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General Discussion  » Lead dev says game world larger than Skyrim, Oblivion and Morrowind combined

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102 posts found
  ArChWind

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/19/11
Posts: 486

1/18/14 10:12:42 PM#81
Originally posted by SlyLoK
Originally posted by cura
Originally posted by SlyLoK
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by ste2000
I can confirm what the dev said, the world is huge indeed

No it's not, it's an instanced zoning word, even within each faction area you are zoning between areas. You cannot go where you want within the world and to top it all it's made of many instances.

Vanguards world of Telon is huge not ESO lol.

Except Vanguard is also cut up into zones or in its case " chunks " and each time you cross one there is a pause for it to load. It is pretty quick being only a second or 2 though but it is still the same.

The world in TESO is huge.. It doesnt matter if there is a loading screen between each area. You can quickly lose hours of playtime by just roaming around in ES fashion in one of the early areas. In fact that is what happened to me.

And everything is made of pixels, lol. There is a difference between loading screens and seemless world where engine loads more data every so often. TES world is small in comparison to Vanguard's no matter how you will try to spin it, lol

Vanguard isnt seamless because it has the loading chunks. Seamless would be 100% no loading ever. In Vanguard the chunks are zone lines. Not seamless.

Your argument is senseless.

The fact is that every game including EQ2 still has chunks. The problem is that Vanguard used a engine that had to load a full chunk up front and not broken into very small pieces for background processing. Engines that are streaming are by your definition not seamless but yet I can show you that they are fully seamless to the limits of your hard drive. :)

The iron sphere turns.

  Fearum

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/15/11
Posts: 1089

1/18/14 10:22:01 PM#82
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Tamanous
Originally posted by JJ82
 

 The game also uses invisible walls to block off the rest of the world while attempting to use old phrases like "open world".

So yeah, actually you can compare it to Asheons Call, because it really was an open world, where you could go anywhere with your character. Which you cant in TESO.

TESO is trying to be everything to everyone and lying their backsides off while doing it.

I really have to ask: Did you even play TESO past level 15?

 

 

or 10 for that matter

lol, I would say he is mad because he didn't get into beta yet.

  SlyLoK

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/04/08
Posts: 939

1/19/14 9:28:38 AM#83
Originally posted by ArChWind
Originally posted by SlyLoK
Originally posted by cura
Originally posted by SlyLoK
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by ste2000
I can confirm what the dev said, the world is huge indeed

No it's not, it's an instanced zoning word, even within each faction area you are zoning between areas. You cannot go where you want within the world and to top it all it's made of many instances.

Vanguards world of Telon is huge not ESO lol.

Except Vanguard is also cut up into zones or in its case " chunks " and each time you cross one there is a pause for it to load. It is pretty quick being only a second or 2 though but it is still the same.

The world in TESO is huge.. It doesnt matter if there is a loading screen between each area. You can quickly lose hours of playtime by just roaming around in ES fashion in one of the early areas. In fact that is what happened to me.

And everything is made of pixels, lol. There is a difference between loading screens and seemless world where engine loads more data every so often. TES world is small in comparison to Vanguard's no matter how you will try to spin it, lol

Vanguard isnt seamless because it has the loading chunks. Seamless would be 100% no loading ever. In Vanguard the chunks are zone lines. Not seamless.

Your argument is senseless.

The fact is that every game including EQ2 still has chunks. The problem is that Vanguard used a engine that had to load a full chunk up front and not broken into very small pieces for background processing. Engines that are streaming are by your definition not seamless but yet I can show you that they are fully seamless to the limits of your hard drive. :)

SMH. Now the argument as changed about what seamless is. You lost. Get over it. Vanguard is not seamless.

  ArChWind

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/19/11
Posts: 486

1/19/14 11:13:44 AM#84
Originally posted by SlyLoK

 

SMH. Now the argument as changed about what seamless is. You lost. Get over it. Vanguard is not seamless.

