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General Discussion  » Non Consensual PVP By The Subscription Numbers

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115 posts found
  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2660

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

6/22/13 10:51:34 PM#61
Originally posted by ice-vortex
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by Rusque
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by fyerwall

Serious question: Why does PvP have to be Non-Consensual to be considered 'Good PvP'?

Because I see all this talk about it has to be, but never a reason as to 'why'.

Because some of us prefer a certain play style and forcing a particular play style on others detracts from the game.  Honest answer!

 

Same as forced grouping, forced raiding or any other element in an MMO.  Choices and options are what we want, not pigeon holing us into a game style we may or may not like.  I love dungeon delving but I would never obtuse to believe that dungeon delving with a group should be required to play a game. 

So forced non-consensual pvp is a-okay, but forced grouping, raiding, and anything else is not?

Maybe that's why so many people prefer BG's/Arena style pvp, because it's optional and not forced upon them.

You make no sense.  You cant force something that is optional.  And I said I don't believe in forced anything, whether it be grouping or raiding. 

 

Your signature is wrong. What you say is a sandbox is just an "open world" or "free roaming" game.

 

An open world is a type of video game level design where a player can roam freely through a virtual world and is given considerable freedom in choosing how or when to approach objectives.[1] The term "free roam" is also used, as is "sandbox" and "free-roaming".[2][3] "Open world" and "free-roaming" suggest the absence of artificial barriers,[4] in contrast to the invisible walls and loading screens that are common in linear level designs. An "open world" game does not necessarily imply a sandbox. In a true "sandbox", the player has tools to modify the world themselves and create how they play.[5] Generally open world games still enforce some restrictions in the game environment, either due to absolute technical limitations or in-game limitations (such as locked areas) imposed by a game's linearity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_world

That bolded part is part of the overall definition not exclusive of it.  Any or all of those elements are part of the sandbox definition.  The problem is gamers have been trying to associate sandbox to certain elements for years now and that is a false premise.

 

One recurring theme across this genre is the open-ended "sandbox" style gameplay that is most often associated with the slightly more rigid Grand Theft Auto series (see book Chapter 9, "Grand Theft Auto III (2001): The Consolejacking Life") today; players are mostly free to choose their own way to accumulate capital and judge their own success at the game.

There is no one right way to play these games, and plots (if they exist at all) have little bearing. All of these games are highly detailed and complex, requiring comprehensive manuals and rigid study.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  ice-vortex

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/21/10
Posts: 909

6/22/13 10:51:46 PM#62
Originally posted by furbans

EVE took A LONG ASS TIME to get those numbers and is like the WoW of PvP centric games.  So far only none has been able to pull off what EVE did.  Not to mention EVE is a COMPLETELY different entity than ..... well ALL MMOs and is the most intricate, complex, massive, freedom MMO out there.  Hell it takes one MONTHS to really learn just one aspect of EVE and there is so much out there it ain't even funny.

If non-consensual fantasy based PvP MMOs were such a highly popular game then why is it that Age of Washu, Darkfall, Mortal Online, and not sure if Warhammer Online fits the bill all received less that stellar recognition if not downright hate for some.  Hell even Camelot Unchained only got about 15k backers.  Then look at PvE focused crowd and it dwarfs the PvP centric game.

Also the OP needs to compare all non-consensual PvP MMOs to ALL PvE centric MMOs.  This is what companies will see, a very much higher market by NOT making a non-consensual MMO, at least not forced but as an option.

 

Just looking at numbers, it would tell us that WoW-clones are the most popular, so by your logic they should make a WoW-clone.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11925

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

6/22/13 10:57:06 PM#63
Originally posted by DocBrody

So by this theory when I log in to a FFA game I know what to expect, so it is consensual PvP too.

In fact EvE Darkfall and Mortal Online are consensual PvP too, everyone agrees to the rules of the game which makes it consensual

False.

To clear things up for the people unfamiliar with the topic (godforfuckingbid you should google it and know what you're talking about):

 

The term came from the multi-facet server feature introduced to Ultima Online during the Renaissance expansion in May 2000.  Consensual PVP is where player-versus-player combat is relegated to only consensual agreement or warring guilds. A non-consensual PVP area is one with FFA PVP, where there is no explicit agreement between players/guilds to have combat that is restricted to the agreeing parties. 

