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WildStar

WildStar 

General Discussion  » Meaningful PVP?

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42 posts found
  Romulan78

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/08/06
Posts: 89

 
OP  11/21/13 8:11:23 PM#1

Not an attack guys but I am looking at some of the new games coming out and this caught my eye due to having a pvp server for those of us that enjoy full world pvp.

The concern I have and question is what penatly do you suffer for losing in pvp? I realize that unfortunately this is not a drop all your loot when you die like UO, darkfall etc but if there is no penalty and reward for pvp then why even do it?

Will this be another "die and wait a few seconds to get back into battle, no harm done" or will there be some form of real loss and gain making it meaningful pvp?


Marksman/Bladedancer/Saboteur

  Daessar

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 197

11/21/13 10:08:36 PM#2
Originally posted by Romulan78

Not an attack guys but I am looking at some of the new games coming out and this caught my eye due to having a pvp server for those of us that enjoy full world pvp.

The concern I have and question is what penatly do you suffer for losing in pvp? I realize that unfortunately this is not a drop all your loot when you die like UO, darkfall etc but if there is no penalty and reward for pvp then why even do it?

Will this be another "die and wait a few seconds to get back into battle, no harm done" or will there be some form of real loss and gain making it meaningful pvp?

 

This is another one of those "too vague" posts, you gave an example of what it wont be ( drop all your loot ), but you didn't give an example of the types of "meaningfull losses and gains" that you would be happy about. Just tossing out the word meaningful and expecting everyone to know exactly what you want from that, is not realistic.

You specifically pointed to open world Pvp, in the open world when you die, there is gear deterioration so you will need to repair, and alternatively you can rez on the spot once every 30min, which will cost you a gold fee and a short rez sickness.

There are no open world pvp objectives at launch, and there are no "rewards", although they have yet to say if there will be something like "honor points" in Wow. Now for battlegrounds, and warplots, I imagine it will be the standard rez at graveyard and run back to battle, so I dont believe there will be big penalties for those, and the rewards will be standard pvp currency.

  itsTort

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/11
Posts: 127

11/21/13 11:03:41 PM#3
Not too sure what you mean by 'meaningful pvp'. I'm sure it will be like every other MMO that has PvP though. The meaning for PvP will likely be to let the player have fun, while they are not doing PvE.
  rensta

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/08
Posts: 241

"Girlfriends come and go but epic items are soulbound"

11/21/13 11:12:58 PM#4

OMG there will be an open world pvp server? suddenly I am once again interested :)  

I wonder how will a class like an explorer function in a pvp server? 


Basically clicking away text windows ruins every MMO, try to have fun instead of rushing things. Without story and lore all there is left is a bunch of mechanics.
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  Romulan78

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/08/06
Posts: 89

 
OP  11/22/13 12:00:23 PM#5

Just to clarify what is meant by meaninful pvp:

Consequences for winning or losing, you lose you feel it, similar to eve where you lose your ship, or UO where you get your body looted and lose items in your possesion, I cant stand games where you lose and you are back in the battle with no lose whatsover.


Marksman/Bladedancer/Saboteur

  EinsamWulf

Novice Member

Joined: 12/30/07
Posts: 70

11/22/13 1:17:46 PM#6
I can't say for sure but I am unaware of any heavy consequences to the player from death. Perhaps suffering a defeat in Warplot PvP could be costly due to loosing bosses captured from end game raids and buildings that had to be paid for. I have no idea of this is true so I'm just speculating.

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  Sinsai

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/13/07
Posts: 217

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
-Benjamin Franklin

11/22/13 1:25:25 PM#7
Originally posted by rensta

OMG there will be an open world pvp server? suddenly I am once again interested :)  

I wonder how will a class like an explorer function in a pvp server? 

Explorer isn't a Class, it's a Path that can be part of any Class.

Paths are Play Styles you choose and you gain rewards/specific quests/items for them.

Here's a link that better explains it:

http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/the-game/paths/

  GlacianNex

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/13/03
Posts: 595

11/22/13 1:27:45 PM#8

Based on my open world pvp play at PAX it is pretty much wait for 15 seconds and restart at the town. 

I can't see any type of real penalty where you can be killing a monster and then all of the sudden you get jumped by 3 players (no choice, no way to escape, no way to win situation). What you want is just not main stream and in most cases people will get pissed off. 

WildStar is really aiming at a main stream MMO gamer - if you want something exquisite like full loot on death, permadeath, heavy loss penelity this is not it. That said PvP in this is REALLY REALY fun, fights last a decent amount of time. Some open world 1 v 1 PvP fights took 2 - 4 minutes to finish yet they feel very fast paced and active.

  Raventree

Novice Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 455

It is a double pleasure to gank the ganker.
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11/22/13 1:27:51 PM#9
Originally posted by Romulan78

Just to clarify what is meant by meaninful pvp:

Consequences for winning or losing, you lose you feel it, similar to eve where you lose your ship, or UO where you get your body looted and lose items in your possesion, I cant stand games where you lose and you are back in the battle with no lose whatsover.

By this definition, all PVP is meaningful, at least to me.  You always suffer some sort of loss, whether it is some sort of draconian rez penalty or something as minor as being pissed off because you were killed and you know some smug jerk is smiling about it and you have to run all the way back to your corpse.  If you think that PVP has to have a more harsh penalty to be truly meaningful, then you might be interested in something like Eve Online, where you can suffer some excruciating losses through PVP.  Some of the stories I have read have discouraged me from playing Eve, simply because of the potential severity of the loss.