No I didn't lose anything. Vanguard is seamless like any other gridded out world. Unreal engine just runs like crap when you start using area streaming. Unity is fairly good with the pro version for chunks but they have to be really small just like Hero Engines seamless linking which runs like crap if you grid a world.

There are real streaming engines but that's completely another discussion.

TESO is either gridded out or streaming even if it's still broken into all these little zones. Hopefully they do a better job than Vanguard.

The iron sphere turns.

  cura

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/04
Posts: 861

1/19/14 11:20:15 AM#85
Originally posted by ArChWind
Originally posted by SlyLoK

 

SMH. Now the argument as changed about what seamless is. You lost. Get over it. Vanguard is not seamless.

No I didn't lose anything. Vanguard is seamless like any other gridded out world. Unreal engine just runs like crap when you start using area streaming. Unity is fairly good with the pro version for chunks but they have to be really small just like Hero Engines seamless linking which runs like crap if you grid a world.

There are real streaming engines but that's completely another discussion.

TESO is either gridded out or streaming even if it's still broken into all these little zones. Hopefully they do a better job than Vanguard.

Dont waste your time, he has no idea about the thing but will litter this thread with more nonsense if not ignored.

  Jean-Luc_Picard

Elite Member

Joined: 1/10/13
Posts: 2672

There... are... four... lights!

1/19/14 11:21:46 AM#86

To address the topic title, no lead developer with half a brain woudl say his game is crap and his world is small...

Even if the world was the size of the post stamp, the lead dev would still say that it's huge.

Playing now: Archeage, WoW, Landmark, GW2

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  CazNeerg

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/04
Posts: 2220

"So, Lone Star, now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb." Dark Helmet

1/19/14 11:22:47 AM#87
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard

To address the topic title, no lead developer with half a brain woudl say his game is crap and his world is small...

Even if the world was the size of the post stamp, the lead dev would still say that it's huge.

Well, he could say it's not the size of the wave that's important, it's the motion of the ocean.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.

  Comaf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/13/10
Posts: 1131

I want an mmorpg where pvp matters, my enemies are not my race or class, and community matters.

1/19/14 11:23:47 AM#88
Originally posted by Mr.Kujo
Really depends on how character relates to the world. If character is faster than in Skyrim, and you get on a even faster mount map may feel 10x smaller than in older games...

Could use a bard, skald, and or minstrel.  But wait, all the classes are the same in each realm so....lol.

  Golelorn

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/23/03
Posts: 1056

1/19/14 11:28:13 AM#89
Originally posted by CrazKanuk
Originally posted by Mr.Kujo
Really depends on how character relates to the world. If character is faster than in Skyrim, and you get on a even faster mount map may feel 10x smaller than in older games...

I don't agree with this. Sounds like someone trying to dig up hate. This is like saying that the Earth shrinks as you speed up in your car. 

No, he said "feels". And if you walk, drive or fly to California from New York  the feel of the distance will certainly change depending on your travel mode.

  Entinerint

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/12
Posts: 716

1/19/14 3:12:42 PM#90

It fucking better be, the maps from TES games are TINY for an MMO.

16 square miles ain't shit.

  muthax

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/15/05
Posts: 582

1/19/14 3:21:12 PM#91
Originally posted by Fearum
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Tamanous
Originally posted by JJ82
 

 The game also uses invisible walls to block off the rest of the world while attempting to use old phrases like "open world".

So yeah, actually you can compare it to Asheons Call, because it really was an open world, where you could go anywhere with your character. Which you cant in TESO.

TESO is trying to be everything to everyone and lying their backsides off while doing it.

I really have to ask: Did you even play TESO past level 15?

 

 

or 10 for that matter

lol, I would say he is mad because he didn't get into beta yet.

