses fight.......loss of hand!  PERMANENTLY.

Give the butt heads something to think about.........

They wanna gank........make em pay for a loss.

As it sits......they lose NOTHING.

Is that fair???

I think this is great, except of course it will be free to play, so there will be endless accounts full of one handed gankers.  Still, if leveling is slow enough, that might deter a few of them.  Plus, it would be hilariously funny.  +1 for Medieval punishment.  And permadeath for repeat offenders, with their carcasses prominently displayed on spikes, would also be a nice touch.

 

If i had to start over after pirating someones goods, i sure as hell would not pirate in the first place.   Some folks would and more power to them...i have no problem with pirates, but the current system is as others have said...deeply flawed.

If risk vs reward applies to Pver's, let it apply to pirates as well...hell even stop the early escape from jails and increase the jail time.  Can you imagine the uproar if a pirate had to spend 2 days in jail and could not play with that character.  They would flip out.

Yet that would be risk  vs reward.  I know if i was a pirate and was looking at 2 days of not advancing my toon i would seriously rethink my choices!  Especially if the duration in jail increased with each offense.

But alas all this means nothing because the system will not be changed....it is a pirates heaven and i cannot blame them for taking advantage of a flawed system.

 

 

I can't blame them either, it's just a shame this game, which otherwise sounds like so much fun, is so fundamentally flawed.  Not even saying there shouldn't be areas for pirates and PvP, either.  There should be, and I'd go into those areas, especially if I could join up with a group caravan.  But it seems the whole game is infested with PvP except for maybe one tiny area.  I'm very disappointed, because if it weren't for that, I'd have scraped up the $150 for alpha instead of buying into another themepark.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  flizzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 1357

5/23/14 10:15:27 AM#22
I feel we need to petition Trion to change their stance on no PvE servers.  As the game currently stands gankers will be out in force and ruin the experience of most PvE oriented players.   The justice system is no deterrent since the punishments are inconsequential.  
  daimer

Novice Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 8

5/23/14 10:18:18 AM#23
Originally posted by kridak
Originally posted by Madimorga
Originally posted by eyesadi

Totally agree.....So, I repeat.....Pirate attacks....loses fight.......loss of hand!  PERMANENTLY.

Give the butt heads something to think about.........

They wanna gank........make em pay for a loss.

As it sits......they lose NOTHING.

Is that fair???

I think this is great, except of course it will be free to play, so there will be endless accounts full of one handed gankers.  Still, if leveling is slow enough, that might deter a few of them.  Plus, it would be hilariously funny.  +1 for Medieval punishment.  And permadeath for repeat offenders, with their carcasses prominently displayed on spikes, would also be a nice touch.

 

If i had to start over after pirating someones goods, i sure as hell would not pirate in the first place.   Some folks would and more power to them...i have no problem with pirates, but the current system is as others have said...deeply flawed.

If risk vs reward applies to Pver's, let it apply to pirates as well...hell even stop the early escape from jails and increase the jail time.  Can you imagine the uproar if a pirate had to spend 2 days in jail and could not play with that character.  They would flip out.

Yet that would be risk  vs reward.  I know if i was a pirate and was looking at 2 days of not advancing my toon i would seriously rethink my choices!  Especially if the duration in jail increased with each offense.

But alas all this means nothing because the system will not be changed....it is a pirates heaven and i cannot blame them for taking advantage of a flawed system.

 

 

 I dont agree with permadeath, and i dont think the system is flawed as ppl are stating here. If piracy didnt exist, the game would lose much of its appeal. 

I mean, why do we play games? Because we want to have fun, with experiences we dont have in RL, feelings that are born from those experiences are what keep us playing the game. 

If there was permadeath for pirating, there would be no pirates. And then what? How long would you keep playing a game where there was no thrill or danger for the best rewards? I sure would get bored in a few weeks. But if the game forces me to analyze my route, plan the deliveries with my friends, hire mercs to escort me, just because i know there will be a pirate waiting to rob me!!! man, i would play that game for a long time!!! Simply because it messes with my emotions, makes me think ,and will give me a much better sense of acomplishment when i do actually have succes in my runs!

Just my opinion

  Cetra

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/04
Posts: 371

5/23/14 10:22:28 AM#24

The ganker has nothing to lose. While the trader has everything to lose.

Why would anyone be a trader when being a pvper is so much easier??

