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EverQuest Next

EverQuest Next 

General Discussion  » What type of PvP do you want in EQN

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167 posts found
  ice-vortex

Novice Member

Joined: 5/21/10
Posts: 921

6/21/13 11:56:32 AM#61
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

Makes me wonder if...

1. EQ fans are up for a shock as a sandbox type of PvP system comes to be with EQN.

2. PvP fans are upset as PvP is not a focus or even a reality. 

Both seem to be a reality that could happen.

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

  Aelious

Elite Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2514

World > Quest Progression

6/21/13 11:58:16 AM#62
If I was a betting man I'd say each player could serve a god and have the friends and enemies in game according to the "cliques" of the gods. If you didn't want to PvP you'd either choose to be agnostic or there may be a clique that is neutral. Just a guess but it would really get people involved IMO, even those not apt to PvP because of the strong lore ties.
  AIMonster

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/31/08
Posts: 2023

6/21/13 12:00:13 PM#63
PvP and PvE servers, with zones on PvE servers dedicated to optional large scale open world PvP if you'd like, as well as standard structured PvP like battlegrounds and arenas.

Raptr link because it's the cool new trend:

  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 3065

6/21/13 12:01:59 PM#64
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

Makes me wonder if...

1. EQ fans are up for a shock as a sandbox type of PvP system comes to be with EQN.

2. PvP fans are upset as PvP is not a focus or even a reality. 

Both seem to be a reality that could happen.

I'd say the "EQ fans" are potentially in for the biggest shock, if all the hype about EQN being "nothing that you've ever seen before" turns out to be actually true.

 

I don't recall EQ as ever having a huge PVP community or being renowned for it's amazing PVP. So I can't imagine EQ's "PVP community" being shocked if it doesn't deliver a groundbreaking PVP experience.

  Aelious

Elite Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2514

World > Quest Progression

6/21/13 12:03:19 PM#65
Even if there isn't an "end game" that doesn't mean it won't appeal to PvE players. The idea that endgame = PvE is just as silly as thinking sandbox = PvP. In fact I think having a sandbox-style (remember, they were very clear about the "style" part) will give everyone more options to play as they like. Georgson said a main design philosophy was to make it fun for everyone.

I have no doubt there will be plenty to do in EQN where PvE is concerned. I'm glad that SoE seems to be righting the ship on what PvE should be about without pigeonholing it into endgame.
  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

6/21/13 12:11:55 PM#66
Originally posted by SpottyGekko
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

Makes me wonder if...

1. EQ fans are up for a shock as a sandbox type of PvP system comes to be with EQN.

2. PvP fans are upset as PvP is not a focus or even a reality. 

Both seem to be a reality that could happen.

Both teams are screaming "mine!" at the top of their lungs.

Don't think it matters; Smed's probably not reading (here) anyway.

At least we know BM's gonna be happy.  <--see what I did there ahr ahr

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  Waterlily

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 2921

6/21/13 12:13:04 PM#67
Originally posted by ice-vortex

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

Pretty sure no one is going to care drama queen.

If EQNext is forced PVP, EQ players will still play EQ, EQ2 players will still play EQ2 and PVP players will wonder why their game has died like Darkfall has and gets no development support anymore.

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6910

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

6/21/13 12:26:34 PM#68

None period.You are never going to do pvp justice in a rpg,to try is just catering to more potential customers,you are not going to do the game any justice.PVp belongs infps's and/or separate it completely form the PVE game.That means separate everything,you cannot expect the same setup in PVE to carry over to pvp unless both are designed poorly.

PVE works best when NOT balanced and pvp needs to be balanced,so they cannot coincide.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3577

 
OP  6/21/13 12:29:05 PM#69
Originally posted by Wizardry

None period.You are never going to do pvp justice in a rpg,to try is just catering to more potential customers,you are not going to do the game any justice.PVp belongs infps's and/or separate it completely form the PVE game.That means separate everything,you cannot expect the same setup in PVE to carry over to pvp unless both are designed poorly.

PVE works best when NOT balanced and pvp needs to be balanced,so they cannot coincide.

Sure you can. Many MMOs have pulled it off very well. Sure PvPers cant get everything they want and same goes for PvEers but many a game has walked the line of keeping an active community of both type of players.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5431

6/21/13 12:31:09 PM#70
Originally posted by Waterlily
Originally posted by ice-vortex

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

Pretty sure no one is going to care drama queen.

