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General Gaming  » Microsoft just dropped DRM

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234 posts found
  Yodi2007

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/30/12
Posts: 167

6/19/13 11:56:24 PM#161
Originally posted by MindTrigger
Originally posted by atziluth
Originally posted by cgplayer
You guys are just sad.  Whine and cry about all that crap most of which is already being done on PC games.  Internet connection required, cant sell, etc etc.  Now MS goes ahead and changes course and your still whining and crying.  Move on already sad plain sad some people are.  

Please name a PC system or even a game that locks you out if you don't connect to the internet every 24 hours. Nothing?

It was a horrible idea that had nothing to do with evolution of gaming and had everything to do with forcing direction of revenue streams down the throats of their buyers. 

 

I think you all sound like a bunch of luddites, afraid of the big bad internet.  I've had some form of always-on broadband in my homes since about 1998, so I have trouble understanding why having your console connected to the internet in 2013 is so hard to swallow.  I guess I'm just used to be connected all the time via my phone, tablet, computers, etc.

On another note, if these new consoles exist for 5-8 years again, that means you may be using them until the year 2022 or so. Does anyone think cloud services won't be the norm by the year 2022?  As a 20 year IT tech who see's my whole business model changing over the next five years or so, I believe you are insane if you don't see it coming.  I'm not referring to cloud-streaming games, but SaaS, constant cloud connectivity, etc. Ubiquitous computing.

If you don't have always-on broadband in 2014, perhaps you should put that console money towards MOVING to a place where you can get a real internet connection.

This post is a joke because broadband internet is not everywhere yet as I read somewhere only 65% of populated america is broadband connected this still leaves 35% of the populated area out in the cold! You cannot tell people to move to those area's that do have it some people like living in the country or secluded area (not me i like the sound of the city). Don't fault consumers for the lack of broadband service fault ISP's like ATT, Verizon, Mediacom, Comcast, and ect who the Govt gave Billions to upgrade their towers and lay fiber optic cables down, but partially laid it and the rest still using good ole "Copper Cable"!

Also most ISP's have caps on GB some as low as 5GB or comparable to Smartphone data plans. This does not carry well if trying to game! 

Remember 2014 is in 6 months and Broadband is costly to alot of people from 39.99 usd up to 100.00 usd depending on the ISP! 

 

P.S Broadband is not stable in alot of area's and remember unless the information is optimized it could bog down your "internet pipeline". ( read about it too much detail to give here.)

Below is where we can disscuss and come up with new ideas for Sandparks!

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/5164689#5164689

  bestever

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/26/11
Posts: 608

6/19/13 11:58:21 PM#162
Originally posted by Drakynn
Originally posted by thunderC
Originally posted by bestever

I know I hate steam too. God steam why can't I sale my games and why do I need to login and update them before I can go offline and play. You suck steam, it really make me mad that I don't own the rights to my games. Screw you steam. 

This is what most of you sound like when you talk about the X1, just replace steam with X1. Some of the cool thing MS was going to do are now gone because of this. No more digital trade-ins which steam was going to do if it worked for MS. No more family sharing. 

Cloud will still do the same thing it was going to do, nothing is going to change about that but you still need to be online. What a shocker. Gaikai's streaming system is a joke. Just look at onlive, man they just took off right? Also just another way for sony to charge you for all those games again. It won't work the same way MS has it set up. MS will off load some of the game to the cloud which will make the system even stronger when online. Its pretty funny how Sony had to bring in a 3rd party company to handle cloud servers but its better then MS's when MS was building it right along side the X1. Yeah makes since Gaikai will be so superior to X!'s cloud system. LOL what a joke.

300,000 servers for online play. Sweet no more host advantage since games will be hosted on dedicated servers now. Pretty sure Sony doesn't have that.

X1 can't change out the hard drive. Cool pick up a 2 TB usb hard drive and your good to GO! I also love the complaint the you need to install the games on the hard drive. Good they always boot fast and run faster off the hard drive.

Just hope Sony's new super memory controller works out for them and hope the box has great cooling since its so small. Guess will have to wait and see if its the new 360.

Yup I'll be getting a X1, was going to anyways. Like more game on the X1 anyways.

 

O PLEASEEEE...... Dont even try to compare Steam to Micro$$$$oft. Steam runs insane sales all the  time practically giving games away with -75% off sales, Don't sit here and insult everyone's intelligence by claiming Microcrap would do the same. Steam's business model works because they treat the Gamer with respect , Microsoft does not.

