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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » The Greed, OMG the Greed

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348 posts found
  gervaise1

Elite Member

Joined: 1/17/07
Posts: 1184

1/14/14 8:01:04 AM#241
Originally posted by simplius

where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so

if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops

Didn't EA say something like that just after it launched a couple of years ago? I thought they did so it must still be true. However just in case they didn't it is easy to deduce: 

Assume that SWTOR is a purely western only game - easy now its closed its Asiatic servers.

And whilst SWTOR does allow non-western players to play assume that there are so few of them that they can be ignored.

Ignore worldwide games - those that allow people to play even if they live outside of "the west" (except SWTOR see above).. 

Ignore console games - thngs like Battlefield. Got to do this since e.g. EA booked over $100M in premium sub revenue @ $50/year for v3 which equates to so 2-3M full year subs. 

Ignore PC browser games - as above some of these might be deemed western only and they give out big numbers e.g. Stronghold Kingdoms. In fact better make it PC games in general, games like Skyrim have pretty big co-op numbers on Steam, in the hundreds of thousands,  so to avoid any ambiguity ignore them.

Ignore mobile - well obviously yeah?

If not excluded above assume that any game that hasn't published numbers is small or - if it has and might be considered western e.g. CloneWars (10M) the number has fallen away.  

And then either:

a)  Assume that EA's statement last May that it had just under 500k and 1.7M f2p accounts is still valid or

b) Assume that people who were at the community event in early November understood what Eric M (community manager) was talking about when he, reportedly, gave out 10M and 1M numbers. Now I know the 10M number has been called crap but if you think this might call into doubt the validity of the 1M number, as it has the same source, just fall back on the just under 500k number. And I know that people have said that the 1M will be a mix of f2p and sub but if you feel there may be more f2p than subs - again just fall back on the May numbers. OK?

And c) Assume that SWTOR has been totally unaffected by the launch of all new Christmas games, XBox1 and PS4 and hence numbers have not declined.

Which makes SWTOR number 1. 

Now because number 1 is a bit hard to swallow split WoW into two games, one western, one not western. Just WoW however - I know games like CloneWars (10M+) tend to be thought of as western but stick to the assumptions. This is crucial. 

Roll of the drums: SWTOR is the number 2 western mmo.

  DaRoamer

Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 252

1/14/14 9:11:07 AM#242
Originally posted by simplius

where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so

if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops

Right here:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/

"When free-to-play launched in November, it "blew all expectations out of the water," said Ohlen. Subscriptions started going up again. Concurrent players on the servers went way up. Both of those statistics continue to rise. As Ohlen put it, TOR is the second biggest subscription MMORPG in the western world"

That's one piece of evidence.  After that they announced they had over 500k subs.  Then there was the quote they had over 1 million active users.  If you look at Xfire you'll see SWTOR is 3rd behind WoW and GW2 in hours which would also put it at second biggest subscription MMO since GW2 doesn't have a sub.  Then there was my rough player count which showed around 100k people online on Sunday.

You need to face the facts that SWTOR is quite successful at the moment.  No one says you can't hate the game and keep posting the same hate here day after day but your personally feelings don't change the truth of the matter.

  gervaise1

Elite Member

Joined: 1/17/07
Posts: 1184

1/14/14 9:34:56 AM#243
Originally posted by DaRoamer
Originally posted by simplius

where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so

if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops

Right here:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/

"When free-to-play launched in November, it "blew all expectations out of the water," said Ohlen. Subscriptions started going up again. Concurrent players on the servers went way up. Both of those statistics continue to rise. As Ohlen put it, TOR is the second biggest subscription MMORPG in the western world"

That's one piece of evidence.  After that they announced they had over 500k subs.  Then there was the quote they had over 1 million active users.  If you look at Xfire you'll see SWTOR is 3rd behind WoW and GW2 in hours which would also put it at second biggest subscription MMO since GW2 doesn't have a sub.  Then there was my rough player count which showed around 100k people online on Sunday.