Its only 20%.  Give the trader some consolation and encouragment to do the trades.

No need to cry a river over this.

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:26:36 AM#25
Originally posted by flizzer
I feel we need to petition Trion to change their stance on no PvE servers.  As the game currently stands gankers will be out in force and ruin the experience of most PvE oriented players.   The justice system is no deterrent since the punishments are inconsequential.  

Pretty much why I've been commenting so much on the game.  Bless mmorpg.com's little hearts, they come up high in search engine results.  If anyone at Trion is curious about how the masses are receiving their game in its current form, they'll eventually see some of what we post here.

 

And if they still aren't interested in the content of carebear wallets, maybe some other devs will be.  The key is not to cave and put money into a ganker game for want of something better.  Doing that sends the wrong message:  It says we gripe, but in the end, we put up with it.  And I've been guilty of doing so in the past, but not again.  Because being ganker content is just too frustrating, no matter how good a game's other features might be.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:35:05 AM#26

Also, the ffa pvp everywhere crowd who are complaining about this trade pack split should be screaming at Trion or some devs somewhere to please get carebears our own server or our own sandbox game so the PvPers don't have to compromise their gameplay in an attempt by developers to bring in the PVE players.  Because we don't belong in the same world with the true ffa pvpers.  It tends to lead to neither type of player ever being happy.

 

We don't want you.  You don't want us.  The sooner devs realize it, the sooner we'll all be a lot happier with our gaming choices.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  MadDemon64

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1093

Why is it that fantasy trolls are vulnerable to fire, but internet trolls thrive on flame wars?

5/23/14 10:38:00 AM#27
As much as I avoid PvP, I have to agree with you on this.  Trion making this change just isn't right.

Since when is Tuesday a direction?

  flizzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 1357

5/23/14 10:39:37 AM#28
Originally posted by Madimorga

Also, the ffa pvp everywhere crowd who are complaining about this trade pack split should be screaming at Trion or some devs somewhere to please get carebears our own server or our own sandbox game so the PvPers don't have to compromise their gameplay in an attempt by developers to bring in the PVE players.  Because we don't belong in the same world with the true ffa pvpers.  It tends to lead to neither type of player ever being happy.

 

We don't want you.  You don't want us.  The sooner devs realize it, the sooner we'll all be a lot happier with our gaming choices.

The PvP types , of course, don't want separate servers because they understand most people would migrate to them as soon as the ganking started.  And contrary to the protestations of PvP types,  many, if not most, seem to prefer the one-sided battle where the ganker and friends jump on the lone player, or ideally the lower rated /beginner player.  Of course, everyone who posts on these forums is an "honorable" PvP player and only wants fair fights (eye rolling).  In game the truth is revealed and the number of people who really care for fair fights are extremely slim.  

  kridak

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/22/13
Posts: 10

5/23/14 10:41:43 AM#29
Originally posted by Madimorga

Also, the ffa pvp everywhere crowd who are complaining about this trade pack split should be screaming at Trion or some devs somewhere to please get carebears our own server or our own sandbox game so the PvPers don't have to compromise their gameplay in an attempt by developers to bring in the PVE players.  Because we don't belong in the same world with the true ffa pvpers.  It tends to lead to neither type of player ever being happy.

 

We don't want you.  You don't want us.  The sooner devs realize it, the sooner we'll all be a lot happier with our gaming choices.

 

I actually would love to keep the pvp aspect.  The thrill of danger trying to deliver packs is fun.  But they just need to even out the risk vs reward.  I believe the pirate should keep all the trade pack contents and sell for themselves....but eventually when they get caught...oh boy their fun now begins.

If they did that it would be awesome.

I also disagree with people saying a pve server is what we need.  I think it would be boring without the danger.  But make it dangerous for the pirate and the trader.

But again, i doubt there will be any change, it is what it is.

 

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:45:48 AM#30
Originally posted by flizzer
Originally posted by Madimorga

Also, the ffa pvp everywhere crowd who are complaining about this trade pack split should be screaming at Trion or some devs somewhere to please get carebears our own server or our own sandbox game so the PvPers don't have to compromise their gameplay in an attempt by developers to bring in the PVE players.  Because we don't belong in the same world with the true ffa pvpers.  It tends to lead to neither type of player ever being happy.

 

We don't want you.  You don't want us.  The sooner devs realize it, the sooner we'll all be a lot happier with our gaming choices.

