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Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn

Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn 

General Discussion  » POLL: Subworthy?

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171 posts found
  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3709

7/18/13 12:02:29 PM#101
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by ZizouX
Digital Download is only $29.99... isn't that pretty awesome?

That actually is pretty dang awesome.  Thanks for the info, all.

Actually, if you buy it from http://www.greenmangaming.com/ you can get 20% off $29.99 price tag.

Ya I got mine for 22 bucks. Never paid to little for a MMO before =-)

  Searias

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/23/08
Posts: 678

7/18/13 12:05:41 PM#102
Originally posted by DanitaKusor

I won't play a P2P game for the simple reason that I tend to waste most of the sub time because I get bored and wander off the play another game.  So currently I have Tera, Rift, TSW, Defiance, SWTOR, and GW2 installed and wander between them when I feel like it or when they bring out something new.

The problem with a subscription is you are locked into the game and have to play that month or you'll waste your money and even if you only feel like playing 1 or 2 hours a week you still have to pay a full month's subscription.  I'd prefer to see a B2P model with regular purchasable DLC additions that would encourage the company to work on new content unlike games like WoW where you can see 6months or more between content updates.

I have a question for you. If you buy a single player game (recent one) for $15 (FFXIV being $12.99 per month), how long do you think that single player last for? I fail to comprehend how playing $12.99 being a waste of money even if you play don't play much because you are still getting more play time out of p2p game than a game you paid $15 for.

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  arctarus

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/26/06
Posts: 2591

7/18/13 12:14:21 PM#103

Personally , last time I'm an advocate for p2p games, hate f2p due to cash shops and p2w items.

But after playing years of p2p, and now playing f2p/b2p games like Aion, gw2 and rift, I don't feel it's worth to pay a monthly sub anymore.

I like ARR, but somehow I just can't seem to convince myself to pay a sub for it., or for any mmo anymore.

So to help a dev financially i vote b2p, that with cash shop that sells mounts, armor or weapon skins , pets, anything as long as its not a p2w item.

 

 

RIP Orc Choppa

  Sithos

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/25/04
Posts: 318

7/18/13 12:19:57 PM#104

I don't think it's worth the sub. At least for the first few months till they work the bugs out and balance a few things. As it stands the beta tests have been a few days here and a few days there,no real long stretches and sadly they are about to enter open beta. Hopefully with OB they will have the servers online 24/7 for quite a few weeks.

What also concerns me is the fact that some classes/jobs aren't making it into beta at all for testing but will be available upon release. What company in this day and age thinks that would be good for any MMO?

The beta forums themselves aren't even for discussing aspects of the game. If you even so much as make a post about an aspect of the game that you feel would benefit from a change you get swarmed by the thousands of fan boi's who feel the game is absolutely perfect and you get shouted down and belittled.

SE also limits the amount of characters and the frequency with which you can post on the forums.  You can make a new post every 15 minutes,you can only post in a thread once per hour. No posts can go above the 1000 character mark. By limiting our ability to have any form of discourse about the game (on forums specifically for that) they have handcuffed their testers ability to provide any form of reliable feedback.

 

  Searias

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/23/08
Posts: 678

7/18/13 12:37:13 PM#105
Originally posted by Sithos

I don't think it's worth the sub. At least for the first few months till they work the bugs out and balance a few things. As it stands the beta tests have been a few days here and a few days there,no real long stretches and sadly they are about to enter open beta. Hopefully with OB they will have the servers online 24/7 for quite a few weeks.

What also concerns me is the fact that some classes/jobs aren't making it into beta at all for testing but will be available upon release. What company in this day and age thinks that would be good for any MMO?

The beta forums themselves aren't even for discussing aspects of the game. If you even so much as make a post about an aspect of the game that you feel would benefit from a change you get swarmed by the thousands of fan boi's who feel the game is absolutely perfect and you get shouted down and belittled.

SE also limits the amount of characters and the frequency with which you can post on the forums.  You can make a new post every 15 minutes,you can only post in a thread once per hour. No posts can go above the 1000 character mark. By limiting our ability to have any form of discourse about the game (on forums specifically for that) they have handcuffed their testers ability to provide any form of reliable feedback.

