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News & Features Discussion  » [Review] Elder Scrolls Online: Very Fun, But Not Perfect

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  Pratt2112

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1171

5/06/14 6:49:46 AM#241
Originally posted by someforumguy

 

The writer was reviewing a game, not reviewing other players. This should be obvious. How 'social' other people are in the game has no part in a game's review.


So what is left are the tools that the game has for grouping, for interaction and communication between people. These come with the box. If looking at these and how well they are designed and executed, you could argue that the rating for social is maybe too generous.


My impression is that the writer played mainly solo and maybe didn't experience the problems surrounding grouping.

Yep, I keep seeing people misplacing the praise on the social aspects, based on their descriptions.

Talking to someone during a trade is not indicative of "the game supporting or encouraging social interaction". If people decide to start chatting during a trade, it's because they, as individuals, feel like chatting during a trade. It could have been just as much a matter of someone saying "here", and "thanks" in reply. Or nothing at all, though that would be awkward lol.

A bunch of people running up to take on a Public Quest/Event/Whatever is not "social content". It's content designed for individual reward, where a bunch of people can participate at the same time. Again, you can talk and be social in those situations... but by no means are you ever required or even encouraged to. Any chatting going on happens 100% through the players' own initiative.

I can't stand Rifts/Anchors/World Events/F.A.T.E.s/Public Quests and anything like them, because of what they represent. What they represent is developers trying to find a way to create content that they can spin as being 'social content' in their PR, without actually creating what they're describing. A bunch of individuals zerg-rushing a "public event" is not a "social activity". It's a bunch of individuals zerg rushing a public event in hopes they can get some shots in and earn a reward before running off to do the rest of their "Me" content. Calling that "social content" is a lie.

I gave examples in a previous post of game mechanics that truly encouraged, and rewarded people to meaningfully communicate, coordinate, cooperate.. in order to achieve a goal or perform some task, which would be unachievable otherwise. You didn't chat with people "because you felt like it". You did because some aspect of the game requires people to work together toward a common goal... or even an individual one.

Sadly, the moment a MMO tries to go toward something that actually does encourage true communication, cooperation and other social type activity... people immediately say "Forced grouping! Ew! No way! The game needs to be more soloable!", or "I don't want to be forced to talk to people!", and rally against it.

Two big things players consistently get wrong these days about MMOs..

1. Praising the game for having "strong social systems", when it's themselves being social, and the game has little to nothing to do with it.

2. Believing the key to a strong MMO community is "joining a good guild".

The blame for both of those is on both the developers (for not developing systems and tools for stronger socializing and community), and the players, (for not pushing more for such systems). Both issues are a direct result of the continued emphasis on the individual experience. As long as new MMOs continue to be developed for "Me", at the expense of "We", it will never change.

 

"Devs need to stop trying to make MMOs for people who don't like MMOs" - thevampirelematt/Reddit

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17203

5/06/14 7:05:59 AM#242
Originally posted by TangentPoint
Originally posted by someforumguy

 

 

 

Talking to someone during a trade is not indicative of "the game supporting or encouraging social interaction". If people decide to start chatting during a trade, it's because they, as individuals, feel like chatting during a trade. It could have been just as much a matter of someone saying "here", and "thanks" in reply. Or nothing at all, though that would be awkward lol.

as opposed to a strict auction house system where you just pick your item and be on your way?

Every system that a game has were players have an actual opportunity to "talk" is a part of the game and a part of the game design to be "social".

One of the most social parts of lineage 2 was waiting at a dock for a boat. That is an opportunity to be social. Sure you could just walk away to get a soda but the opportunity is there because the game has "worked in" that opportunity. and if you are attacked at that dock then some players might come to your aid and that is another opportunity to meet people.

the opposite would be not having the boat and opening up your map and clicking on your destination and materializing at your destination. There is no opportunity to be social there.

I'm pretty much an extrovert and i've spoken with more people in ESO than I have in LOTRO in years, another theme park. Why? because there are more opportunities in ESO to speak with people. Whether it be by trade or being out in the world meeting people who want help with a variety of mini-bosses/encounters.

As opposed to clicking on the auction house, buying my item, picking up x quests, running to the yellow bits on the map, collecting y, coming back and rinse and repeat.

Whether or not people take advantage of those opportunities is up to them.