You need to face the facts that SWTOR is quite successful at the moment.  No one says you can't hate the game and keep posting the same hate here day after day but your personally feelings don't change the truth of the matter.

I thought they said it just after launch as well - but there you have it!

And based on what Olsen said we can even bring the non-western players back into the fold as well. Of course he was still excluding console games etc. etc. and so on but no problem. with the right assumptions it is fine.

Small concern though with the way it reads. "Second largest subscription mmo ever". Suggests he is talking about an all time chart. So "EQ1 would be the third highest subscription mmo ever" (I guess). And Titanic is the second highest grossing film. 

I can see how that would work. 

  simplius

Novice Member

Joined: 12/12/12
Posts: 978

1/15/14 4:03:14 AM#244
Originally posted by DaRoamer
Originally posted by simplius

where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so

if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops

Right here:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/

"When free-to-play launched in November, it "blew all expectations out of the water," said Ohlen. Subscriptions started going up again. Concurrent players on the servers went way up. Both of those statistics continue to rise. As Ohlen put it, TOR is the second biggest subscription MMORPG in the western world"

That's one piece of evidence.  After that they announced they had over 500k subs.  Then there was the quote they had over 1 million active users.  If you look at Xfire you'll see SWTOR is 3rd behind WoW and GW2 in hours which would also put it at second biggest subscription MMO since GW2 doesn't have a sub.  Then there was my rough player count which showed around 100k people online on Sunday.

You need to face the facts that SWTOR is quite successful at the moment.  No one says you can't hate the game and keep posting the same hate here day after day but your personally feelings don't change the truth of the matter.

looool, why didnt they say anything, when they had 1,9 mio subs? because they didnt need the PR back then

and, because , they knew, that they wouldnt keep that many players

suddenly, when 3/4 of the playerbase have left, Things are looking rosy?

talk about a convenient miracle

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 214

1/15/14 7:23:39 AM#245
Originally posted by simplius
Originally posted by DaRoamer
Originally posted by simplius

where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so

if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops

Right here:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/

"When free-to-play launched in November, it "blew all expectations out of the water," said Ohlen. Subscriptions started going up again. Concurrent players on the servers went way up. Both of those statistics continue to rise. As Ohlen put it, TOR is the second biggest subscription MMORPG in the western world"

That's one piece of evidence.  After that they announced they had over 500k subs.  Then there was the quote they had over 1 million active users.  If you look at Xfire you'll see SWTOR is 3rd behind WoW and GW2 in hours which would also put it at second biggest subscription MMO since GW2 doesn't have a sub.  Then there was my rough player count which showed around 100k people online on Sunday.

You need to face the facts that SWTOR is quite successful at the moment.  No one says you can't hate the game and keep posting the same hate here day after day but your personally feelings don't change the truth of the matter.

looool, why didnt they say anything, when they had 1,9 mio subs? because they didnt need the PR back then

and, because , they knew, that they wouldnt keep that many players

suddenly, when 3/4 of the playerbase have left, Things are looking rosy?

talk about a convenient miracle

as everyone has told you over a million times by now.  It's F2P its no longer about subs anymore its about total profit and as they have said many many times the total profit is far above what it was when they had over 1 million subs. 

 

Do you think by making up lies SWTOR will start to fail?  Because guess what? its not.  

  simplius

Novice Member

Joined: 12/12/12
Posts: 978

1/15/14 7:29:56 AM#246

okay, TODAY: roughly 1 mio customers

AT LAUNCH:  roughly 2,8 mio customers

1 mio vs 1,8 mio,,which one has the most potential?

two things keep swtor afloat:

EAs deal with disney

and the ASTRONOMICAL budget

they , pretty much , HAVE to keep it alive

and do note: we didnt even want swtor , to shut down

we just wanted something better

competition is always good for the market

monopoly is bad

 

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10426

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

1/15/14 7:47:00 AM#247


Originally posted by simplius
okay, TODAY: roughly 1 mio customers

AT LAUNCH:  roughly 2,8 mio customers

1 mio vs 1,8 mio,,which one has the most potential?

two things keep swtor afloat:

