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General Discussion  » Payment model - Box Sales & Subs more or less confirmed

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60 posts found
  Wildaboutwildstar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/13
Posts: 43

7/26/13 9:29:10 AM#41
Originally posted by fiontar
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by fiontar

From what I understand, GW2 has produced superb earnings using the B2P+cash shop model. NCSoft owns Carbine and is publishing the game. If B2P/Cash Shop is working for GW2 and all indications are that it is, then there is a pretty good chance Wildstar will offer something very similar.

"Hybrid". Well, B2P+Cash Shop is a hybrid. It's almost F2P+CS, but you also have to buy the box. So, there is a possibility that WS will use the same model as GW2. "What if it's a hybrid between the GW2 model and the P2P  model"? I see that as a possibility as well. It could offer the GW2 model, plus an optional subscription that would include an exclusive benefit and maybe some cash shop currency included in the deal.

As to GW2, NCSoft doesn't break down their revenue numbers in much detail. GW2 box sales dropped by 50% vs. the previous quarter, but most MMOs today would be overjoyed to still be selling as many new boxes half a year+ after release. Even with the decline in Box sales, NCSoft Revenue was up over 300% vs. the same quarter a year ago and a good portion of that likely came from GW2 cash shop sales.

I love the GW2 business model and have spent a fair amount in the cash shop since release. However, I'd have no problem at all if Wildstar added an optional sub fee, with reasonable benefits, as long as the game is still playable and fun without the sub.

NCsoft is just the publisher.  That doesn't mean diddly shit.  They are two completely different games made by two completely different game developers.

GW2 only did good, because they intentionally didn't create any end game, or devote any resources to continually pumping out end game updates.  That is extremely expensive.  WS has 50-70% of its team devoted to doing just that!

Just to clarify, Carbine, just like Arenanet, is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft. I assume they have a similar level of creative control, but NCSoft makes the business decisions, even if done so with input from the studio.

I stand by my post and reasoning. Also, any variation on the GW2 business model may provide some insight into how NCSoft views the results of that model.

My take is that the GW2 business model will be one of the most prominent business models for future MMOs, with straight F2P being the the other most prevalent. There seems to be some room for an optional monthly subscription with value added benefits in the mix, but it has to be truly optional. The once dominant P2P  model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death.

 

Lets hope the hell not, because GW2 isn't a real MMO. In large part due to the business model they chose. There is absolutely no evidence that P2P is a dying model! Stop stating your opinions as facts! GW2 wasn't subscription based, because it was never designed to be from the start! That means no end game, no intention of updating end game. Over half of the WS staff is only working on end game! That is nearly HALF of their current development cost going to something GW2 barely spent any time on.
  Stayonboard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/28/10
Posts: 79

7/26/13 11:45:12 AM#42
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by fiontar
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by fiontar

From what I understand, GW2 has produced superb earnings using the B2P+cash shop model. NCSoft owns Carbine and is publishing the game. If B2P/Cash Shop is working for GW2 and all indications are that it is, then there is a pretty good chance Wildstar will offer something very similar.

"Hybrid". Well, B2P+Cash Shop is a hybrid. It's almost F2P+CS, but you also have to buy the box. So, there is a possibility that WS will use the same model as GW2. "What if it's a hybrid between the GW2 model and the P2P  model"? I see that as a possibility as well. It could offer the GW2 model, plus an optional subscription that would include an exclusive benefit and maybe some cash shop currency included in the deal.

As to GW2, NCSoft doesn't break down their revenue numbers in much detail. GW2 box sales dropped by 50% vs. the previous quarter, but most MMOs today would be overjoyed to still be selling as many new boxes half a year+ after release. Even with the decline in Box sales, NCSoft Revenue was up over 300% vs. the same quarter a year ago and a good portion of that likely came from GW2 cash shop sales.

I love the GW2 business model and have spent a fair amount in the cash shop since release. However, I'd have no problem at all if Wildstar added an optional sub fee, with reasonable benefits, as long as the game is still playable and fun without the sub.

