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WildStar

WildStar 

General Discussion  » When does it "Click" ?

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23 posts found
  Awolol

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 33

 
OP  4/04/14 4:36:21 PM#1

So I've been in 2 BETA weekends so far, and I'm waiting for it to actually pick up / "Click" and know it's something special.

I've seen the popular video posted here recently that the game opens up at LVL.20 and shows it's true colours, (currently level 15), but right now I see the same copied features of WoW, with some bonuses and negatives. 

 

What I've experienced:

 

-Same hub to hub quest errand system .

-Automatic pvp queue (+ dungeon I assume, lvl 20) with automatic teleport, no interaction.

-Extremely easy outside mobs / quests.

 

What I know / expect:

 

Raids with tokens / treadmill No actual world pvp, the main focus will be scenarios / instanced for ranks.

Separate PVP/ PVE Gear so any form of interaction will be disastrous.

 

So I'm just asking, when did it "Click" for you?

  Daessar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 207

4/04/14 5:22:08 PM#2
Originally posted by Awolol

 

So I'm just asking, when did it "Click" for you?

 

For many people it is right in that level 20+ area that you start to see more variation on quests, zones, mob attacks and health, and a difficulty ramp up.  It was in this level range for me also.

You post highlights many things that people who dont like themepark games talk about. You do understand that most of that isn't going to change because........this is a themepark game right?

So if you already see the same copied features of Wow, those aren't suddenly going to magically go away at later levels and be this incredible new innovative game that will revolutionize the industry. Play what you enjoy playing......or, if you want to gamble and throw your money at the devs, I'm sure they will take your cash with pleasure.

  Satsunoryu

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/23/06
Posts: 272

4/04/14 5:29:29 PM#3

Definitely gets awesome reaching the later teens.  Granted, it's a hub-questing game.  That's just what it is.  If you are wanting an MMO for "epic" questing, I think something like ESO may be more up your alley.  There are a lot of other things to do though, which is what makes the game fun and end-game is definitely a major focus of Carbine's.  Personally, the PVP is what makes the game super fun for me.  The combat system is also unique and very entertaining.  Can't wait for release.

Warning:  Not everyone will agree :P.

Dane | www.Ironsworn.com | ROLE-PLAYERS WANTED!

  ApolloZen

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/18/14
Posts: 5

4/04/14 5:40:02 PM#4

The questing system is kind of overwhelming tbh, most of it is hub based, but between paths and challenges theres usually a LOT being thrown at you. Slow down and reading the quests is worth it most of the time, no they didn't sink 100s of millions into voice acting, but the writing is good). Overall though questing is probably the weak point of WIldstar, especially the first 12-15 levels...after that they get more fun.

You have to travel to dungeons/adventures to do them. BG queues are instant so PvPrs aren't standing around a battlemaster as they await queues they can actually go and do things. Open world PvP begins post level 20. You gain XP and shit for player kills in the open world, as well as prestige, you can also add rivals which allows you to mark enemy players when they are near you...its like a friends list for enemies you want to kill.

Game gets harder. Way harder. Mobs start doing some ridiculous shit.

Again there is open world PvP, there are also a TON of rare spawns which give unique items (most of them aren't soloable), there are world bosses, some zones have multiple world bosses and are in areas where you can get PvP'd on at any moment.

Raid content also changes every week (boss abilities switch up meaning you have to be on your toes for new combos), different compositions of bosses, different adds etc. Crafting is also EXTREMELY deep in this game. Like really deep. Unsure how viable the gear will be in the end as not many people have put the full time required into it.

Your last point is an opinion. 

Overall the game opens up A TON after 20, they really hold your hand before then, which is a shame since it will turn a lot of people off...but most MMO players should know by now early on MMOs just suck.

And you understand why they hold your hand, once they give you your full kit, open you to the large zones with OWPvP and throw the most difficult mob mechanics/combos at you, you realize if you had just dropped into the game you would have died until you quit. 

This game becomes one of the deepest, most challenging and rewarding MMOs I've played in YEARS. I expect once the player base above 20 expands in early access/post launch (right now its quite small) the world PvP will explode...especially when the majority starts to cap at 50. Housing is also the best in any MMO Ive played by far, I can't wait til they expand into guild housing.