That would explain the ignorant statements

  ArChWind

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/19/11
Posts: 486

1/19/14 5:16:37 PM#92


Originally posted by cura

Originally posted by ArChWind

Originally posted by SlyLoK

 
SMH. Now the argument as changed about what seamless is. You lost. Get over it. Vanguard is not seamless.
No I didn't lose anything. Vanguard is seamless like any other gridded out world. Unreal engine just runs like crap when you start using area streaming. Unity is fairly good with the pro version for chunks but they have to be really small just like Hero Engines seamless linking which runs like crap if you grid a world. There are real streaming engines but that's completely another discussion. TESO is either gridded out or streaming even if it's still broken into all these little zones. Hopefully they do a better job than Vanguard.
Dont waste your time, he has no idea about the thing but will litter this thread with more nonsense if not ignored.
Threw this together today. Kind of sums up how a lot of TES fans feel about this whole zone thing.

 http://youtu.be/_lV0mdCCgyA

The iron sphere turns.

  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2660

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

1/21/14 3:25:30 AM#93
Originally posted by Tamanous
Originally posted by JJ82
Originally posted by Tamanous
Originally posted by karmath

lol. Way to try and hype your game but shoot yourself in the foot.

Since we already know that each faction has its own lands that others cant enter, and there is three of them, the total area accessible per character is about the same area as Skyrim. Which is utterly inadequate for hosting thousands of players. The amount of instancing that will result will be horrid.

The game uses phasing.

 

I could also say the TESO world is nowhere as large as Asheron's Call but that is entirely pointless comparing to a game using phasing on a mega-server. There is a TON to talk about regarding TESO systems alone but evidently so many here know so little about this game they completely miss the major topics that SHOULD be talked about.

 The game also uses invisible walls to block off the rest of the world while attempting to use old phrases like "open world".

So yeah, actually you can compare it to Asheons Call, because it really was an open world, where you could go anywhere with your character. Which you cant in TESO.

TESO is trying to be everything to everyone and lying their backsides off while doing it.

I really have to ask: Did you even play TESO past level 15?

 

As I said before, you can't compare TESO to Asheron's Call. AC didn't have phasing to spread out the population. That isn't it's only benefit. The main reason why phasing exists is to support the story and quest mechanics by allowing the world to change around the player based upon their actions. AC had very little actual questing and story when it came out. It's 1 month (as best as Turbine could do to stick to the schedule anyway) content additions effectively added the story ... it wasn't build in. It actually worked because the world was so massive and it had individual servers with finite players on each server. It created a game dramatically different and effectively made the game an early attempt at a sandbox game (the developers long ago admitted their tech limited them to much to truly match their original vision).

 

Yes you could run for an hour trying to cross the world (at running speeds comparable to epic flying mounts in some games) and this gave a great feeling of openness but in reality it wasn't much more than a mob grinding game as those open areas supported no story and no quests. It targeted players loving exploration. TESO isn't entirely that game. It is something different. Perhaps that is what upsets you.

 

I still do not understand the argument here. Obviously you think a large world is only measured by being larger than previous games effectively unconnected to TESO and it must absolutely be seamless. Where did Zenimax promise this? Perhaps you are simply arguing that you hoped the game was different than it is? This is a fruitless argument. You will forever be disappointed wishing something is different than it is in reality. To continue to do so places you among the crushed souls who continue to complain Swtor isn't a sandbox even though the game has been out for over 2 years and isn't going to be anything else other than what it is.

 

I've read over the majority of your arguments it mostly is centered around TESO not being entirely open and seemless yet every TES game prior was little more than one single large zone with no ability to go elsewhere (minus player made content). Each zone in TESO past starter zones still offer this exact same game play yet you actually CAN go beyond those boarders. So what exactly is your argument again? Did I miss the memo saying you could install Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim on your pc and suddenly you can walk seamlessly between those areas?

 

All I am reading is that you (and several others) are upset because TESO isn't the game you envisioned. Well, at the start of each season I envision my home team the Edmonton Oilers winning the Stanley cup as they did when I was a kid but they are in last %$@&ing place right now so I choose to accept reality instead of smashing my head against the wall hoping for something that isn't reality.

