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Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn

Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn 

General Discussion  » Videos showing current client/server sync issues (skill delay)

6 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 » Search
106 posts found
  koboldfodder

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/18/04
Posts: 359

10/05/13 9:31:13 PM#41

The delay is a problem on big mobs with huge AOE circles.  Because you run kind of slow, it takes a while to get out of the area.  That split second may not mean much on a lesser mob, but on a boss or raid fight it can mean the difference between winning or dying.

 

While you can use it to your advantage by running in a split second earlier, that's not that big of an advantage.  So you get there a split second earlier, bid deal.  It is a lot more important getting out of the circle than getting back in after the attack is over.

 

It's a well know delay, everyone has it and you will see it in every fight from level 1 to level 50.

  Homitu

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/01/09
Posts: 2026

10/05/13 9:32:20 PM#42

It's funny how you passively adapt to these issues, possibly without even realizing it.  I'm pretty sure I always start running before my mount cast time finishes, and I've been doing so for weeks.  On an encounter like Demon Wall, I stand on the outside in preparation for when the middle gets covered in ooze; but I've grown accustomed to running back into the middle well before the ooze actually disappears on my screen in order to get a head start on avoiding the incoming side ooze.  So my character appears to be retardedly standing in the middle of the black stuff, but I know I'm safe because the game doesn't register me there yet.  This works without fail, and I learned to do this completely subconsciously, surely after lots of repetition and experience.  

I think it's safe to conclude that anyone who claims the combat latency is fine is either A) like me above and just got so subconsciously used to it that perhaps they didn't even notice it was happening (although I will say I definitely did notice it was happening, very consciously in the case of dozens of circumstances where I took damage while clearly not being anywhere near an aoe targetted area), or B) are just so slow and bad that they can't concretely feel the impact of a 300ms delay.  

  Ppiper

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/13
Posts: 649

10/05/13 9:41:32 PM#43
Originally posted by chakalaka
[mod edit]

there is no reason to accept this crap! Why should I have to adapt to a coding failure? Enlighten me. This game is fail 101, and already dead in the water. I've never played a game where the mechanics beat me,  not the content. Fool me once with FF XI, fool me twice with FFXIV, never again will I waste money on SE. I need a shower.

  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 9:53:31 PM#44
Originally posted by Homitu

 On an encounter like Demon Wall, I stand on the outside in preparation for when the middle gets covered in ooze; but I've grown accustomed to running back into the middle well before the ooze actually disappears on my screen in order to get a head start on avoiding the incoming side ooze.

While the rest of your post is true, I sort of wonder why you use an example of a fight where you are starting in a safe area is evidence of lag.

I mean....it's just good sense to start on the sides vs. Demon Wall regardless of lag.

Overall, unless you really have a lot of lag - whatever delay there is on positioning is easily adjusted to.  We can argue all day as to whether or not we should have to adjust, but the fact is simple.  This 300ms position check is real and it's going no where.

Get used to it.  I don't know what I can say to you if you really have that much trouble staying on top of your battle awareness.

  Pelagato

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/10/07
Posts: 655

Beware of Felidae on the hunt.

10/05/13 10:00:12 PM#45

Its not a bug... Is broken on purpose.

or

SE simply doesnt have the skill to fix it.

  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 10:08:19 PM#46
Originally posted by Pelagato

Its not a bug... Is broken on purpose.

or

SE simply doesnt have the skill to fix it.

Honestly, I think its neither.  SE has chronically had server load issues since the beginning of launch.

Yoshi has been quoted saying that there is no inventory sort function because of concern about server load.  Inventory sorting is a concern on server load.  If that's an potential issue, what the heck do you think increasing position checks would do?

  Purutzil

Elite Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2825

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

10/05/13 10:10:15 PM#47

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

  Ppiper

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/13
Posts: 649

10/05/13 10:12:35 PM#48
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Homitu

 On an encounter like Demon Wall, I stand on the outside in preparation for when the middle gets covered in ooze; but I've grown accustomed to running back into the middle well before the ooze actually disappears on my screen in order to get a head start on avoiding the incoming side ooze.