NCsoft is just the publisher.  That doesn't mean diddly shit.  They are two completely different games made by two completely different game developers.

GW2 only did good, because they intentionally didn't create any end game, or devote any resources to continually pumping out end game updates.  That is extremely expensive.  WS has 50-70% of its team devoted to doing just that!

Just to clarify, Carbine, just like Arenanet, is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft. I assume they have a similar level of creative control, but NCSoft makes the business decisions, even if done so with input from the studio.

I stand by my post and reasoning. Also, any variation on the GW2 business model may provide some insight into how NCSoft views the results of that model.

My take is that the GW2 business model will be one of the most prominent business models for future MMOs, with straight F2P being the the other most prevalent. There seems to be some room for an optional monthly subscription with value added benefits in the mix, but it has to be truly optional. The once dominant P2P  model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death.

 

Lets hope the hell not, because GW2 isn't a real MMO. In large part due to the business model they chose. There is absolutely no evidence that P2P is a dying model! Stop stating your opinions as facts! GW2 wasn't subscription based, because it was never designed to be from the start! That means no end game, no intention of updating end game. Over half of the WS staff is only working on end game! That is nearly HALF of their current development cost going to something GW2 barely spent any time on.

I really have no idea what your trying to say here. What does P2P have to do with having end game content? 

Guild wars makes PLENTY of money from their cash shop - and it's not pay to win either.... their lack of end game was a horrible mis-management of their development resources, but that isn't because they don't have a subscription. They have tons of money to implement more end game content they just choose to go with the living story route, which I could give two shits about personally even though I quite like GW2.

Oh and lastly, how is it not an real MMO? I love how you say "GW2 isn't a real MMO" then blast the person for stating his opinions as fact LOL. Hypocrite much?

 

  achesoma

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 959

7/26/13 11:51:49 AM#43

I imagine the cash shop will be similar to Aion.  Will probably have mostly aesthetic items.  Since WS will have a wardrobe system, I'd imagine they could make some decent coin as long as items are reasonably priced. 

  Wildaboutwildstar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/13
Posts: 43

7/26/13 11:58:01 AM#44
Originally posted by Stayonboard
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by fiontar
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by fiontar

From what I understand, GW2 has produced superb earnings using the B2P+cash shop model. NCSoft owns Carbine and is publishing the game. If B2P/Cash Shop is working for GW2 and all indications are that it is, then there is a pretty good chance Wildstar will offer something very similar.

"Hybrid". Well, B2P+Cash Shop is a hybrid. It's almost F2P+CS, but you also have to buy the box. So, there is a possibility that WS will use the same model as GW2. "What if it's a hybrid between the GW2 model and the P2P  model"? I see that as a possibility as well. It could offer the GW2 model, plus an optional subscription that would include an exclusive benefit and maybe some cash shop currency included in the deal.

As to GW2, NCSoft doesn't break down their revenue numbers in much detail. GW2 box sales dropped by 50% vs. the previous quarter, but most MMOs today would be overjoyed to still be selling as many new boxes half a year+ after release. Even with the decline in Box sales, NCSoft Revenue was up over 300% vs. the same quarter a year ago and a good portion of that likely came from GW2 cash shop sales.

I love the GW2 business model and have spent a fair amount in the cash shop since release. However, I'd have no problem at all if Wildstar added an optional sub fee, with reasonable benefits, as long as the game is still playable and fun without the sub.

NCsoft is just the publisher.  That doesn't mean diddly shit.  They are two completely different games made by two completely different game developers.

GW2 only did good, because they intentionally didn't create any end game, or devote any resources to continually pumping out end game updates.  That is extremely expensive.  WS has 50-70% of its team devoted to doing just that!

Just to clarify, Carbine, just like Arenanet, is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft. I assume they have a similar level of creative control, but NCSoft makes the business decisions, even if done so with input from the studio.

I stand by my post and reasoning. Also, any variation on the GW2 business model may provide some insight into how NCSoft views the results of that model.