Not to mention once you get a game ready and set it to offline mode you don't have to log in every 24 hours to validate it again.

I'm pretty sure Steam wills till trial digital trade in as they've been setting up the marketplace for awhile now to accomodate it.

I'm also pretty sure Sony is setting up dedicated servers which is why it's asking people to use PS+ to play multiplayer in games using those servers.If a game chooses to use it's own servers and not Sony's you won't need PS+ no different from Xbox Gold.

He's really stretching for criticism here.

Not sure I'll invest in a PS4 either,I'm more likely to upgrade my PC and wait for both consoels to pan out and have a better library of games, but damn he complains about whining with the whiniest post I've seen in this thread and related threads yet.

I hope steam does because of right now we don't own are steam games. They can take the games away at any time go look it up.

I sure hope sony starts using dedicated server now that they're charging for PSN.

Oh i'm not whining just pointing out facts that so many of you like to over look and how most of this thread is nothing but whining about MS.

Sorry if it upsets you get over it.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15582

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

6/19/13 11:59:56 PM#163
Originally posted by thunderc

 

O PLEASEEEE...... Dont even try to compare Steam to Micro$$$$oft. Steam runs insane sales all the  time practically giving games away with -75% off sales, Don't sit here and insult everyone's intelligence by claiming Microcrap would do the same. Steam's business model works because they treat the Gamer with respect , Microsoft does not.

You really think those sales are about the gamer? You do realize how much they're making off those sales considering the rate at which most of those products would be selling otherwise (at full price)?

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  Vesoc

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/13
Posts: 9

6/20/13 12:01:01 AM#164
Sad for them... this time sony nailed it :)
  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5249

6/20/13 12:03:34 AM#165
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by bestever

I know I hate steam too. God steam why can't I sale my games and why do I need to login and update them before I can go offline and play. You suck steam, it really make me mad that I don't own the rights to my games. Screw you steam. 

This is what most of you sound like when you talk about the X1, just replace steam with X1. Some of the cool thing MS was going to do are now gone because of this. No more digital trade-ins which steam was going to do if it worked for MS. No more family sharing. 

Cloud will still do the same thing it was going to do, nothing is going to change about that but you still need to be online. What a shocker. Gaikai's streaming system is a joke. Just look at onlive, man they just took off right? Also just another way for sony to charge you for all those games again. It won't work the same way MS has it set up. MS will off load some of the game to the cloud which will make the system even stronger when online. Its pretty funny how Sony had to bring in a 3rd party company to handle cloud servers but its better then MS's when MS was building it right along side the X1. Yeah makes since Gaikai will be so superior to X!'s cloud system. LOL what a joke.

300,000 servers for online play. Sweet no more host advantage since games will be hosted on dedicated servers now. Pretty sure Sony doesn't have that.

X1 can't change out the hard drive. Cool pick up a 2 TB usb hard drive and your good to GO! I also love the complaint the you need to install the games on the hard drive. Good they always boot fast and run faster off the hard drive.

Just hope Sony's new super memory controller works out for them and hope the box has great cooling since its so small. Guess will have to wait and see if its the new 360.

Yup I'll be getting a X1, was going to anyways. Like more game on the X1 anyways.

 

Also here's a link read up on what cloud is.

http://bestonlinefilestorage.net/cloud-computing-and-who-invented-it/

 

Worth pointing out that while having an external storage device is handy for saving things to, its almost useless for backing games up onto, unless your going to transfer them back to the hard drive, running a game through a usb connection is a dumb idea, and with games becoming increasingly more complex, in terms of graphics etc, an external drive would add a significant slow down to the whole system, running the game off of the dvd/bluray disc would be significantly faster.

But well done to M$  for their total 180 on DRM policy, even if it meant losing access to offsite games back-up, which if they were at all bothered about they could have added to the Xbox Live Gold account perks, and might have actually given people more reason to buy it.

Now just need to persuade M$ to turn off the 'always connected to the Kinnect' requirement and maybe then people might consider buying the thing, Never mind all those people out there who already bought the kinnect and probably feel a bit ripped off by having to buy yet another one, when M$ should have given the option to buy a cheaper Xbone without Kinnect. That would even make the Xbone more competitive price wise.

Yeah I have a friend that won't get it because of the kinect thing but its not that big of a deal to me. 

Its usb 3.0 and I do it on PC all the time with no issues. I also run games off of a 32gb thumb drive on my 360 with no issues so will have to wait and see. 

