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General Discussion  » I have grouped and found the community feeling in every "solo" MMO. Maybe YOU are the problem

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214 posts found
  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15694

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

8/10/13 9:04:01 PM#61
Originally posted by Foomerang

 




There is definitely that. Ive been a part of those types of game communities. I think partof it may be also that there is just so much to choose from there is no comiseration anymore haha. People struggled through broken mmos together because it was the best it could get. Now theres so many choices, we can hop over to a never ending stream games.

 

That is probably a big part of it as well. One I didn't think to mention as it does have some numerical evidence, F2P consistently seems to go up and down on a steady basis, mostly around content updates. OR it could just mean there's a crap ton of us floating from game to game hoping to find the one. :)

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  ego13

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/24/04
Posts: 287

Hell is other people. - Sartre

8/10/13 9:05:25 PM#62

People will group for necessity, they will communicate if they wish but also if it will benefit them.

 

Personally, I feel people never fail to disappoint, I group with friends and I carefully pick my guildies because I like to play at a high challenge (if that could be said) level.  Yes...I would consider myself elitist, in game, in life, at work, and in most every aspect of my life.  This is a benefit in my opinion, I am extremely critical of myself and those around me (more myself) which is why I rarely group unless it's necessary.

Does this mean MMOs aren't for me?  No.  That's asinine.

 

MMOs and 1-player games differ in more ways than just being MMO.  When I play an MMO it's because there is no end, I can continue to progress, I can choose to solo, I can choose to group, I have options but in the end there is no "ending".  I don't care, at all, about story (Bastion is really the only exception here, brilliantly implemented story) and the great thing about MMOs....very little story unless you want it.

 

MMOs are like sexuality.  There are the normal ways that people choose to engage/enjoy/etc, but there are MANY ways for each and every person to enjoy the acts involved or many varied acts, as it were.  No one way is the right way or the wrong way, the point is enjoyment, so be accepting and leave it at that.  You may choose to enjoy x in y way, that doesn't make it any better or right than my way.

Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.

  User Deleted
8/10/13 9:07:16 PM#63


Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by Foomerang  


There is definitely that. Ive been a part of those types of game communities. I think partof it may be also that there is just so much to choose from there is no comiseration anymore haha. People struggled through broken mmos together because it was the best it could get. Now theres so many choices, we can hop over to a never ending stream games.  
That is probably a big part of it as well. One I didn't think to mention as it does have some numerical evidence, F2P consistently seems to go up and down on a steady basis, mostly around content updates. OR it could just mean there's a crap ton of us floating from game to game hoping to find the one. :)

Yeah I have a personal checklist of features I look for in an mmo. But sometimes I feel that list wont matter if I find a good group of gamers to play the same game with. Maybe my list isnt so much the features themselves but the type of gamers they hopefully will attract.

  ElRenmazuo

Elite Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 4285

8/10/13 9:15:03 PM#64
Originally posted by fyerwall
Originally posted by CalmOceans
Originally posted by tkreep

I ride trains all the time and I dont talk to anyone in them or require to talk to ride the train.

Maybe you should ask yourself if MMO are for you then. A lot of people would be better off playing single player games.

Have you ever ridden the subway in NY?

The T in Boston?

The only time anyone really talks is to say "Help!" or "What you looking at?" or "Please stop peeing on me!"

They are all pretty much silent encounters unless you boarded with friends. Then it's you and them whispering...

 

Having options such as soloing and grouping are needed in an MMO. While soloing you may just run into someone who needs help, you form a group. Then someone else joins...

Socializing comes down to the player, not the mechanic. I have been in many groups in early EQ where we would be grouped for hours and the only words uttered were "Pulling" "Brb" "Afk 1min" or "OOM Meding" other than that complete silence.

 

Same with DC metro and Northern VA, hell sometimes people look at me like im gonna do something lol. And he act like I dont socialize just because I dont talk to people on the train.  Just like in modern mmos, parts of my real life I solo and other parts I socialize.   And nothing is forced.  The whole point I play mmos is having that virtual world feeling, because even when im soloing its cool to know im still effecting other players in small ways like through crafting and economy or sometimes maybe run into them and help them out with something and then go back to whatever I was doing.

Its like being wolverine whos a loner most of his life and find the x-men and do big things with them but still goes out and does his own thing time to time.

  Gallus85

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/13/11
Posts: 1114

8/10/13 9:18:40 PM#65
Originally posted by ego13

People will group for necessity, they will communicate if they wish but also if it will benefit them.

 

Personally, I feel people never fail to disappoint, I group with friends and I carefully pick my guildies because I like to play at a high challenge (if that could be said) level.  Yes...I would consider myself elitist, in game, in life, at work, and in most every aspect of my life.  This is a benefit in my opinion, I am extremely critical of myself and those around me (more myself) which is why I rarely group unless it's necessary.

Does this mean MMOs aren't for me?  No.  That's asinine.

