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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Why do certain groups of MMO players feel the need to force their gameplay on others?

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173 posts found
  User Deleted
2/26/14 8:32:08 PM#141

Taking an absolutely gigantic PvP zone and converting it, (or cloning it), into a PvE zone would probably take them upwards of 6 months to a year and millions upon millions of dollars. They'd have to add mobs/bosses in place of enemy players, maybe add more quests and additional npcs to give these quests. The whole thing would have to be alpha tested, beta tested, debugged, balanced, etc., etc..

 

What would inevitably happen is that one of the versions of Cyrodiil would become easier to farm than the other. The PvP version might be easier during off peak hours, when many players aren't logged in. The PvE version would eventually get out geared and the mechanics would become rote. Trying to balance the two different versions of Cyrodiil against each other would undoubtedly prove to be a nightmare. Players would flock to the version that was perceived to be quicker/easier, leaving the other version a veritable ghost town. 

 

I'm mostly a PvE player myself, but implementing a PvE version of Cyrodiil just doesn't make any sense at this point.

 

Edit: I'm assuming the OP is asking for an entirely separate PvE version. Just letting players run around the current Cyrodiil un-flagged wouldn't make any sense, it would defeat the entire purpose of the zone.  

  TheLizardbones

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10959

I think with my heart and move with my head.-Kongos

2/26/14 8:49:38 PM#142
Originally posted by free2play
Originally posted by Ghern

Wait, let me get this straight.

You want to be able to enter a pvp-only zone (the only pvp zone in the game mind you) and not be flagged for pvp?

Now who is being a little selfish?

He wants to enter the PvP only zone to do PvE content, in the PvP only zone?

Or is the PvP only PvE?

Wait what?

 

No.  What they are asking for is two separate zones.  One is PvP and one is PvE.  Players would be in different phases so that the PvP people would be all together and the PvE people would be all together.  If they weren't going with a "super server" thing, it would be two different servers.

 

**

 

Which is an odd request for ESO, since the developers have taken pains to create both PvE and PvP content.  The only difference between PvE content in Cyrodil and PvE content outside of Cyrodil would be the location.

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with players wanting stuff like this, but at the same time, the developers have decided how they want it setup.  ESO doesn't need a PvE only Cyrodil, because ESO has a PvE only entire half or more of the game.  Darkfall doesn't need PvE servers because the developers don't want them and the game just isn't built with that in mind.  And so on.  I'm sure there's an inverse request that approximates the PvE requests I've noted somewhere.  Maybe PvP in A Tale In The Desert.  Nothing wrong with wanting it, but don't expect changes like this to take place.

 

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  Ramonski7

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/03
Posts: 2704

"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something."

2/26/14 8:56:33 PM#143

This is the fundamental flaw of today's mmorpg gamer. They are not looking for the answer to their issues anymore, they want the devs to give them the answers, the goals, the achievements and the endgame. In the past mmorpg gamers use to compensate for a lot of shortcomings found in past mmorpgs. My friends and I wanted to be ninjas in UO, there was no ninja class, skills, armor or weapons. So we "created" our version of ninjas in a UO setting. We basically looked for our answer and made due with what was provided.

 

The stage has been set for ESO, there is no given endgame for PvErs handed to you so obviously. The focus of the game is war, so what you do with that with a PvE mindset is up to you. You can tr catering to a PvPer mindset by trying to become a legend on the battlefield. I doubt you'd get anywhere but frustrated. Or you can create your own "ninja". The choice is yours. Too many mmorpg gamers these days want to change something they play instead of change the way they play.


"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."

  Octagon7711

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/12
Posts: 799

Devs please nerf paper it's overpowered I'm rock which is fine scissors are fine.

2/26/14 9:18:00 PM#144
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker

My point is that there are a lot of different play styles out there and when you sort those 642 games into categories there are an awful lot of them in a very few categories and quite a number of categories with no games in them at all.

No you did not offer to research games for people but you said that there existed games for every play style and when people point out that there are play styles without games you at least imply that it  is their fault for wanting a game to meet their play style.

 

.... and yes that is a personal attack.

So your saying it's not my fault if I can't find what I'm looking for?  That I should give that responsibility to someone or something else?  I believe that finding what I enjoy is my responsibility.

It may or not be your fault if you can't find what you are looking for, nor is it the responsibility of others to provide what you are looking for.