 

Link: http://www.1up.com/features/ultima-online-turns-10?pager.offset=2

  Sukiyaki

Elite Member

Joined: 8/14/09
Posts: 1288

6/24/13 5:56:05 PM#64

GW2 earnings/sales a public (converted them to U.S. Dollar and rounded by 100.000).

GW2 earned 31 Million $US in the first 3 months (January - March) of this year without  the great margin of the 3 Million box sales reached before January 15  .

GW2 earned little over 140 Million $US in the 4.5 last months of last year in which is was available to the market, accounting for the major part of the 3 Million sales until 2013.01.15.

In total GW2 earned over 170 Million $US in the barely over 7 months it was released until the last report.

The total processing, box production and remaining distribution cost included under other variable costs in these past three quarters sum up to 33 Million $US for all game title published by  NCSoft including Blade & Soul, Aion, Lineage 2, Lineage 1 and other game title than GW2.  Distributor shares are already excluded from sales.

Net revenues of GW2 and in general are not disclosed by NCSoft.

Sadly any data previously claimed about revenues, net revenues, distribution cost and sales windows in this entire thread regarding ANet or GW2 are fabrications and misinformation or (only in the case of the the OP) poorly informed misconception or a very weak estimation attempt.

 

EvE subscription do not return return exactly 15$ per month, just like GW2 does not earn simply 60$ per sale ever, not necessarily close unless per coincidence in either case. But EVE also has micro transaction systems and account setup fees.

EvE 2011 annual earnings amounted to $US 66 Million sales, while growing from 300.000 close to 400.000 active player (not excluding Chinese Serenity player). Next to royalties this however also includes the upfront licensing fees paid by EvEs Chinese publishing parter in 2012 which could range from few hundred thousand to several millions depending on length and terms of the contract.  Latter holds truth for GW2 in 2012 or 2013 either.

 

Setting aside the schoolboy calculations. EvE simply turns out to be the biggest earner of all niche game title, while GW2 is just one of the more cost efficient mainstream type game title for the players. End the end player activity counts. See League of Legends or World of Tanks. Those are mainstream without any argument needed dwarfing EvEs  userbase, still their ARPU rates are fractions of EvEs. Just because someone might have paid 5 times more than you does not mean he represents the public habits and trends 5 times more or in reverse the publics dislikes.

  Giffen

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/28/04
Posts: 213

6/24/13 6:42:03 PM#65
Originally posted by dejoblue

GW2 has sold 3 million copies. That is 3,000,000 x $60 = $180,000,000

If GW2 comes out with an expansion at year 2 then they will have made

$90,000,000 per year

 

EVE Online has 500,000 SUBSCRIBERS that pay $15/month. That is:

500,000 x $15 = $7,500,000 x 12 months = .....

$90,000,000 per year

 

Does this mean that GW2 is "niche" or does it mean that EVE is "mainstream"

 

What does this bode for EQN, a "sandbox" game like EVE?

What does this say about the marketability of Non consensual PVP versus traditional PVE MMORPG games?

 

GW2 has nonconsensual PvP?  Who knew?  I played it for several months and never ran into a pvper... (note: exclusive zones for pvp does not make a game have nonconsensual PvP...that is called Consensual PvP)

 

As for Eve, a very large portion of the game's population does not even venture into low sec space, they play the game for the market and economy, not the pvp. 

  Dejoblue

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/11
Posts: 295

I'll give them heroics...and when everyone is super...no one will be.

 
OP  6/24/13 6:56:14 PM#66

Thanks for corroborating my OP.

GW2 made $170M so far in the months it has been out. That is pretty close to the 180 Million for 3 million units sold. Of course there are cash shop sales.

EVE made, in 2011, while growing from 300-400K subscribers, $66M(366,666 subscriber as per $15/month). They have since had another year, 2012, growing from 400K - 500K. Assuming the same revenue, here we go assuming again!, that is the $90M in my OP.

The point is not the semantics of the GW2 to EVE comparison per se, it is recognizing that EVE is growing, is subscription based and meets the revenue of the box sales of GW2.

GW2 box sales = EVE subscription revenue.

GW2 is successful and EVE is successful.

The cash shop has nothing to do with it because we are taking this market performance and developing it for use with Everquest Next which will be planned to have significant cash shop revenue just like EQ and EQ2(and all of their other games.)