Yes that bothers me because that too me is fun and was part of the appeal for all Elder Scrolls games.  I love huge open worlds with lots of things to explore.  Reason why Asheron's Call and Skyrim are my 2 favorite MMO's and RPG's of all time.  SO sue me for getting a little nostalgia and wanting something akin to the those.  I wouldn't even mind it if this was another game but being based on a beloved open world IP I presume to think open ended gameplay would be prevalent here as well.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  Spriggen

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/09/13
Posts: 20

1/21/14 7:29:56 PM#94
Let's just say that TESO puts most mmos to shame when it comes to scale
  remyburke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/03/04
Posts: 3000

I liked MMOs better when gamers didn't play them, and just geeks did.

1/21/14 7:32:56 PM#95
Ya how much of the land are players actually able to traverse?

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  Bruhza

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/09/12
Posts: 279

1/21/14 7:42:10 PM#96

Not trying to sound negative, but I would hope it would be larger considering it is an MMO. However, the 3 factions are going to severely limit to how big the world "Feels". Granted we can go to all of these places, but how many of them will we actually want to come back to? Not to mention the waypoint system that will let you surpass any area you have already been to plus a mount. You will be traversing the land faster than you can in even GW2.

 

In short, it seems as though this MMO is setup closer to a SWTOR type of leveling path than say a WoW/GW2 (Yes I feel that GW2 had a great leveling path, the world simply felt massive, granted the waypoints killed that feeling pretty quick.).

 

 

  alancode

Novice Member

Joined: 9/20/10
Posts: 137

1/21/14 7:48:22 PM#97
I'll buy it, play it, and see what I think. I have played every ESO game so far. Currently I'm digging FFXIV. I am looking forward to EQnext, ESO, Wildstar, Archeage, and a few others. Those I will defiantly buy regardless of what everyone says because I like to make my own opinion. 

(-_-)

  DAS1337

Novice Member

Joined: 11/28/07
Posts: 2378

1/21/14 11:29:17 PM#98
Originally posted by Margulis

In this interview the lead game dev Nick Konkle talks about a lot of things, and mentions that the game world is absolutely massive and bigger than the previous 3 Elder Scrolls games combined.  He also says that the map for Cyrodil is the same size as in Oblivion, not smaller at all.  When asked about freedom he also states the first few levels are more linear but it quickly opens up to freedom Elder Scrolls fans are familiar with.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80mHQNA45js

No, he didn't say that.  I listened to literally the whole thing.  One of the panel questioned whether it was bigger than all three combined and he did not say yes.  He did mention Cyrodil being about the same size as the Oblivion map.  He said he didn't know the exact numbers, but that the game was absolutely massive.

 

Please don't spread lies.

  gervaise1

Elite Member

Joined: 1/17/07
Posts: 1185

1/22/14 7:25:27 AM#99
Originally posted by Sleepyfish
Dark and Light had a large land mass. Wont really matter if the game is no good it can have a land mass the size of Saturn and no one will play it. If the game is great it can get by with an area the size of an island. 

Ah someone else who remembers DnL. It was truly vast. Even flying a dragon and going at 300mph you could go 20 minutes without seeing another mob. Forget the postage sized worlds like Skyrim and even EQ1. And yes if you wanted you could walk. 

Truly vast and almost totally empty except for a little bit around the starter area. Size is only a part of what makes a good game.

  IDontThinkSoNo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/22/13
Posts: 63

1/22/14 7:28:05 AM#100
Originally posted by Smikis
Originally posted by Eol-

well if you fast travel in Skyrim, the world starts looking a lot smaller. In ESO you cant fast travel to nearly the same extent.

As far as being linear, well, any game with overarching quests can seem linear if you just go do the quests as fast as you can. If you just head out and explore and do stuff, it wouldn't be linear at all. A lot of folks simply do the main quests in a game as fast as they can, they don't explore, they don't do side quests, and naturally the game seems linear to them and quickly they begin complaining that they 'ran out of content', when really they just bypassed much of it.

if you would have seen beta forums you would feel very silly right now , your statement wrong in more than one way

In the beta.  Been to the forums... through every single beta I've not been able to get to lvl 10 because I go off task and start exploring.

 

So... not really sure what you're babbling about.

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