However, it is a personal attack to suggest that someone has a problem for having an aspiration that has yet to be met.

 

BTW you still have not substantiated your claim that there is a game for every play style.

I really don't understand that if you can't find a game to enjoy out of hundreds after a 2 year search, then it is your problem.  Who else's problem would it be?  There is no perfect MMO.  Playing in an MMO means we have to adjust and adapt to playing with a community in order to find enjoyment.  MMO's constantly change as well as gamers.  I still do believe there is a game for every playstyle, and yes all this is my opinion and not a claim.  

  centkin

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/01/10
Posts: 828

2/26/14 9:24:29 PM#145
The one that gets me is the "must use voice" crowd.  If you are not into voice chat or worse have some reason why you CAN'T use voice chat, you have no haven.  The voice people will force you to use it.  It would be nice if games had servers where the terms of play eschewed voice chat. 
  CazNeerg

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/04
Posts: 2220

"So, Lone Star, now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb." Dark Helmet

2/26/14 10:42:14 PM#146
Originally posted by centkin
The one that gets me is the "must use voice" crowd.  If you are not into voice chat or worse have some reason why you CAN'T use voice chat, you have no haven.  The voice people will force you to use it.  It would be nice if games had servers where the terms of play eschewed voice chat. 

Yeah, I'll be interested in voice chat once we have advanced filters that make player voices sound appropriate to the characters they are attached to.  Until then, no thanks, I don't need squeaky pimple voices from buff orcs, deep baritones from elf chicks, or the voice of a small child coming from somebody who looks like Gandalf.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.

  kakasaki

Novice Member

Joined: 6/11/06
Posts: 1263

"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!"

2/26/14 10:55:04 PM#147
Originally posted by ihaveabeard
Originally posted by kakasaki
Originally posted by ihaveabeard
Because MMOs are stagnant. Only one type ever seems to go beyond pre alpha phase, and that's inferior single player games with multiplayer lobbies. It's my guess that people would be less frustrated with other's preferred playstyle if more was offered in the genre.

Stating opinion as fact does not make it fact... You may feel it is stagnant but other may be perfectly happy with the choices being offered. Again, at the end of the day, it comes to PERSONAL likes/dislikes. The sooner people realize this, they happier they will be.

 

Nowhere did I say YOUR preferred playstyle is wrong, why so defensive? I don't know you, and sure as heck don't care what games you prefer to play. You might want to read posts more carefully next time.

You made a broad generalization and nowhere did you indicate "in my opinion" or "I think".  Learn to communicate better and there will be less misunderstandings. 

A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  Tibernicuspa

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/03/13
Posts: 1014

2/26/14 11:19:22 PM#148
Originally posted by RealmLordsKen
Originally posted by dave6660
Originally posted by avatarair

Consent and free will violations are pretty much front and center as the basis or "right" for common western morality, so why is it that certain groups of MMO players love oh so much to enforce playstyle they prefer onto people that don't prefer those playstyles.

How is this possible?  Players don't create the games, they don't make the rules.  Nor do they choose what games others play.

Players can complain, threaten to quit or actually quit, but that's about it.

 

Complain until the game changes would seem most likely.  TESO could be seen as having been player feedback influenced.

 

Also talking sh** about upcoming releases with the intent of discrediting them because the design doesn't match their preferred gameplay.  SWTOR not being a sandbox being a pretty clear example.

 

No, the issue with SWTOR was because the game was barely an MMO at all.

  Tibernicuspa

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/03/13
Posts: 1014

2/26/14 11:33:51 PM#149
Originally posted by avatarair
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Because MMOs are complex things and letting certain players just have what they want because they THINK it'll be convenient and fun, undermines the rest of the game for the rest of the players.

How so?

How does it undermine the game? How does making more people happy undermine the game?

Would everyone in Eve be happier if they all had a billion isk? Yes. But it would ruin the point of the entire game.

 

If you're making a PVP game, unless you tie it to the game world, the PvP is going to feel shallow and unrewarding for the PvP players. So, if PvE prices are influenced by PvP successes and failures, than PvP and PvE can both interact. PvE players may not want this on surface, but it makes the game richer as a whole.