I do hope they drop the price down a 100$ but if not oh well still cheaper then my video card.

Kinnect being always on is a problem to a lot of people though, and being able to physically turn it off or disconnect it when not in use for games that use it, would be a huge deal, and for those with a 360 with Kinnect, it would make more sense for them to be able to use the one they have already purchased, than to have to buy yet another Kinnect device, they are not cheap after all, and while that may be cheaper than a video card, a video card is far more integral to any games system, whether it be a console or a pc, the Kinnect device is not.

  Magnetia

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 969

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

6/20/13 12:06:42 AM#166

At least MS listens to their share prices. Seeing them plummet forced them into action.

 

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  bestever

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/26/11
Posts: 608

6/20/13 12:07:41 AM#167
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by thunderc

 

O PLEASEEEE...... Dont even try to compare Steam to Micro$$$$oft. Steam runs insane sales all the  time practically giving games away with -75% off sales, Don't sit here and insult everyone's intelligence by claiming Microcrap would do the same. Steam's business model works because they treat the Gamer with respect , Microsoft does not.

You really think those sales are about the gamer? You do realize how much they're making off those sales considering the rate at which most of those products would be selling otherwise (at full price)?

No he doesn't and he probably thinks he owns his steam games. Which we don't. I have over a 100 steam games that I don't own and they can take them and anytime and if the publisher/dev removes the license from steam then you lose the game.

Just so you guys know.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/02/01/thought-do-we-own-our-steam-games/

  Drakynn

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/08
Posts: 2051

6/20/13 12:12:22 AM#168
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Drakynn

Not to mention once you get a game ready and set it to offline mode you don't have to log in every 24 hours to validate it again.

I'm pretty sure Steam wills till trial digital trade in as they've been setting up the marketplace for awhile now to accomodate it.

I'm also pretty sure Sony is setting up dedicated servers which is why it's asking people to use PS+ to play multiplayer in games using those servers.If a game chooses to use it's own servers and not Sony's you won't need PS+ no different from Xbox Gold.

He's really stretching for criticism here.

Not sure I'll invest in a PS4 either,I'm more likely to upgrade my PC and wait for both consoels to pan out and have a better library of games, but damn he complains about whining with the whiniest post I've seen in this thread and related threads yet.

I hope steam does because of right now we don't own are steam games. They can take the games away at any time go look it up.

I sure hope sony starts using dedicated server now that they're charging for PSN.

Oh i'm not whining just pointing out facts that so many of you like to over look and how most of this thread is nothing but whining about MS.

Sorry if it upsets you get over it.

I don't need to look it up I know the ToS.It's just very unlikely they'd ever do that and even if they did I can't see it standing when legally challenged.

Your facts are all as biased and suspect as anyone your railing against.

I'm not upset I don't plan to buy either at launch and will concentrate on my PC till the full story on both consoles has played out and we have decent libraries of games on either.

I just believe Sony has so far won the PR war with some crafty marketing added to Microsoft's arrogant and poorly messaged marketing.Sony is guilty of this in the last gen with PS3 and MS obviously learnt nothing from the mistakes Sony made back then.

I also believe MS is being childish with it's angrily caving in to public opinion  but taking it's toys and going home,instead of  trying to reach a compromise and clearly explaining the benefits of submitting to a revised DRM for example DRM only being used aggressively when it comes to sharing .

Give People reasons to want to be online ,give them benefits that can't be had offline.The third party developers have shown the way with this with The Division,Destiny,Need For Speed Rivals etc.Instead MS arrogantly told us we HAD to do it and we will like it and didn't emphasize why maybe we would want to be and what little they did explain was half assed and unclear.

They only have themselves to blame not the consumer.

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5249

6/20/13 12:33:59 AM#169
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by thunderc

 

O PLEASEEEE...... Dont even try to compare Steam to Micro$$$$oft. Steam runs insane sales all the  time practically giving games away with -75% off sales, Don't sit here and insult everyone's intelligence by claiming Microcrap would do the same. Steam's business model works because they treat the Gamer with respect , Microsoft does not.

You really think those sales are about the gamer? You do realize how much they're making off those sales considering the rate at which most of those products would be selling otherwise (at full price)?

No he doesn't and he probably thinks he owns his steam games. Which we don't. I have over a 100 steam games that I don't own and they can take them and anytime and if the publisher/dev removes the license from steam then you lose the game.