 

They have internal testers testing those classes/jobs that aren't in the beta and also the jobs are also being tested by the legacy beta testers. You don't need a mass number of players to tests out every aspect of the game.

As for the forum restrictions are you talking about the official FFXIV forums or the beta forums? I haven't used the official forums to check if there are restrictions. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/forum.php

From the posts I have read, I think most people who talk about changing the game talks like their opinion is the only opinion, I think that's the reason for the hostility.

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  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15957

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/18/13 12:38:08 PM#106
Originally posted by Murugan
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by Murugan
Looks like a pretty clear winner to me, the handful of trolls prophesying doom for P2P must *gasp* not speak for the majority.

 N offense but every game is that way at launch.  The real test of faith comes 2-3 months post launch.

The game released in 2010 they never put a cash shop in then.  The real test is in 2-3 months, then 6 months, then a year, then two years, then 8 years (I mean EQ has a cash shop if you can believe that).  It *COULD* happen at any time.

 

So far Square Enix hasn't folded to the pressure.  But once people like you can spend hundreds of dollars in a cash shop my experience is ruined, and I'm out.  If there is nothing else that is honest/subscription based I will concede defeat to you and just leave gaming for good (at least until someone else other than Square Enix comes to their senses and stops the money grubbing).

Why do people ignore that this happens regardless of a company supported cash-shop? This has been happening since the early days of MMO's, sites have been making a killing selling anything from gold to fully decked out characters for years. It happens in every game.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  GeezerGamer

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 5215

7/18/13 12:43:58 PM#107
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by DanitaKusor

I won't play a P2P game for the simple reason that I tend to waste most of the sub time because I get bored and wander off the play another game.  So currently I have Tera, Rift, TSW, Defiance, SWTOR, and GW2 installed and wander between them when I feel like it or when they bring out something new.

The problem with a subscription is you are locked into the game and have to play that month or you'll waste your money and even if you only feel like playing 1 or 2 hours a week you still have to pay a full month's subscription.  I'd prefer to see a B2P model with regular purchasable DLC additions that would encourage the company to work on new content unlike games like WoW where you can see 6months or more between content updates.

I have a question for you. If you buy a single player game (recent one) for $15 (FFXIV being $12.99 per month), how long do you think that single player last for? I fail to comprehend how playing $12.99 being a waste of money even if you play don't play much because you are still getting more play time out of p2p game than a game you paid $15 for.

All I can tell you is that if you need to take a good look at the way the class system works. And you'll see there really isn't a need for alts in the sense of other class systems.  FF 14 is set up so that 1 character can experience everything the game can offer.

It's the sad state of the genre. The next big title has as many threads discussing issues with it's business model than issues with the game itself.

  Searias

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/23/08
Posts: 678

7/18/13 12:46:41 PM#108
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Murugan
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by Murugan
Looks like a pretty clear winner to me, the handful of trolls prophesying doom for P2P must *gasp* not speak for the majority.

 N offense but every game is that way at launch.  The real test of faith comes 2-3 months post launch.

The game released in 2010 they never put a cash shop in then.  The real test is in 2-3 months, then 6 months, then a year, then two years, then 8 years (I mean EQ has a cash shop if you can believe that).  It *COULD* happen at any time.

 

So far Square Enix hasn't folded to the pressure.  But once people like you can spend hundreds of dollars in a cash shop my experience is ruined, and I'm out.  If there is nothing else that is honest/subscription based I will concede defeat to you and just leave gaming for good (at least until someone else other than Square Enix comes to their senses and stops the money grubbing).

Why do people ignore that this happens regardless of a company supported cash-shop? This has been happening since the early days of MMO's, sites have been making a killing selling anything from gold to fully decked out characters for years. It happens in every game.

Didn't that F2P game Allods or whatever it's called open a P2P server or something? http://2p.com/50f78a6c61fc40a44feedfce_1/Allods-OnlineRU-Opened-a-Subscription-Server.htm If subscriptions are turly gone, why would a f2p game open up a p2p server I wonder.