Everquest Next will have a cash shop. SOE is good at doing this, so good that they have eliminated the need for a subscription with Everquest and Everquest 2 and gone free to play.

You look at is as if you are SOE and say to yourself, "Self, EVE subscriptions are matching box sales of GW2. In EQN we could have a cash shop that makes up that subscription revenue, also we have box sales scheduled yearly in the form of expansions. So, even if we only have the 500K players EVE has, we will generate the box sales that GW2 has with cash shop sales. We will also have box sales a year in and every year after for even more revenue and heck we even offer subscriptions as well."

Take EVE, remove the barrier to play(initial box sales and subscription), add box sales after 1 year and every year and have a cash shop revenue stream that supplants the lost subscription revenue as well as offering subscriptions. You have every monitization method in use in an emerging MMO market. Not to mention the inundation of Sandbox we are getting from Asia. EQN can corner the Western sandbox MMO.
  DamonVile

Elite Member

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 4414

6/24/13 6:59:23 PM#67
Originally posted by TheCrow2k
Originally posted by DocBrody

WORLD OF TANKS - ENTIRELY PVP

 

40 MILLION REGISTERED USERS

 

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-hits-40-million-registered-users/

 

"EATS WOW USER NUMBERS FOR BREAKFAST"


 

 

LOL stop now, you are embarrassing yourself. Wot is entirely PVP but it is consensual, your not going to queue for a match then complain you got ganked.... WOT has more in common with fps/tps games like COD & BF than any MMO's.

He's also comparing registered accounts to subs. If you look at the numbers of battles fought on those account ( my info is about a year old ) almost 70% of those accounts where under 100 battles. that means they played a week or so and then quit.

wow has 8 million subs going right now....how many people have played it, how many free trials signed up ? They never tell you that.

Also Eve has no competition. If you want a space sci-fi mmo you play eve. If you don't like EQN you can't swing a dead chipmunk without hitting a hundred other fantasy mmos you could play instead. That makes a pretty big difference when people are deciding what they' will and wont put up with.

People are like cats. When they die, you get a new one.

  Dr_Shivinski

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/12
Posts: 188

6/24/13 6:59:53 PM#68
Originally posted by furbans

EVE took A LONG ASS TIME to get those numbers and is like the WoW of PvP centric games.  So far only none has been able to pull off what EVE did.  Not to mention EVE is a COMPLETELY different entity than ..... well ALL MMOs and is the most intricate, complex, massive, freedom MMO out there.  Hell it takes one MONTHS to really learn just one aspect of EVE and there is so much out there it ain't even funny.

If non-consensual fantasy based PvP MMOs were such a highly popular game then why is it that Age of Washu, Darkfall, Mortal Online, and not sure if Warhammer Online fits the bill all received less that stellar recognition if not downright hate for some.  Hell even Camelot Unchained only got about 15k backers.  Then look at PvE focused crowd and it dwarfs the PvP centric game.

Also the OP needs to compare all non-consensual PvP MMOs to ALL PvE centric MMOs.  This is what companies will see, a very much higher market by NOT making a non-consensual MMO, at least not forced but as an option.

 

The problem is the PVP centric games don't balance very well. EVE has great PVP elements, but the PVE is just utterly fucking mind numbing. Same wiht Wushu and Warhammer (though not open world still PVP centric) 

WoW was more of a PVE centric game until they introduced Arenas then most of the balancing and the loudest voices came from that community of players. But still PvPers are a minority compared to the amount of PVEers in that game. 

So here's to hoping for open world PVP in EQNEXT with substantial PVE content that is WORTH DOING. Try to find that happy medium yeah?

Here Siggy Siggy!

  atticusbc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/07
Posts: 1054

I hated hipsters before hating hipsters was cool.

6/24/13 7:02:55 PM#69
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by TheCrow2k
Originally posted by DocBrody

WORLD OF TANKS - ENTIRELY PVP

40 MILLION REGISTERED USERS

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-hits-40-million-registered-users/

"EATS WOW USER NUMBERS FOR BREAKFAST"

sets Guiness Book world record for most concurrent users online at the same time

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-sets-new-guinness-world-record/

 

LOL stop now, you are embarrassing yourself. Wot is entirely PVP but it is consensual, your not going to queue for a match then complain you got ganked.... WOT has more in common with fps/tps games like COD & BF than any MMO's.

uh-huh.