The PvP types , of course, don't want separate servers because they understand most people would migrate to them as soon as the ganking started.  And contrary to the protestations of PvP types,  many, if not most, seem to prefer the one-sided battle where the ganker and friends jump on the lone player, or ideally the lower rated /beginner player.  Of course, everyone who posts on these forums is an "honorable" PvP player and only wants fair fights (eye rolling).  In game the truth is revealed and the number of people who really care for fair fights are extremely slim.  

Gankers aren't true ffa pvp players, they're just pests.  No one cares what they want.  True ffa pvpers want to pvp anytime, anywhere, with others who also want to pvp anytime, anywhere.  I like to think gankers are in the minority of pvpers.  I could be wrong, but I like to think that.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16835

5/23/14 10:46:51 AM#31
Originally posted by kridak

If you want realism then i say let's make it real.

If you are caught stealing you lose a hand...permanently.

Which means no weapon or shield in that hand.  You would have real ramifications for pirating.

Steal again loose the other.

Now we are talking realism.

But all you pirates want is to steal and not pay a real price.

A couple of hours in jail?  big frickin deal.

Make it so that the pirate can lose something truly substantial, then you might have people not being pirates for fear of actually having to pay a real price (like their heads).

But the keyboard pirates want to keep all the loot while they suffer no real ramifications to pirating...and do not tell me spending a couple of hours in jail is a big deal...please.

Hey what about real permanent character death...ya..let's see how many big bad pirates we would have if there was a real penalty for pirating.

Wow, just Wow... Losing bodyparts for severe crimes would be.... Awesome. I can just see a character with pegleg and a hook. :D

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:49:08 AM#32
Originally posted by kridak
Originally posted by Madimorga

Also, the ffa pvp everywhere crowd who are complaining about this trade pack split should be screaming at Trion or some devs somewhere to please get carebears our own server or our own sandbox game so the PvPers don't have to compromise their gameplay in an attempt by developers to bring in the PVE players.  Because we don't belong in the same world with the true ffa pvpers.  It tends to lead to neither type of player ever being happy.

 

We don't want you.  You don't want us.  The sooner devs realize it, the sooner we'll all be a lot happier with our gaming choices.

 

I actually would love to keep the pvp aspect.  The thrill of danger trying to deliver packs is fun.  But they just need to even out the risk vs reward.  I believe the pirate should keep all the trade pack contents and sell for themselves....but eventually when they get caught...oh boy their fun now begins.

If they did that it would be awesome.

I also disagree with people saying a pve server is what we need.  I think it would be boring without the danger.  But make it dangerous for the pirate and the trader.

But again, i doubt there will be any change, it is what it is.

 

I would like to see a ruleset where you can enjoy the entire game without dealing with PvP if you would like that, but if you want to go into PvP areas to trade, fight, or gather, you can.  The way it seems to be set up now is a tiny pvp free area, and everywhere else, for at least a good chunk of time, is PvP.  The worst for me is the posts on other forums by people trying to find a place to put a farm or house that is safe. They're being told there are plenty of places to put a farm, just go to the PvP areas.  This is not a good thing to tell a player who does not want to PvP.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Dagon13

Novice Member

Joined: 8/16/07
Posts: 198

5/23/14 10:52:34 AM#33

I'm a little disappointed in the approach players are taking with this game mechanic.  Instead of being viewed as a fun mechanic to play around with many are viewing it as a min-max income generator.  The whole purpose of the mechanic is to incite PVP fun, not just as a means to make money.  The payout is just the reward for winning.

That being said, risk vs reward should be equal for both parties, and I don't think payout ratios are the solution.  Someone mentioned that the pirates just swim around in the water, waiting for a target to appear.  This doesn't make any sense at all and is one of the first things I would take a look at.  Some sort of swimming endurance mechanic would be a good start.  How do pirates climb from the water onto a sailing ship would be another.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17596

5/23/14 10:54:19 AM#34
Originally posted by kridak

I actually would love to keep the pvp aspect.  The thrill of danger trying to deliver packs is fun.  But they just need to even out the risk vs reward.  I believe the pirate should keep all the trade pack contents and sell for themselves....but eventually when they get caught...oh boy their fun now begins.

If they did that it would be awesome.

I also disagree with people saying a pve server is what we need.  I think it would be boring without the danger.  But make it dangerous for the pirate and the trader.

But again, i doubt there will be any change, it is what it is.