My take is that the GW2 business model will be one of the most prominent business models for future MMOs, with straight F2P being the the other most prevalent. There seems to be some room for an optional monthly subscription with value added benefits in the mix, but it has to be truly optional. The once dominant P2P  model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death.

 

Lets hope the hell not, because GW2 isn't a real MMO. In large part due to the business model they chose. There is absolutely no evidence that P2P is a dying model! Stop stating your opinions as facts! GW2 wasn't subscription based, because it was never designed to be from the start! That means no end game, no intention of updating end game. Over half of the WS staff is only working on end game! That is nearly HALF of their current development cost going to something GW2 barely spent any time on.

I really have no idea what your trying to say here. What does P2P have to do with having end game content? 

Guild wars makes PLENTY of money from their cash shop - and it's not pay to win either.... their lack of end game was a horrible mis-management of their development resources, but that isn't because they don't have a subscription. They have tons of money to implement more end game content they just choose to go with the living story route, which I could give two shits about personally even though I quite like GW2.

Oh and lastly, how is it not an real MMO? I love how you say "GW2 isn't a real MMO" then blast the person for stating his opinions as fact LOL. Hypocrite much?

 

 

It seemed pretty simple. You are stating bad opinions and claiming they are facts. They are not. The p2p model is still solid, and isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

GW2 was a cheap game to make, and to continue to develop content for. That is why it is profitable! Their lack of end game was not a horrible mismanagement. It was intentional. That is the type of game they tried to make. That is what you can always expect when an MMO is B2P.

Yet, you claim you want more of this? Are you delusional? B2P is a MMO formula that will always result in a lackluster game, like GW2.

Also note, that just because the servers are still up doesn't mean the game is making money. Lots of games maintain servers at a loss for years without any subsequent revenue other than a few additional box sales. You can't say they are making tons of money from their cash shop, unless you have actual evidence to support that.

Its not a real MMO, because it has no end game content. It has no endurance! It doesn't meet the standards of massive. It is merely a single player game with some multiplayer.
  Stayonboard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/28/10
Posts: 79

7/26/13 12:29:58 PM#45
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by Stayonboard
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by fiontar
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by fiontar

From what I understand, GW2 has produced superb earnings using the B2P+cash shop model. NCSoft owns Carbine and is publishing the game. If B2P/Cash Shop is working for GW2 and all indications are that it is, then there is a pretty good chance Wildstar will offer something very similar.

"Hybrid". Well, B2P+Cash Shop is a hybrid. It's almost F2P+CS, but you also have to buy the box. So, there is a possibility that WS will use the same model as GW2. "What if it's a hybrid between the GW2 model and the P2P  model"? I see that as a possibility as well. It could offer the GW2 model, plus an optional subscription that would include an exclusive benefit and maybe some cash shop currency included in the deal.

As to GW2, NCSoft doesn't break down their revenue numbers in much detail. GW2 box sales dropped by 50% vs. the previous quarter, but most MMOs today would be overjoyed to still be selling as many new boxes half a year+ after release. Even with the decline in Box sales, NCSoft Revenue was up over 300% vs. the same quarter a year ago and a good portion of that likely came from GW2 cash shop sales.

I love the GW2 business model and have spent a fair amount in the cash shop since release. However, I'd have no problem at all if Wildstar added an optional sub fee, with reasonable benefits, as long as the game is still playable and fun without the sub.

NCsoft is just the publisher.  That doesn't mean diddly shit.  They are two completely different games made by two completely different game developers.

GW2 only did good, because they intentionally didn't create any end game, or devote any resources to continually pumping out end game updates.  That is extremely expensive.  WS has 50-70% of its team devoted to doing just that!

Just to clarify, Carbine, just like Arenanet, is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft. I assume they have a similar level of creative control, but NCSoft makes the business decisions, even if done so with input from the studio.

I stand by my post and reasoning. Also, any variation on the GW2 business model may provide some insight into how NCSoft views the results of that model.

My take is that the GW2 business model will be one of the most prominent business models for future MMOs, with straight F2P being the the other most prevalent. There seems to be some room for an optional monthly subscription with value added benefits in the mix, but it has to be truly optional. The once dominant P2P  model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death.