 

Making SOME people happy at the expense of all the others is bad.

  craftseeker

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 651

2/26/14 11:34:01 PM#150
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker

My point is that there are a lot of different play styles out there and when you sort those 642 games into categories there are an awful lot of them in a very few categories and quite a number of categories with no games in them at all.

No you did not offer to research games for people but you said that there existed games for every play style and when people point out that there are play styles without games you at least imply that it  is their fault for wanting a game to meet their play style.

 

.... and yes that is a personal attack.

So your saying it's not my fault if I can't find what I'm looking for?  That I should give that responsibility to someone or something else?  I believe that finding what I enjoy is my responsibility.

It may or not be your fault if you can't find what you are looking for, nor is it the responsibility of others to provide what you are looking for.

However, it is a personal attack to suggest that someone has a problem for having an aspiration that has yet to be met.

 

BTW you still have not substantiated your claim that there is a game for every play style.

I really don't understand that if you can't find a game to enjoy out of hundreds after a 2 year search, then it is your problem.  Who else's problem would it be?  There is no perfect MMO.  Playing in an MMO means we have to adjust and adapt to playing with a community in order to find enjoyment.  MMO's constantly change as well as gamers.  I still do believe there is a game for every playstyle, and yes all this is my opinion and not a claim.  

.... and yet three people have posted lists of criteria and no one has come up for a game for any of them. 

No the "hundreds of games" soon get whittled down to none when you apply a set of criteria to them that is not the current main stream.

Yes I have a game I play, not because it is a 10 out 10 but because as a 5 out of 10 it is the best match I have found at the moment. I and others do select from what is out there but still hope for a game to come along that is a better match than the current crop. To suggest that there is a game "for every play style" is naive at best and deliberately provocative at worst.

To take this site's list of nearly 700 games and apply a couple of criteria to the list and see how fast it dwindles.

  • Released since 1/1/2010
  • Full 3d
  • High fantasy (no spaceships, no fire arms and no robots or mech suits)
  • No twitch combat
How many do you think would be left?
Remember this is just the start of a selection criteria and not the end.

 

  Zorgo

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/05/05
Posts: 2269

Who did wrong? The advertiser hired to sell the game or the consumer who put faith in advertising?

2/26/14 11:40:06 PM#151
Originally posted by avatarair
Originally posted by nariusseldon

I dunno why they feel that way ...

But it boils down to gaming is about preferences, and free market, and so no matter what they are saying, it is moot at the end, since the market is going to do what it does anyway.

And no one should compromise on their preferences. I always play games my way .. and if devs don't want to cater to me, i will do something else.

It is that simple.

 

If only the market truly were free. AS it stands right now, I LOVE the theme and feel of ESO but absolutely cannot stand PvP, so essentially I will have no end-game as end-game is heavily crafting influenced and all good end-game mats and recipes come from PvP areas.

 

On the contrast, Wildstar looks exactly like what I want in an MMO, but lacks any form of seriousness, graphical fidelity, or complexity (both inner and outer), and to boot I HATE HATE HATE anything that looks sci-fi.

 

The day where new MMOs are coming out all the time to suit all types of playstyles is when I'll be happy but right now the genre feels so shallow to me in the upcoming year. 

So the question is - why do others want to force their gameplay on others?

Well, apparently your reason is so you can get mats and recipes from non-pvp areas. 

 

 

  Wraithone

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/09/04
Posts: 3589

If you can't kill it, don't make it mad.

2/26/14 11:51:01 PM#152
Originally posted by avatarair

Consent and free will violations are pretty much front and center as the basis or "right" for common western morality, so why is it that certain groups of MMO players love oh so much to enforce playstyle they prefer onto people that don't prefer those playstyles.

 

What instigated this is reading about how some people are against adding a PvE-only Cyrodil campaign in ESO, for example. Or older examples like WoW where they fought to improve the way where one could permanently toggle PvP off.

 

While this is of course more prominent for PVP'ers in my knowledge this kind of vitriol also comes from PvE'ers (hardcore more often than not), and "hardcore" gamers in general.

 

I mean I've pretty much accepted that it's the way of human to be blissfully and ignorantly bigoted and try to dominate and subdue people that don't agree with them because of some perceived strength or level of value to their specific opinion simply because...well, because. But at the same time it just gets hard to wrap my head around it.

 

Why can't you let people just be whoever the hell they want to be? They're themselves anyway, you restricting them doesn't change that in any way. It just makes life shittier from a utilitarian standpoint.