If EQNext is forced PVP, EQ players will still play EQ, EQ2 players will still play EQ2 and PVP players will wonder why their game has died like Darkfall has and gets no development support anymore.

True.

What is more likely to happen, is that they will use the exact same system they used in EQ1, there really isnt any need or demand to change it. The old, if it aint broke don't fix it, would in fact, be the ideal, at least for Everquest fans.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3577

 
OP  6/21/13 12:39:57 PM#71
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by Waterlily
Originally posted by ice-vortex

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

Pretty sure no one is going to care drama queen.

If EQNext is forced PVP, EQ players will still play EQ, EQ2 players will still play EQ2 and PVP players will wonder why their game has died like Darkfall has and gets no development support anymore.

True.

What is more likely to happen, is that they will use the exact same system they used in EQ1, there really isnt any need or demand to change it. The old, if it aint broke don't fix it, would in fact, be the ideal, at least for Everquest fans.

Or like they said this will be nothing like EQ1 or EQ2. Pure PvE game with some side PvP that has no impact on any class is all the former games fall under. Much like themepark vrs sandbox. Maybe SoE thinking is they keep their former games to keep that market and EQN to take a grab at sandbox and PvP gamers. 

Biggest hyped game on mmorpge.com and PvP seems to be the only active threads. I think its time for mmorpg.com to write up something about the topic and really let everyone hash this out before we get any solid info =-) lol My guess is SoE will be doing some type of PvP that will impact PvE, if nothing else in the class balance area. Druid could be a lot of fun in PvP. Not sure how well a Bard would do, would be a PvP king or they would really suck.

  Xthos

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/18/10
Posts: 2651

6/21/13 12:41:18 PM#72

I honestly cannot pick one, not until I really see how the game is structured, some of the choices make more sense in different systems, and no sense in others for me.

 

I don't see FFA fitting EQ, I see some sort of factioned fitting it more, but will have to wait and see what they do.

 

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3577

 
OP  6/21/13 12:45:59 PM#73
Originally posted by Xthos

I honestly cannot pick one, not until I really see how the game is structured, some of the choices make more sense in different systems, and no sense in others for me.

 

I don't see FFA fitting EQ, I see some sort of factioned fitting it more, but will have to wait and see what they do.

 

Rifts system may work here. Where you pick a faction and PvP with your faction and come back to the PvE areas and team with every faction.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5431

6/21/13 12:46:27 PM#74
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Wizardry

None period.You are never going to do pvp justice in a rpg,to try is just catering to more potential customers,you are not going to do the game any justice.PVp belongs infps's and/or separate it completely form the PVE game.That means separate everything,you cannot expect the same setup in PVE to carry over to pvp unless both are designed poorly.

PVE works best when NOT balanced and pvp needs to be balanced,so they cannot coincide.

Sure you can. Many MMOs have pulled it off very well. Sure PvPers cant get everything they want and same goes for PvEers but many a game has walked the line of keeping an active community of both type of players.

And yet the Everquest games have managed to outlive many other games that do cater to the PVP community. EQ1 is still going, and for all its faults so is EQ2, the biggest problem with catering to the PVP community, is that its a relatively small one, that doesnt tend to stick with games long term, its always the next 'thrill'  - rather than the PVE community which oddly enough, is usually in it for the long haul. As has already been demonstrated.

  sirphobos

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/10/11
Posts: 610

6/21/13 12:47:42 PM#75

Faction based open world PvP where you start out as a particular faction based on some combination of race/class/deity but give you the ability to change your faction via quests.

That being said, I played EQ1 for years and wouldn't mind no PvP at all.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3577

 
OP  6/21/13 12:49:19 PM#76
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Wizardry

None period.You are never going to do pvp justice in a rpg,to try is just catering to more potential customers,you are not going to do the game any justice.PVp belongs infps's and/or separate it completely form the PVE game.That means separate everything,you cannot expect the same setup in PVE to carry over to pvp unless both are designed poorly.

PVE works best when NOT balanced and pvp needs to be balanced,so they cannot coincide.

Sure you can. Many MMOs have pulled it off very well. Sure PvPers cant get everything they want and same goes for PvEers but many a game has walked the line of keeping an active community of both type of players.

And yet the Everquest games have managed to outlive many other games that do cater to the PVP community. EQ1 is still going, and for all its faults so is EQ2, the biggest problem with catering to the PVP community, is that its a relatively small one, that doesnt tend to stick with games long term, its always the next 'thrill'  - rather than the PVE community which oddly enough, is usually in it for the long haul. As has already been demonstrated.