 

Lets hope the hell not, because GW2 isn't a real MMO. In large part due to the business model they chose. There is absolutely no evidence that P2P is a dying model! Stop stating your opinions as facts! GW2 wasn't subscription based, because it was never designed to be from the start! That means no end game, no intention of updating end game. Over half of the WS staff is only working on end game! That is nearly HALF of their current development cost going to something GW2 barely spent any time on.

I really have no idea what your trying to say here. What does P2P have to do with having end game content? 

Guild wars makes PLENTY of money from their cash shop - and it's not pay to win either.... their lack of end game was a horrible mis-management of their development resources, but that isn't because they don't have a subscription. They have tons of money to implement more end game content they just choose to go with the living story route, which I could give two shits about personally even though I quite like GW2.

Oh and lastly, how is it not an real MMO? I love how you say "GW2 isn't a real MMO" then blast the person for stating his opinions as fact LOL. Hypocrite much?

 

 

It seemed pretty simple. You are stating bad opinions and claiming they are facts. They are not. The p2p model is still solid, and isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

 

 

GW2 was a cheap game to make, and to continue to develop content for. That is why it is profitable! Their lack of end game was not a horrible mismanagement. It was intentional. That is the type of game they tried to make. That is what you can always expect when an MMO is B2P.

 

Yet, you claim you want more of this? Are you delusional? B2P is a MMO formula that will always result in a lackluster game, like GW2.

 

Also note, that just because the servers are still up doesn't mean the game is making money. Lots of games maintain servers at a loss for years without any subsequent revenue other than a few additional box sales. You can't say they are making tons of money from their cash shop, unless you have actual evidence to support that.

 

Its not a real MMO, because it has no end game content. It has no endurance! It doesn't meet the standards of massive. It is merely a single player game with some multiplayer.

Am I delusional? Only took you one post to get insulting eh? Boy you sure have a lot of assumptions about me when you don't really know what the fuck you're talking about.... I guess I should know better about posting on these forums. Full of people who know pretty much everything about online gaming but yet have never coded a day in their life. B2P is indeed very profitable, if it wasn't you wouldn't have CEO's and executives considering those payment methods as well. Ohhh right... you know more than those people too I'm sure. With your vast business knowledge and fully operational MMO that you've been working on in your studio. 

And for the record, I'm not saying P2P is dead, far from it... in fact, you can charge people $20 dollar subs with an $80 dollar game if the game is actually a GOOD game to play and it wouldn't be an issue at all. It's all about the quality. But the fact that there's only about 15 games left on the market with this type of payment model SHOULD tell you something (I'm sure it doesn't, but it should). I also know GW2 is making money because their quarterly report indicates they are making money. You know, those funny stat things that they have to give investors during their conference calls?

Yeahhh I know exactly where this thread is going. Rawr P2P is the ONLY model worth talking about and everyone who disagrees with me is wrong!!! Keep at it though, don't lose the good fight.... I'm done wasting my time on this site. 

 

  Wildaboutwildstar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/13
Posts: 43

7/26/13 1:33:16 PM#46
Originally posted by Stayonboard
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by Stayonboard
Originally posted by Wildaboutwildstar
Originally posted by fiontar
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by fiontar

From what I understand, GW2 has produced superb earnings using the B2P+cash shop model. NCSoft owns Carbine and is publishing the game. If B2P/Cash Shop is working for GW2 and all indications are that it is, then there is a pretty good chance Wildstar will offer something very similar.

"Hybrid". Well, B2P+Cash Shop is a hybrid. It's almost F2P+CS, but you also have to buy the box. So, there is a possibility that WS will use the same model as GW2. "What if it's a hybrid between the GW2 model and the P2P  model"? I see that as a possibility as well. It could offer the GW2 model, plus an optional subscription that would include an exclusive benefit and maybe some cash shop currency included in the deal.