The developers also plan on waiting to see where players naturally flow towards world pvp before they add incentives/events/objectives to try to promote it. They want it to naturally evolve for now (i expect there will be some griefing around world bosses).

TL;DR it clicks starting around 15, REALLY picks up at 20 (that first dungeon is a good taste) and gets disgustingly good after that...which you won't experience unless you were Closed Beta Tester before preorders and had a level 32+ already.

I can't argue it does have the best early game impressions. But it IS out of necessity for once. This game gets crazy really fast. And yes. The group content, is HARD, a lot of it IS in the open world, (world bosses, rare spawns, events, group quests etc). 

 

 

 

  Volgore

Tipster

Joined: 6/15/08
Posts: 1967

Posts deleted: 12589457

4/04/14 7:56:07 PM#5

The game started to slowly click on me after i found the right class.

I've had a hard time to get excited about the classes, since all i loved in other mmos just isnt there to the extend i am used to..dots, range, pets, debuffs, casting. I think this is more a game for people who like to be more in close range meleeish combat.

However, the stalker was the last class i tried -burnt old school rogue here, coming from when rogues where a dime a dozen and borderline useless in WoW. What to say... the game grew alot more on me after i discovered the stalker and there were moments when i was tempted to even preorder -too bad that the at times low performance is killing it :/

  MamasGun

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/15/13
Posts: 154

"The man that knows something knows that he knows nothing at all." -E. Badu

4/04/14 11:15:12 PM#6
Originally posted by ApolloZen

The questing system is kind of overwhelming tbh, most of it is hub based, but between paths and challenges theres usually a LOT being thrown at you. Slow down and reading the quests is worth it most of the time, no they didn't sink 100s of millions into voice acting, but the writing is good). Overall though questing is probably the weak point of WIldstar, especially the first 12-15 levels...after that they get more fun.

You have to travel to dungeons/adventures to do them. BG queues are instant so PvPrs aren't standing around a battlemaster as they await queues they can actually go and do things. Open world PvP begins post level 20. You gain XP and shit for player kills in the open world, as well as prestige, you can also add rivals which allows you to mark enemy players when they are near you...its like a friends list for enemies you want to kill.

Game gets harder. Way harder. Mobs start doing some ridiculous shit.

Again there is open world PvP, there are also a TON of rare spawns which give unique items (most of them aren't soloable), there are world bosses, some zones have multiple world bosses and are in areas where you can get PvP'd on at any moment.

Raid content also changes every week (boss abilities switch up meaning you have to be on your toes for new combos), different compositions of bosses, different adds etc. Crafting is also EXTREMELY deep in this game. Like really deep. Unsure how viable the gear will be in the end as not many people have put the full time required into it.

Your last point is an opinion. 

Overall the game opens up A TON after 20, they really hold your hand before then, which is a shame since it will turn a lot of people off...but most MMO players should know by now early on MMOs just suck.

And you understand why they hold your hand, once they give you your full kit, open you to the large zones with OWPvP and throw the most difficult mob mechanics/combos at you, you realize if you had just dropped into the game you would have died until you quit. 

This game becomes one of the deepest, most challenging and rewarding MMOs I've played in YEARS. I expect once the player base above 20 expands in early access/post launch (right now its quite small) the world PvP will explode...especially when the majority starts to cap at 50. Housing is also the best in any MMO Ive played by far, I can't wait til they expand into guild housing.

The developers also plan on waiting to see where players naturally flow towards world pvp before they add incentives/events/objectives to try to promote it. They want it to naturally evolve for now (i expect there will be some griefing around world bosses).

TL;DR it clicks starting around 15, REALLY picks up at 20 (that first dungeon is a good taste) and gets disgustingly good after that...which you won't experience unless you were Closed Beta Tester before preorders and had a level 32+ already.

I can't argue it does have the best early game impressions. But it IS out of necessity for once. This game gets crazy really fast. And yes. The group content, is HARD, a lot of it IS in the open world, (world bosses, rare spawns, events, group quests etc). 

 

 

 

Very beautifully said.  I can attest, as other are saying- lvl 20 is when my Spellslinger started feeling right.  I've been having a blast since then!