Just so you guys know.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/02/01/thought-do-we-own-our-steam-games/

Oh please, so now publishers are going to be pulling their licences from Steam, i suppose they'll be giving back all the money they got from Steam too, now you might not like it, but Steam is a free service that is a platform for selling games, if a publisher/developer were to do that they would find themselves in court so fast they would barely have time to file a chapter 11. Real world scenario's are a bit of a sod, of which im sure M$ will undoubtedly agree, at least for the brief moments their in it with the rest of us.

  chaintm

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/02/04
Posts: 977

"Shutting down threads sense 2004"

6/20/13 12:48:12 AM#170
It's really a good move for them, im not even a console player, but the xbox just has way more better titles coming out in it's lineup for the new system. At least I my eyes, they look like things I would play if I did use a console. I watch both full reveals on utube and after the hour and half of each, the xbox just had it right except for the DRM, the price is definitely another issues, but they do have a great lineup, I wasn't to impressed by the PS4 lineup even thou I think the system overall is better. Games make consoles sadly, not just consoles themselves. Probably the main reason I will be a pc gamer for life.

"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"

  bestever

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/26/11
Posts: 608

6/20/13 12:51:20 AM#171
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by thunderc

 

O PLEASEEEE...... Dont even try to compare Steam to Micro$$$$oft. Steam runs insane sales all the  time practically giving games away with -75% off sales, Don't sit here and insult everyone's intelligence by claiming Microcrap would do the same. Steam's business model works because they treat the Gamer with respect , Microsoft does not.

You really think those sales are about the gamer? You do realize how much they're making off those sales considering the rate at which most of those products would be selling otherwise (at full price)?

No he doesn't and he probably thinks he owns his steam games. Which we don't. I have over a 100 steam games that I don't own and they can take them and anytime and if the publisher/dev removes the license from steam then you lose the game.

Just so you guys know.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/02/01/thought-do-we-own-our-steam-games/

Oh please, so now publishers are going to be pulling their licences from Steam, i suppose they'll be giving back all the money they got from Steam too, now you might not like it, but Steam is a free service that is a platform for selling games, if a publisher/developer were to do that they would find themselves in court so fast they would barely have time to file a chapter 11. Real world scenario's are a bit of a sod, of which im sure M$ will undoubtedly agree, at least for the brief moments their in it with the rest of us.

I never said that they are going to pull their licences from steam, I said they could and you all can say that it would end up in a law suit all you want. How do you sue for something you don't own? Anyways thanks for trying to twist that and put words in my mouth.

In the end they can do what ever they want since its not are property and till laws are changed for digital owner ship we don't have a leg to stand on. Just like if I get a movie on amazon and the licences gets pulled I no longer have that movie. Whats so hard about understanding that? I can't go after amazon. All you get is a digital right to use the licence and that's it, you don't own it.

What if steam shut down tomorrow then what? Who are you going to sue then?  

  craftseeker

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 628

6/20/13 12:56:06 AM#172
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by thunderc

 

Oh please, so now publishers are going to be pulling their licences from Steam, i suppose they'll be giving back all the money they got from Steam too, now you might not like it, but Steam is a free service that is a platform for selling games, if a publisher/developer were to do that they would find themselves in court so fast they would barely have time to file a chapter 11. Real world scenario's are a bit of a sod, of which im sure M$ will undoubtedly agree, at least for the brief moments their in it with the rest of us.

Well publishers could pull their licenses from Steam or from individuals, and no they would not have to repay the license fees or provide compensation or even a reason.  As you said real world scenario's are a bitch.  Hewlett Packard and other hardware companies have withdrawn software licenses in the past (UNIX OS and supporting software) they have gone to court over it and did win.  The wording of those EULA's is based on the proven terms of earlier software license agreements. So no chapter 11, probably no court case and almost certainly no compensation.

However there would be a loss of good will and perhaps a backlash against a publisher that did this with the result of loss of future earnings.

  Ujirik

Novice Member

Joined: 3/27/07
Posts: 457

6/20/13 1:10:51 AM#173
The funny thing is that most of you complainers will end up buying the Xbox One anyway.  It might not be now, next year or two years from now but you'll have the damn thing in your home eventually.

  KhinRunite

Novice Member

Joined: 11/05/10
Posts: 897

6/20/13 1:25:10 AM#174
Originally posted by Ujirik
The funny thing is that most of you complainers will end up buying the Xbox One anyway.  It might not be now, next year or two years from now but you'll have the damn thing in your home eventually.