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  wangkom

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/04/05
Posts: 118

11/22/13 1:42:44 PM#10
There is no such thing as meaningful pvp, pvp is stupid, its for people who wants to gank up on someone, then kill him and of course then its time to shit talk a bunch. this is how pvp is now adays.
  sgel

Elite Member

Joined: 7/11/08
Posts: 962

I've got this creature on my back.. it just wont let go.

11/22/13 1:47:26 PM#11

The only game with meaningful PvP is EvE Online.

It has ruined my enjoyment of  PVP in every other game I've tried.

"This creature softened my heart of stone. She died and with her died my last warm feelings for humanity." - Joseph Stalin

  Aison2

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/11/05
Posts: 600

11/22/13 1:49:31 PM#12
I hate this phrase "meaningful pvp". Nothing you do in a game matters. All you end up with is more grind as punishment and less actual pvp. Just more time wasted with something you didn't want to do in the first place.

Pi*1337/100 = 42

  Daessar

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 197

11/22/13 2:24:38 PM#13

What I hate is when people whine about Pvp but then they go ahead and roll on a Pvp server, your own fault, thats what the server was designed for, if you are looking for "safe" Pvp, then shut your face and go to a PvE server and do instanced Pvp.

Obviously there are games where a more harsh death penalty works, and all players know this going into the game, and yet they still choose to participate, even with the knowledge they may lose items or w/e upon death. I'm not sure how this would work in a big MMO, as I have not heard of one that has harsh penalties, but in the end the result comes out the same in either game, so it would be interesting to test out on a Pvp server.

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 18726

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

11/22/13 2:46:30 PM#14
Originally posted by Romulan78

Just to clarify what is meant by meaninful pvp:

Consequences for winning or losing, you lose you feel it, similar to eve where you lose your ship, or UO where you get your body looted and lose items in your possesion, I cant stand games where you lose and you are back in the battle with no lose whatsover.

It is more likely this title will go the WOW route because at its heart there's little indication they are trying to do things much differently than a standard theme park MMO.

 

"In these forums 'honest' seems to be a symonym for 'hates the game just like I do'" - ohioastro
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
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  BuddyDude

Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 38

11/23/13 12:43:51 AM#15
Originally posted by wangkom
There is no such thing as meaningful pvp, pvp is stupid, its for people who wants to gank up on someone, then kill him and of course then its time to shit talk a bunch. this is how pvp is now adays.

 

I agree, things used to be different but now it's all about teabagging and spawn camping.  MMO pvp is all about epeen and bullying. 

  Romulan78

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/08/06
Posts: 89

 
OP  12/12/13 9:04:46 PM#16

Thanks all for the replies.

Ya, not really interested in another themepark low consequence to pvp type game, heading back to Eve till a game comes out that is not a WOW clone.


Marksman/Bladedancer/Saboteur

  Dauntis

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 10/21/09
Posts: 403

12/12/13 9:31:00 PM#17
They need real meaningful PvP. A couple of guys show up at your house and beat the hell out of you with baseball bats, after the third time they destroy your computer, ten times they just put two in the back of your head. That's right, PvP should be meaningful, I mean if you are going to go hardcore, go full hardcore.

I would like to give an opinion on this post, but if I agree I will offend people who disagree. While if I disagree my comment will be seen as inflammatory. Either way I will get banned by this site full of the most delicate flowers in online gaming. Ban people for giving honest opinions... beautiful. Unfortunately I still like the articles.

  Realbigdeal

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/08
Posts: 1646

12/12/13 9:32:59 PM#18
Originally posted by sgel

The only game with meaningful PvP is EvE Online.

It has ruined my enjoyment of  PVP in every other game I've tried.

Me too. I never tried eve, but the pvp in DF is as harsh as in eve so you can count me in. I can't go back playing mmo's with no meaningful pvp.

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  Robokapp

Elite Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4476

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

12/12/13 9:38:43 PM#19
Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Originally posted by sgel

The only game with meaningful PvP is EvE Online.

It has ruined my enjoyment of  PVP in every other game I've tried.

Me too. I never tried eve, but the pvp in DF is as harsh as in eve so you can count me in. I can't go back playing mmo's with no meaningful pvp.

not all eve pvp is meaninful. there's tons of 'drunken frigate roams'....some pvp is fun, some pvp is necesary, some pvp is meaninful. flipping the timer on system XYZ-WT for the 6h time may be necesary but in the long run not meaningful. intercepting half of the enemy supercapital fleet in low sec...is fun and meaningful but not necesary...

  DeniZg

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/29/12
Posts: 485

12/13/13 5:51:03 AM#20
Originally posted by Romulan78

Thanks all for the replies.

Ya, not really interested in another themepark low consequence to pvp type game, heading back to Eve till a game comes out that is not a WOW clone.

OP, playing games in general is not meaningful. There are no consequences which translate into real life (unless you count losing job or friends/family because of unhealthy gaming habits). So why do it?

FPS games such as Battlefield also don't have "meaningful PVP" since there are no consequences to losing, but they are still fun, have progression and millions of people play them.

 

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