As to GW2, NCSoft doesn't break down their revenue numbers in much detail. GW2 box sales dropped by 50% vs. the previous quarter, but most MMOs today would be overjoyed to still be selling as many new boxes half a year+ after release. Even with the decline in Box sales, NCSoft Revenue was up over 300% vs. the same quarter a year ago and a good portion of that likely came from GW2 cash shop sales.

I love the GW2 business model and have spent a fair amount in the cash shop since release. However, I'd have no problem at all if Wildstar added an optional sub fee, with reasonable benefits, as long as the game is still playable and fun without the sub.

NCsoft is just the publisher.  That doesn't mean diddly shit.  They are two completely different games made by two completely different game developers.

GW2 only did good, because they intentionally didn't create any end game, or devote any resources to continually pumping out end game updates.  That is extremely expensive.  WS has 50-70% of its team devoted to doing just that!

Just to clarify, Carbine, just like Arenanet, is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft. I assume they have a similar level of creative control, but NCSoft makes the business decisions, even if done so with input from the studio.

I stand by my post and reasoning. Also, any variation on the GW2 business model may provide some insight into how NCSoft views the results of that model.

My take is that the GW2 business model will be one of the most prominent business models for future MMOs, with straight F2P being the the other most prevalent. There seems to be some room for an optional monthly subscription with value added benefits in the mix, but it has to be truly optional. The once dominant P2P  model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death.

 

Lets hope the hell not, because GW2 isn't a real MMO. In large part due to the business model they chose. There is absolutely no evidence that P2P is a dying model! Stop stating your opinions as facts! GW2 wasn't subscription based, because it was never designed to be from the start! That means no end game, no intention of updating end game. Over half of the WS staff is only working on end game! That is nearly HALF of their current development cost going to something GW2 barely spent any time on.

I really have no idea what your trying to say here. What does P2P have to do with having end game content? 

Guild wars makes PLENTY of money from their cash shop - and it's not pay to win either.... their lack of end game was a horrible mis-management of their development resources, but that isn't because they don't have a subscription. They have tons of money to implement more end game content they just choose to go with the living story route, which I could give two shits about personally even though I quite like GW2.

Oh and lastly, how is it not an real MMO? I love how you say "GW2 isn't a real MMO" then blast the person for stating his opinions as fact LOL. Hypocrite much?

 

 

It seemed pretty simple. You are stating bad opinions and claiming they are facts. They are not. The p2p model is still solid, and isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

 

 

GW2 was a cheap game to make, and to continue to develop content for. That is why it is profitable! Their lack of end game was not a horrible mismanagement. It was intentional. That is the type of game they tried to make. That is what you can always expect when an MMO is B2P.

 

Yet, you claim you want more of this? Are you delusional? B2P is a MMO formula that will always result in a lackluster game, like GW2.

 

Also note, that just because the servers are still up doesn't mean the game is making money. Lots of games maintain servers at a loss for years without any subsequent revenue other than a few additional box sales. You can't say they are making tons of money from their cash shop, unless you have actual evidence to support that.

 

Its not a real MMO, because it has no end game content. It has no endurance! It doesn't meet the standards of massive. It is merely a single player game with some multiplayer.

Am I delusional? Only took you one post to get insulting eh? Boy you sure have a lot of assumptions about me when you don't really know what the fuck you're talking about.... I guess I should know better about posting on these forums. Full of people who know pretty much everything about online gaming but yet have never coded a day in their life. B2P is indeed very profitable, if it wasn't you wouldn't have CEO's and executives considering those payment methods as well. Ohhh right... you know more than those people too I'm sure. With your vast business knowledge and fully operational MMO that you've been working on in your studio. 

And for the record, I'm not saying P2P is dead, far from it... in fact, you can charge people $20 dollar subs with an $80 dollar game if the game is actually a GOOD game to play and it wouldn't be an issue at all. It's all about the quality. But the fact that there's only about 15 games left on the market with this type of payment model SHOULD tell you something (I'm sure it doesn't, but it should). I also know GW2 is making money because their quarterly report indicates they are making money. You know, those funny stat things that they have to give investors during their conference calls?