So by this theory when I log in to a FFA game I know what to expect, so it is consensual PvP too.

In fact EvE Darkfall and Mortal Online are consensual PvP too, everyone agrees to the rules of the game which makes it consensual

that is a logical fallacy. if someone takes your phone when you leave it unattended doesn't change the fact that it was an act of theft. likewise when you are attacked in a ffa. sure you set yourself up for it, but that doesn't change the nature of the action.

moreover, in an arena type game, fighting other players is the entire game. you log in to fight other players. you log into a ffa to experience the game, a portion of which (to a greater or lesser extent) is the pvp conflict.

furthermore "registered users" means nothing. that is the number of accounts made with them to date. because WoW has an unlimited trial, and all blizzard accounts are centralized in battle.net, blizzard could say the exact same thing about WoW accounts except they'd be including every account ever made on battle.net. which i'm guessing is more than 40 mil.

  Dahkoht

Novice Member

Joined: 4/03/13
Posts: 289

6/24/13 7:07:37 PM#70
Equating stealing property vs killing someone in an online game where it is NOT against the rules and or law is it most ridiculous thing I've seen yet in a thread whining about FFA PVP.

One is against the law the other isn't.
  Dr_Shivinski

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/12
Posts: 188

6/24/13 7:07:45 PM#71
Originally posted by atticusbc
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by TheCrow2k
Originally posted by DocBrody

WORLD OF TANKS - ENTIRELY PVP

 

40 MILLION REGISTERED USERS

 

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-hits-40-million-registered-users/

 

"EATS WOW USER NUMBERS FOR BREAKFAST"

 

sets Guiness Book world record for most concurrent users online at the same time

 

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-sets-new-guinness-world-record/

 

 

 

 

LOL stop now, you are embarrassing yourself. Wot is entirely PVP but it is consensual, your not going to queue for a match then complain you got ganked.... WOT has more in common with fps/tps games like COD & BF than any MMO's.

uh-huh.

So by this theory when I log in to a FFA game I know what to expect, so it is consensual PvP too.

In fact EvE Darkfall and Mortal Online are consensual PvP too, everyone agrees to the rules of the game which makes it consensual

that is a logical fallacy. if someone takes your phone when you leave it unattended doesn't change the fact that it was an act of theft. likewise when you are attacked in a ffa. sure you set yourself up for it, but that doesn't change the nature of the action.

moreover, in an arena type game, fighting other players is the entire game. you log in to fight other players. you log into a ffa to experience the game, a portion of which is the pvp conflict.

It's not entirely a logical fallacy. Really whenever I log into to EVE I expect someone to try to attack me. High Sec, Lo Sec, Null Sec, makes no difference. Anyone can attack you anywhere and when you log in and undock if you don't expect it to happen then you really don't much about EVE. Age of Wushu makes people accept their "Open World PVP Challenge" every time you log in to the game which is basically consenting to being attacked by anyone anwhere. 

Here Siggy Siggy!

  Dejoblue

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/11
Posts: 295

I'll give them heroics...and when everyone is super...no one will be.

 
OP  6/24/13 7:16:48 PM#72
Originally posted by Dr_Shivinski
Originally posted by furbans

EVE took A LONG ASS TIME to get those numbers and is like the WoW of PvP centric games.  So far only none has been able to pull off what EVE did.  Not to mention EVE is a COMPLETELY different entity than ..... well ALL MMOs and is the most intricate, complex, massive, freedom MMO out there.  Hell it takes one MONTHS to really learn just one aspect of EVE and there is so much out there it ain't even funny.

If non-consensual fantasy based PvP MMOs were such a highly popular game then why is it that Age of Washu, Darkfall, Mortal Online, and not sure if Warhammer Online fits the bill all received less that stellar recognition if not downright hate for some.  Hell even Camelot Unchained only got about 15k backers.  Then look at PvE focused crowd and it dwarfs the PvP centric game.

Also the OP needs to compare all non-consensual PvP MMOs to ALL PvE centric MMOs.  This is what companies will see, a very much higher market by NOT making a non-consensual MMO, at least not forced but as an option.

