Trending Games | The Crew | Landmark | Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor | WildStar

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,850,602 Users Online:0
Games:732  Posts:6,223,911
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Puzzle Pirates Quickhit Football
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik Discussion Forums

Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » Guys, are you mad at zenimax right now?

6 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 » Search
105 posts found

Elite Member

Joined: 1/07/06
Posts: 6153

The adult I am takes care of most things real life. However my inner-child is a GAMER!!

2/01/14 4:14:04 AM#61
Originally posted by DamonVile
I don't play box/subs with cash shops so, not mad, but not going to play either. It will go f2p soon enough.

Same here as I don't play cashshop and will stick with just the box/sub fee for the game.

I mean if I truly wouldn't play a game that might have a subfee, box cost and a cashshop I think there isn't a game anymore that I could play cause almost every MMO/rpg has some form of cashshop or real life cost items players can buy above their box/sub fee.

I just choose not to use cashshop unless a cashshop really prevents me from enjoying the game without using it. Then I just feel the game isn't for me.

I think that Zenimax actually understands giving players something meaningfull for pre-ordering their game. Most pre-order come with fluff stuff that is even out of game, like artbooks, posters, maps, figuriens, which might be fun for certain collectors. But simple isn't what would make me buy a pre-order.

Not saying I will pre-order the game because I will not. But definitly will buy the game that's for sure.

Wondering what kind of uproar we will see when upcoming sandbox games come out F2P with cashshops cause to be honost that is something I truly can not understand how that will work. But of course that's pure speculation cause I have no idea what things will be or not be cashshop related. But just the whole premise of a sandbox game being F2P just doesn't feel right to me.

And pre-orders never really bothered me ever. Even though I never pre-order.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/11/06
Posts: 845

2/01/14 4:47:14 AM#62

no ,I am not mad,just don't care for ESO, maybe if game surprised me with good pvp ,I 'll play

Nothing wrong with CE & monthly sub

only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW


Elite Member

Joined: 3/07/13
Posts: 264

2/01/14 4:52:44 AM#63
When I was younger I used to be angry all the time. As I got older I just became more and more annoyed.

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/23/09
Posts: 587

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

2/01/14 4:56:27 AM#64
I don't care. I will buy and play it simply because I have nothing else on my plate and $80 dollars is nothing to me. However, if you're tight fisted I suggest you be wary. The preorder and imperial edition digital bonuses feel very much like a cash grab which leads me to believe that they're playing the short game rather than the long game. In other words, looking to profit mainly off of box sales rather than subs. 

"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:
And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"
~Lord George Gordon Byron


Novice Member

Joined: 1/04/14
Posts: 188

2/01/14 4:57:19 AM#65
I'm mad on their marketing team. Developers has only one option to follow greedy minds. I hope this kind of things will not repeat other wise I will not buy or continue my subscription.

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/04/10
Posts: 672

2/01/14 5:03:49 AM#66
Originally posted by Panther2103
I don't even want to play the race, or use that horse, so I'm not mad. If people want to pay for things like that then they can go ahead and do it. As long as they aren't paying for power than why should I care about it?

Because they are paying for aesthetics. Power is not everything in a game you knnow?I know more people feel this way.


Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/05
Posts: 729


2/01/14 5:09:50 AM#67
They've been smoking the greed weed :)


Novice Member

Joined: 9/30/10
Posts: 15

2/01/14 5:50:53 AM#68
Not "mad" about it. In fact I probably won't ever play the game, but what is frustrating is that a lot of us are just used to being able to pay for a game and getting what comes with that purchase. Everyone who bought a game would have access to all of the classes, races, factions, spells, zones etc. .. the normal, standard features that come with a game (yes .. I know the race/faction is the main aspect in question here, but that used to be considered a standard feature).

But over the past few years, it seems the game companies are just continuously nudging us to test what we'll give into next over time and I highly doubt it will stop here.

I guess it's kind of like buying cheese and cracker packs for years and then the companies that makes them decide to still charge the same amount of money for them, then lock the cheese container part and charge more to unlock that part of the box. You still get the cheese section in your purchase, you just can't eat it.
  User Deleted
2/01/14 5:51:52 AM#69
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Xarko
Originally posted by Ividnaelax
I could care less about the race, I just want the horse.

It will certainly be easier to spot people for me to avoid, just like in good old days ;P v=gCjuFpQ3EeA

i never saw that -  amusing

That was pretty funny, although most of the people that get those sparkle ponies from both SoE and Blizzard are from buying it with platinum / gold from other players.  Really its just a RMT gateway for players to buy in game currency with real money.


Novice Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 21

“Best way to ease your mind is in another world”

2/01/14 6:02:08 AM#70
I'm not mad but I dislike that they gave the option where any race can join any alliance. This is AvA be true to your alliance don't punk out . 