While the rest of your post is true, I sort of wonder why you use an example of a fight where you are starting in a safe area is evidence of lag.

I mean....it's just good sense to start on the sides vs. Demon Wall regardless of lag.

Overall, unless you really have a lot of lag - whatever delay there is on positioning is easily adjusted to.  We can argue all day as to whether or not we should have to adjust, but the fact is simple.  This 300ms position check is real and it's going no where.

Get used to it.  I don't know what I can say to you if you really have that much trouble staying on top of your battle awareness.

this is a game using idiotic coding or an ineptitude to correct it's problems and relying on its users to compensate for it? Are you fucking kidding with me? You're ok with idiocricy?

  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 10:13:46 PM#49
Originally posted by Purutzil

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

Does everyone really believe that the timing to dodge AoEs doesn't account for 300ms position lag?

Everything is so easily dodged if you execute things properly, you have well over half a second more than what's needed.

  Ppiper

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/13
Posts: 649

10/05/13 10:21:13 PM#50
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Purutzil

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

Does everyone really believe that the timing to dodge AoEs doesn't account for 300ms position lag?

Everything is so easily dodged if you execute things properly, you have well over half a second more than what's needed.

you are the complete apologist, you'll say anything to defend this wretched train wreck of a game. It's wonderful that you can telepathically anticipate the 300 ms deviation in a game. I always assumed a game played fair, not using it's poorly developed code as an enticement for the twitch generation. How is this fun?

  Asm0deus

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/10
Posts: 782

10/05/13 10:23:06 PM#51

It is  a bug due to bad coding. Link

Those of you saying it is not a bug and you all just suck and need to learn "battle awareness or you need to learn how run out of the red or you need to adapt to the timing" please note the forums it is under:

case: Coolermaster HAF932
PSU: Antec EA 750watt
RAM: 2x2g G-SKILL DDR3-1600mhz 9-9-9-24
Mb:Gigabyte GA-P55-UD4P
CPU: i5-750 @4ghz
GPU: gtx msi N760 TF 2GD5/OC
cooling: Noctua NH-D14
storage: seagate 600 240GB SSD, 500GB x7200rpm HDD

  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 10:25:29 PM#52
Originally posted by Ppiper
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Purutzil

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

Does everyone really believe that the timing to dodge AoEs doesn't account for 300ms position lag?

Everything is so easily dodged if you execute things properly, you have well over half a second more than what's needed.

you are the complete apologist, you'll say anything to defend this wretched train wreck of a game. It's wonderful that you can telepathically anticipate the 300 ms deviation in a game. I always assumed a game played fair, not using it's poorly developed code as an enticement for the twitch generation. How is this fun?

Look, you need to stop because you are one of the biggest know nothing trolls on the FFXIV forums.  PiedPiper, am I correct?

It's an honest question.  I'm not professional developer but if I knew there would be 300ms positional lag as a worst case scenario, I think I'd account for 300ms when Im setting up the timing to dodge AoE.  If that suddenly went away, I'd trim down the allowance accordingly.

Lag is lag.  People that have difficulty lag well beyond the 300 ms worst cast scenario.  I imagine they'd STILL have problems if this was changed.

The issues are duty finder stress, lag spikes need to be alleviated.  The fact that there is no Euro data center for the Euro worlds also makes no sense.

This?  Doesn't even make the top 5 list.

  Asm0deus

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/10
Posts: 782

10/05/13 10:27:43 PM#53
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Ppiper
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Purutzil

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

Does everyone really believe that the timing to dodge AoEs doesn't account for 300ms position lag?

Everything is so easily dodged if you execute things properly, you have well over half a second more than what's needed.

you are the complete apologist, you'll say anything to defend this wretched train wreck of a game. It's wonderful that you can telepathically anticipate the 300 ms deviation in a game. I always assumed a game played fair, not using it's poorly developed code as an enticement for the twitch generation. How is this fun?

Look, you need to stop because you are one of the biggest know nothing trolls on the FFXIV forums.  PiedPiper, am I correct?

It's an honest question.  I'm not professional developer but if I knew there would be 300ms positional lag as a worst case scenario, I think I'd account for 300ms when Im setting up the timing to dodge AoE.  If that suddenly went away, I'd trim down the allowance accordingly.

