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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn: Beta Three in FFXIV

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  Ayulin

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/13
Posts: 344

6/25/13 10:40:49 PM#61
Originally posted by MondoA2J

To be honest. I think ARR is a great game and I have had fun playing it.

Unfortunately the entire subscription thing is old fashioned and I just don't enjoy that feeling of "Well I paid for a month. I need to play it now." I guess im a casual? Whatever I don't care about naming it.

I see this said a lot, and I never understand it. It just seems so backwards to me.

 

You should be paying for something because you enjoy it and want to partake in it. You shouldn't be feeling you 'need to' partake in something because you're paying for it. Phrases like "obligated to" or "need to" should not factor in when it comes to something you're doing voluntarily because you enjoy it.

 

If it comes back to the "well, I feel like if I'm not playing enough, then I'm not getting my money's worth", then I don't get that either, because it's such a nebulous point of view. It seems to be based on looking at the cost as a lump sum without regard of how it breaks down. And anyway what's "enough"? Is there some specific number of hours required to be "enough"? Is it more of a non-specific "feeling" thing? If so, how do you even begin to quantify that?

 

For example... If you're paying $15 a month on a sub (XIV is cheaper than that), then you're paying about 50 cents a day. Half a dollar for 24 hours of "all you can eat" access.  That's one way of looking at it.

 

Another way to break it down is by  hour.

 

Let's be extremely conservative and say you only play 4 hours a week. That's 16 hours in a month. That comes out to just under a dollar per hour.  I don't think anyone would call that a bad deal. And that's a very conservative example.

 

Let's take my situation as a slightly more "normal" example (and probably still on the conservative side). I play about 2-3 hours at a stretch, roughly 5 days a week. Sometimes less, sometimes more.

 

Let's be conservative and say 2 hours per session, 5 days a week. That's 10 hours a week,  40 hours a month. That means I'm paying about 37 cents an hour. Thirty-seven cents for an  hour of entertainment. And that's based on more conservative figures.

 

How could anyone call that a bad deal with a straight face?

 

People tend to worry about "not getting their money's worth" when they're not playing, when it really makes far more sense to think of how little you're paying per hour when you are playing.

 

It's all perspective.

 
  Thupli

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/25/11
Posts: 408

6/25/13 10:48:06 PM#62
It will be interesting to see if the payment model explodes.  It sure could if subbers don't stay.  Which is very likely with the hype this game is getting.
  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4110

6/25/13 11:20:45 PM#63

Loved the beta, can't wait for August.  That being said, I loved FFXI big time.  One of the things I hope this game does that FFXI did, was to bring a certain immersive quality in game as well as out.  A very large Metagame if you will.  FFXI had this in large quantities.  I remember reading forums for hours on various FFXI topics from job macros, subjob combos, Mission tips, leveling and camping tips, and so on and enjoying that as much as playing the game.  I kind of miss that level of metagaming and theory crafting.

The graphics and music are superb, as is the story, the controls are finally more friendly and modern.  I just hope that beyond quests, leveling other classes will be just as fun.  I almost wish the quests were tied to a Fame system similar to FFXI.  Maybe my fears in this area are moot as I only got to level 11 and still had plenty of quests all over each map I visited. 

Lastly, I definitely need to see what mid game and elder game look like as those things help a player set goals and give them something to look forward to and work toward.  Much like in FFXI there were tons of things to set one's sight's on and achieve, almost to the point of being overwhelming.  I really hope this game engenders that same level of content and quality.

http://www.twitch.tv/elockethemmoaddict

https://twitter.com/MMOAddicted

  MagKiln

Novice Member

Joined: 11/22/12
Posts: 56

6/25/13 11:28:56 PM#64

I am bored wake me up when another paradigm shifting game is produced as WOW did in 2004! I will probably die in my sleep waiting :(

 

  twrule

Novice Member

Joined: 7/15/09
Posts: 1260

6/26/13 12:27:23 AM#65
Originally posted by Ayulin

How could anyone call that a bad deal with a straight face?

People tend to worry about "not getting their money's worth" when they're not playing, when it really makes far more sense to think of how little you're paying per hour when you are playing.

It's all perspective.

I sympathize with those who worry about 'getting their money's worth' on monthly subscription models. It's not that anyone thinks its a bad deal; it's really just a psychological pressure. In a B2P model, I can decide not to play at all for 2 months, come back for a few days, quit again for a week, etc., and not have to even worry about things like whether I should cancel my sub to save the 15 bucks that would otherwise be wasted, for instance. As someone who at one point was in a situation where 15 bucks made a big difference in a tight monthly budget, I can say this pressure isn't to be underestimated. Even when one isn't on such a tight budget, the thought that all the time not spent playing is wasting money is uncomfortable.