EAs deal with disney

and the ASTRONOMICAL budget

they , pretty much , HAVE to keep it alive

and do note: we didnt even want swtor , to shut down

we just wanted something better

competition is always good for the market

monopoly is bad

 




I find your posts amusing. You should keep it up.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10426

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

1/15/14 7:49:00 AM#248


Originally posted by bobdole1979

Originally posted by simplius

Originally posted by DaRoamer

Originally posted by simplius where did BW claim, to be nr 2? or EA? if they havent claimed it, theyre VERY far, from being so if they WERE nr 2, they would be yelling it from the rooftops
Right here: http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/ "When free-to-play launched in November, it "blew all expectations out of the water," said Ohlen. Subscriptions started going up again. Concurrent players on the servers went way up. Both of those statistics continue to rise. As Ohlen put it, TOR is the second biggest subscription MMORPG in the western world" That's one piece of evidence.  After that they announced they had over 500k subs.  Then there was the quote they had over 1 million active users.  If you look at Xfire you'll see SWTOR is 3rd behind WoW and GW2 in hours which would also put it at second biggest subscription MMO since GW2 doesn't have a sub.  Then there was my rough player count which showed around 100k people online on Sunday. You need to face the facts that SWTOR is quite successful at the moment.  No one says you can't hate the game and keep posting the same hate here day after day but your personally feelings don't change the truth of the matter.
looool, why didnt they say anything, when they had 1,9 mio subs? because they didnt need the PR back then and, because , they knew, that they wouldnt keep that many players suddenly, when 3/4 of the playerbase have left, Things are looking rosy? talk about a convenient miracle
as everyone has told you over a million times by now.  It's F2P its no longer about subs anymore its about total profit and as they have said many many times the total profit is far above what it was when they had over 1 million subs. 

 

Do you think by making up lies SWTOR will start to fail?  Because guess what? its not.  




Let's not get crazy here. It most certainly is about subs. It's just that it's not only about subs. There are people who prefer to sub to a game, people who prefer to not sub to a game, and people who want to do a little of both. SWToR is capturing all of those people by having a F2P system that incorporates subscriptions, premium cash shop purchases and basic cash shop purchases.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  Kicksave321

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/13
Posts: 309

1/15/14 8:38:16 AM#249
Originally posted by simplius

okay, TODAY: roughly 1 mio customers

AT LAUNCH:  roughly 2,8 mio customers

1 mio vs 1,8 mio,,which one has the most potential?

two things keep swtor afloat:

EAs deal with disney

and the ASTRONOMICAL budget

they , pretty much , HAVE to keep it alive

and do note: we didnt even want swtor , to shut down

we just wanted something better

competition is always good for the market

monopoly is bad

 

Every single person on this site knows you have never and will never provide facts or links to back up your rants. 

 

So on on that note please provide a link that backs up anything you said here, while your at it provide links for anything you have ever said.  

  mstrsrevati

Novice Member

Joined: 11/01/06
Posts: 100

"The Force is like duct tape it has a light side and a dark side and holds everything together" :P

1/15/14 9:03:49 AM#250
Being a huge Star Wars fan and the fact that I played Star Wars Galaxies from day one until they launched their doom which was the new player addition.  That killed the best game ever.  Anyway, as soon as SWTOR was ready to launch I was buying my account, not just a normal account but the limited addition to get the special bike and other nifty things.  After about 6months of playing I left the game because I realized this game wasn't going to be like the other at all.  The community was different, there was no housing, no real player role play just storyline, and being a crafter I hated their crafting system.  So I moved on and gave away what I could to the few people I made friends with.  I was going to try going back but after reading all of this I don't think I'll bother.  But I am curious to ask if I had a sith character and I logged in on that account would i be able to play it? or would she be deleted already? I wasn't going to get into a sub again until I decided whether I was going to stay or not, but if I can't play my sith then I don't see the point of doing the download.  Anyone have any idea whether I'd be able to play her or not? Thanks.

  Psion33

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/13
Posts: 257

1/15/14 9:08:26 AM#251

*Slaps the wrist of the kid asking for a handout.*

 

Moving on....