 

  Cymdai

Novice Member

Joined: 6/05/05
Posts: 1085

It's my job to be objective, it's my right to have an opinion.

5/06/14 2:55:21 PM#243

My opinion on ESO is this: If it were NOT for the name "Elder Scrolls" in the title, complimented with the decades of lore and world setting, this game would be a flat out 3/10


 


During beta, it was hot garbage. During release, it's better than it was, but it's lacking in every way. Every. Single. Way. The map of all the dungeons? It's a testament to lower quality standards. Maybe you guys don't remember the last AAA title that copy-pasted maps, but it was the original Final Fantasy 14 release, and it copied SUBSTANTIALLY less than ESO does.


The fact that this wasn't mentioned is disappointing. However, gamers' standards over the years have fallen so low that I doubt anyone even would have noticed or cared. 


As I'm not buying this heaping disaster of a game, I won't say what it is now. But based on what it WAS? I'd bet it's no higher than a 5, and that's a generous rating for a game that wants you to pay a subscription fee for offering no real new features or innovation from the hundreds of F2P MMO's out there.


Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...

  evak2979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/08/12
Posts: 1

5/07/14 6:54:30 AM#244

So much hate..!


It's easy to hammer down an MMO in a day where a dozen launch/month.


If WoW (which imo) is king of the heel and will be for some time more had launched today, it would've gotten a 5 - constant server DCs, random maintenance that lasted days, but hey there was no alternative so the community endured.


Today's lot act like a series of spoiled children, nagging about anything and everything.


I am not sure what people expected from this game - me, I am having fun in it. I do agree that being unable to help someone with a completed quest is pretty frustrating. On the other hand they wanted to give a sense of continuity and completion to those that had completed the quest.


The dungeons are new, and with plenty of content..Those who compare this to TOR are delusional, to say the least - being a pve fan, I remember TOR and its first year (or was it two?) ways of dungeon grouping..let's see...NONE?


Everyone had to physically travel to the dungeon? People had to know where they are?And finding a group was all about spamming the LFG? Even TSW, one of my fav PvE games, still uses LFG spam to get a group going.


TESO launched with grouping functionality right out of the box. For the first time as well crafting is useful and makes sense as I level. 


I am still level 35, but I have played long enough to enjoy the experience - I do have a RL job, so I mostly play in most evenings.


You got a fantasy game without confeti, hello kitty baloons, with plenty a dungeon (True some similar) on launch, 3 faction pvp that hasn't been there properly since DaOC, and we're still about a month in. And people are already whining about bugs and content. I'll rest my case. Some people are never pleased.


This game is here to stay - plenty of content, plenty more coming, and the bugs will be fixed as time passes. A good review (Social rating is FINE. You can auto group with people. No MMO that I know of in the last 4 years included this on launch ! )


  Mothanos

Elite Member

Joined: 10/20/10
Posts: 1849

5/07/14 7:06:54 AM#245

level cap 50 ? uhm ?
I am veteran rank 5 and have a veteran rank 2 alt.
This game requires you to be Rank 10 veteran for future contend and getting the best gear.
So level 50 you say ? grats you just completed only a meager 30% of the game.
here lets port you to the veteren zone where all stuff is scaled up and you need millions and millions of exp to gain a level while only doing !!!! QUESTS !!!

i loved this game as i tought level 50 was it ! now i can have fun in pvp !!!
But boy was i wrong :P

casuals are going to get a shock of their lives once they reach the vet contend.
half the skills and passives do not work, so you never know what build is working and wich doesnt.
If you die alot that means 2000 gold repair for you sir ! oh you only made 500 gold ? no problem just wear trash items you find and lose stats you might need for you playstyle !

Where is Knotwood ? and his assumptions of 20 millions subs in a year ?
i think 200k subs left before the year is over.
And still no word from Zenimax that they reached that wonderfull 1 million units sold or 2 million units or 3 million !
To me it indicates they are having a rough time selling this mmo.
And with all the borked stuff currently ingame i can only say that many people are not willing to spend another month worth on a sub to a game that frustrates the fack out of you.

I am not a fanboy or hater as i still love to play it, but if it wasnt for my guild i would have uninstalled this mmo and not look back before they fixed at least 90% of the stuff that is not working as it should be.