Lag is lag.  People that have difficulty lag well beyond the 300 ms worst cast scenario.  I imagine they'd STILL have problems if this was changed.

The issues are duty finder stress, lag spikes need to be alleviated.  The fact that there is no Euro data center for the Euro worlds also makes no sense.

This?  Doesn't even make the top 5 list.

Baloney, there will always be lagg from the net that we can adapt too but adding a 300ms coding lag on top of it is asinine and it needs to go away, they do this and most of the complaints will evaporate.

case: Coolermaster HAF932
PSU: Antec EA 750watt
RAM: 2x2g G-SKILL DDR3-1600mhz 9-9-9-24
Mb:Gigabyte GA-P55-UD4P
CPU: i5-750 @4ghz
GPU: gtx msi N760 TF 2GD5/OC
cooling: Noctua NH-D14
storage: seagate 600 240GB SSD, 500GB x7200rpm HDD

  Ppiper

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/08/13
Posts: 649

10/05/13 10:28:37 PM#54
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Ppiper
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Purutzil

Not a fan how its set up. You need to train yourself to get use to walking away quicker, and know you can run into aoes (that don't persist) even while the effect looks like its just going off.

 

I've done titan HM without being hit once, its plausible (most didn't get hit once in my group) but it relies on getting use to its form of timing.

Does everyone really believe that the timing to dodge AoEs doesn't account for 300ms position lag?

Everything is so easily dodged if you execute things properly, you have well over half a second more than what's needed.

you are the complete apologist, you'll say anything to defend this wretched train wreck of a game. It's wonderful that you can telepathically anticipate the 300 ms deviation in a game. I always assumed a game played fair, not using it's poorly developed code as an enticement for the twitch generation. How is this fun?

Look, you need to stop because you are one of the biggest know nothing trolls on the FFXIV forums.  PiedPiper, am I correct?

It's an honest question.  I'm not professional developer but if I knew there would be 300ms positional lag as a worst case scenario, I think I'd account for 300ms when Im setting up the timing to dodge AoE.  If that suddenly went away, I'd trim down the allowance accordingly.

Lag is lag.  People that have difficulty lag well beyond the 300 ms worst cast scenario.  I imagine they'd STILL have problems if this was changed.

The issues are duty finder stress, lag spikes need to be alleviated.  The fact that there is no Euro data center for the Euro worlds also makes no sense.

This?  Doesn't even make the top 5 list.

are you insane? I never post on the FFXIV forums. I post on their forums with a different handle so STFU!  You lied about that and now you lie about your subject matter. So, if I were you, I'd save my breath for your inflatable date. Got it, rook!?

  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 10:29:47 PM#55
Originally posted by Asm0deus
-snip-
and most of the complaints will evaporate.

Pfft, in your dreams bud.  These people will find something else to complain about in a matter of days.

I just wish people would be vocal about things that actually matter.  The gil deletion and positional lag are just minor quality of life issues.  No progression blocks.

  TangentPoint

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1102

The "Real Game" begins at character creation.

10/05/13 10:33:39 PM#56
Originally posted by DMKano
Originally posted by Vyce
Easy Solution - remove the red circle/cone/rectangle from the game. I have always found those early warning signs too carebear and annoying as hell.

Maybe you are missing the point, removing red circles would only be masking the problem, the 300ms delay is still present for every single skill in game!

They need to solve this in server netcode, other AAA games do not have this issue, so its clearly possible.

Should I even mention that as P2P game, this is simply a big no-no IMO.

 

Bear in mind, this is from the same Producer/Director who has stated the reason you can't send PMs while in a cross-server instance is because it's not possible.

Other MMOs have had cross-server instancing since well before ARR, and you could send PMs just fine.

I admire the hell out of the guy for the effort and time he's put into rebuilding the game, not to mention the hours of sleep he must have lost... He's a hard-working and passionate man, and nothing can take that away from him. It's clear he did his research into the gameplay aspects of other MMOs (whether their implementation in ARR was a good thing or not is subjective).