Loves: SMITE, WildStar, Project Zomboid, PSO2, DCUO,

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  Rhianne

Novice Member

Joined: 5/20/08
Posts: 58

4/05/14 2:49:09 AM#7

Hearing people say that the game gets a lot better after L20 is reassuring, but the road to get there is agony. I want to like this game, but hours and of hours of drudgery, nonintuitive interfaces, world lore served up in dozens of books lying around instead of roleplayed through the characters, and repetitive combat all make for a tearful first impression.

Why would you want to alienate such a huge majority of the very fans you're hoping to impress in an early beta? It just boggles the mind. 

Some other peeves:

* Adding hammer-the-F-key-fast to disarm/do/mine something isn't a step forward from click-and-wait harvesting, it's a step backward. The extra required (and babyish) activity makes it more work, not more fun. 

[Apologies ahead of time for the WoW comparisons here, but they are necessary.]

* WoW was gorgeous when you started in the Night Elf village for the first time. In WildStar, you start in a dreary, worn-out spacecraft (Exiles) and have to spend several hours fighting uninteresting robots and talking to uninteresting people before you even see the planet. WildStar could be beautiful, and the stock character models are often quite awesome, but the planet doesn't dazzle. 

* Also in WoW, it was pretty clear where you needed to go. Everything was intuitive. In WildStar, I can't begin to figure out where to go, ever, even on the starting ship, without a map. Very little is intuitive. And figuring out the weird new-but-not-better ways that WS does things (like talent trees and crafting) could have been fun learning experiences, but aren't.

I just don't think I, and many others, are going to make it.

  Volgore

Tipster

Joined: 6/15/08
Posts: 1967

Posts deleted: 12589457

4/05/14 11:44:43 AM#8
Originally posted by Rhianne

* Adding hammer-the-F-key-fast to disarm/do/mine something isn't a step forward from click-and-wait harvesting, it's a step backward. The extra required (and babyish) activity makes it more work, not more fun. 

I wonder if they implement the "hammer-F!!11" mechanics into raid environment. It would surely annoy the hell out of people ;)

 

[Apologies ahead of time for the WoW comparisons here, but they are necessary.]

* WoW was gorgeous when you started in the Night Elf village for the first time. In WildStar, you start in a dreary, worn-out spacecraft (Exiles) and have to spend several hours fighting uninteresting robots and talking to uninteresting people before you even see the planet. WildStar could be beautiful, and the stock character models are often quite awesome, but the planet doesn't dazzle. 

This is a point i very much agree to and i wonder, why it's not getting more acknowledgment in general. I wrote a post touching the same subject a few days ago

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/6259701

* Also in WoW, it was pretty clear where you needed to go. Everything was intuitive. In WildStar, I can't begin to figure out where to go, ever, even on the starting ship, without a map. Very little is intuitive. And figuring out the weird new-but-not-better ways that WS does things (like talent trees and crafting) could have been fun learning experiences, but aren't.

Alot of people complained about about writing altogether and i think that indeed the quests don't explain themselves very well. While in vanilla WoW we got along without questhelpers and arrows all the way, the questtext contained at least some direction or description of the location to where we had to go to.

Wildstar's quests seem to be made with the writers relying on arrows and markers on the map rather than quality NPC dialogue. I agree it's quite unintuitive most of the time, also thanks to the pretty much cluttered environment.

  Gormogon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 156

4/05/14 1:20:40 PM#9
Originally posted by Volgore

* Also in WoW, it was pretty clear where you needed to go. Everything was intuitive. In WildStar, I can't begin to figure out where to go, ever, even on the starting ship, without a map. Very little is intuitive. And figuring out the weird new-but-not-better ways that WS does things (like talent trees and crafting) could have been fun learning experiences, but aren't.

Alot of people complained about about writing altogether and i think that indeed the quests don't explain themselves very well. While in vanilla WoW we got along without questhelpers and arrows all the way, the questtext contained at least some direction or description of the location to where we had to go to.

Wildstar's quests seem to be made with the writers relying on arrows and markers on the map rather than quality NPC dialogue. I agree it's quite unintuitive most of the time, also thanks to the pretty much cluttered environment.

 

Even modern WoW's quests are written well enough that with just a little attention one can discern where one is supposed to go.  Having played WoW and WildStar literally one right after another last week, the difference is night and day.  WildStar so often tells you "Go talk to so and so" or "Go kill such and such" and leaves it at that.  It absolutely relies on the arrow and marker system to guide you to your objectives.  That's not to say you can't do it without using them.  I tried it and managed.  But it was more a case of just wandering around until "Oh!  I see it!"  Which is all fine.  The vast majority of MMO players, both young and old, just want you to show them who to talk to and what to kill.  It's a more efficient use of their time.