  Panzerbase

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/20/13
Posts: 431

5/07/14 8:16:01 AM#246
For the supposed 200 million or so they paid to make this MMO every dungeon should have been unique, the fact that they copied and pasted so many designs is embarrassing. As a matter of fact for 200 million the game should have been in much better condition.
  insanex

Novice Member

Joined: 7/06/06
Posts: 141

5/07/14 2:36:35 PM#247



Originally posted by Vapors


















Originally posted by Golelorn















Just a very expensive, depthless solo game.
















Too much time is spent running around doing pointless quest. No community whatsoever. 
















This game will be f2p very shortly. Too much is lacking from this game. No viable way to level except the boring quest. No grouping. No socializing. 
















Very fun?? Not even close. Its fun for about 40 hours. 































 
















So 49 $ for a new released game (solo game) is expensive? There are games you play 9 hours story mode and they are over, where you pay 69$, thats expensive. Even though even 40 hours for 49$ is even over the average gametime of games in that price region.























 




Um, solo games don't cost $15/month... And solo games from the ES saga are WAY better than this. And you don't have to be online to play them. And...and....and.....





 

  insanex

Novice Member

Joined: 7/06/06
Posts: 141

5/07/14 2:41:11 PM#248

Originally posted by Cymdai

My opinion on ESO is this: If it were NOT for the name "Elder Scrolls" in the title, complimented with the decades of lore and world setting, this game would be a flat out 3/10




 




During beta, it was hot garbage. During release, it's better than it was, but it's lacking in every way. Every. Single. Way. The map of all the dungeons? It's a testament to lower quality standards. Maybe you guys don't remember the last AAA title that copy-pasted maps, but it was the original Final Fantasy 14 release, and it copied SUBSTANTIALLY less than ESO does.




The fact that this wasn't mentioned is disappointing. However, gamers' standards over the years have fallen so low that I doubt anyone even would have noticed or cared. 




As I'm not buying this heaping disaster of a game, I won't say what it is now. But based on what it WAS? I'd bet it's no higher than a 5, and that's a generous rating for a game that wants you to pay a subscription fee for offering no real new features or innovation from the hundreds of F2P MMO's out there.





 


^ This.


  FrancKaos

Novice Member

Joined: 4/20/14
Posts: 7

5/08/14 5:24:57 PM#249

They had this game franchise built around open world roaming and adventuring and they turned it into the most on-rails smoke and mirror game I've ever played in order to move boxes.


QFT!


  karmath

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/24/05
Posts: 843

5/10/14 1:45:58 AM#250
Yet another paid for review. Ugh, so utterly blatant these days its pretty sickening.
  Volenibblets

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/08/12
Posts: 192

5/10/14 2:06:49 AM#251
I wasn't a fan of the beta but I very foolishly bought the bloody thing anyway thinking nah I must have not 'got it', it's Elder Scrolls it has to be good! One month in, got a good bit further into the game and...no it's still mediocre. Though passable as a casual hack and slash game, it's so utterly bland in almost every way despite trying my best to ignore the short comings. The skills are all sickeningly bland. The world is bland. The classes and skill trees are horrifically bland. The story is just about passable if you get into it for a while but it ultimately fades into blandness after a while running mind-numbing errands. The zergfests are temporarily entertaining till you find out how repetitive they are. They even managed to make the beloved Elder Scrolls lore a snorefest which is an amazing feat of deconstruction. The whole venture just feels like a half-arsed effort from top to bottom proving that reverse alchemy is possible turning gold into lead. I cannot imagine this holding any subbing customer's loyalty for very long unless I really am missing something.  
  Alber_gamer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/08/12
Posts: 471

5/10/14 2:08:02 AM#252
The fact that fanboys all over the thread are satisfied with the 7.9 says it all. The game deserves a 6.

My opinion is my own. I respect all other opinions and views equally, but keep in mind that my opinion will always be the best for me. That's why it's my opinion.

  Zorgo

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/05/05
Posts: 2212

Who did wrong? The advertiser hired to sell the game or the consumer who put faith in advertising?

5/10/14 11:10:11 PM#253
Originally posted by Alber_gamer
The fact that fanboys all over the thread are satisfied with the 7.9 says it all. The game deserves a 6.

A fanboy wouldn't be satisfied with a 7.9. A fanboy would be mad that it wasn't at least an 8.9 and most would say it was a perfect 10.