 

What's worse is the convoluted logic these people will sometimes employ to defend these claims.

 

And before you post "Of you're complaining about intolerance by being intolerant of intolerance" well god damnit there's no way out of the tolerance paradox that doesn't conflict with my moral standings, flimsy as they may be, so I just say fuck it. If it helps I'm approaching this from a utilitarian POV as well so just take it from there.

 One of the reasons that Goonies and other such tend to object to that is obvious... People playing on PvE servers/areas aren't available for ganking and/or griefing. Its really as simple as that.

Some may make different claims, and hand wave about "tradition" and other such nonsense, but it all boils down to that.

  PAL-18

Novice Member

Joined: 4/14/13
Posts: 743

2/27/14 12:02:52 AM#153

Cyrodil PvE only safe zone and rest of the world open PvP on.

WTB.

 

So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.
By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
**On the radar:http://cyberpunk.net/**

  Arglebargle

Elite Member

Joined: 6/13/07
Posts: 1219

2/27/14 12:18:26 AM#154

The OP is just far too persnickety.   If you demand too many required aspects, the chances of you getting a game that fits them all goes way down.  It's a personal problem.

 

I was involved with some boat design once, and everything in it was a trade off.  You could design to be stable in the water, but you'd be unstable in the air.  You could design for greater space, but you ended up not be able to go into shallower water.  You could go real fast, but it'd be real uncomfortable sailing, and you couldn't carry even basic necessities. ETC.

 

Game designers face these decisions all the time.   They try to not go too deleteriously far in any particular direction (unless they are working on a very specific, niche, product).   But even things like the call for different servers for different playstyles comes at some dev cost.   The extra conversion work, more complicated version control, etc, can add to a developer load that is already stretched to the breaking point. 

 

I'm not that keen on some of the PVE elements mandated by ESO's RVR-centric design.  But I can happily settle for no forced PvP, and don't have to be the uber-est character around.  I have just opened up a bunch of other games for my possible play as well.  I can handle cartoony to realistic art (as long as the art direction is good), just like I can in movies.  More games opened up for play.

 

You're best off, in my opinion, finding the thing closest to your narrow definitions and playing that.  Otherwise .... you get to play the waiting game....

If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 21215

2/27/14 12:36:36 AM#155
Originally posted by craftseeker
 

.... and yet three people have posted lists of criteria and no one has come up for a game for any of them. 

So? May be their preferences are so out of the norm that no devs want to cater to them.

No one owe them a game they like 100%.

 

  FinalFikus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/01/13
Posts: 910

"We're up all night to get lucky"

2/27/14 12:40:56 AM#156
Originally posted by Wraithone
Originally posted by avatarair

Consent and free will violations are pretty much front and center as the basis or "right" for common western morality, so why is it that certain groups of MMO players love oh so much to enforce playstyle they prefer onto people that don't prefer those playstyles.

 

What instigated this is reading about how some people are against adding a PvE-only Cyrodil campaign in ESO, for example. Or older examples like WoW where they fought to improve the way where one could permanently toggle PvP off.

 

While this is of course more prominent for PVP'ers in my knowledge this kind of vitriol also comes from PvE'ers (hardcore more often than not), and "hardcore" gamers in general.

 

I mean I've pretty much accepted that it's the way of human to be blissfully and ignorantly bigoted and try to dominate and subdue people that don't agree with them because of some perceived strength or level of value to their specific opinion simply because...well, because. But at the same time it just gets hard to wrap my head around it.

 

Why can't you let people just be whoever the hell they want to be? They're themselves anyway, you restricting them doesn't change that in any way. It just makes life shittier from a utilitarian standpoint.

 

What's worse is the convoluted logic these people will sometimes employ to defend these claims.

 

And before you post "Of you're complaining about intolerance by being intolerant of intolerance" well god damnit there's no way out of the tolerance paradox that doesn't conflict with my moral standings, flimsy as they may be, so I just say fuck it. If it helps I'm approaching this from a utilitarian POV as well so just take it from there.

 One of the reasons that Goonies and other such tend to object to that is obvious... People playing on PvE servers/areas aren't available for ganking and/or griefing. Its really as simple as that.

Some may make different claims, and hand wave about "tradition" and other such nonsense, but it all boils down to that.