  Mors.Magne

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/02/07
Posts: 1417

1/15/14 9:09:32 AM#252

If a game is good, I'll pay for it regardless of payment system.

 

SWTOR is a s.h.i.t. game - end of. The NPC AI is one of the worst I have ever seen. I am bored of seeing the NPC's repetative idle animations while I slaughter their friends in the same way, regardless of what method I am 'choosing'.

 

Warhammer Quest on iPad has DLC, and every bit of it has been well worth purchasing.

  DaRoamer

Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 252

1/15/14 9:49:35 AM#253
Originally posted by simplius

okay, TODAY: roughly 1 mio customers

AT LAUNCH:  roughly 2,8 mio customers

1 mio vs 1,8 mio,,which one has the most potential?

two things keep swtor afloat:

EAs deal with disney

and the ASTRONOMICAL budget

they , pretty much , HAVE to keep it alive

and do note: we didnt even want swtor , to shut down

we just wanted something better

competition is always good for the market

monopoly is bad

 

Please provide some proof of this argument.

  ktanner3

Master

Joined: 3/19/06
Posts: 4144

Trolls will be ignored

1/15/14 10:48:46 AM#254
To say that any company HAS to keep a game going shows a complete lack of understanding about how business works. No company keeps funding a product that isn't making money.To think EA would continue to fund an MMO that loses money is just.....weird.

Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5575

1/15/14 12:45:57 PM#255
Originally posted by laresloci
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Torvaldr

Don't be cheap. Pay some money to fund the game. Why are p2p gamers so cheap?  Spend $15 and unlock some stuff and then you don't have to pay it again. Or spend $15 a month and do a sub. Threads where people whine about money are really getting annoying.

But you forget some people are entitled to everything for free.  And when they don't get what they think they are entitled to they make threads like this.  

Personally if I ever got to point in my life were I posted on a website whining a video game is not free enough is the day I stop playing video games.  

This whole sense of entitlement these days bugs the crap out of me. Like you know there's people at the other end of this game that create and make it possible for people to play it. That need to eat too.

When I commented on this I hadn't yet played the game. That has bothered me since then. I felt like I should play it so I could gain my own perspective. I still feel the same way in general that complaining about greed and money is annoying. Really if you like and want to play a game, then fund it, and if not then don't complain. If it's that bad, then move on.

With that said, now having played it for a bit, I can understand how the OP would be put off. Bioware constantly nags and whines for money in the game. They constantly remind you how they're purposefully giving you a crappier game experience unless you pay. It's as obnoxious as the OP's post to me. It makes me not want to spend money with them.

I don't feel the need to pay yet (I'm still really low level though). That is the game hasn't put me in a place where not paying is very uncomfortable, but it is close. The lack of bank storage and the very limited inventory likely means I'll skip crafting in the game. I seem able to enjoy the story well enough and gain decent enough gear that I can play through the game without having to spend money, at least so far.

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  Nanfoodle

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3367

1/15/14 12:49:45 PM#256
Originally posted by Morgaren

I was coming back to the game, lost my account info, was making a new account, everything's good.

Made a new toon, couldn't roll a sith, had to pay for that or unlock in in legacy.....ok, that's cool too, gotta make money somehow, saw new races, that's interesting.

So then I am playing, was enjoying it, done the story before but you know, was enjoying it all the same. So I got some new moves, was telling myself "I want to put that rush ability above my builder, cause it will make for easier clicking." cause I am a clicker.

 

Then it came up, I HAD TO PURCHASE THE ABILITY TO HAVE EXTRA HOTBARS.

so I uninstalled the game, came here to moan, and warn people talk about how horrible the cash shop is in the game, well here is a prime example.

 

Recover your account and you will have your hotbars. You were playing a free account that has no CD key attached too the account. Sub too the game and you get everything, You think they running a charity? They need to make money somehow. Hand out everything for free and they close their doors. 