  Daessar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 207

4/05/14 2:09:22 PM#10
Originally posted by Rhianne

Hearing people say that the game gets a lot better after L20 is reassuring, but the road to get there is agony. 

I just don't think I, and many others, are going to make it.

 

Since almost everything in your post is an over-exaggeration on top of being overly dramatic, then I'd have to agree that I don't think you are going to make it, and I'd even question why you would waste time or money attempting to make it.

They can't satisfy every player type and every variation of play style all in one MMO, and for every point you brought up there have been just as many people posting that they want the exact opposite. 

  Siphaed

Elite Member

Joined: 1/17/08
Posts: 780

4/05/14 2:14:58 PM#11
Originally posted by Rhianne

Hearing people say that the game gets a lot better after L20 is reassuring, but the road to get there is agony. I want to like this game, but hours and of hours of drudgery, nonintuitive interfaces, world lore served up in dozens of books lying around instead of roleplayed through the characters, and repetitive combat all make for a tearful first impression.

Why would you want to alienate such a huge majority of the very fans you're hoping to impress in an early beta? It just boggles the mind. 

Some other peeves:

1.)  * Adding hammer-the-F-key-fast to disarm/do/mine something isn't a step forward from click-and-wait harvesting, it's a step backward. The extra required (and babyish) activity makes it more work, not more fun. 
 
[Apologies ahead of time for the WoW comparisons here, but they are necessary.]
 
2.) * WoW was gorgeous when you started in the Night Elf village for the first time. In WildStar, you start in a dreary, worn-out spacecraft (Exiles) and have to spend several hours fighting uninteresting robots and talking to uninteresting people before you even see the planet. WildStar could be beautiful, and the stock character models are often quite awesome, but the planet doesn't dazzle. 
 
3.)* Also in WoW, it was pretty clear where you needed to go. Everything was intuitive. In WildStar, I can't begin to figure out where to go, ever, even on the starting ship, without a map. Very little is intuitive. And figuring out the weird new-but-not-better ways that WS does things (like talent trees and crafting) could have been fun learning experiences, but aren't.

I just don't think I, and many others, are going to make it.

As mentioned on the website, the interface/UI will be changing in April to the UI 2.0.   It's a bit messy now, for sure, but it will be loads different in a couple week's time.

 

Are you talking about player Role playing or "character" meaning NPC?  If the former, there's nothing preventing you and your friends from doing so; if the latter, there's plenty of lore given by a lot of the NPCs throughout the game in the form of the random conversations they have (yes, many are text bubble conversations and only some are verbal).  And sure there's no expensive voice acting, but that's okay as the funds could be used for much more content.  (P.S.  Reading isn't bad as this whole genre derived it's beginnings from RPG books.  And if people are too lazy in this generation to read, then there's no hope for the future.)

 

Really?  When is any MMORPG not repetitive after a while for it's combat system? Honestly, every genre becomes repetitive in it's combat system unless it eventually adds something a bit changing compared to others.  Take for example Titanfall in comparison to all the other FPS games out there: those robots stir up the monotony of what would otherwise be another generic FPS game with the same point-and-shoot repetition that others in the genre have.     To point, Wildstar's combat has a sort of 'skill shot' feel to it from League of Legends, but brought into the MMORPG genre that many others have not yet done.    Most of the genre still uses Tab Targeting -or some other type of targeting like auto targeting when looking at the person and they highlight red (oh, you Mr. Elder Scrolls Online)- and that's rather stale no matter if it is being played in WoW or LotRO.  

 

1.)  The F-key hammering is adding in interactivity for the player.  It's not simply click-it-and-forget-it as olden games have had.  This helps in multiple ways, most notably is that it will deter botting mechanics.  And if hitting your F-key for 5-10 seconds is so problematic for someone, maybe PC gaming in general isn't for that individual person.

 

2.)  Really?  Several hours?  After a stint in character creation, the whole ship tutorial zone took at most 45 minutes and if speeding through it was 15 minutes.    The invading Dominion and saving living vegetable plants wasn't interesting?  Not sure what planet you're currently living on.