That said, it's not that one should foist responsibility for this entirely on the game producers; one just has to keep from losing sight of why they play the game at all (for example, to spend time with friends), and regulate their playing habits around that instead.

  nightowl79a

Novice Member

Joined: 2/04/11
Posts: 26

6/26/13 12:29:44 AM#66
Yes please no free to play, Please don't make me enjoy 1/2 a game unless I spend endless amounts of money in a cash shop. I'd rather pay a sub and not worry about weather that guy got his amazing looking sword because he has loads of money to throw at a game, or weather he got it by doing something cool in the game. 
  nightowl79a

Novice Member

Joined: 2/04/11
Posts: 26

6/26/13 12:36:01 AM#67
Originally posted by Ayulin
Originally posted by MondoA2J

To be honest. I think ARR is a great game and I have had fun playing it.

Unfortunately the entire subscription thing is old fashioned and I just don't enjoy that feeling of "Well I paid for a month. I need to play it now." I guess im a casual? Whatever I don't care about naming it.

I see this said a lot, and I never understand it. It just seems so backwards to me.

 

You should be paying for something because you enjoy it and want to partake in it. You shouldn't be feeling you 'need to' partake in something because you're paying for it. Phrases like "obligated to" or "need to" should not factor in when it comes to something you're doing voluntarily because you enjoy it.

 

If it comes back to the "well, I feel like if I'm not playing enough, then I'm not getting my money's worth", then I don't get that either, because it's such a nebulous point of view. It seems to be based on looking at the cost as a lump sum without regard of how it breaks down. And anyway what's "enough"? Is there some specific number of hours required to be "enough"? Is it more of a non-specific "feeling" thing? If so, how do you even begin to quantify that?

 

For example... If you're paying $15 a month on a sub (XIV is cheaper than that), then you're paying about 50 cents a day. Half a dollar for 24 hours of "all you can eat" access.  That's one way of looking at it.

 

Another way to break it down is by  hour.

 

Let's be extremely conservative and say you only play 4 hours a week. That's 16 hours in a month. That comes out to just under a dollar per hour.  I don't think anyone would call that a bad deal. And that's a very conservative example.

 

Let's take my situation as a slightly more "normal" example (and probably still on the conservative side). I play about 2-3 hours at a stretch, roughly 5 days a week. Sometimes less, sometimes more.

 

Let's be conservative and say 2 hours per session, 5 days a week. That's 10 hours a week,  40 hours a month. That means I'm paying about 37 cents an hour. Thirty-seven cents for an  hour of entertainment. And that's based on more conservative figures.

 

How could anyone call that a bad deal with a straight face?

 

People tend to worry about "not getting their money's worth" when they're not playing, when it really makes far more sense to think of how little you're paying per hour when you are playing.

 

It's all perspective.

 
 

You sir are awesome. Not to mention you get the whole game for that cheap, not just parts of the game. 

  sudo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/23/05
Posts: 698

6/26/13 12:51:25 AM#68
Originally posted by Fendel84M
Ill say it in Japanese.

The game is super happy fun time. It will bring many greatness and honor for my life.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

"Only in quiet waters do things mirror themselves undistorted.
Only in a quiet mind is adequate perception of the world."
Hans Margolius

  Ashikuro

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 21

6/26/13 2:01:04 AM#69
I've been playing the beta and its soooooo much better than the first version of the game. That said, the game is no where near as good as RIFT which is F2P. I'm really not sure how this game will succeed with its dated subscription model. If it was the best game on the market then people would pay, but its not.
  redcloud16

Novice Member

Joined: 1/08/11
Posts: 223

There is no chance unless you take one.

6/26/13 2:04:05 AM#70

Yoshi has acknowledged the lack of a scouting class and wants to work on that as soon as possible. 

 

The Arcanist and its two jobs, Summoner and Scholar, were added since Arcanist was promised from 1.0 but never deivered, and they needed to balance out the melee to caster ratio. 

Originally posted by Ashikuro
I've been playing the beta and its soooooo much better than the first version of the game. That said, the game is no where near as good as RIFT which is F2P. I'm really not sure how this game will succeed with its dated subscription model. If it was the best game on the market then people would pay, but its not.

Opinion. I played RIFT for a bit, even subbed for a month, but for me personally, ARR is far more entertaining, higher quality, better looking and it has that 'magic.'

 

That magic of adventure, when you played your first MMO. 