Yeahhh I know exactly where this thread is going. Rawr P2P is the ONLY model worth talking about and everyone who disagrees with me is wrong!!! Keep at it though, don't lose the good fight.... I'm done wasting my time on this site. 

 

 

Assumptions about you? I have made no such assumptions. Delusional is not an insult. It means your thoughts on the matter are unrealistic.

You need to be a computer programmer to understand economics and business models? Odd.. I must of missed that day in both my IT courses, and economics courses. Damn!

I never even hinted that B2P wasn't profitable. You incorrectly assumed I was attacking you, and now you have allowed your emotions to sway your comments. This comment is nothing more than mere straw grasping to attack me. The vast majority of the gaming industry is B2P, so obviously it is profitable!

You didn't? I guess I imagined it when you wrote,

"The once dominant P2P model is making it's exit and once a few more major AAA titles opt out, that business model will likely die a rapid death."

Yah, it tells me they aren't quality games. It is simple supply and demand. The demand is there, the supply of quality games worth a sub is low. People are willing to pay more for quality. WS is aiming to make a quality product, and will almost certainly have a sub option.

The quarterly report that shows revenues way down? That quarterly report?

You know? Damn, do you have a magic 8 ball?
  Kratier

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/13/09
Posts: 78

7/27/13 9:04:23 PM#47

this is hilarious, this game obviously did not cost 100 million to make

its a budget f2p game with a massive pr spin to it

no it did not take 8 years to develop thats hilarious

 

this whole thing reeks of failure, they are going to try to do what every mmo in the past 6 years has been trying, make as much money as they can off of hype, then cash out

 

theyve clearly said they have no plans post-launch, expect failure

  Scorchien

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/12/06
Posts: 1086

7/27/13 9:09:06 PM#48
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by jimprouner

They have already announced the game won't be Pay to win. 

The devs clearly said that they hate that model.

Has any dev actually said they ARE Pay to Win and they like that model?

I'm pretty sure every F2P or B2P game says that it isn't Pay to Win - but that's only a judgement the players can make and only after investing considerable time into the game.

Funny how that works...

When I saw the rabid bunny race, and now this "hybrid" model nonsense, my interest went from an already low 1 or 2/10 to 0.

Carbine devs seem legit.   They actually care about making a quality game they want to play.  You can tell by the way they talk about the game.  You can feel the excitement in their voice.   On the other hand, you listen to interviews from the ESO devs and to them talking about the game sounds like a chore.

Remember WAR?

Remember SWToR , how the devs and members of this community preached the same thing, im sure you remember.. :)

  Aldous.Huxley

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/04/13
Posts: 443

7/27/13 9:22:12 PM#49

From what I've seen of this game so far, I wouldn't call it AAA. Maybe AA.

Premium Freemium, maybe?

Meh... Who knows...

  Aeander

Elite Member

Joined: 7/15/11
Posts: 240

7/27/13 10:16:38 PM#50
I'd pay a box price for this, but not a sub. It's not worth it.
  Frostvein

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/11/13
Posts: 159

7/28/13 10:55:56 AM#51
Originally posted by Hanthos

I have no problem with paying for a box or a sub, but I'm completely done with the discriminatory cash shops requiring me to pay more for anything. Subs work just fine, they create balance for all players, do not disrupt the in game economy or crafters and encourage invested players.

 

Cash Shop = Next game please...

This is how I feel as well.

Cash shops become pervasive and tend to have all of the best items, and I really dislike having to spend more money on top of my subscription to gain access to everything in the store.

Unless an MMO with a cash shop prices their in store items in such a way that subscribers have access to everything in there, for free, or there are massive discounts that allow afford everything in there with the stipend of coins then It really turns me off to a game.

 

Box plus Sub only = I might try the game, and I might end up quitting if I don't like it but you got some money from me.

Cash shop anything = I probably won't try the game.

 

Developers can take their pick.

 

 

  Wildaboutwildstar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/13
Posts: 43

7/28/13 11:00:02 AM#52
Originally posted by Scorchien
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by jimprouner
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by jimprouner

They have already announced the game won't be Pay to win. 