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  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15957

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

7/18/13 12:48:04 PM#109
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Murugan
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by Murugan
Looks like a pretty clear winner to me, the handful of trolls prophesying doom for P2P must *gasp* not speak for the majority.

 N offense but every game is that way at launch.  The real test of faith comes 2-3 months post launch.

The game released in 2010 they never put a cash shop in then.  The real test is in 2-3 months, then 6 months, then a year, then two years, then 8 years (I mean EQ has a cash shop if you can believe that).  It *COULD* happen at any time.

 

So far Square Enix hasn't folded to the pressure.  But once people like you can spend hundreds of dollars in a cash shop my experience is ruined, and I'm out.  If there is nothing else that is honest/subscription based I will concede defeat to you and just leave gaming for good (at least until someone else other than Square Enix comes to their senses and stops the money grubbing).

Why do people ignore that this happens regardless of a company supported cash-shop? This has been happening since the early days of MMO's, sites have been making a killing selling anything from gold to fully decked out characters for years. It happens in every game.

Didn't that F2P game Allods or whatever it's called open a P2P server or something? http://2p.com/50f78a6c61fc40a44feedfce_1/Allods-OnlineRU-Opened-a-Subscription-Server.htm If subscriptions are turly gone, why would a f2p game open up a p2p server I wonder.

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  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 3170

7/18/13 12:48:13 PM#110
Originally posted by Sithos

I don't think it's worth the sub. At least for the first few months till they work the bugs out and balance a few things. As it stands the beta tests have been a few days here and a few days there,no real long stretches and sadly they are about to enter open beta. Hopefully with OB they will have the servers online 24/7 for quite a few weeks.

What also concerns me is the fact that some classes/jobs aren't making it into beta at all for testing but will be available upon release. What company in this day and age thinks that would be good for any MMO?

The beta forums themselves aren't even for discussing aspects of the game. If you even so much as make a post about an aspect of the game that you feel would benefit from a change you get swarmed by the thousands of fan boi's who feel the game is absolutely perfect and you get shouted down and belittled.

SE also limits the amount of characters and the frequency with which you can post on the forums.  You can make a new post every 15 minutes,you can only post in a thread once per hour. No posts can go above the 1000 character mark. By limiting our ability to have any form of discourse about the game (on forums specifically for that) they have handcuffed their testers ability to provide any form of reliable feedback.

 

Unlikely that open beta will be very long. I can't see it being more than a week at the most. The open beta times are only being announced on the 8th of August. The game launches on the 27th, and there's Early Access as well.

So, between the 8th and the 27th, there's Open Beta, server wipes and launch prep, and Early Access. That's a very busy 19 days...

  furbans

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/10/13
Posts: 966

7/18/13 12:49:27 PM#111
Originally posted by Doogiehowser
Its been years since i came across a MMO which is worth a monthly sub and after playing the beta, even thought it is a fun game, it falls in the same category of MMOS that are not worth a sub after first month is over.

And I'm sure people said the exact same thing for TSW and SWTOR...

  GeezerGamer

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 5215

7/18/13 12:50:59 PM#112
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by Murugan
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by Murugan
Looks like a pretty clear winner to me, the handful of trolls prophesying doom for P2P must *gasp* not speak for the majority.

 N offense but every game is that way at launch.  The real test of faith comes 2-3 months post launch.

The game released in 2010 they never put a cash shop in then.  The real test is in 2-3 months, then 6 months, then a year, then two years, then 8 years (I mean EQ has a cash shop if you can believe that).  It *COULD* happen at any time.

 

So far Square Enix hasn't folded to the pressure.  But once people like you can spend hundreds of dollars in a cash shop my experience is ruined, and I'm out.  If there is nothing else that is honest/subscription based I will concede defeat to you and just leave gaming for good (at least until someone else other than Square Enix comes to their senses and stops the money grubbing).

Why do people ignore that this happens regardless of a company supported cash-shop? This has been happening since the early days of MMO's, sites have been making a killing selling anything from gold to fully decked out characters for years. It happens in every game.

