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Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft

Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft 

General Discussion  » Huge pay to win

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66 posts found
  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6991

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

 
OP  2/20/14 10:24:27 PM#1

No you don't have to buy but if you do like some that have already bought over 100 packs,there is a huge disparity in cards.

Even their auto match maker is really bad,example i was constantly matched versus players with more unlocked decks than me and seemed every single card they played was o/p.

Soon i seen the decks with very powerful multi-mechanic cards,i just esc and concede,not much fun there.I have been a long time member of MTGO and MTG regular cards and played SOE's version,i won't be supporting these games anymore with money.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Myrdynn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/25/07
Posts: 1452

2/20/14 10:26:33 PM#2
Originally posted by Wizardry

No you don't have to buy but if you do like some that have already bought over 100 packs,there is a huge disparity in cards.

Even their auto match maker is really bad,example i was constantly matched versus players with more unlocked decks than me and seemed every single card they played was o/p.

Soon i seen the decks with very powerful multi-mechanic cards,i just esc and concede,not much fun there.I have been a long time member of MTGO and MTG regular cards and played SOE's version,i won't be supporting these games anymore with money.

still not pay 2 win.  there is only 1 card that you can get in Hearthstone by purchasing that you cant get by playing.  Do dailies, do arenas, you can unlock every card eventually but slowly.

 

  genoshan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/09
Posts: 50

2/20/14 10:46:03 PM#3

I disagree about it being p2w. I thought this was the case originally also, but I did my quests, the hidden quests ( such as 100 wins ) and have managed to get legendaries a few times.

 

I actually save up 150 gold, run an arena and hope for profit. It works, often i get a pack, 60-100 gold and some enchanting material from one arena run... Unless I suck, i at least always get a pack of cards to open.

  Damedius

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/13/13
Posts: 353

2/20/14 10:52:37 PM#4

I would consider constructed Pay 2 Win or Pay for a massive advantage. Players who spend money will have an advantage over those who don't.. The only other way to be competitive is to play for months. However during that time you won't be competitive at the upper levels. It would probably take a casual player, who only plays a few games a week, at least a year to be competitive without spending money.

Of course you have those who will say that it isn't Pay 2 Win because it doesn't have a literal "I Win" button.

  Deathenger

Elite Member

Joined: 9/07/08
Posts: 446

Wipe yourself off, U DEAD!

2/20/14 10:58:16 PM#5

Oh geez another one of "you" people. You do realize in ALL tcg/ccg even IRL you must purchase cards to build decks and play right?

Blizzard even gave you a way to earn decks with free gold thru dailies and stuff. What would you have them do, not make a dime and give every single player every single card for free? Gimme a effing break!!!

  Tygranir

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/13
Posts: 765

2/20/14 11:01:31 PM#6

Pay to win? What card can I buy that will let me win? I don't understand.... Where is this all powerful card that you can only get by paying?

 

Oh wait, people don't know what pay to win is....

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  Dalexith78

Novice Member

Joined: 5/18/10
Posts: 29

2/20/14 11:02:10 PM#7
U folks need to learn what pay to win is. If you could buy single cards then yes it would be but u are not. U are buying packs of RANDOM cards just like you do in real life.
  DamonVile

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4909

2/20/14 11:08:46 PM#8

So playing longer than someone else is now pay 2 win ?

 

  Andelith

Novice Member

Joined: 9/04/09
Posts: 20

2/20/14 11:13:18 PM#9

Even their auto match maker is really bad,example i was constantly matched versus players with more unlocked decks than me and seemed every single card they played was o/p.

 

LOL, so they played against the computer more than you chose to and you are complaining, (beat the AI class and unlock that deck) I find it funny you obviously don't know anything about the game because it seemed every single card was OP. 

If you were playing unranked who cares what their cards were, do what you are supposed to do at the beginning and READ the cards and learn WTF you are supposed to be doing, if you were playing ranked the match maker put you against someone of similar rank, I've earned many packs for free just playing and learning the game.

