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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » What makes an MMORPG a WoW clone?

18 posts found
  User Deleted
 
OP  8/21/13 1:02:28 PM#1

So, this is an ongoing phenomenon that has been occurring for years and IMO far too long. Its so prevalent and that it just makes me ask the question towards people (more specifically the ones that believe) constantly stating the "every or most MMORPG's are just WoW clones".


Personally, I don't see it and believe there are distinguishing features that separate many of the MMO's from each other but wanted to see the reasoning and other people's opinions behind everything being a "WoW clone".


Like what exactly is the criteria or theshold that makes an MMO merely a clone and what is the criteria/threshold for an MMO to NOT be a WoW clone?

  Nadia

Tipster

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11863

8/21/13 1:07:28 PM#2

the label is totally subjective

ive seen some gamers use Theme park and WoWclone w no distinction

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

8/21/13 1:09:44 PM#3

When they ttake 90% of their game design directly from WoW without any thought to how it works or how it can be improved.

 

Same quest based leveling, same generic NPCs with !! over their heads, same GUI, same class system, same quest system, same tier based gear grind raiding system, same death penalty, same instanced dungeon system, same loot system, same crafting system, same market system, it goes on and on.

Now that sounds like a lot of things to be the same, and yet, games that hit those marks are, LotRO, AoC, Rift (except classes), SWTOR, and nearly every AAA MMORPG of the last 8 years.

When a game rolls out with the same UI as WoW, and the first thing you see is an NPC with a !! over their heads, you can pretty much know right then EXACTLY how the game will be.

 

Now compare this to pre WoW MMOs where almost no two MMOs were alike, and if they shared anything, it was something very basic like "You get xp from mobs you kill". Ideas were shared but it was such a mixed bag it was never clear where the devs were taking ideas from. In WoW clones, you know EXACTLY where ALL those ideas came from.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 22588

8/21/13 1:10:08 PM#4

Arguing semantics is never very useful.

There is no agreement of what sandbox means, or even what a MMO is.

Many here even disagree with common industry usage about what should be categorized as MMOs.

The argument will never end.

 

  Nadia

Tipster

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11863

8/21/13 1:11:42 PM#5
Originally posted by DavisFlight

When they ttake 90% of their game design directly from WoW without any thought to how it works or how it can be improved.

games that hit those marks are, LotRO, AoC, Rift (except classes), SWTOR, and nearly every AAA MMORPG of the last 8 years.

i fail to see how Age of Conan is a wow clone

a themepark yes,  a wow clone ?  no

 

other recent games that were not wow clones:

DCUO

Free Realms  (kid mmo)

TERA

The Secret World

  User Deleted
 
OP  8/21/13 1:13:50 PM#6


Originally posted by nariusseldon
Arguing semantics is never very useful.

There is no agreement of what sandbox means, or even what a MMO is.

Many here even disagree with common industry usage about what should be categorized as MMOs.

The argument will never end.

 



I guess I'm not really looking for an argument or semantics as opposed to just seeing other people's opinions and reasoning behind something. Despite me and possibly others disagreeing, this is still something that is thrown around and used quite often so I wanted to kinda see how people with opposing view somewhat think or their logic is.


Whether I personally think they are correct or incorrect isn't what this thread is about but merely how people distinguish between a WoW clone and not a WoW clone and their opinions. Like when do they decide that a certain game isn't a WoW clone especially when so many are labeled WoW clones?

  maplestone

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 3109

8/21/13 1:16:36 PM#7

Was the game motivated by some people coming together and saying "WoW's making a lot of money, let's copy that gameplay and try to get a piece of that"?    However, as players, we're not usually in on those meetings - we just end up with games with a subjective clone-like vibe.  Because the term is used derisively, it's an instant lightning rod for flamewars.

It's still a term I use in my own mind when I look at games.  But using on the boards has become sort of pointless.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 22588

8/21/13 1:18:43 PM#8
Originally posted by Jairoe03

 


Originally posted by nariusseldon
Arguing semantics is never very useful.