 

  MondoA2J

Novice Member

Joined: 3/18/13
Posts: 259

"You are mine, I'm yours, and if we die, we die. But first we'll live." Ygritte

6/26/13 3:05:13 AM#71
Originally posted by Ayulin
Originally posted by MondoA2J

To be honest. I think ARR is a great game and I have had fun playing it.

Unfortunately the entire subscription thing is old fashioned and I just don't enjoy that feeling of "Well I paid for a month. I need to play it now." I guess im a casual? Whatever I don't care about naming it.

I see this said a lot, and I never understand it. It just seems so backwards to me.

 

You should be paying for something because you enjoy it and want to partake in it. You shouldn't be feeling you 'need to' partake in something because you're paying for it. Phrases like "obligated to" or "need to" should not factor in when it comes to something you're doing voluntarily because you enjoy it.

 

If it comes back to the "well, I feel like if I'm not playing enough, then I'm not getting my money's worth", then I don't get that either, because it's such a nebulous point of view. It seems to be based on looking at the cost as a lump sum without regard of how it breaks down. And anyway what's "enough"? Is there some specific number of hours required to be "enough"? Is it more of a non-specific "feeling" thing? If so, how do you even begin to quantify that?

 

For example... If you're paying $15 a month on a sub (XIV is cheaper than that), then you're paying about 50 cents a day. Half a dollar for 24 hours of "all you can eat" access.  That's one way of looking at it.

 

Another way to break it down is by  hour.

 

Let's be extremely conservative and say you only play 4 hours a week. That's 16 hours in a month. That comes out to just under a dollar per hour.  I don't think anyone would call that a bad deal. And that's a very conservative example.

 

Let's take my situation as a slightly more "normal" example (and probably still on the conservative side). I play about 2-3 hours at a stretch, roughly 5 days a week. Sometimes less, sometimes more.

 

Let's be conservative and say 2 hours per session, 5 days a week. That's 10 hours a week,  40 hours a month. That means I'm paying about 37 cents an hour. Thirty-seven cents for an  hour of entertainment. And that's based on more conservative figures.

 

How could anyone call that a bad deal with a straight face?

 

People tend to worry about "not getting their money's worth" when they're not playing, when it really makes far more sense to think of how little you're paying per hour when you are playing.

 

It's all perspective.

 
 
 Technically, I never said I didn't wanna pay for it. All I said was I prefer a B2P model then P2P model. You posted one snippet of my post and took it out of context. Also I even said it was a personal preference.

As many have pointed out. There are times when life simply gets in the way or other interests, other games.

With a P2P model and my precious free time, these don't always mix very well. I enjoy the freedom of being able to leave and do something else for 3 weeks to a month or 2 and not worry about cancelling a subscription simply cause I am going to play Watch Dogs for example. If im leaving town to go visit the In-laws for a week. If my job requires me to travel and I won't have time/decent internet to access my MMO. Its not always about hours or playtime but if I want to hop on for a sec and say hello to friends or hell do a quick one hour dungeon then I need to shell out that 15 buck barrier for it. Now I will oblige your example of hours needed to get "Bang for your buck."
 
MMO's are the most time consuming hobby one could have almost. Your entire example of you getting bang for your buck isn't exactly straight forward. Given the fact that you have times in a MMO that simply your not doing ANYTHING. Load screens, traveling, waiting for a party, waiting for a patch(okay that is only sometimes). Waiting in a log in que. Point is your not always getting bang for your buck the entire time your playing. If you want an example straight outta the FFXIV game, anyone remember the Line?
 
I know that was a glitch in beta. No biggie. Simply put there is a downtime in MMOs that doesn't always equal bang for your buck. Okay lets take out time to eat in your 3-5 hour block. Time for the bathroom. RING RING...whats that? Your mom is calling, she wants to know why you haven't called her in 7 days and talk about that for an hour. See what im doing here? Stacks up quick.   Now we could sit here and argue the difference between what qualifies as bang and what doesn't or we could simply acknowledge that I have different perspective then you.
 

Its not that im expecting some sort of higher demand or even that things conform to what I want. I just have a preference. 15 bucks isn't really that much. I acknowledge this but IF I don't touch the game for reasons outside my control(work, family, travel) or reasons within my control (other games, hobbies, friends) Then suddenly that 15 dollars is a waste of money.

Remember, its all perspective.