Didn't that F2P game Allods or whatever it's called open a P2P server or something? http://2p.com/50f78a6c61fc40a44feedfce_1/Allods-OnlineRU-Opened-a-Subscription-Server.htm If subscriptions are turly gone, why would a f2p game open up a p2p server I wonder.

WOW! I'd love to see how that one pans out. Has there been anything further on how it's going?

It's the sad state of the genre. The next big title has as many threads discussing issues with it's business model than issues with the game itself.

  Naqaj

Novice Member

Joined: 7/24/09
Posts: 1681

7/18/13 12:53:36 PM#113
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by ZizouX
Digital Download is only $29.99... isn't that pretty awesome?

That actually is pretty dang awesome.  Thanks for the info, all.

Actually, if you buy it from http://www.greenmangaming.com/ you can get 20% off $29.99 price tag.

Ya I got mine for 22 bucks. Never paid to little for a MMO before =-)

I got it for 10 back when prices tanked after the first launch ;P

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3709

7/18/13 1:07:33 PM#114
Originally posted by Naqaj
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by ZizouX
Digital Download is only $29.99... isn't that pretty awesome?

That actually is pretty dang awesome.  Thanks for the info, all.

Actually, if you buy it from http://www.greenmangaming.com/ you can get 20% off $29.99 price tag.

Ya I got mine for 22 bucks. Never paid to little for a MMO before =-)

I got it for 10 back when prices tanked after the first launch ;P

Thats it... I want my money back!!!!

  Ayulin

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/13
Posts: 344

7/18/13 1:35:44 PM#115
Originally posted by DanitaKusor

I won't play a P2P game for the simple reason that I tend to waste most of the sub time because I get bored and wander off the play another game.  So currently I have Tera, Rift, TSW, Defiance, SWTOR, and GW2 installed and wander between them when I feel like it or when they bring out something new.

The problem with a subscription is you are locked into the game and have to play that month or you'll waste your money and even if you only feel like playing 1 or 2 hours a week you still have to pay a full month's subscription.  I'd prefer to see a B2P model with regular purchasable DLC additions that would encourage the company to work on new content unlike games like WoW where you can see 6months or more between content updates.

You're not "locked into the game". You've voluntarily chosen to sub. You can voluntarily choose to unsub at any time.

I mean, after a certain point, if you're only logging in once or twice in a month's time, then I would say "yeah, probably not worth paying the sub for something you're not even playing". However, even if you log in for 2 hours a week, maximum, that's about $1.60 for an hour of entertainment if you're on the basic $13/mnth plan. That's still a darn good value.

If you find you're not really enjoying that 2 hours a week of gametime, then it's likely you're just not digging the game and so, yeah.. it wouldn't make sense to continue subbing to it.

Ultimately, it's all subjective. I'm genuinely enjoying the game, so even if I could only play ~8 hours a month, to me it's still more than worth the sub fee. I measure the value in the amount of fun I'm having, not the amount of time I'm able to play.

Generally speaking (ie. not at you personally, Danita)...

If you're someone who's accustom to game-hopping, and doesn't put any serious time into one or two primary MMOs, then I can see where the disconnect is... and it isn't with the game's revenue model.

At the end of the day, though, there's this extremely egocentric mentality among many MMO gamers these days, who feel that somehow a game's design or its revenue model should be molded around their personal preferences or life situations.

If someone enjoys an open world PvP MMO and really finds that to be the only kind of game they can enjoy, then it makes absolutely no sense for them to go to a PvE MMO and start demanding that open world PvP be added "because that's what's best" for them. The opposite is also true.

Likewise, if someone has trouble finding a sense of value in a monthly sub because they're a self-admitted game-hopper, or just don't have a lot of time to play, asserting that a MMO "should change its revenue model to B2P or F2P because it would work better for them" is completely self-centered and unrealistic.