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10426

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

1/15/14 12:54:49 PM#257


Originally posted by Nanfoodle

Originally posted by Morgaren I was coming back to the game, lost my account info, was making a new account, everything's good. Made a new toon, couldn't roll a sith, had to pay for that or unlock in in legacy.....ok, that's cool too, gotta make money somehow, saw new races, that's interesting. So then I am playing, was enjoying it, done the story before but you know, was enjoying it all the same. So I got some new moves, was telling myself "I want to put that rush ability above my builder, cause it will make for easier clicking." cause I am a clicker.   Then it came up, I HAD TO PURCHASE THE ABILITY TO HAVE EXTRA HOTBARS. so I uninstalled the game, came here to moan, and warn people talk about how horrible the cash shop is in the game, well here is a prime example.  
Recover your account and you will have your hotbars. You were playing a free account that has no CD key attached too the account. Sub too the game and you get everything, You think they running a charity? They need to make money somehow. Hand out everything for free and they close their doors. 



People have already tried to explain this. The fact that they locked themselves out of their own account seems kind of lost on them.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  Talonsin

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 7/19/06
Posts: 1032

1/15/14 12:55:25 PM#258

While I do agree that charging for actionbars is about the greediest thing I have ever seen, I dont have an issue with most of the other F2P restrictions in the game since there is a way to get around most of them.  I like the storylines and feel paying for a month or two of playtime is worth it.  Thats $30 for a game you can play unlimited for 60 days.  By that time you should have a level 55 toon who can farm Makeb or Ilum for comms and credits.  I just run around Ilum for an hour and make $100k in credits and I'm not even trying to max my money making.  After that, you can buy whatever you want from the auction house.  Cartel packs are only $250k each and there are plenty of unlocks for sale way below $100k there.  That means for $30 you can enjoy just about everything in the game.

 

 

  BadOrb

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/11/13
Posts: 720

1/15/14 12:58:29 PM#259
Originally posted by mstrsrevati
Being a huge Star Wars fan and the fact that I played Star Wars Galaxies from day one until they launched their doom which was the new player addition.  That killed the best game ever.  Anyway, as soon as SWTOR was ready to launch I was buying my account, not just a normal account but the limited addition to get the special bike and other nifty things.  After about 6months of playing I left the game because I realized this game wasn't going to be like the other at all.  The community was different, there was no housing, no real player role play just storyline, and being a crafter I hated their crafting system.  So I moved on and gave away what I could to the few people I made friends with.  I was going to try going back but after reading all of this I don't think I'll bother.  But I am curious to ask if I had a sith character and I logged in on that account would i be able to play it? or would she be deleted already? I wasn't going to get into a sub again until I decided whether I was going to stay or not, but if I can't play my sith then I don't see the point of doing the download.  Anyone have any idea whether I'd be able to play her or not? Thanks.

I wouldn't take notice of some forum posts in this thread , it's not all doom and gloom I assure you. Now to your question , no characters have been deleted at all ever. So yes you will be able to play on her , the only thing that might have happened to her though is she may have been moved to another server , possibly loosing her name and/or lost her name recently due to freeing up some names. Other than that you will be a preferred player and have various restrictions , unless you subb. You will have 4 skill bars though as a preferred player like you did 6 months after launch. You have a credit cap of 350 k as a preferred too.

Cheers,

BadOrb.

PSO 4 years , EQOA 4 months , PSU 7 years , SWTOR launch ongoing.
"SWG was not fun. Let it go buddy." quote from iiNoSkillzii 10/18/13
The original propoganda pixie dust villain :[]

  bobdole1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/09
Posts: 214

1/15/14 1:03:38 PM#260
Originally posted by DaRoamer
Originally posted by simplius

okay, TODAY: roughly 1 mio customers

AT LAUNCH:  roughly 2,8 mio customers

1 mio vs 1,8 mio,,which one has the most potential?

two things keep swtor afloat:

EAs deal with disney

and the ASTRONOMICAL budget

they , pretty much , HAVE to keep it alive

and do note: we didnt even want swtor , to shut down

we just wanted something better

competition is always good for the market

monopoly is bad

 

Please provide some proof of this argument.

Simplus will never ever give any proof for any of his statements.  

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