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General Discussion  » What's the point of TESO

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96 posts found
  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 2:41:24 PM#61

It never ceases to amaze me how many people who like to throw the trendy "I hate themeparks" phrase around say, usually in the same sentence, that they like TES.

You don't really think that quest-based game like TES is a sandbox do you? The ability to ignore plot-lines and auto-scaled NPC strength don't make it a sandbox you know. You can ignore all plot-lines in WOW and GW2 also auto-scales combat. Are they sandboxes?

 

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

6/18/13 3:47:58 PM#62
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by jtcgs

Most console TES players don't play MMOs,

Most PC TES players don't like DaoC style limitations

Most PC MMO players never played DaoC

How many MMOers that you know don't also have consoles? But you know that those who played Skyrim or Oblivion on a console don't do MMOs... nice leap of logic.

You highlighted 3 things from my entire post and then attack it with something NOT related. Nice leap of logic.

At no point did I say that most MMO players do not have consoles...and yes, most TES players do NOT play MMOs as can be CLEARLY seen on TES websites where they are saying the game is not a TES game...OR WHY THE COMPANY ITSELF IS NOW TRYING TO REMOVE THE GAME FROM BEING ASSOCIATED WITH MMOS AND ARE TRYING TO PASS IT OFF AS A TES MULTIPLAYER GAME!

But wait, why am I talking TESO with someone that is going around saying TESO will sell 10 million copies and shut WoW down...hell, not even the COMPANY believes it will work anymore so are abandoning the MMO association. Do you even have anyone other than hardcore fanboys on your side anymore?

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 4:25:45 PM#63
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by jtcgs

Most console TES players don't play MMOs,

Most PC TES players don't like DaoC style limitations

Most PC MMO players never played DaoC

How many MMOers that you know don't also have consoles? But you know that those who played Skyrim or Oblivion on a console don't do MMOs... nice leap of logic.

You highlighted 3 things from my entire post and then attack it with something NOT related. Nice leap of logic.

At no point did I say that most MMO players do not have consoles...and yes, most TES players do NOT play MMOs as can be CLEARLY seen on TES websites where they are saying the game is not a TES game...OR WHY THE COMPANY ITSELF IS NOW TRYING TO REMOVE THE GAME FROM BEING ASSOCIATED WITH MMOS AND ARE TRYING TO PASS IT OFF AS A TES MULTIPLAYER GAME!

But wait, why am I talking TESO with someone that is going around saying TESO will sell 10 million copies and shut WoW down...hell, not even the COMPANY believes it will work anymore so are abandoning the MMO association. Do you even have anyone other than hardcore fanboys on your side anymore?

 "Shut WOW down" is your spin... 10 Mil copies? Quite possible... "abandoning MMO association" once again, your own brand of melodramatic hyperbole....

My side? Unless you mean rational people that don't go off half-cocked on every issue with melodrama, as you do, and who will either play this game or not depending on whether it sucks or not when it's released... I don't have any other side.

Don't mistake my reply to you as support for anything. It's just a reply against melodramatic nonsense...nothing more.

  MMOman101

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/05/08
Posts: 1214

6/18/13 4:26:43 PM#64
$
  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 4:29:38 PM#65
Originally posted by MMOman101
$

Did you think any AAA video games were designed for love? Only addicts and children would think that. It's an industry that rivals Hollywood for revenue... that's a clue.

  Punk999

Novice Member

Joined: 10/26/04
Posts: 882

6/18/13 4:41:24 PM#66

The point of TESO is to make people bitch and moan till it comes out.

That's just my opinion tho.

"Negaholics are people who become addicted to negativity and self-doubt, they find fault in most things and never seem to be satisfied."
^MMORPG.com

  Burntvet

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/16/07
Posts: 2800

6/18/13 4:44:01 PM#67
Originally posted by MMOman101
$

 

The only point is to sell boxes.
  Entinerint

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/12
Posts: 755

6/18/13 4:47:55 PM#68

Give me an Em

Give me an Oh

Give me an En

Give me an Ee

Give me a Why

What does that spell?!

MONEY!!!

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

6/18/13 5:38:35 PM#69
Originally posted by Iselin

 "Shut WOW down" is your spin... 10 Mil copies? Quite possible... "abandoning MMO association" once again, your own brand of melodramatic hyperbole....

My side? Unless you mean rational people that don't go off half-cocked on every issue with melodrama, as you do, and who will either play this game or not depending on whether it sucks or not when it's released... I don't have any other side.

Don't mistake my reply to you as support for anything. It's just a reply against melodramatic nonsense...nothing more.