The fact that so many all over the thread are satisfied with the 7.9 says that perhaps they aren't necessarily fanboys after all.

The fact that so many all over the thread are dissatisfied with a 7.9 says it all. The game has a lot of haters - not fanboys.

  xpiher

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3301

5/12/14 5:51:03 AM#254
how can you claim the game has longevity when people reach max vr level in the first month and all the quests feel the same?


Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher

  UncleTopher

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/15/14
Posts: 3

5/12/14 8:02:50 AM#255

I have to say I think the game released with a great amount of content.  The world is large and beautiful on the surface, with a variety of flora and fauna.


There are, however, many core areas which still need work. The game is in need of polish and feels rushed to press.


 


The 'Guild Store' concept vs a Global AH is really one area that needs work...ranging from a little shining to a complete overhaul depending on who you ask. I personally think it adds another layer of insulation protecting against artificial inflation caused by the buying/selling of gold. If you manage to get into a couple good Trade Guilds (high population/activity) you can make this work. The Guild Store UI needs a complete overhaul however. Trying to search through Guild Stores is a nightmare and feels like some afterthought. This MUST be addressed.




 




As far as longevity, hard core scrollers are going to stick with this one. The near limitless tweakability of 'classes' makes leveling interesting and requiring of though.




It remains to be seen how quickly and of what caliber new content is and will be. I have not gotten anywhere near end game so I am still happily churning through low level content. I find it interesting and engaging and satisfying for the most part. 




 




The largest problem I can see is the overwhelming amount of gold sellers and bots within the game.




In so many ways this game is almost perfect. The security issues, however are really going to run ppl off here in a few days. The problems caused by bots MUST be mitigated or there is going to be hard times ahead for TESO...




 




 




Innovation 7




Aesthetics 9




Longevity 9




Polish  6




Value 6




 




I'm seeing a 7.4




 




I hope I can review this later and that number will be higher.....




 




 





 

  Illyssia

Novice Member

Joined: 8/10/09
Posts: 1523

5/12/14 11:39:26 AM#256
In a way the large numbers of bug fixes needed for the MMO fit well with the RPG game as Skyrim had a ton of critical bugs that made me quit it in the end on PS3. Maybe this is a game that needed the extra year of thought as it may get hurt for numbers when the next WoW expansion and other games launch.
  r3dl4nce

Novice Member

Joined: 8/29/07
Posts: 120

5/13/14 9:23:32 AM#257

My votes

GAMEPLAY – 9

action combat, a lot of skills and mix of them, various roles, questing and exploration, living world that changes according to the player actions, nice instanced dungeons, public dungeons with a big/difficult public dungeons per zone per faction,  free development of character, TES lore, epic main storyline, very different gameplay based on class. What more could ask a themepark lover. Bots farming dungeons bosses are gone, thanks to the great work of Zenimax GMs, so now even public dungeons are enjoyable at the best!

 

AESTHETICS – 9

The world of Tamriel is beautiful, and the graphic, even without 20GB of texture packs, is visually great, most of all is very good the realistic feeling of environments, inside house/caves or outside. People still play the 10 years old WoW graphics or the "new" shitty cartoony  graphic of Wildstar, I really can't believe how one can look at those graphics and not bleed from eyes.

 

INNOVATION - 8

Innovation in end game, without dungeon farming but with Veteran Zones questing. Good innovation in character development, not so vast like in DDO but from a different point of view even better (in DDO you could not even make a single mistake in building your character - before reincarnation -, in TESO you can make mistakes and then fix them)

 

POLISH - 6 for the first release days, 9 now

After the first days of patches/maintenances/bugfixed, now the quests are working flawless and very are very few bugs left. Great work!

 

LONGEVITY - 9

50 levels, 10 Veteran Zones, plus all the RvR zone. The game can last for lot of years, just like DAoC

 

SOCIAL - 8

All the greatness and the wonderful world of the TES games, but with multiplayers added. Other players can help complete quests, killing bosses, completing instanced dungeons, trading items. Finally Tamriel full of human players. Great!

 

VALUE - 9

The usual cost of a good MMO (F2P MMO are not good, just look at Neverwinter Online). It's a low price for all the hours of fun, there is no paywall, in game shop or shitty things like you found in F2P games.

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