 

3.) What do you mean "without a map"?  There's a mini-map on screen, there's a map that can be brought up by pressing "M", and every quest has this nice beautiful "GO HERE NOW!" arrow that directs you in not only where to go, but also the distance you are from that location.    

 

 

 

Overall I got from your post is that you hate Wildstar not for what it does, but for it not being nearly exactly like World of Warcraft.  You're approaching the game with the full mental expectation based on WoW experience AND you are not giving it any chance on the systems the tutorials tell you (instead only assumptions and postulation).    This might very well be a post deserving the ever hated "go back to WoW", as that seems to be the underlying context of your post.

  Rhianne

Novice Member

Joined: 5/20/08
Posts: 58

4/06/14 6:48:00 PM#12
Originally posted by Siphaed
Are you talking about player Role playing or "character" meaning NPC?  If the former, there's nothing preventing you and your friends from doing so; if the latter, there's plenty of lore given by a lot of the NPCs throughout the game in the form of the random conversations they have (yes, many are text bubble conversations and only some are verbal).  And sure there's no expensive voice acting, but that's okay as the funds could be used for much more content.  (P.S.  Reading isn't bad as this whole genre derived it's beginnings from RPG books.  And if people are too lazy in this generation to read, then there's no hope for the future.)

I don't see why you're defending this. Or turning it into a misdirected rant about how much people read. Or why you think the medium's origins are relevant. 

In case you haven't noticed, a video game is an interactive, visual medium. It doesn't have to have voice acting everywhere, but I want to experience the game. Not read about it. I'm talking about the dozens of lore books that are found in every zone if that wasn't clear.

 

Really?  When is any MMORPG not repetitive after a while for it's combat system? Honestly, every genre becomes repetitive in it's combat system unless it eventually adds something a bit changing compared to others.  Take for example Titanfall in comparison to all the other FPS games out there: those robots stir up the monotony of what would otherwise be another generic FPS game with the same point-and-shoot repetition that others in the genre have.     To point, Wildstar's combat has a sort of 'skill shot' feel to it from League of Legends, but brought into the MMORPG genre that many others have not yet done.    Most of the genre still uses Tab Targeting -or some other type of targeting like auto targeting when looking at the person and they highlight red (oh, you Mr. Elder Scrolls Online)- and that's rather stale no matter if it is being played in WoW or LotRO.  

So, because all combat systems are repetitive, this one has to be too?

Your response sounds like "Really? You're complaining about lack of innovation? How DARE you!"

In 2014, with veterans from Blizzard at the helm, yes. I expect more than running in circles and spamming keys. You don't? Sorry to hear that.

 

1.)  The F-key hammering is adding in interactivity for the player.  It's not simply click-it-and-forget-it as olden games have had.  This helps in multiple ways, most notably is that it will deter botting mechanics.  And if hitting your F-key for 5-10 seconds is so problematic for someone, maybe PC gaming in general isn't for that individual person.

Now you're defending spamming the F key as a fun experience that only true gamers appreciate?

Wow. Just... wow.

 

 3.) What do you mean "without a map"?  There's a mini-map on screen, there's a map that can be brought up by pressing "M", and every quest has this nice beautiful "GO HERE NOW!" arrow that directs you in not only where to go, but also the distance you are from that location.    

You're not paying attention. I said it wasn't possible to navigate without those tools. I want to pay attention to the surroundings and experience the world, not have to rely on arrows and maps. We didn't have those things in Wow, and I enjoyed looking at the world around me. 

But since you breeze past starting areas in 15 minutes and are much more interested in text and GPS systems, I can see why the beauty of a virtual world doesn't interest you. Maybe Zork is more your speed.

 

Overall I got from your post is that you hate Wildstar not for what it does, but for it not being nearly exactly like World of Warcraft.  You're approaching the game with the full mental expectation based on WoW experience AND you are not giving it any chance on the systems the tutorials tell you (instead only assumptions and postulation).    This might very well be a post deserving the ever hated "go back to WoW", as that seems to be the underlying context of your post.

I considered this carefully and will say that you are indeed partially correct. I do have some preconceptions that come from WoW. Not because I love WoW, but because WoW did certain things very well.

1. WoW was intuitive. WildStar is not. WildStar can be different from WoW all it likes. But if the end result is something that is not instantly easy to use, that's a barrier to enjoyment. 