It's all about the exclusives, baby.

  zellmer

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/30/09
Posts: 452

6/20/13 1:29:05 AM#175

Sigh, so many defensive xbox fans..

Does it matter at this point?  You're not fooling anybody anymore Microsoft, and the PS4 is still SOLD OUT already..

 

 

  Mothanos

Elite Member

Joined: 10/20/10
Posts: 1849

6/20/13 1:30:13 AM#176

Microsoft will digg for new ways to screw their customers.
Dont think for a second this company can be trusted.

Sony all the way.

  Merklynn

Novice Member

Joined: 6/09/10
Posts: 74

6/20/13 2:00:23 AM#177
No matter what both Xbox1 and PS4 will do well when they launch. We all have our favorite exclusives that simply must be played but Microsoft saw Sony getting a big boost of gamer support & had no choice but do a 180. At this point both companies want our gaming dollars so expect plenty more interesting events before launch.
Merklynn Xfire Miniprofile
  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

6/20/13 3:13:48 AM#178
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by darkhalf357x
It would have killed their sales and their image.  Still going to hack it like I did my 360.

 

 

This is the reason why they wanted the 24 Hour Authentication Check.

 It still wouldn't have stopped it, the connection process can be spoofed which is how all cloud based games have been hacked. Just look at ONlive lol.

 

What happened with Onlive? I thought that service died awhile back.

 awhile back? its only been going for 3 years. they found a way to hack their service, though some of it has been fixed, people keep finding a way to play games without paying for them and even cheating on the games.

anyway im done posting for the night...this James Gandolfini news I stumbled across got me down to the point im feeling the need to drink.

 

 

I know its been going for around 3 years because I was a beta tester for Onlive. I thought I read somewhere that it was bought out by some company and afther that I never heard anything about it again.

Nah, it's not dead. Onlive was bought out but it is still going. Its also going to be part of the Xbox One in a sense anyways. 

http://iebandonlive.eventbrite.com/

"We are eager to speak to individuals and teams affected by the OnLive transition.  With the stunning success of Xbox/Kinect and the accelerated growth of this business, we are looking to add key players who want to make a real impact in creating groundbreaking new products and services.

We have positions in both Redmond, WA, and in Mountain View. There are big projects in the pipeline for the rest of 2012 and beyond, and the team is growing rapidly to support the work ahead! We’d love to have YOU be part of our team!

Come join us!  Enjoy food, drinks and mix and mingle with our hiring managers .  Stick around for a chance to win a Kinect Bundle.  We will be raffling one off during the Mixer."

 

 

  Kaijin2k3

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/28/08
Posts: 549

6/20/13 3:20:29 AM#179
Originally posted by bestever

I never said that they are going to pull their licences from steam, I said they could and you all can say that it would end up in a law suit all you want. How do you sue for something you don't own? Anyways thanks for trying to twist that and put words in my mouth.

In the end they can do what ever they want since its not are property and till laws are changed for digital owner ship we don't have a leg to stand on. Just like if I get a movie on amazon and the licences gets pulled I no longer have that movie. Whats so hard about understanding that? I can't go after amazon. All you get is a digital right to use the licence and that's it, you don't own it.

What if steam shut down tomorrow then what? Who are you going to sue then?  

Publishers pulling games off of Steam has already happened, or did you miss this when Crysis 2 and Dragon Age 2 was pulled from Steam by EA?

Anyone who owned the game WAS NOT AFFECTED. You just couldn't buy it anymore (although Crysis 2 Maximum Edition was later added).

No publisher in their right mind would pull something like that. The outcry against that specific publisher along with Steam would dwarf the reaction from the X1; and we saw what MS now had to do.

EDIT: For some reason I thought this was a seperate thread. I wanted to add that I think it's absolutely great that MS dropped those policies. Whether they regain the trust of offended buyers is another topic, but I still hardily clap the action at least (though I am aware they could bring the policies back, my clap will change if that ever occurs =P).

  Adalwulff

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/18/10
Posts: 1191

"I am not the light, or the darkness, but the twilight in between"

6/20/13 3:28:22 AM#180
Originally posted by Mothanos

Microsoft will digg for new ways to screw their customers.
Dont think for a second this company can be trusted.

Sony all the way.

 

Did you just say Sony can be trusted?   ...LOL

Seriously, you guys got some serious issues. Even when Microsoft gives you what you want, you give them no credit at all. I guess haters gunna hate.

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