 

The problem is the PVP centric games don't balance very well. EVE has great PVP elements, but the PVE is just utterly fucking mind numbing. Same wiht Wushu and Warhammer (though not open world still PVP centric) 

WoW was more of a PVE centric game until they introduced Arenas then most of the balancing and the loudest voices came from that community of players. But still PvPers are a minority compared to the amount of PVEers in that game. 

So here's to hoping for open world PVP in EQNEXT with substantial PVE content that is WORTH DOING. Try to find that happy medium yeah?

Yea this is pretty prevalent, everyone has the same skills etc, same ships bla bla, in Darkfall everyone had the same skills it may as well have been the same classes like ona  WoW scale. But yea Even WoW has to deal with it, everyone gravityates to what is most powerful so it becomes bland, WoW has resigned to that fact and I thiank they purposefully "balance" classes to rotate in FOTM classes just so PVP is less boring, under the guise of the ever on going balancing act, it may just be a result but in the end why not use it to your advantage, or at least to try and keep your players sane.

 

i expect EQN to have heavy PVE as well so it may lend itself to a wider bredth of player classes and builds being used for skirmishes where sub optimal builds are used simply because it is what is currently equipped and trained.

not tog et off track but It will be interesting to see how PVE and PVP gear are balanced as well. EVEs system is pretty exclusive having differnt shisp for different tasks, kinda hard to do that in a class based system unless gear restricts what spells you can use.

  Yalexy

Novice Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 1020

6/24/13 7:17:32 PM#73

If developers would stop thinking about how to get the most money, then we wouldn't need to talk about stuff like this.

EvE Online is a very profitable game, because there's enough people who like it. However CCP never thought about subscriptions to begin with, but only about making a good game. In other words... they took a risk.

Most devs don't want to take risks anymore, and that's why we see one crappy game after another, were people play for a few month and then leave in droves to start playing the next MMO.

PvE-MMOs are by far the most popular, as they offer the possibility to play the game like a solo RPG (storyline, questing, leveling up) with multiplayer-mode (dungeons, raids, arenas and BGs).

In a game like EvE you can't do much on your own, besides the boring missions in high-sec, and that's the reason why these kind of games don't have as much players, yet they have the highest retention-rate as players heavily commit to these kind of games.

So yeah. Subsciption-numbers are really of no interest, as long as you have enough players to keep the game profitable. And if devs would start with this mindset, then we would actually see some better games being developed, as devs would start taking risks again.

  linadragon

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/05
Posts: 74

6/24/13 7:18:56 PM#74
Originally posted by OSF8759
There is no such thing as non-consensual PvP. If you're playing an open world PvP game, you've consented to PvP.

You are not consenting to being ganked there is a difference between ganking and pvp and most open world pvp games / sandbox with open world pvp are gear/level/skill based gankfests entirely. I have yet to see one have fair balanced real PVP cuz you sissies would wet your britches if it was a level playing field and you couldn't go around ganking people that you have a large edge over. If you want real PVP go do pvp in gw1 or 2 where gear doesn't matter or a game that isn't based around level, skill, or gear or stats. The latter doesn't exist though.

  Hellidol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 354

6/24/13 7:22:53 PM#75
Originally posted by Scalpless
I think he's trying to say EVE, a game with non-consentual PvP, is as profitable as GW2. He's ignoring lots of things, such as the fact that devs don't get 60$ per a box of GW2 (it's more like 40$) and that people spend 15$ per month in GW2's gem store on average according to some relatively credible source I forgot. Basically, the OP is full of holes.

he is just taking the base of all stuff and showing people that part, you can add in "what ifs" if you want to see the out come over all but he is correct in what his point is.

  Hellidol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 354

6/24/13 7:25:21 PM#76
Originally posted by reaperuk
Originally posted by dejoblue

GW2 has sold 3 million copies. That is 3,000,000 x $60 = $180,000,000

If GW2 comes out with an expansion at year 2 then they will have made

$90,000,000 per year

 

EVE Online has 500,000 SUBSCRIBERS that pay $15/month. That is:

500,000 x $15 = $7,500,000 x 12 months = .....

$90,000,000 per year

 

Does this mean that GW2 is "niche" or does it mean that EVE is "mainstream"

 

What does this bode for EQN, a "sandbox" game like EVE?

What does this say about the marketability of Non consensual PVP versus traditional PVE MMORPG games?