 

MMOs and 1-player games differ in more ways than just being MMO.  When I play an MMO it's because there is no end, I can continue to progress, I can choose to solo, I can choose to group, I have options but in the end there is no "ending".  I don't care, at all, about story (Bastion is really the only exception here, brilliantly implemented story) and the great thing about MMOs....very little story unless you want it.

 

MMOs are like sexuality.  There are the normal ways that people choose to engage/enjoy/etc, but there are MANY ways for each and every person to enjoy the acts involved or many varied acts, as it were.  No one way is the right way or the wrong way, the point is enjoyment, so be accepting and leave it at that.  You may choose to enjoy x in y way, that doesn't make it any better or right than my way.

About time you said something smart enough I could agree with.

Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL

  Theocritus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/15/08
Posts: 3616

8/10/13 9:40:58 PM#66
Yes you can group in those games but its kinda like having 5 people to screw in a light bulb......
  kellian1

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/20/06
Posts: 230

8/10/13 9:49:42 PM#67

What I have found in the modern MMO (GW2, SWTOR, etc.) is most group content is based around speed runs. I see people here discussing how it makes the game more social, I totally disagree. I have been in countless groups back when I played GW2, SWTOR and other recent releases where I tried to engage in conversation with a pick up group and nobody responded.

 

It was literally ok we are doing this content, skipping this, or in some cases not a word said the entire time. No social interaction at all. We have guilds for big time social interaction, but group content social interaction has been sorely lacking.

 

Now with that said, I'm all for having group content. And this is where the key is in my view. In EQ and EQ2, communication meant something. You almost had to communicate and feel comfortable with your teammates even in a PUG. I can't tell you the amount of interesting conversations that were had regarding class builds, content, the dungeon we were running or countless other things BEFORE we even started the content in EQ and EQ2. In other words it wasn't one giant zerg that required little to no interaction to complete.

 

I still want solo or more to the point duo content as my wife and I play together, but I also want challenging group content as well. How do they plan on striking the balance in EQnext is what we don't know yet and how they are going to strike the balance with how groups work together will determine alot.

  munx4555

Novice Member

Joined: 6/07/07
Posts: 170

8/10/13 9:59:04 PM#68
Originally posted by Theocritus
Yes you can group in those games but its kinda like having 5 people to screw in a light bulb......

ding ding, this is the problem, outside of raiding and dungeons it becomes counter productive to group up, I don't belive grouping should be forced, It should however be strongly encouraged.

  Daaken

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/01/13
Posts: 160

“It is better to fail in originality than to succeed in imitation.”

8/10/13 10:01:18 PM#69
Originally posted by Ecoces

if you need a game to promote mechanics that FORCE people to group with you ... you are the problem. I have run with groups constantly in EQ2, WoW, Guild Wars 2, Rift and countless other "solo MMORPGs".

 

see thats the beauty of MMORPGs right now,  people have options, they can either solo or they can group IF THEY WANT. recently in guild wars 2 my guild took 2 groups and started over, just running from event to event leveling up some new players from another guild game. it was amazing and fun but if someone wanted to go and do their own thing they could by themselves.

 

forced grouping to do anything in a game is bad game design, sorry but someone has to say it. sure there should be some content that can only be done as a group however designing the whole game NOW around the concept of "you must group or get left behind" is destined to fail.

 

so to all those out there saying they can't find groups or the community feeling and games need to force grouping. its most likely YOUR attitude that's keeping people from interacting and grouping with you.

 Agreed!

 

Also I am one of those advocates who after 14 years playing MMO's still consider Guilds the perennial social construct and interactive mode.  That's not to say I've never carried on a cool and enjoyable conversation or have never interacted with others in an MMO but the primary way I do so is through my guild mates. Other players are just there to create the sense of virtuality that a single player game can not recreate.  Look at it like this, do you converse with every person you meet during the course of a day?  I suspect most do not, they go about their own business....this is the same scenario in an MMO.

Random Forum Poster: I want an MMO that is different, original and fun.

Me: So you want something like EQN

Them: Nah dude, I want a Holy Trinity, Tab Target combat, Instanced Raiding, and Rigid classes.

Me: Double Facepalm.

  Grailer

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/13/06
Posts: 840

8/10/13 10:33:31 PM#70

Do you seriously think people in games are your real friend ?  A lot of the time they are just using you so they can obtain something for themselves.

 

Human interaction tho is what people seek in mmo's .  

 

There is global chat which are just spam fests and full of trolls usually so remove that.

Remove trade auction houses

Remove mailbox

Remove automatic group finders.

 

Force people to actually have to type in some sort of words like "hi can I join your group ?

 

camps were great for that in EQ , you knew where the camps were so finding them and asking to join the group was easy .

 

 

 

 

  supertouchme

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/10/08
Posts: 69

8/10/13 10:42:54 PM#71

The OP misses the point of "encouraged" grouping. The social dynamic is completely different when you're tackling obstacles with other people and having to depend on them to survive and succeed.