The devs clearly said that they hate that model.

Has any dev actually said they ARE Pay to Win and they like that model?

I'm pretty sure every F2P or B2P game says that it isn't Pay to Win - but that's only a judgement the players can make and only after investing considerable time into the game.

Funny how that works...

When I saw the rabid bunny race, and now this "hybrid" model nonsense, my interest went from an already low 1 or 2/10 to 0.

Carbine devs seem legit.   They actually care about making a quality game they want to play.  You can tell by the way they talk about the game.  You can feel the excitement in their voice.   On the other hand, you listen to interviews from the ESO devs and to them talking about the game sounds like a chore.

Remember WAR?

Remember SWToR , how the devs and members of this community preached the same thing, im sure you remember.. :)

To be fair, SWTOR did have one of the best leveling experiences in an MMO.

I never played War, so I have no idea how bad it was or even what the devs said it would be for that matter.  From my limited understand though, it was just an all around bad game though. 

 

Originally posted by Aldous.Huxley

From what I've seen of this game so far, I wouldn't call it AAA. Maybe AA.

Premium Freemium, maybe?

Meh... Who knows...

Triple A primarily refers to the budget.  This game is no doubt in the 100+  million category.

 

The game has been in development 8 years.

Lets guesstimate,

Avg 100 employees

Avg of 100k a year

8 years

8 * 100k * 100 = 80 million dollars

 

That sounds like a stupidly large sum of money, but that initial investment can easily be made back with a modest amount of box sales. 

2 million box sales * $60 = 120 million dollars  (They obviously don't get all of that money though)

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3259

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

7/28/13 11:09:27 AM#53

You know what? I hardly ever say this but i think i would really like this to be B2P.

I don't however think they will pass up the opportunity for weekly raid content to be gated behind a subscription.


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  Wildaboutwildstar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/13
Posts: 43

7/28/13 11:10:23 AM#54
Originally posted by Kratier

this is hilarious, this game obviously did not cost 100 million to make

its a budget f2p game with a massive pr spin to it

no it did not take 8 years to develop thats hilarious

 

this whole thing reeks of failure, they are going to try to do what every mmo in the past 6 years has been trying, make as much money as they can off of hype, then cash out

 

theyve clearly said they have no plans post-launch, expect failure

Everything you said is plainly false, especially that last comment. 

The devs have said, on numerous occasions, that they have a whole year of content planned post launch.

 

I can only assume you are trolling.

  Eir_S

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4700

GW2 socialist.

7/28/13 11:15:40 AM#55

If development costs are as high as stated by the OP, I think they might do the "smart" thing and go sub to earn back their investment, and then go B2P or F2P to get the inevitably dropping numbers back up.  This is good for the company, but if they end up being like EA, they'll just make their money back and then start slacking off or add an intrusive cash shop, or both.  Let's hope Carbine is better than that.

I don't like subs, but if the game impresses me, I'll pay for a few months at least until I see if it has legs.

  daveyjonez

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/30/13
Posts: 10

7/30/13 1:23:43 PM#56
Originally posted by Nitth

You know what? I hardly ever say this but i think i would really like this to be B2P.

I don't however think they will pass up the opportunity for weekly raid content to be gated behind a subscription.

It will be B2P with a sub option and a cash shop selling only aesthetic items.

  Mathadar

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/05
Posts: 24

8/06/13 1:12:56 AM#57
 If a sub only gets you shop cash and minor upgrades, who would ever sub?
  Ezbee

Novice Member

Joined: 5/29/11
Posts: 31

8/06/13 7:13:23 AM#58
Originally posted by Mathadar
 If a sub only gets you shop cash and minor upgrades, who would ever sub?

People who play WoW.

  jesusjuice69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/13
Posts: 293

8/07/13 11:57:39 PM#59
Originally posted by Mathadar
 If a sub only gets you shop cash and minor upgrades, who would ever sub?

I am sure there will be other perks.  Idk what though.  I just hope it doesn't go freemium like SWTOR!

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11414

8/19/13 8:53:14 AM#60
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