PVE cost 50 times more than pvp and only last for a week. Then requires the best rewards or it's worthless. They need level cap increases, new treadmills to constantly take the place of the old.  PVP players get hit with all that too.

But we have 50% hardcore pvp players now. Who use progression to win. They are hardcore, not because its an fps based on skill, but because other people were allowed to join the game after them making them better than someone else. This will lead to all kinds of mischief. Guilds forming to literally ruin online games and put people out of work. Then a decade will pass and they're still taking the easy win, the unoriginal.

"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12456

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

2/27/14 12:41:41 AM#157
Originally posted by Arglebargle

The OP is just far too persnickety.   If you demand too many required aspects, the chances of you getting a game that fits them all goes way down.  It's a personal problem.

I was involved with some boat design once, and everything in it was a trade off.  You could design to be stable in the water, but you'd be unstable in the air.  You could design for greater space, but you ended up not be able to go into shallower water.  You could go real fast, but it'd be real uncomfortable sailing, and you couldn't carry even basic necessities. ETC.

Game designers face these decisions all the time.   They try to not go too deleteriously far in any particular direction (unless they are working on a very specific, niche, product).   But even things like the call for different servers for different playstyles comes at some dev cost.   The extra conversion work, more complicated version control, etc, can add to a developer load that is already stretched to the breaking point. 

I'm not that keen on some of the PVE elements mandated by ESO's RVR-centric design.  But I can happily settle for no forced PvP, and don't have to be the uber-est character around.  I have just opened up a bunch of other games for my possible play as well.  I can handle cartoony to realistic art (as long as the art direction is good), just like I can in movies.  More games opened up for play.

You're best off, in my opinion, finding the thing closest to your narrow definitions and playing that.  Otherwise .... you get to play the waiting game....

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  whisperwynd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/22/06
Posts: 1474

Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the priviledge to do so as well.

2/27/14 1:05:47 AM#158
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by craftseeker
 

.... and yet three people have posted lists of criteria and no one has come up for a game for any of them. 

So? May be their preferences are so out of the norm that no devs want to cater to them.

No one owe them a game they like 100%.

 

For once I'm in complete agreement with Narius.. here. No one can get a game that fits them %100 and trying to change an aspect of a game that is the dev's own vision (in this case as example is the PvP zone of Cyrodiil) is actually trying to 'force' others to their playstyle (those that are looking forward to it).

This is the game being made. It's what's being 'sold' to the players. The choice to play it or not is really simple and up to the individual. No company can cater to everyone, it's just not possible. There will always be someone not liking something another loves, the sheer numbers of games out there kinda proves it. 

  Octagon7711

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/12
Posts: 799

Devs please nerf paper it's overpowered I'm rock which is fine scissors are fine.

2/27/14 1:07:47 AM#159
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker

My point is that there are a lot of different play styles out there and when you sort those 642 games into categories there are an awful lot of them in a very few categories and quite a number of categories with no games in them at all.

No you did not offer to research games for people but you said that there existed games for every play style and when people point out that there are play styles without games you at least imply that it  is their fault for wanting a game to meet their play style.

 

.... and yes that is a personal attack.

So your saying it's not my fault if I can't find what I'm looking for?  That I should give that responsibility to someone or something else?  I believe that finding what I enjoy is my responsibility.

It may or not be your fault if you can't find what you are looking for, nor is it the responsibility of others to provide what you are looking for.

However, it is a personal attack to suggest that someone has a problem for having an aspiration that has yet to be met.

 

BTW you still have not substantiated your claim that there is a game for every play style.

I really don't understand that if you can't find a game to enjoy out of hundreds after a 2 year search, then it is your problem.  Who else's problem would it be?  There is no perfect MMO.  Playing in an MMO means we have to adjust and adapt to playing with a community in order to find enjoyment.  MMO's constantly change as well as gamers.  I still do believe there is a game for every playstyle, and yes all this is my opinion and not a claim.  

.... and yet three people have posted lists of criteria and no one has come up for a game for any of them. 

No the "hundreds of games" soon get whittled down to none when you apply a set of criteria to them that is not the current main stream.

Yes I have a game I play, not because it is a 10 out 10 but because as a 5 out of 10 it is the best match I have found at the moment. I and others do select from what is out there but still hope for a game to come along that is a better match than the current crop. To suggest that there is a game "for every play style" is naive at best and deliberately provocative at worst.