I guess I will just never understand the "entitled" mentality, it's not fair because someone else has something i don't so I'll come online and cry about it.

 

As far as a casual player competing at high levels, good luck with that, casual joe can dump $1000 into the game right now and it won't mean a thing, the top players are top players because they play the game constantly, the meta changes hour to hour and if you don't keep up with it you are behind and at a disadvantage, doesn't make a difference how many cards you have.

  Damedius

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/13/13
Posts: 353

2/20/14 11:13:42 PM#10
Originally posted by DamonVile

So playing longer than someone else is now pay 2 win ?

 

No ,but playing less than someone else and paying to be able to beat them, could be construed as Pay 2 Win.

  Andelith

Novice Member

Joined: 9/04/09
Posts: 20

2/20/14 11:16:01 PM#11
Originally posted by Damedius
Originally posted by DamonVile

So playing longer than someone else is now pay 2 win ?

 

No ,but playing less than someone else and paying to be able to beat them, could be construed as Pay 2 Win.

So how is buying random cards going to make you beat them?

  genoshan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/09
Posts: 50

2/20/14 11:17:47 PM#12

Terrible example. There are very few things in this world where you challenge or compete against another person, where the person who trains or practices the most will not win.

 

I am not about to pick up a tennis racquet and expect to have a 50/50 change of beating Roger Federer !

  RollieJoe

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/31/05
Posts: 415

2/20/14 11:17:52 PM#13

Wizardry, ignore the trolls, the game is clearly p2w.   But my question is, what CCG isn't?    Faeria is the only one I know of that isn't p2w, its b2p and grind2win  (duels of the planeswalkers don't really count).    But every other CCG from Duels of Champions to Infinity Wars, Hearthstone to Solforge, and even hybrid games like Cardhunter, all have the same payment model.    You mention MTGO which is also pure p2w without even a way to grind the cards slowly.

 

I guess bottom line is, if you don't like p2w, CCG games are NOT the genre of gaming you want to be in.   Of course if you love CCG's but just hate p2w and want a game where everyone has access to the same cards, there's always Cockatrice.  

  Damedius

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/13/13
Posts: 353

2/20/14 11:19:07 PM#14
Originally posted by Andelith

So how is buying random cards going to make you beat them?

You break down those cards and make the cards you need.

  Kost

Newshound

Joined: 1/15/10
Posts: 2025

In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro.

2/20/14 11:19:16 PM#15

Welcome to the world of card games...

There is nothing "pay to win" about any TCG. Buying boosters (or trading cards) to improve your deck is the very essence of what TCG's are all about, it's been this way since Magic came out in '93, and it will always be this way. Serious  players often buy entire boxes of booster packs, just for the chance of getting one or two extremely rare cards.

Hearthstone has added an alternative method of obtaining cards for players who don't want to spend any cash (which is selfish to be entirely honest, way to show your support for the developer...) and you still see these complainers who want everything that someone else has, but are unwilling to do what is required to achieve that goal.

You have a few choices:

(1) Spend money to improve your deck immediately, like EVERY other TCG on the face of the planet.

(2) Grind out packs by gaining gold through playing the game (and be thankful that this option is even available at all).

(3) Stick with a basic deck, get shit on, and come complain on forums about the game being "pay to win".

Options 1 and 2 are completely respectable. Option 3 is the equivalent of complaining that someone with a Ferrari F50 just blew the doors off of your 1995 Ford Tempo.

You claim that you spent time playing MTG, yet this very simple premise, of which the entire game is built upon, seems to elude you.

/facepalm

 

 

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6991

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

 
OP  2/21/14 8:06:30 AM#16

Well 1 or 2 got the point,has nothing to do with playing longer or playing the computer.

The difference is that the original you purchased physical cards ,nice looking cards that were covered in work by artists.Then in the online version if you collected a full set you could also redeem that for physical cards as well.