So many people will argue that games should be designed to cater to their own personal preferences or situations. "I'm an adult with a family and full-time job and I don't have the time I once did to spend on these games, so they need to make them more accessible" - how often do we see arguments like that? Basically, "My life situation makes me special, and it's all about me". I'm amazed at how many demonstrate that kind of mentality so openly and unabashedly. The lack of a grounded and realistic perspective some people demonstrate is truly disturbing.

The idea is to choose entertainment that suits your preferences, your circumstances and your budget. That's the wise and reasonable thing to do. Choosing activities - ostensibly to enjoy them - which are in opposition to what you enjoy, etc, and then arguing that they should be changed around to suit you, is just plain ridiculous.

 

  Volgore

Tipster

Joined: 6/15/08
Posts: 2092

Posts deleted: 12589457

7/18/13 1:47:20 PM#116

Not worth to sub until i know about the quantity and quality of endgame.

I'm tired of games i sub 1 month to and then find out i can dump it because there is nothing to do. And no, grinding up the Xth job on the same char through the same content only with fewer quest isn't an option.

  Wolfhammer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 540

Bleh!

7/18/13 3:02:48 PM#117
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by GeezerGamer
There is a market for P2P games, They just can't be games where you cap in a week and then have a small handful of things to do at level cap.

Ding ding ding we have a winner!

+1 :)

  PolyMacon

Novice Member

Joined: 2/05/13
Posts: 5

7/18/13 3:06:18 PM#118

Yes,

   I already have 10 months prepaid (Legacy)and cant wait to rejoin all my old buddy's from FFXI who moved on to different games.

 

  Sephrinx

Novice Member

Joined: 7/13/13
Posts: 73

7/18/13 3:13:46 PM#119
Originally posted by Wolfhammer
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by GeezerGamer
There is a market for P2P games, They just can't be games where you cap in a week and then have a small handful of things to do at level cap.

Ding ding ding we have a winner!

+1 :)

Yeah, pretty much this. The problem with most MMO's nowadays is the lack of endgame content, or meaningful side content available to do once you hit level cap. I don't want a stupid non combat pet, I don't want a stupid ass weapon or armor skin, and I don't want retarded achievements. Another problem is the time it takes to actually hit the level cap. I remember my first level 60 in wow took my 3 months to level. It was a paladin and it was a lengthy process to solo quest. When I finally hit the level cap I could start finishing up my Lightforge Set, and turn it into Soulforge in order to start getting into the more endgame instances, such as UBRS and Strat, and eventually work my way up towards molten core and  BWL.

 

Anyway, the point being I was so over whelmed with content my head would spin. I finally had access to the FUN and INTENSE part of the game. I had all my talent points, I had my mount, I had my guild. They helped me get geared, which took weeks, not just 3-4 days like todays MMO standards to start raiding. And then i settled in as a holy pally and started to have the most amazing MMO experience I can recall. There are few other moments in my MMO history that can compare to the first time I downed Golemagg or Ragnaros. That shit was straight EPIC!

 

These days, once you hit level cap, there is very very little too do. I'm pointing at you, Guild Wars 2.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 6110

7/18/13 3:21:29 PM#120
Originally posted by Searias
Originally posted by DanitaKusor

I won't play a P2P game for the simple reason that I tend to waste most of the sub time because I get bored and wander off the play another game.  So currently I have Tera, Rift, TSW, Defiance, SWTOR, and GW2 installed and wander between them when I feel like it or when they bring out something new.

The problem with a subscription is you are locked into the game and have to play that month or you'll waste your money and even if you only feel like playing 1 or 2 hours a week you still have to pay a full month's subscription.  I'd prefer to see a B2P model with regular purchasable DLC additions that would encourage the company to work on new content unlike games like WoW where you can see 6months or more between content updates.

I have a question for you. If you buy a single player game (recent one) for $15 (FFXIV being $12.99 per month), how long do you think that single player last for? I fail to comprehend how playing $12.99 being a waste of money even if you play don't play much because you are still getting more play time out of p2p game than a game you paid $15 for.

When I play a single player game I can go back and replay it any time I want.  If I want to go back to a sub-locked game I can't play it unless I pony up more money and then only for as long as I keep the recurring payment going.

Curse you AquaScum!

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