To take this site's list of nearly 700 games and apply a couple of criteria to the list and see how fast it dwindles.

  • Released since 1/1/2010
  • Full 3d
  • High fantasy (no spaceships, no fire arms and no robots or mech suits)
  • No twitch combat
How many do you think would be left?
Remember this is just the start of a selection criteria and not the end.

 

The problem with a list is that there is always something left out.  For example nowhere in the lists does it refer to preferences for playing with others.  Solo questing? Group questing?  Dungeon groups only? No PVP anywhere or anywhere near PVE areas? Full 3D as with 3D glasses and compatible graphics card? No twitch as in turned based?  No twitch as in ranged DPS  group support based?  It's far to easy to say here is my list of games that fit your list then you would clarify what you actually meant and the list would grow towards your quest for the perfect MMO.  We all have a list in our heads about what we like or don't like in games and I don't think I've ever heard someone say they've found the perfect MMO which they have been playing for the last two to five years, well maybe except for some people who play WOW.

I did the work and found a lot of games I like to play.  None are perfect but yes I can play them and have fun most of the time.  If you are playing a game then it does fit your play style, maybe not 100% but my statement included nothing about  to what degree.  I was actually thinking in general terms, pve preferred play, a pvp play style, solo or grouped preferred questing centric MMO's, etc.  Which I thought the title of the thread was about.

Actually a good idea for a company would be one that matched players to games.  You could fill out an evaluation form which could be run through a complete database of current games and produce a list of games based on your play style.  Sounds like a kickstarter project.

  craftseeker

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 651

2/27/14 1:23:32 AM#160
Originally posted by Octagon7711
Originally posted by craftseeker

.... and yet three people have posted lists of criteria and no one has come up for a game for any of them. 

No the "hundreds of games" soon get whittled down to none when you apply a set of criteria to them that is not the current main stream.

Yes I have a game I play, not because it is a 10 out 10 but because as a 5 out of 10 it is the best match I have found at the moment. I and others do select from what is out there but still hope for a game to come along that is a better match than the current crop. To suggest that there is a game "for every play style" is naive at best and deliberately provocative at worst.

To take this site's list of nearly 700 games and apply a couple of criteria to the list and see how fast it dwindles.

  • Released since 1/1/2010
  • Full 3d
  • High fantasy (no spaceships, no fire arms and no robots or mech suits)
  • No twitch combat
How many do you think would be left?
Remember this is just the start of a selection criteria and not the end.

 

The problem with a list is that there is always something left out.  For example nowhere in the lists does it refer to preferences for playing with others.  Solo questing? Group questing?  Dungeon groups only? No PVP anywhere or anywhere near PVE areas? Full 3D as with 3D glasses and compatible graphics card? No twitch as in turned based?  No twitch as in ranged DPS  group support based?  It's far to easy to say here is my list of games that fit your list then you would clarify what you actually meant and the list would grow towards your quest for the perfect MMO.  We all have a list in our heads about what we like or don't like in games and I don't think I've ever heard someone say they've found the perfect MMO which they have been playing for the last two to five years, well maybe except for some people who play WOW.

I did the work and found a lot of games I like to play.  None are perfect but yes I can play them and have fun most of the time.  If you are playing a game then it does fit your play style, maybe not 100% but my statement included nothing about  to what degree.  I was actually thinking in general terms, pve preferred play, a pvp play style, solo or grouped preferred questing centric MMO's, etc.  Which I thought the title of the thread was about.

Actually a good idea for a company would be one that matched players to games.  You could fill out an evaluation form which could be run through a complete database of current games and produce a list of games based on your play style.  Sounds like a kickstarter project.

That is a much more considered response than I have seen previously.  I left out the PvP/PPvE question because that differentiated me from the other two posters that had made criteria lists.

Your idea of creating a matrix that players could fill in and be matched against existing games has merit.  It would be nice to see such a matrix with 10,000 or so responses that could demonstrate the gaps in the existing market.  It may even lead to some games getting developed to fill the gaps.

BTW I would like to see a game that had questing options for variable numbers of players between 1 and 12. More than 12 and the "bio breaks" and other organizational problems take too much time out of the hour.  No twitch as in recognizing that 350ms latency and slowing reflexes does not make 'dodge ball' games much fun.

 

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