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General Discussion  » Leveling, without questing. Possible?

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71 posts found
  Abndn

Novice Member

Joined: 4/04/12
Posts: 55

3/01/14 10:58:21 AM#41
Originally posted by DAS1337
Originally posted by onlinenow25
Originally posted by LisaFlexy22
You would rather mob grind than do quests?  To each their own I suppose.

Why would you not?

 

WIth combat "grind" as your actually playing one of the core aspects of the game.  The quest "grind" is much more of a grind due to quests being artificial things to do that have no impact what so ever in the game world.  

 

If you consider killing mobs in a video game repetitive and boring, then your in the wrong hobby and shows that you actually don't know what you want.  Its similar to saying you want a song that were its written ABCD or non-repetitive, yet I can tell you that you will not like a song that does not repeat its melody.  The other factor as well is that camping actually had an impact in the game even if a minor/temporary one.

If a group of people were already set up you had to find another place/share/steal their camp.  The players at the camp before actually impacted your game play experience, unlike questing which is done almost completely solo and once completed is never done again, as well as no one knowing if you even quested save for a game that has achievements telling everyone you have.

This confuses me.  Someone is actually trying to explain how mob grinding is more exciting than quests?  Did I wake up in Bizarro World or something?  How is doing a wide variety of quests more exciting than killing a mob five thousand times?

 

Actually read the quest text and immerse yourself into what you're doing.  Don't give us your weak ass example of grinding static mobs affecting other people's play session being a positive thing.  That's all you've got?  Usually I see this conversation going the other way, meaning I've never actually seen someone post about actually wanting to mob grind.  I've seen people complaining about boring quests or lack of variety.  But, never complaining about wanting to mob grind.  Maybe we're seeing the greater de-evolution of the MMO gamer here.  I thought it was bad enough people couldn't be bothered with quest text.  Now you guys are taking an extra step and ignoring the quests all together?  Screw quests!  I aint ' got time for that!

 

Fascinating...

I also think grinding is better, and it's not all that strange. I've played quest-based MMORPGs so much that I no longer see the variety you're talking about. To me each quest is a marker on my map with exp and item rewards attached. The dialogue bores me to tears and I always skip it, despite enjoying singleplayer RPGs a lot (my all time favorite is Planescape: Torment, which is extremely heavy on dialogue). I think it's because I know it isn't my story, and that the quest will inevitably lead to 100 exp and a bronze shortsword rather than impacting the world in any real way.

Once you reach this point there's really not that big of a difference between grinding mobs and playing "Whack-a-Quest"; one has you repeatedly killing mobs in an area and the other has you following an arrow, clicking npcs and objects and killing mobs in areas. Technically there is more variety in the latter, but it's not a whole lot more interesting.

What really separates the two is the social factor: group grinding can be a great social experience, while quest grinding usually isn't. Playing Whack-a-Quest with a group is usually unnecessary (the content is easy), slower (you need to coordinate what quests you are doing), rarer (you need to go out of your way to find someone to quest with) and often frustrating (you don't all have the same quests). Grinding is best done in a group since you gain more exp, there's downtime (respawns) which allows socializing, and it's usually pretty easy and painless to get going since you really just need to go somewhere and start grinding. 

 

  arieste

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/11/04
Posts: 3311

3/01/14 11:13:33 AM#42
Originally posted by DAS1337.

This confuses me.  Someone is actually trying to explain how mob grinding is more exciting than quests?  Did I wake up in Bizarro World or something?  How is doing a wide variety of quests more exciting than killing a mob five thousand times?

A wide-variety of interesting, well-written and challenging quests is to me more fun than just grinding mobs.  For me, these criteria were met to different degrees in LoTRO, in TSW and to some extent in AoC.    In ESO, that simply isn't the case for me. 

 

When you get to the point where quests are boring and simple "run to map marker, click it and run back", then it just starts to feel like you're grinding quests rather than doing anything interesting or fulfilling.  And between grinding quests and just grinding mobs / doing a dungeon, i'd rather do the latter.  But that's a matter of personal preference. 