What's also clear, however, is the apparent lack of research he and his team did when implementing the systems around it. 300ms delay "built in" to the game, inability to support PMs from instances even though it's clearly do-able, lack of any anti-RMT systems in-place at launch, or even so much as a right-click "report gilspammer" option in a right-click menu, their complete lack of preparedness to setup and launch additional servers to keep up with player demand. Their lack of immediate response to the AFK'ing issue that locked up available login slots, and prevented many people from being able to play for almost two weeks, how they pushed ahead with Early Access even without more thoroughly testing the issues plaguing Open Beta (which would come back to bite them in the ass). And so on.

All of these things are situations that have occurred in other MMOs of the last 8+ years, and have been handled far better. There's really no excuse for SE to have been so ill-prepared for these things with ARR; especially when they'd already dealt with and addressed some of them with one of their own MMOs.

 

My philosophy on MMORPGs:

Leveling is what happens while you're playing the rest of the game.

Don't worry about levels. Just play.

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 4660

 
OP  10/05/13 10:37:15 PM#57
Originally posted by Asm0deus?

It is  a bug due to bad coding. Link

Those of you saying it is not a bug and you all just suck and need to learn "battle awareness or you need to learn how run out of the red or you need to adapt to the timing" please note the forums it is under:

Thanks again for finding this - at least they are acknowledging that its a bug - now what will they do about it?

 

  Asm0deus

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/10
Posts: 782

10/05/13 10:39:36 PM#58
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by Asm0deus
-snip-
and most of the complaints will evaporate.

Pfft, in your dreams bud.  These people will find something else to complain about in a matter of days.

I just wish people would be vocal about things that actually matter.  The gil deletion and positional lag are just minor quality of life issues.  No progression blocks.

Oh they will complain about other things like all the speedhacks/teleporting botters and whatnot but most of the big complaint about AOE lagg will go away as it is due to this very thing.

 

If you think otherwise you are fooling yourself and do not know what you are talking about and are just looking to be argumentative.

 

Oh btw my handle here is Asm0deus not "bud" please remain civil and use it.

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  Alamareth

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/03/06
Posts: 591

10/05/13 10:41:14 PM#59
Originally posted by DMKano
Originally posted by Asm0deus?

It is  a bug due to bad coding. Link

Those of you saying it is not a bug and you all just suck and need to learn "battle awareness or you need to learn how run out of the red or you need to adapt to the timing" please note the forums it is under:

Thanks again for finding this - at least they are acknowledging that its a bug - now what will they do about it?

 

Notice how a pretty large chunk of them are in the EU servers?

  Asm0deus

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/10
Posts: 782

10/05/13 10:54:23 PM#60
Originally posted by Alamareth
Originally posted by DMKano
Originally posted by Asm0deus?

It is  a bug due to bad coding. Link

Those of you saying it is not a bug and you all just suck and need to learn "battle awareness or you need to learn how run out of the red or you need to adapt to the timing" please note the forums it is under:

Thanks again for finding this - at least they are acknowledging that its a bug - now what will they do about it?

 

Notice how a pretty large chunk of them are in the EU servers?

If you had actually read some threads about the subject instead of skimming through it you would know even people in the province of Quebec living only 1 hr away have issues with this but it is less of a problem because they have very low net lagg.

The issues and reason it needs to go is because they are not willing to have servers in every state so we all have very low net lagg. This is something that will not change period, they can however reduce this coding lagg so the formula would be:

real lagg = net lagg + server lagg (due to primetime and high server traffic) which we all, by now, are use to and can adapt to.

I have guildies from Australia and they can adapt to stupid crazy lagg times of 300 400ms plus (this lagg btw is only the net lagg and doesn't include the coding lagg).

 

The problem however is right now you have this formula:

real lagg = net lagg + server lagg+ coding lagg (300ms).  There are limits to how much you can compensate before things become  "not fun". 

Also keep in mind that this coding lagg (300ms) doesn't show up really when you are testing your lagg. So if you have 150ms lagg due to you being far away from the servers you need to add 300 to that because of these positioning checks plus if you play primetime add in the lagg spikes.

 

 

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