 More proof you have NO CREDIBILITY at all.

http://www.justpushstart.com/2013/06/e3-2013-elder-scrolls-online-is-a-multiplayer-game-with-social-interactions/

Matt Frior, THE MAN MAKING THE GAME "Elder Scrolls Online is a multiplayer game with a built in social aspects like doing quests with friends or guilds. Though it’s not really an MMO at all".

http://www.strategyinformer.com/news/23350/the-elder-scrolls-online-is-more-a-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-game-than-an-mmo

""This is more a multiplayer Elder Scrolls game than an MMO," Matt Firor explains to Gamereactor"

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/06/05/zenimax-views-teso-as-more-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-than-mmo/

"We wanted to get Elder Scrolls players who were unfamiliar with online games and MMO terms to get in, play, have fun and get introduced to the multiplayer aspects."

Sorry buddy, your rose colored glasses have blinded you to everything...even the people making the game you are trying to hump agree with ME and what I have stated here. They are in full tilt damage control now trying to undo the last years worth of hype that completely missed its mark which is NOT YOU. lol...

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 5:56:17 PM#70
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Iselin

 "Shut WOW down" is your spin... 10 Mil copies? Quite possible... "abandoning MMO association" once again, your own brand of melodramatic hyperbole....

My side? Unless you mean rational people that don't go off half-cocked on every issue with melodrama, as you do, and who will either play this game or not depending on whether it sucks or not when it's released... I don't have any other side.

Don't mistake my reply to you as support for anything. It's just a reply against melodramatic nonsense...nothing more.

 More proof you have NO CREDIBILITY at all.

http://www.justpushstart.com/2013/06/e3-2013-elder-scrolls-online-is-a-multiplayer-game-with-social-interactions/

Matt Frior, THE MAN MAKING THE GAME "Elder Scrolls Online is a multiplayer game with a built in social aspects like doing quests with friends or guilds. Though it’s not really an MMO at all".

http://www.strategyinformer.com/news/23350/the-elder-scrolls-online-is-more-a-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-game-than-an-mmo

""This is more a multiplayer Elder Scrolls game than an MMO," Matt Firor explains to Gamereactor"

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/06/05/zenimax-views-teso-as-more-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-than-mmo/

"We wanted to get Elder Scrolls players who were unfamiliar with online games and MMO terms to get in, play, have fun and get introduced to the multiplayer aspects."

Sorry buddy, your rose colored glasses have blinded you to everything...even the people making the game you are trying to hump agree with ME and what I have stated here. They are in full tilt damage control now trying to undo the last years worth of hype that completely missed its mark which is NOT YOU. lol...

 Lol. I guess I missed where they got rid of Cyrodiil and AvA...oh wait they didn't: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/view/videos/play/3123/E3-2013-Talking-PVP-with-Brian-Wheeler.html

The game hasn't changed in the slightest but you obviously are swallowing all the new hype they're spoon feeding you. Can't say I'm surprised.

  waynejr2

Elite Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 3878

RIP City of Heroes!

6/18/13 6:00:07 PM#71
Originally posted by ChloroCat
Not sure why they didn't just get on the zombie band-wagon. Skyrim: Z

 This is full of win!

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

6/18/13 7:08:04 PM#72
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Iselin

 "Shut WOW down" is your spin... 10 Mil copies? Quite possible... "abandoning MMO association" once again, your own brand of melodramatic hyperbole....

My side? Unless you mean rational people that don't go off half-cocked on every issue with melodrama, as you do, and who will either play this game or not depending on whether it sucks or not when it's released... I don't have any other side.

Don't mistake my reply to you as support for anything. It's just a reply against melodramatic nonsense...nothing more.

 More proof you have NO CREDIBILITY at all.

http://www.justpushstart.com/2013/06/e3-2013-elder-scrolls-online-is-a-multiplayer-game-with-social-interactions/

Matt Frior, THE MAN MAKING THE GAME "Elder Scrolls Online is a multiplayer game with a built in social aspects like doing quests with friends or guilds. Though it’s not really an MMO at all".

http://www.strategyinformer.com/news/23350/the-elder-scrolls-online-is-more-a-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-game-than-an-mmo

""This is more a multiplayer Elder Scrolls game than an MMO," Matt Firor explains to Gamereactor"

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/06/05/zenimax-views-teso-as-more-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-than-mmo/

"We wanted to get Elder Scrolls players who were unfamiliar with online games and MMO terms to get in, play, have fun and get introduced to the multiplayer aspects."

Sorry buddy, your rose colored glasses have blinded you to everything...even the people making the game you are trying to hump agree with ME and what I have stated here. They are in full tilt damage control now trying to undo the last years worth of hype that completely missed its mark which is NOT YOU. lol...

 Lol. I guess I missed where they got rid of Cyrodiil and AvA...oh wait they didn't: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/view/videos/play/3123/E3-2013-Talking-PVP-with-Brian-Wheeler.html

The game hasn't changed in the slightest but you obviously are swallowing all the new hype they're spoon feeding you. Can't say I'm surprised.

 Where did *I* say the game changed? Didn't, grasping at straws again so you don't have to refute why the COMPANY is pushing it as something different?

Yep, cause you bought into all that old spoon fed hype.

You still haven't done a thing to gain any credibility back, the company itself changed its tune and that only happens for a reason...TES fans weren't buying into it and hated the idea.