 

"Read the quests and be immersed!" is a nice sentiment.  but when quests are poorly written and don't really make sense with what's going on the world around, they do not entice one to read more and they actually take away from immersion. 

"I’d rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."

- Raph Koster

Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
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  Uthuk

Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/09
Posts: 4

3/01/14 11:18:29 AM#43

I agree with everything you said, couldn't have phrased it better.

 

I never read a single quest I been taking, since I do't care why I need to run 5 minutes to collect 10 apples and then run 2 minutes and kill 2 bettles and then run another 3 minutes to quench 5 fires etc etc.

 

Questing or killing mobs is the same to me, a mean to reach max level and I admit have some fun on the way up (but that fun is not reading the quests). The one thing I would highlights is the social aspects of real open dungeans, if done right they create real oppurtunities for social interaction between players.

This is what I would like someone to comeup with a really cool system where the open realm pvp actually is meaningful (other than bragging about having a fort, or capturing the flag for the bazillionth time) and has impact on the pve (and pvp) aspects of the game.

  Rattenmann

Elite Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 360

 
OP  3/01/14 3:45:48 PM#44

I have only gotten skill points for the MAIN quest line up to this point.

 

Is this true for the rest of the game? If so, that would totally rock. I am fine with a mainquest that tells a story. Our team could just do the mainquest and fill the xp gaps with dungeons and pvp.

So, anyone found a quest, APART from the main story, that gives skill points?

MMOs finally replaced social interaction, forced grouping and standing in a line while talking to eachother.

Now we have forced soloing, forced questing and everyone is the hero, without ever having to talk to anyone else. The evolution of multiplayer is here! We won,... right?

  rounner

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/06
Posts: 563

3/01/14 3:56:54 PM#45
Originally posted by DAS1337
Originally posted by onlinenow25
Originally posted by LisaFlexy22
You would rather mob grind than do quests?  To each their own I suppose.

Why would you not?

 

WIth combat "grind" as your actually playing one of the core aspects of the game.  The quest "grind" is much more of a grind due to quests being artificial things to do that have no impact what so ever in the game world.  

 

If you consider killing mobs in a video game repetitive and boring, then your in the wrong hobby and shows that you actually don't know what you want.  Its similar to saying you want a song that were its written ABCD or non-repetitive, yet I can tell you that you will not like a song that does not repeat its melody.  The other factor as well is that camping actually had an impact in the game even if a minor/temporary one.

If a group of people were already set up you had to find another place/share/steal their camp.  The players at the camp before actually impacted your game play experience, unlike questing which is done almost completely solo and once completed is never done again, as well as no one knowing if you even quested save for a game that has achievements telling everyone you have.

This confuses me.  Someone is actually trying to explain how mob grinding is more exciting than quests?  Did I wake up in Bizarro World or something?  How is doing a wide variety of quests more exciting than killing a mob five thousand times?

 

Actually read the quest text and immerse yourself into what you're doing.  Don't give us your weak ass example of grinding static mobs affecting other people's play session being a positive thing.  That's all you've got?  Usually I see this conversation going the other way, meaning I've never actually seen someone post about actually wanting to mob grind.  I've seen people complaining about boring quests or lack of variety.  But, never complaining about wanting to mob grind.  Maybe we're seeing the greater de-evolution of the MMO gamer here.  I thought it was bad enough people couldn't be bothered with quest text.  Now you guys are taking an extra step and ignoring the quests all together?  Screw quests!  I aint ' got time for that!

 

Fascinating...

The core game play of MMORPG's today is killing stuff not running around like postman pat. Content that revolves around killing or gives pretext to killing is what questing should be aiming for. Simplified enough for you? If you want to talk smack over it, then I challenge you to deny that all other ESO games are more 'combat' and less 'look for next arrow'.

  Tibernicuspa

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/03/13
Posts: 1008

3/02/14 2:18:19 PM#46
Originally posted by LisaFlexy22
You would rather mob grind than do quests?  To each their own I suppose.

Every day of the week. Mob grinding allows me to go where I want and experience what I want, and encourages me to group up.