The quoted figures are so wildly inaccurate that any further debate is meaningless as far as I can see.....

 

good job at pointing out nothing thanks for well...nothing? if you want call him out on stuff you might want to bring in some examples of what you believe this. As far as I can tell he did everything correct.

  atticusbc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/07
Posts: 1054

I hated hipsters before hating hipsters was cool.

6/24/13 7:25:53 PM#77
Originally posted by Dr_Shivinski
Originally posted by atticusbc
Originally posted by DocBrody
Originally posted by TheCrow2k
Originally posted by DocBrody

WORLD OF TANKS - ENTIRELY PVP

 

40 MILLION REGISTERED USERS

 

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-hits-40-million-registered-users/

 

"EATS WOW USER NUMBERS FOR BREAKFAST"

 

sets Guiness Book world record for most concurrent users online at the same time

 

http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/46/world-tanks-sets-new-guinness-world-record/

 

 

 

 

LOL stop now, you are embarrassing yourself. Wot is entirely PVP but it is consensual, your not going to queue for a match then complain you got ganked.... WOT has more in common with fps/tps games like COD & BF than any MMO's.

uh-huh.

So by this theory when I log in to a FFA game I know what to expect, so it is consensual PvP too.

In fact EvE Darkfall and Mortal Online are consensual PvP too, everyone agrees to the rules of the game which makes it consensual

that is a logical fallacy. if someone takes your phone when you leave it unattended doesn't change the fact that it was an act of theft. likewise when you are attacked in a ffa. sure you set yourself up for it, but that doesn't change the nature of the action.

moreover, in an arena type game, fighting other players is the entire game. you log in to fight other players. you log into a ffa to experience the game, a portion of which is the pvp conflict.

It's not entirely a logical fallacy. Really whenever I log into to EVE I expect someone to try to attack me. High Sec, Lo Sec, Null Sec, makes no difference. Anyone can attack you anywhere and when you log in and undock if you don't expect it to happen then you really don't much about EVE. Age of Wushu makes people accept their "Open World PVP Challenge" every time you log in to the game which is basically consenting to being attacked by anyone anwhere. 

true enough. but the way i perceive the issue is that even in a ffa game, though you acknowledge the danger of being attacked, the attack itself is still not consented to. usually. that's what makes things fun and exciting: you never know what's going to happen. that said, just because it's fun doesn't mean you weren't attacked without consent. 

so what's really going on is some people want the option to opt out of pvp, they want to consent to when and where they need to worry about the additional threat of other players. i can see it both ways personally, but there is no doubt that ffa pvp is a niche, and will remain so. probably forever.

  Hellidol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 354

6/24/13 7:30:00 PM#78

 

so it sounds like it comes down to the game, if you dont like FFA type pvp then dont play the game and stop crying about it. If this is the direction that EQN is going then there is nothing you can do about it so move on, if you want to give it a try and stop crying about then do so, either way sounds like the game is set in stone with FFA style pvp so deal with it, crying about it isnt dealing at all it is just making you look like a cry baby.

  atticusbc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/07
Posts: 1054

I hated hipsters before hating hipsters was cool.

6/24/13 7:33:52 PM#79
Originally posted by Dahkoht
Equating stealing property vs killing someone in an online game where it is NOT against the rules and or law is it most ridiculous thing I've seen yet in a thread whining about FFA PVP.

One is against the law the other isn't.

so despite your... retort being rather lacking, i will respond anyway.

first off: it's a metaphor. ... yeah. nothing else to be said about that.

two: i clearly stated that by engaging in both actions you are opening yourself to a certain reaction. the fact remains though that in ffa game x, you did not ask, or want, that random guy to gank you for all your stuff. you did not consent. period. some people want to be able to choose when so-and-so can attack them. that is all. they want to give consent before they are engaged in pvp.

  Eolex

Novice Member

Joined: 7/31/04
Posts: 19

6/24/13 7:34:01 PM#80
I fail to see what the OP is complaining about, or even aiming at... It is an Everquest game. Like most AAA title MMO's it will have servers. Some RP, some Normal, Some PVP... So let SOE make the damn game and pick the server with the playset that  you feel inclined to play on. Quit trying to convince the users or developers that making the game a specific way will make it successful when they have the option of designing different rule sets to each server. Even the original EQ had this with the Zek servers...
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