MMORPG Gamers/Developers need a reality check!

  tommygunzII

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 322

6/26/13 5:35:27 AM#72
Originally posted by elocke

Loved the beta, can't wait for August.  That being said, I loved FFXI big time.  One of the things I hope this game does that FFXI did, was to bring a certain immersive quality in game as well as out.  A very large Metagame if you will.  FFXI had this in large quantities.  I remember reading forums for hours on various FFXI topics from job macros, subjob combos, Mission tips, leveling and camping tips, and so on and enjoying that as much as playing the game.  I kind of miss that level of metagaming and theory crafting.

The graphics and music are superb, as is the story, the controls are finally more friendly and modern.  I just hope that beyond quests, leveling other classes will be just as fun.  I almost wish the quests were tied to a Fame system similar to FFXI.  Maybe my fears in this area are moot as I only got to level 11 and still had plenty of quests all over each map I visited. 

Lastly, I definitely need to see what mid game and elder game look like as those things help a player set goals and give them something to look forward to and work toward.  Much like in FFXI there were tons of things to set one's sight's on and achieve, almost to the point of being overwhelming.  I really hope this game engenders that same level of content and quality.

 

Well said. I couldn't agree more.

 
  PolyMacon

Novice Member

Joined: 2/05/13
Posts: 5

6/26/13 6:11:18 AM#73

$15.00 = 730 hours of play

this week I spent $57.00 at the movies for 3* hours 

  majinant

Novice Member

Joined: 4/17/07
Posts: 432

6/26/13 7:09:16 AM#74
I will be playing this once the PS4 comes out. My PC cannot handle it and I see no point in getting a PS3 this late.

  Azarten

Novice Member

Joined: 3/19/13
Posts: 34

6/26/13 8:02:06 AM#75

When I played the first couple of Beta's the game didn't really seem to be what I was looking for, but after playing the last Beta I've subsequently ordered the CE version.  I'm not really sure what changed or if it was me simply persisting with the game but now I find myself loading up the launcher to see if the servers are up (damn that Yoshi P for making me want to play more when I can't).

 

The other reason I've purchased the CE is because it will be subscription based.  I've tried so many F2P games and for me I don't like the developers methods behind trying to maximize their profits.  It would seem unlike many others in this world of capitalism I still believe that even though a business is there to make money they should retain some ethics whilst doing so.

  Kry0gen

Novice Member

Joined: 11/06/12
Posts: 11

6/26/13 10:19:57 AM#76

No game will get one sided reviews, everyone has a different view of what the perfect immersive online world is. What I believe that FF:ARR is accomplishing is giving FF fans something new in this universe in the best way they know and feel comfortable doing it in.

If you like the Old school combat of systematic strategic play style with stunning graphics and extensive crafting this is for you. If your looking for fast pace in your face finger twitching combat this is not for you.

I really want to point out the amount of in depths story telling and player driven content. You get to customize your character to a level not seen in 90% of other games, you feel connected to the world you live in because every stat increase, gear color, class, or even house design and crafting choice is specific to you.... no one else will have a character with 100% the same everything, you can and will stand out for what your character is and will be if it is the house design, crafting choice, gear customization, or even the class you pick and train as or just look of your character.

That is what attracts me a person that has not cared much for the FF universe to this game to the point of buying the CE of FF:ARR that I did not even do for SWTOR which was like that bad Ex girlfriend that keeps coming to your mind because of her looks and good times spent together.

  MagKiln

Novice Member

Joined: 11/22/12
Posts: 56

6/26/13 10:40:09 AM#77
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz........
  Spaceweed10

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/01/08
Posts: 656

Where do we go from here?

6/26/13 10:45:26 AM#78
Originally posted by Sovrath

Yoshi is committed to releasing a subscription FF14:ARR and I respect the decision, I just wonder if that market segment has come and gone?

 

Nope I'm still here.

I think the subscription model will return with a vengeance - folk are suddenly realising that the trash that comes with 'F2P' are a plague that should be avoided.

I'll happily pay a sub for a AAA title.

  plutosams

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/12
Posts: 49

6/26/13 12:07:51 PM#79
I am really excited for this game and preordered yesterday.  I am also glad they are sticking with P2P, makes me much more inclined to play and stay.
  Arourie

Novice Member

Joined: 3/11/13
Posts: 4

6/26/13 6:47:15 PM#80
Played FFXI,RIFT,FFXIV, TERA, all in P2P mode RIFT & TERA in F2P mode. I like the P2P mode better F2P = haha "Dangle the shiny" You know you want it BUY IT! = oh look I didn't pay a 12.99 subscription and getting my gear to +12 only cost me 100 real dollars. ummm ?????!!!! LOL. no thanks give me my P2P with content and a sense of accomplishment.
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