It's an honest grind.

 

Quests insult my intelligence and drag me around by the balls and making grouping nearly impossible.

  Comaf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/13/10
Posts: 1146

I want an mmorpg where pvp matters, my enemies are not my race or class, and community matters.

3/02/14 2:26:31 PM#47
Originally posted by Arataki
Being in a group gives exp bonus, so while solo grinding might take a long while, doing so in a group should be viable. Problem is, of course, finding like minded folks to grind with you.

"XP-Groups where the best social experience i ever had in MMOs and actually never had again after EQ" said the OP and I agree.  People can take their solo questing and shove it.  The MMO part of the RPG experience shouldn't just be me seeing a bunch of folks soling.

 

If IF it is true that bonus xp comes from groups - then sign me up - because all quest chains do is isolate a player from everyone else who is potentially on a different step.

  cylon8

Novice Member

Joined: 6/10/07
Posts: 314

3/02/14 2:37:38 PM#48
the problems with the origin of this post is this is for al intent and purposes a PREQUEL so theres a lot of lore in the quests you or at least I as a eso fan would  want to be immersed in through the quests. that being said it sounds like you want to treat the game like a sandbox. there are elemtns in the open worl where you could in the smallest definition just farm mobs craft and do open world dungeons occasionally  grouping to do the wvw pvp and still never touch a quest. but if that's what you want why stop playing skyrim to play eso?

so say we all

  Jockan

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 4290

Elder Scrolls Online

3/02/14 2:38:24 PM#49
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by LisaFlexy22
You would rather mob grind than do quests?  To each their own I suppose.

Every day of the week. Mob grinding allows me to go where I want and experience what I want, and encourages me to group up.

It's an honest grind.

 

Quests insult my intelligence and drag me around by the balls and making grouping nearly impossible.

 

 

  Lawlmonster

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/07/09
Posts: 957

Take my advice, I'm not using it anyway.

3/02/14 2:47:19 PM#50
Originally posted by lizardbones

Was it possible to "level" without doing any quests in Skyrim or Oblivion?

 

Yes.

"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  DrunkWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 1120

3/02/14 2:48:56 PM#51
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by LisaFlexy22
You would rather mob grind than do quests?  To each their own I suppose.

Every day of the week. Mob grinding allows me to go where I want and experience what I want, and encourages me to group up.

It's an honest grind.

 

Quests insult my intelligence and drag me around by the balls and making grouping nearly impossible.

Finally people who see it like me.

 

In todays MMOs the way quest are, other players are just in your way. to me thats not questing.

personally i have more fun in games searching the land for the perfect grind spot that me and some others can group up and kill some mobs, chat, hang out.

instead of constantly stairing at a map looking wich npc we need to talk to next and they call that a quest.

  Rattenmann

Elite Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 360

 
OP  3/02/14 2:58:04 PM#52

Really nice to see this topic going in the right direction without flamewars. Also nice to see so many people that agree and want social leveling back.

Testing in ESO showed that xp is given out equally to everyone hitting the mob. And it is NOT divided! Let's put some facts into this topic and show that there is an indicator for possible group xping.

 

Let's assume a mob gives 100xp.

  • If i kill it alone, i get 100xp.
  • If i kill it and someone else is doing half the damage, i also get 100xp.
  • If i kill it and someone else is doing 90% of the damage, i still get 100xp.
  • If i group up with the other guy and we kill said mob, we both gain 110xp (10% bonus per member).
So, good to know and glad to see this system.
 
 
Still the Nr1 Question remains: Do only MAINSTORY quests give out direct skillpoints, or do we have to do every sidequest as well to gain points? Anyone found a quest that gives a skillpoint and is NOTpart of the main story?

MMOs finally replaced social interaction, forced grouping and standing in a line while talking to eachother.

Now we have forced soloing, forced questing and everyone is the hero, without ever having to talk to anyone else. The evolution of multiplayer is here! We won,... right?

  DrunkWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 1120

3/02/14 3:08:37 PM#53
Originally posted by Rattenmann

Really nice to see this topic going in the right direction without flamewars. Also nice to see so many people that agree and want social leveling back.