 

There is no agreement of what sandbox means, or even what a MMO is.

Many here even disagree with common industry usage about what should be categorized as MMOs.

The argument will never end.

 


 


I guess I'm not really looking for an argument or semantics as opposed to just seeing other people's opinions and reasoning behind something. Despite me and possibly others disagreeing, this is still something that is thrown around and used quite often so I wanted to kinda see how people with opposing view somewhat think or their logic is.


Whether I personally think they are correct or incorrect isn't what this thread is about but merely how people distinguish between a WoW clone and not a WoW clone and their opinions. Like when do they decide that a certain game isn't a WoW clone especially when so many are labeled WoW clones?

Ah ok.

As oppose to say what define a wow-clone, I would suggest ask for a list of games that a person may consider a wow-clone. That is the least unambigious way of trying to see how people think.

 

 

 

  LeGrosGamer

Novice Member

Joined: 7/06/13
Posts: 214

8/21/13 1:26:05 PM#9

The first real WoW clone was LoTRO, right down to the health / mana bar.  First time I tried it I had to make sure I wasn't playing WoW.

 

  The term WoW clone really started to kick in to high gear I'd say in 2007-08 where the F2P releases cranked up a notch and we were getting releases month after month after month up to present.

 

  Those that tried being different then WoW ended up being major failures , ie : Age of Conan.    Age Of Conan was SUPPOSE to be WoW's nemesis, but a crappy release and a bug galore MMO made Age of Conan a dead MMO within months of release. 

 

 It would be nice for Devs to be somewhat creative and at least put some thought in to the HP/MP bar , a quick example FF14, their style of HP/MP differs from almost every MMORPG release out there.   Being a WoW player myself for about a year (Was a huge EVE-Online player, so I haven't played WoW for long) I didn't connect that well with WoW because at that time I really hoped for a D3 online that followed D2 style.  

 

  Like it or not, the vast majority of MMORPG players have played and are still playing WoW, so the term WoW clone comes in when a new release comes out and those WoW players cannot see a good reason to leave WoW to play a game that offers the same things, and most of the time even less things, then WoW.

  R1zla

Novice Member

Joined: 6/21/13
Posts: 25

8/21/13 1:33:16 PM#10
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by DavisFlight

When they ttake 90% of their game design directly from WoW without any thought to how it works or how it can be improved.

games that hit those marks are, LotRO, AoC, Rift (except classes), SWTOR, and nearly every AAA MMORPG of the last 8 years.

i fail to see how Age of Conan is a wow clone

a themepark yes,  a wow clone ?  no

Agreed, AoC was nothing like WoW......

People get butt hurt if a company looks at the most successful mmorpg to date and use many of the same features. If a team of devs try to cater to what is actually the majority player base in design and features they are hit with the brand of "WoW Clone" . Devs are expected to to produce a game that actually does away with the tried and tested methods and caters to various minority player bases or they are somehow offended.

Its crazy that people can not get their head around the fact that games from the same genre are going to be packed with similar features.

FF14:ARR is being called a WoW clone. Surely if it cloned WoW, i must like or dislike both right? Wrong. I do not like WoW, but i love FF14. A game can use many signature features of the genre that are in WoW and still be a different game. "WoW clone" is just a go to insult used by people who found they dont like a particular game. If it is similar to WoW in design.

  spizz

Novice Member

Joined: 7/11/04
Posts: 2591

8/21/13 4:17:41 PM#11
I have not seen a single game which is a WoW clone, if so I would join it asap since Vanilla WoW had a great gameplay. Where are these allegedly clones ? They dont exist.
  Greymantle4

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/27/07
Posts: 808

8/21/13 4:24:29 PM#12
Originally posted by spizz
I have not seen a single game which is a WoW clone, if so I would join it asap since Vanilla WoW had a great gameplay. Where are these allegedly clones ? They dont exist.

Haha....Wow is not even a wow clone anymore. :P

  Kevyne-Shandris

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/10/08
Posts: 1980

You can't † BURY † ¤¤ Holy Paladins ¤¤ As we will always __.- ASCEND -.__

8/22/13 1:45:23 AM#13

A WoW clone is a MMORPG that copies the concepts of WoW, as is.