If you don't understand that there are social nuances you can't experience while soloing your way through a game then I don't know what to tell you.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15694

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

8/10/13 11:14:17 PM#72
Originally posted by supertouchme

The OP misses the point of "encouraged" grouping. The social dynamic is completely different when you're tackling obstacles with other people and having to depend on them to survive and succeed.

If you don't understand that there are social nuances you can't experience while soloing your way through a game then I don't know what to tell you.

I'm just trying to figure out how you've come to such a conclusion. Who said anything about there being a problem with mechanics or content that encourages grouping? Every MMO has that, solo oriented or not.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  Gallus85

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/13/11
Posts: 1114

8/10/13 11:16:34 PM#73
Originally posted by munx4555
Originally posted by Theocritus
Yes you can group in those games but its kinda like having 5 people to screw in a light bulb......

ding ding, this is the problem, outside of raiding and dungeons it becomes counter productive to group up, I don't belive grouping should be forced, It should however be strongly encouraged.

The message is clear.  Grouping needs to be encouraged.  It takes more time and effort.  It has more risk and dangers.  It needs to be superior method of progressing in the game.  Gear should be better / more frequent.  Exp / skill gains should be quicker, etc.

But soloing should be there for those who want it.

A healthy medium between solo content availability and group content viability.

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  Shadowguy64

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/13
Posts: 880

8/10/13 11:31:01 PM#74
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

  jesusjuice69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/13
Posts: 293

8/10/13 11:33:41 PM#75
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

The answer is simple.

You don't try to force people to group all the time.

  Shadowguy64

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/13
Posts: 880

8/10/13 11:35:08 PM#76
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

The answer is simple.

You don't try to force people to group all the time.

 

But I thought soloing was the Deviljuice...

  jesusjuice69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/13
Posts: 293

8/10/13 11:45:54 PM#77
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

The answer is simple.

You don't try to force people to group all the time.

 

But I thought soloing was the Deviljuice...

If a game launched in which it required people to group to solo, then I highly suspect most people would ragequit.  It would be the biggest shit storm the internet has ever seen.

  Shadowguy64

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/13
Posts: 880

8/10/13 11:51:40 PM#78
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

The answer is simple.

You don't try to force people to group all the time.

 

But I thought soloing was the Deviljuice...

If a game launched in which it required people to group to solo, then I highly suspect most people would ragequit.  It would be the biggest shit storm the internet has ever seen.

 

Well, if mobs are easily soloable, then why the heck would I want to stand around and wait for for a group when I can just go solo and level faster? Not to mention that if it's a quest centric game, not everyone would be on the same quest.

 

I can chat with people in my guild and friends without being in a group.

  FinalFikus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/01/13
Posts: 910

"We're up all night to get lucky"

8/11/13 12:04:04 AM#79
Originally posted by Gallus85
Originally posted by munx4555
Originally posted by Theocritus
Yes you can group in those games but its kinda like having 5 people to screw in a light bulb......

ding ding, this is the problem, outside of raiding and dungeons it becomes counter productive to group up, I don't belive grouping should be forced, It should however be strongly encouraged.

The message is clear.  Grouping needs to be encouraged.  It takes more time and effort.  It has more risk and dangers.  It needs to be superior method of progressing in the game.  Gear should be better / more frequent.  Exp / skill gains should be quicker, etc.

But soloing should be there for those who want it.

A healthy medium between solo content availability and group content viability.

I thought EQN was a sandbox?

Do you think EVE developers encourage grouping through loot and XP or do they encourage it differently?

It makes me wonder if EQN will get turned into WOW during beta if even the supporters are treating it like another themepark.

 

 

 

 

 

 

"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"

  FinalFikus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/01/13
Posts: 910

"We're up all night to get lucky"

8/11/13 12:05:09 AM#80
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by jesusjuice69
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Originally posted by niceguy3978
Originally posted by Shadowguy64
Halp! I want to leave the city, but I can't go solo! I've been here for three weeks! Please group with me!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a game other than FXI where everything your level would kill you and it was impossible to solo?  That is honestly the only one I can think of where it wasn't possible to solo.  Well at least back in the day it wasn't, I know it has changed over the last few years.

 

Well, I can't really think of another way to force grouping without making the mobs so tough that trying to solo them would mean certain death.

 

So fill the world with hard to kill elite mobs and corral the soloists inside the cities until they finally bend to the groupers demands. 

The answer is simple.

You don't try to force people to group all the time.

 

But I thought soloing was the Deviljuice...

If a game launched in which it required people to group to solo, then I highly suspect most people would ragequit.  It would be the biggest shit storm the internet has ever seen.

 

Well, if mobs are easily soloable, then why the heck would I want to stand around and wait for for a group when I can just go solo and level faster? Not to mention that if it's a quest centric game, not everyone would be on the same quest.

 

I can chat with people in my guild and friends without being in a group.

Have you ever played a sandbox game before?

"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"

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