2. WoW was immersive and beautiful. WildStar is not. 

There are several other points that were made above. The bottom line is that WoW did many things right. You don't even have to be a WoW fan to appreciate this. I haven't even played WoW in years. But I do recognize a well engineered game.

And, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a game that comes out 10 years later made by veterans of the same company that made WoW to be better. I don't even want WoW. It had its time, but it has its own problems. I have been wanting the next big thing, something that's an improvement. After 10 years, is that so much to ask?

  Rhianne

Novice Member

Joined: 5/20/08
Posts: 58

4/06/14 7:02:55 PM#13

[Apologies ahead of time for the WoW comparisons here, but they are necessary.]

* WoW was gorgeous when you started in the Night Elf village for the first time. In WildStar, you start in a dreary, worn-out spacecraft (Exiles) and have to spend several hours fighting uninteresting robots and talking to uninteresting people before you even see the planet. WildStar could be beautiful, and the stock character models are often quite awesome, but the planet doesn't dazzle. 

This is a point i very much agree to and i wonder, why it's not getting more acknowledgment in general. I wrote a post touching the same subject a few days ago

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/6259701

Great post, Volgore! You said it much better than I did. I totally agree. Very few games even come close to doing this right. The opening to Earth and Beyond still gives me goosebumps. The destroyed city zone in early City of Heroes was awe-inspiring. The music when you enter Orgrimmar was always something to look forward to!

* Also in WoW, it was pretty clear where you needed to go. Everything was intuitive. In WildStar, I can't begin to figure out where to go, ever, even on the starting ship, without a map. Very little is intuitive. And figuring out the weird new-but-not-better ways that WS does things (like talent trees and crafting) could have been fun learning experiences, but aren't.

Alot of people complained about about writing altogether and i think that indeed the quests don't explain themselves very well. While in vanilla WoW we got along without questhelpers and arrows all the way, the questtext contained at least some direction or description of the location to where we had to go to.

Wildstar's quests seem to be made with the writers relying on arrows and markers on the map rather than quality NPC dialogue. I agree it's quite unintuitive most of the time, also thanks to the pretty much cluttered environment.

Clutter. Excellent way to describe it. At no point in the game can I just look around and have a good idea of where I am, what's important, or where to go (or why to care). When it comes to villages, I would rather have a wide expanse with two people to talk to then ten.

  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2740

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

4/06/14 7:06:00 PM#14
Originally posted by Awolol

So I've been in 2 BETA weekends so far, and I'm waiting for it to actually pick up / "Click" and know it's something special.

I've seen the popular video posted here recently that the game opens up at LVL.20 and shows it's true colours, (currently level 15), but right now I see the same copied features of WoW, with some bonuses and negatives. 

 

What I've experienced:

 

-Same hub to hub quest errand system .

-Automatic pvp queue (+ dungeon I assume, lvl 20) with automatic teleport, no interaction.

-Extremely easy outside mobs / quests.

 

What I know / expect:

 

Raids with tokens / treadmill No actual world pvp, the main focus will be scenarios / instanced for ranks.

Separate PVP/ PVE Gear so any form of interaction will be disastrous.

 

So I'm just asking, when did it "Click" for you?

For many people I expect it to never click.  We are tired of the WoW formula and doubly more tired of the same cartoony graphics.  And don;t even get me started on that train wreck of a combat system.  Truly one of the worst combat experiences I've ever seen.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  User Deleted
4/07/14 2:45:47 AM#15

Its a problem in itself if people have to ask "when does it click"

Because most people pretty much know the answer to that one.

  Paragonza

Novice Member

Joined: 2/25/14
Posts: 2

4/07/14 5:17:47 AM#16
At lvl20.
  handlewithcare

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/13/14
Posts: 325

4/07/14 5:24:27 AM#17

its average that's why I will not sub.

if it was you buy the game and then play forever I would buy it after I am finished with ESO.

  User Deleted
4/07/14 5:32:16 AM#18

The character building was interesting to me at first, but the full awesomeness of the combat didn't really click until I did my first dungeon at 20.  The first adventure at 15 was fun, but it didn't show me how tactical and rewarding the game really was.

The first dungeon is brutal.  Go watch a video of people doing the later bosses.  That is when I realised that this was a game that rewarded team work and communication.  Something that had been missing in most MMOs for quite some time.