Thats a hard call to make when EQ1 and EQ2 were made before most MMOs. If WoW was made in 1999 would your comment hold any validity? If DAoC keep getting updated like EQ1 and not dumped by EA to make Warhammer would it still have solid numbers? I think it would as thats where I would have stayed.

  ice-vortex

Novice Member

Joined: 5/21/10
Posts: 921

6/21/13 12:49:46 PM#77
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by Waterlily
Originally posted by ice-vortex

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

Pretty sure no one is going to care drama queen.

If EQNext is forced PVP, EQ players will still play EQ, EQ2 players will still play EQ2 and PVP players will wonder why their game has died like Darkfall has and gets no development support anymore.

True.

What is more likely to happen, is that they will use the exact same system they used in EQ1, there really isnt any need or demand to change it. The old, if it aint broke don't fix it, would in fact, be the ideal, at least for Everquest fans.

This is exactly why people think the PVE crowd on this forum is unreasonable. Between posts like these, and threads on camping times, and experience loss, it's as if they have their head in the sand.

When Smedley says:

 

"I also said in there that it will still be very familiar to you, but what I meant by that statement is that we're changing what an MMO is. MMO means something now, and it means the same thing to everybody because it's the same game. EverQuest, WoW, SWTOR all use the same core loot gameplay, which is kill stuff, get reward, get loot, level up. Very few games have broken out of that mold. One or two have. EVE Online is a great example; it's not standard level-based gameplay, although I'm not saying we're going to a big skill-based system. You're still going to recognize the roleplaying game heritage in it. In EverQuest Next, the world itself is a part of the game. What is the world in these other games? It's a simple backdrop. It's nothing. We are changing that greatly. We're changing what AI is in these games to a degree that we're going to bring life to the world. That to us is the essence of the change that we're making."

 

...and people simply don't believe or accept it, is just the height of irrationality.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5431

6/21/13 12:52:21 PM#78
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by Waterlily
Originally posted by ice-vortex

In either case, PVE players are seemingly going to be shocked when they realize there isn't the typical loot centric system of gameplay. I mean, if they don't have the ability to run raids and dungeons for items all day, they will just be shouting that there is no end game.

Pretty sure no one is going to care drama queen.

If EQNext is forced PVP, EQ players will still play EQ, EQ2 players will still play EQ2 and PVP players will wonder why their game has died like Darkfall has and gets no development support anymore.

True.

What is more likely to happen, is that they will use the exact same system they used in EQ1, there really isnt any need or demand to change it. The old, if it aint broke don't fix it, would in fact, be the ideal, at least for Everquest fans.

Or like they said this will be nothing like EQ1 or EQ2. Pure PvE game with some side PvP that has no impact on any class is all the former games fall under. Much like themepark vrs sandbox. Maybe SoE thinking is they keep their former games to keep that market and EQN to take a grab at sandbox and PvP gamers. 

Biggest hyped game on mmorpge.com and PvP seems to be the only active threads. I think its time for mmorpg.com to write up something about the topic and really let everyone hash this out before we get any solid info =-) lol My guess is SoE will be doing some type of PvP that will impact PvE, if nothing else in the class balance area. Druid could be a lot of fun in PvP. Not sure how well a Bard would do, would be a PvP king or they would really suck.

I sincerely doubt that is the case, as for EQ1 etc there was PVP in the game, there were even arena's where you could fight tournaments if you were of a mind to. And there was a certain amount of faction combat, as a dark elf straying too close to a good many places was a recipe to get aggro'd by the guards.  In some ways it was much like the alliance v horde thing in WoW, and open world oddly enough. Its doubtful that SOE would feel any real need to change it, it worked.

  User Deleted
6/21/13 12:54:09 PM#79

I hope to God it's a Open World PvP system like EVE-Online just so the amount of scrubs who voted for 9 can get violated repeatedly by people with less constricted views on what makes a game good.

  CalmOceans

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/06/11
Posts: 1914

6/21/13 12:54:47 PM#80
Originally posted by ice-vortex

This is exactly why people think the PVE crowd on this forum is unreasonable. 

PVE players are the most reasonable of all. I never hear of any PVE player that says there should be no PVP server. PVE players want PVP to have their own server they can enjoy themselves on.

But it is always the PVP players who refuse to let PVE player have their server and would rather have their niche game die than allow others to enjoy themselves.

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