 

RIFT did this in it's own way with their factions. Blue and Red colors even to mimic WoW's Alliance and Horde. Add that the descriptions are even similar, when RIFT opened to the public, folks were drawing lines based on Ally or Horde. It was so in players faces.

 

If RIFT offered a third faction and didn't mimic the warfare between WoW's Alliance and Horde, that clone tag wouldn't stick. Third faction came much later, when players left, too.

 

What makes WoW unique isn't that stuff. It's unique that it's stable all these years. Folks are bored with the game, but stick around because the other "choices" are lackluster. If you're a PvE player, your choices are clearly limited, as MMOs are full of PvP now (cheapest programming, players are the content). It's the only PvE MMO title now producing PvE content of AAA quality. Where else will such players go or play when the industry is more about copying itself, than innovating (or waiting for Blizzard to do this, or possibly SOE, then copying that and pushing it as F2P)?

 

  User Deleted
 
OP  8/22/13 1:10:19 PM#14


Originally posted by UNATCOII
A WoW clone is a MMORPG that copies the concepts of WoW, as is.

 

RIFT did this in it's own way with their factions. Blue and Red colors even to mimic WoW's Alliance and Horde. Add that the descriptions are even similar, when RIFT opened to the public, folks were drawing lines based on Ally or Horde. It was so in players faces.

 

If RIFT offered a third faction and didn't mimic the warfare between WoW's Alliance and Horde, that clone tag wouldn't stick. Third faction came much later, when players left, too.

 

What makes WoW unique isn't that stuff. It's unique that it's stable all these years. Folks are bored with the game, but stick around because the other "choices" are lackluster. If you're a PvE player, your choices are clearly limited, as MMOs are full of PvP now (cheapest programming, players are the content). It's the only PvE MMO title now producing PvE content of AAA quality. Where else will such players go or play when the industry is more about copying itself, than innovating (or waiting for Blizzard to do this, or possibly SOE, then copying that and pushing it as F2P)?

 



So my next question would be how many "WoW concepts" does it take to be able to properly label an MMORPG a WoW clone? Just 1? That would seem fairly easy to justify about any MMORPG a WoW clone so I'm sure its more than 1. What is the threshold for that?


If WoW is considered unique due to its own stability then wouldn't this make it even harder for other MMO's to be actually called a WoW clone because its a characteristic that you said unique to WoW. Does it only take 1 characteristic to define an MMO as "unique" and can we apply this to other MMO's if all it took was just 1 thing to separate it from the rest?

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 22588

8/22/13 1:14:18 PM#15
Originally posted by Zeppelin4
Originally posted by spizz
I have not seen a single game which is a WoW clone, if so I would join it asap since Vanilla WoW had a great gameplay. Where are these allegedly clones ? They dont exist.

Haha....Wow is not even a wow clone anymore. :P

That is correct. The original does not count as a clone.

You need at least TWO for one of the two to be a clone.

 

  User Deleted
8/22/13 1:17:13 PM#16
I don't care if a game is called a WoW clone if I'm having fun playing it. For example Rift has many similarities with WoW and was called a WoW clone but I didn't care cause I had fun while it lasted and was a subscription game. Now it's scam to play so moved on.
  Sephastus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/15/09
Posts: 447

8/22/13 1:25:29 PM#17

MMORPGs pre-WoW:

 

Dungeons and Dragon style pen and paper gaming turned digital, where group and social interactions were the norm, and content could not be completed solo.

 

MMORPG during and Post WoW:

 

Most content soloable with quick rewards for any action, limited group play, and lots of instant gratification.

 

Any and all games that go for solo-centric play styles in a massively multiplayer online role playing game, and places more emphasis on doing content on one's own instead of group play and interdependencies, is a WoW clone, since they are copying WoW.

  GeezerGamer

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 5675

8/22/13 1:28:29 PM#18
When someone doesn't like the game, It's a "WoW clone".