  User Deleted
4/07/14 5:34:53 AM#19
Originally posted by azzamasin
And don;t even get me started on that train wreck of a combat system.  Truly one of the worst combat experiences I've ever seen.

 

Oh please, we all know that honour goes to ESO. It's as deep as a puddle.

  Voqar

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/28/04
Posts: 481

4/07/14 11:09:29 AM#20

I found the 20 levels of ultra easy tutorial in FFXIV to be insulting and a waste of content.  Well, actually, I found FFXIV to be a terrible game that took the genre to new lows.

 

WildStar thru 20 isn't as bad but I agree with the OP that it's pretty lackluster.  It's pretty sad that if there are 50 levels to leveling that the game doesn't get interesting until 40% of that is passed, and chances are it's only marginally more interesting anyways.  Solo ez mode repetitiveness just is not very compelling.

 

Which leads to the point that leveling is nothing like end game - at all - end game is all about grouping.  End game is considered "the real game" ...

 

...so why...why do we even have a solo ez mode leveling portion of a game when "the real game" is completely different?

 

Again.

 

I think that yeah, I'm tired of themepark MMORPGs, because themepark implies a bunch of crappy solo ez mode content that's ultra boring.  So many single player MMORPGs do single player RPG stuff so much better - more immersion, better stories, better character development, decisions that impact the game, etc - stuff you can't do at all in MMORPGs where everything has to be shared with other players that you don't even interact with and has to be dumbed down to the worst player of the worst build because all content has to be at the same difficulty level - ultra dumbed down.

 

I really think the MMORPG genre needs to return to its roots.  Get rid of the solo garbage.  If you want to solo, play single player games.  Period.  What makes the MMORPG genre special, what established the damn genre in the first place, is grouping - ALL the time.

 

We wouldn't need this distinction of "the real game starts at cap" and we wouldn't have theme parks if it wasn't for the incredibly stupid idea of taking a niche game full of challenge and grouping and trying to mash it for "wider appeal" to "causals" - it just doesn't work worth a crap.

 

Because...when your real game is all about grouping and you have this stupidly easy and boring solo content that people plow thru in a couple of days, and you waste millions and years making content that nobody really cares about, you end up not putting enough into "the real game" - and all those people you were trying to impress with your solo ez-mode don't want to play "the real game" anyways - they just plow thru the ez mode content and BAIL.

 

MMORPG after MMORPG follow this pattern of fail - try to be everything to everyone and ultimately be weak at the one thing that makes MMORPGs unique (all the grouping).  Sell lots of boxes to people who don't even like the core of the genre (the real game of grouping).  Watch all those numbers dwindle as the people who don't really like the genre do the single player part that doesn't belong in the genre and then bail.  Go F2P.  Rinse and repeat.

 

How long do people who love real MMORPG gameplay - the real game - the GROUPING - have to wait before developers stop making weak hybrid games and get back to focusing on the real game being the whole game?

 

It's likely that dragon age inquisition will release this year.  And sell millions of units.  There's no lack of demand for high quality single player RPGs.  It looks really sweet and I'm sure I'll buy it.  And there is no way, ever, that the single player content in an MMORPG will ever remotely come close to matching the kind of depth and intricacy of the content in a game like DAI.  Or ES (not the online abomination).  Or Witcher.  Or Pillers of Eternity.  And so on.

 

There is undoubtably a much smaller market for people who want to group all the time - but it does exist - and it has existed since EQ (maybe even UO or earlier).  Would it be so freaking terrible for MMORPGs to return to doing what THEY do best - grouping - and leave single player to genres more suited to it that do it so much better?

 

Arrrg.

 

It's funny how passionately people argue about MMORPGs that they will ultimately either not play or will play for a couple of months before realizing it's just more of the same, is generic, has nothing compelling about it, and move on to waiting for the next big thing.  There simply is NOTHING compelling about single player ez mode - it's boring.  The monstrous quantities of resources spent on developing such garbage end up making the overall game weak in the end, and leave the entire game not compelling.  It happens again and again and somehow people keep thinking - this time it will be different - this time they'll nail it - but they won't - it's a broken formula.

 

Premium MMORPGs do not feature built-in cheating via cash for gold pay 2 win. PLAY to win or don't play.

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