Also if i chose to goto a card shop ,we would work out a fair game.You can't have a fair game when matched with cards that have powerful multi mechanics while i am playing single weak mechanic cards.The more powerful cards are also more powerful for the mana spent.You can also form multiple combinations when buying 100''s of packs,your not getting hundreds of packs the normal way for a VERY very long time.

Soon the game releases full the top players will have all spent on hundreds of packs.Those players will have sponsored websites and enter in payout tournaments,the rest ,well you will be funding it all.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Tygranir

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/13
Posts: 765

2/21/14 8:12:44 AM#17
Originally posted by Wizardry

Well 1 or 2 got the point,has nothing to do with playing longer or playing the computer.

The difference is that the original you purchased physical cards ,nice looking cards that were covered in work by artists.Then in the online version if you collected a full set you could also redeem that for physical cards as well.

Also if i chose to goto a card shop ,we would work out a fair game.You can't have a fair game when matched with cards that have powerful multi mechanics while i am playing single weak mechanic cards.The more powerful cards are also more powerful for the mana spent.You can also form multiple combinations when buying 100''s of packs,your not getting hundreds of packs the normal way for a VERY very long time.

Soon the game releases full the top players will have all spent on hundreds of packs.Those players will have sponsored websites and enter in payout tournaments,the rest ,well you will be funding it all.

So.... you don't know what Pay to Win means. kk

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  Ikeda

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/07/10
Posts: 2093

2/21/14 8:25:43 AM#18

Dear Wizardry,

If you don't want to be over powered, I highly suggest you grind for gold and go play in booster tourneys.

Every CCG is P2W.  That is the very nature of the beast.  A couple of years ago I dropped almost $750 on running a 3 Jace discard deck.  I made most of that money back by selling them when I realized I didn't care for the people I was playing against.  Most whined because it wasn't fair, and I told them to come back on Friday night with our own little booster tourneys.  That's the ENTIRE reason for such format is to be on an "even" keel.  

Of course, you pull a legendary in the booster tourney and you basically hit the I win button (unless you miss play terribly).

I'm sorry you feel it's unfair but those of us who have played this game for MONTHS have worked our butts off for the cards/gold (and I have bought some packs with games I've sold back to gamestop and gotten blizz cards).  

Even you acknowledge that you haven't unlocked all the packs/decks yet.  I suggest you do so before trying to compete.  That's like complaining that you brought a pea shooter into a gun fight with an M-60.  Blizzard has done a comparitively good job of balancing gameplay but a lvl 1 white mage will never be able to fight a lvl 60 white mage and hope to win.

I'd be curious to see if you'd complain if someone who didn't "pay" for packs whooped you.  Still P2W then?

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  thinktank001

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/13/08
Posts: 1953

2/23/14 7:57:06 PM#19
The game is P2W, but I don't think that has to be a bad part of the game.    I think it just  over shadows the fun because the match making for casual play is a broken concept, and by the fact that players can not earn their 100 gold + daily through the AI.

 

  xpowderx

Elite Member

Joined: 10/09/05
Posts: 4311

Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts. Richard Feynman, Nobel-prize-winning physicist

2/28/14 3:17:59 PM#20

I have been playing Hearthstone about a month and a half now.  I mainly play Shaman. I am rank 5 currently. The deck I use is basically the same one I have used since day one. All the good cards in that deck I never payed for. In fact it was not til last Thursday when I decided to buy some booster packs from Blizzard..

I only bought because I like the game and am willing to support it. I spent 20 dollars. Of that 20 dollars I received many doubles of cards I already had and one legendary. The legendary I dont even use!

I do not see how this game is a "Huge Pay To Win". In my view the OP has never really played hearthstone and is trolling the game. In reality, I spent 20 dollars with no significant impact to my gameplay.

To me, Hearthstone is a bargain! A fun one at that!@!!!

 

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