 

I agree, the only issue here is evening out the risk vs reward.

"no" the pirate should not get permadeath just like the Trader should not get "perma-death" if they are killed.

Just make it so that if a pirate is caught the penalty is more severe.

Also, the title of this thread needs to be changed. The OP indicates "fight FOR 1.0 changes" but he then says that those changes are not good.

I suspect he wants "fight against 1.0 changes".

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 10:55:14 AM#35
Originally posted by Dagon13

I'm a little disappointed in the approach players are taking with this game mechanic.  Instead of being viewed as a fun mechanic to play around with many are viewing it as a min-max income generator.  The whole purpose of the mechanic is to incite PVP fun, not just as a means to make money.  The payout is just the reward for winning.

That being said, risk vs reward should be equal for both parties, and I don't think payout ratios are the solution.  Someone mentioned that the pirates just swim around in the water, waiting for a target to appear.  This doesn't make any sense at all and is one of the first things I would take a look at.  Some sort of swimming endurance mechanic would be a good start.  How do pirates climb from the water onto a sailing ship would be another.

That's ridiculous.  The sea obviously needs an infestation of sharks and stinging jellyfish.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  MMOredfalcon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/18/13
Posts: 135

5/23/14 11:18:34 AM#36

Hafta agree with most posters here and not the OP.  PvE players loose everything and Pirates have nothing to loose. If they get caught, well anyone playing now will know the justice system is a joke. I'm all for 100% loss to the Traders.

But in return I would expect a HUGE punishment for pirates/griefers. Rather than  minutes in jail...should be days or months. Homes/properties reclaimed. Loss of bank use or any kind of city vendor. You want realism....well what happens to a criminal on the run? Their names are known, and everybody is gunning for them. Now put that kinda realism on the griefers...see how long they last.

  flizzer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 1357

5/23/14 11:23:00 AM#37
Originally posted by MMOredfalcon

Hafta agree with most posters here and not the OP.  PvE players loose everything and Pirates have nothing to loose. If they get caught, well anyone playing now will know the justice system is a joke. I'm all for 100% loss to the Traders.

But in return I would expect a HUGE punishment for pirates/griefers. Rather than  minutes in jail...should be days or months. Homes/properties reclaimed. Loss of bank use or any kind of city vendor. You want realism....well what happens to a criminal on the run? Their names are known, and everybody is gunning for them. Now put that kinda realism on the griefers...see how long they last.

This is the real point.  I go back to my earliest posts on this game.   THIS GAME IS A GRIEFER'S PARADISE.  There is little consequence for acting in this way.   Something needs to change. 

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 2012

5/23/14 11:23:18 AM#38
Originally posted by MMOredfalcon

Hafta agree with most posters here and not the OP.  PvE players loose everything and Pirates have nothing to loose. If they get caught, well anyone playing now will know the justice system is a joke. I'm all for 100% loss to the Traders.

But in return I would expect a HUGE punishment for pirates/griefers. Rather than  minutes in jail...should be days or months. Homes/properties reclaimed. Loss of bank use or any kind of city vendor. You want realism....well what happens to a criminal on the run? Their names are known, and everybody is gunning for them. Now put that kinda realism on the griefers...see how long they last.

If the game weren't free to play, meaning people can have multiple griefer accounts with no properties, it would be the best deterrent ever to let a jury of players award confiscated property to the aggrieved victims of captured thieves.  

 

I wish some of the people posting in this thread were designing our games instead of the people who are designing them.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  sludgebeard

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/18/13
Posts: 383

 
OP  5/23/14 11:33:52 AM#39
Just to be clear, Trion has made a proper solution with the 20/80 split. It's a decent solution, but I feel like the original way of trader taking all the risk is more realistic and that they should have player run insurance agency's.
  udon

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/23/07
Posts: 1642

5/23/14 11:34:10 AM#40
Originally posted by d_20

I agree, as well.

 

However, I wouldn't mind there being some sort of insurance, but the pirate should get 100% of whatever they take.

 

It would be even better with player-run insurance companies that provided armed guards for certain shipments.

Pirate's rarely got 100% of whatever they took.  Most of the time the Merchants that would work with them took a huge cut and it's not like you can trade it 1 for 1.  This doesn't translate into game very well but 60% of the value in gold is generous for a activity like this.  I'm not sure the person who lost should get the other 40% but the pirate's shouldn't get full value either.

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