Sabotage Gaming TS3 Open To All Gamer's

Teamspeak IP.


Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/13
Posts: 654

2/01/14 6:11:28 AM#71
mad? lol. I have a choice, Why would I be mad? I don't have an emotional attachment to a corporation.

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/19/05
Posts: 2014

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

2/01/14 6:20:06 AM#72

Mixed feelings. Originally I was a definite 'no' for ESO. After the last beta (without getting into NDA stuff) it was a 'probably yes' with the understanding that it would probably be a  4 to 8 week game (for me).

Now with the preorder option I am falling into 'probably no'.

The faction/race locks were a huge central backbone of the game. I didn't think it needed to be but that was the design. Now in what amounts to the 11th hour they effectively take it away by associating it with a means of generating more up front cash.

To me this mean this means:

A) They are really great at customer service, heard the cries of their players and decided to change in favor of the requested 'needs'.

B) They found their original projected sales flagging so they caved in to offer a feature to hopefully pull back disenchanted   potential customers who were upset by the faction lock.

I discount A because the hue and cry was heard long ago. Had they wanted to change positions on faction locks they would have done so long ago.

B I think is a more likely scenario and while I applaud it from a business standpoint (sometimes have to grit your teeth and take it in the gut..or lower) it would seem to point towards the increasingly  common scenario of  a  sub based game going F2P in the short run (12 - 24 months) due to lack of sustainability on the major income stream, subs.

Now I don't mind spending money and Usually play for short periods of time, 1 to 2 months. Then I leave and come back periodically over time. So why am I inclined towards 'no'?

Not 100% sure but I would hazard a guess that after so many years of MMOs (this is my 20th year online gaming) I am starting to burn out on drama. Really not sure. It's one of those things that puzzles me frequently. Doesn't matter, I suppose but for this game the change in race/factions locks has probably taken it off the table for me.



Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/14
Posts: 500

2/01/14 6:26:38 AM#73
What is wrong with people?  Mad about a VIDEO GAME!! Are you kidding?  If a decision a VIDEO GAME company impacts your life where you become mad, outraged, feel anger, feel mistreated or anything like that, that would be a sign it's time to STOP playing VIDEO GAMES!

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/10/11
Posts: 1989

2/01/14 6:34:05 AM#74
I dont get mad about games, it's pathetic really, not to mention over small things like this. If a game does something huge enough that I dont like I pass on it and get the next best thing. Who ever bought the CE for the Imperial, all I can say to you, have fun and I hope you dont have to listen to some whiny kid whining at you in game over it.

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/10/11
Posts: 1989

2/01/14 6:35:05 AM#75
Originally posted by Dewguy79
What is wrong with people?  Mad about a VIDEO GAME!! Are you kidding?  If a decision a VIDEO GAME company impacts your life where you become mad, outraged, feel anger, feel mistreated or anything like that, that would be a sign it's time to STOP playing VIDEO GAMES!



Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/03/04
Posts: 359

2/01/14 6:52:21 AM#76
Not Mad in any way at all. I dont care about playing as an Imperial and as you can play as any Race comes with just the Pre Order, so no ImpEdition needed, im very fine. Even that i bought the Imp Edition. I'm looking forward to the Headstart. Also i prefered SUB Games from the Beginning, it's another reason for me to give it a go. And after Beta, for me it's a must-have.

Novice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 4

2/01/14 7:08:08 AM#77
Mad?... no ofc not... disappointed? yes I am disappointed in some or more choices that are made within zenimax.

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/08/07
Posts: 213

2/01/14 10:41:56 AM#78

No, they can charge Box sell + $15 monthly + cash shop + expansion. whatever they do to their game is their business. 

and buy it or not is out choice , not their business. i'm not mad at them at all b/c i like to see a big title fall, just like FF14 and people who hate the greedy , as i know, already decide not to buy and moving on next new game. 

arent we all love dart vader b./c he also fall hard into darkside? ^__^


Novice Member

Joined: 1/27/10
Posts: 2778

2/01/14 10:47:52 AM#79

The only thing that makes me want to buy the CE is that sweet book that comes with it. But, I'm getting rather tired of statues of characters I don't care (or know nothing) about.


That book really does look sweet though.

I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil


The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3778

2/01/14 10:48:18 AM#80
Originally posted by FrodoFragins

No I'm not mad because I don't plan on ever playing the game.  They are doing some things I could never support though.


I will be happy to see the game utterly fail.

Based on the assumption that they would know exactly why they failed and this would correct the behavior of future developers? Lol


Or maybe you just don't like seeing people enjoy something you don't?


At least your agenda is clear and honest.

6 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 » Search