Testing in ESO showed that xp is given out equally to everyone hitting the mob. And it is NOT divided! Let's put some facts into this topic and show that there is an indicator for possible group xping.

 

Let's assume a mob gives 100xp.

  • If i kill it alone, i get 100xp.
  • If i kill it and someone else is doing half the damage, i also get 100xp.
  • If i kill it and someone else is doing 90% of the damage, i still get 100xp.
  • If i group up with the other guy and we kill said mob, we both gain 110xp (10% bonus per member).
So, good to know and glad to see this system.
 
 
Still the Nr1 Question remains: Do only MAINSTORY quests give out direct skillpoints, or do we have to do every sidequest as well to gain points? Anyone found a quest that gives a skillpoint and is NOTpart of the main story?

what if say me and you are in a group and i kill the mob and you just stand there without hitting it, do you still get the 110 xp?

  Rattenmann

Elite Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 360

 
OP  3/02/14 8:43:13 PM#54

Yes, no need to do anything if grouped up.

 

I guess that they put a limit on powerleveling tho. This could be abused for pushing a new toon otherwise. Like level difference is counted, or your level compared to the mobs level. This is speculation tho and i really don't care if it gets abused. It does help the social aspects... and god knows they are rare enough.

MMOs finally replaced social interaction, forced grouping and standing in a line while talking to eachother.

Now we have forced soloing, forced questing and everyone is the hero, without ever having to talk to anyone else. The evolution of multiplayer is here! We won,... right?

  User Deleted
3/02/14 8:53:24 PM#55

I, for one, do not miss camping mobs for hours on end just to gain a level.  Having said that, if you want to level up by just grinding mob spawn for hours and hours, you could do that.

  SolarRain

Novice Member

Joined: 7/23/04
Posts: 32

3/02/14 10:09:16 PM#56

As much as I would love to have the freedom to grind on mobs through the levels if I want to, it's just really not an option in MMOs anymore. I did a little test (only solo, mind you) during this weekend and the XP gain was absolutely terrible, well, I wasn't surprised.

The real fun of mob grinding in EQ is long gone (though hopefully it will be an option again in EQ Next), and I believe the biggest reason for that is due to the significant downtime required for meditating/regen (as the OP mentioned). That mechanic sounds like an awful idea in todays games, but back then it provided ample time to really interact and get to know the people you were grouped with that often lead to some unforgettable experiences and new friends.  People just don't understand or can even imagine this concept today, which is really sad. Unfortunately WoW took things in the themepark direction and almost every MMO since has used WoW, rather than EQ as a template.

Social levelling, public dungeons etc (I know ESO has them, but they pale in comparison to EQ's) are a thing of the past. Even if you did grind mobs, there's almost no downtime for the social side of things, and no areas really built into the game to allow for it, and like I said the XP seems so small it doesn't seem worth the time.

Anyway, I find it quite sad and depressing. ESO is a beautiful and really atmospheric game and I've discovered some incredible locations that would make the most incredible spots to hang out, but there are no reasons to spend more than a few minutes at these places.

 

 

  User Deleted
3/02/14 10:38:10 PM#57
The fastest way to level is the repeatable quests in Cyrodiil. Its a short circuit for 3 quests. Grinding mobs is rediculously slow as is doing dungeons.
  User Deleted
3/02/14 10:39:53 PM#58
Unless they nerf or limit the number of repeatables you can do a day I expect cyrodiil to be full of repeatable grinders at launch.
  Shadanwolf

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1903

3/02/14 10:45:26 PM#59
You could level in Cyrodiil.
  RebelScum99

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

3/02/14 10:55:55 PM#60

Cyrodill would be your only other alternative, I'd think.  For those claiming they'd like to grind mobs to 50...good luck with that.  You'll be dead of natural causes before you make it.  I've run around and tried my hand at exploring, and while this game does reward exploration and such, it doesn't reward it with much XP.  And least not enough to level on.  The same goes for grinding mobs. 

 

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