Funny thing is, it doesn't MATTER what they do. If they go more MMO, TES fans wont buy into it as THEY SAID THEMSELVES in those interviews. If they go lite MMO, the MMO crowd wont buy into it because it will be a crappy MMO. If they go TES Multiplayer the TES crowd still wont buy into it because of its massive weak DaoC faction/race/zone limitations.

This is what happens when an IP is used by people wanting to make a game based on a different IP that wasn't good enough for a sequel in the first place.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  daltanious

Elite Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1944

6/18/13 7:45:42 PM#73
Originally posted by Voqar

At this point I'm wonder why they're making this game.

....

 

Hmmm. now that I think, wondering myself. You liste a lot of good points. Mainly agree games in general that would like to please PVP-ers only and at same time PVE-ers ... usually fail and at the end nobody is happy.

Guess they want their part of cake. :-) But they could end in not having any.

Anyway ... I'm interested only and only to PVE, could not care less for PVP then I do. With Swtor expansion that do not have enough quests to level up only with questing and one is pretty fast in to high areas ... I have re-discovered what a joy is group content in Swtor. Wow lost me completely for end game with Cata. Maybe normal and to also hard FP are too easy .. but they are incredibly fun, at least for me.

For sure will try TESO but you made me somehow worried. :-) Must check on internet, just hope it does not have forced PVP, because would left instantly.

  McSire

Novice Member

Joined: 5/27/13
Posts: 46

6/18/13 7:52:28 PM#74
ZOS even said it themselves one of the main reasons for this games development is to be able to play Elder Scrolls with your friends. /End discussion.

  TheRose

Novice Member

Joined: 6/18/13
Posts: 5

6/18/13 7:54:09 PM#75
 

 

 

 

 

  McSire

Novice Member

Joined: 5/27/13
Posts: 46

6/18/13 7:57:12 PM#76
Double Post Deleted

  TheRose

Novice Member

Joined: 6/18/13
Posts: 5

6/18/13 8:00:27 PM#77
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by azzamasin

Same here and unlike jctgs (or however he spells his name) is wrong about people not understanding DAoC.  DAoC RvR is synonymous across the MMO genre as having excellent PvP with many people considering it the best iteration of PvP in an MMO to date. 

 Only to former DaoC players.

Nobody that came In with Guild Wars 1 believes DaoC had better PvP, nobody that came in with WoW believes it either, nobody that came into the MMO genre within the last 3 years says "boy that DaoC had better PvP than the MMOs I have played!"

Because they NEVER PLAYED IT...oh wait, do you actually think that because YOU and some other former DaoC players post online about it that it makes people believe your experiences with that game is going to change their mind about their own experiences?!?

Rose colored glasses...glasses that have made some people so blind that they wont even admit that if DaoCs RvR was so damn great...why the hell didn't ANYONE EVER COPY IT? They didn't, because of its massive flaws and limitations.

I must confess ive never played daoc, im too young.

but my current mmo of choice planetside 2 and its predecessor owe daoc heavily.

lots of people have tried to copy DAOCs PVP with varying degrees of success, but most of them tweak it in a bad way and ruin it.

only SOE have succeeded with both Planetside and planetside 2

mythic themselves tried with warhammer, which although i found fun for a few months, was fattaly flawed by having 2 sides and a city seige mechanic which meant it had to reset

Your game of choice GW2 got most things right, although it was small scale and mean in terms of map size and player capacity. I tried to like it I really did, I did kinda like its PVE, but its PVP didn't hold my interest at all because its just RED vs GREEN vs BLUE and lets all stop for a nice cup of tea and a slice of cake 2 weeks later before we fight another RED vs GREEN vs BLUE battle for two weeks.  

In planetside two I've got a hook, I want to see them Smurfs and Commies die, I want to hear the lamentations of their menfolk.  I hate that guild that killed me over and over and over then did a huge airdrop on the crown 2 months ago.  GW2 lacks that, its fun for a few months, but there's no rivalry.  Things like the Dolyaks and Relics were nice features though, they gave it bit more tactics compared to the below games which failed badly.

Blizzard tried to copy it with wrath of the liche king, but they did some stupid thing where you had to be there at certain times or it wasn't on, isn't the point of this PVP style to always have PVP available and not be sat in a queue?

Funcom and Trion tried it, but on a much smaller scale, even than gw2, but it was ruined by cross factioning, because everyone could be friends in pve

Looking at future MMOs and as a fan of this PVP style, middle of the road if you like, I hate the wow style minigames, but I tried eve and that was too hardcore for me.

ESO will not work because of the everyone on the same server thing.  Plus i think an archage type PVP system would have fitted the lore better.

CU will work, its being made by one of the only two groups of people who've ever managed to pull this PVP style off

WH40K will half work, it will be OK, but its making the same flaw as WAR and GW2, it has a campaign that has to reset.  OK its 3 months, but it shouldn't stop, after all "in the grim dark future of humanity there is only war"

also for fun ------- http://tap-repeatedly.com/2011/09/exclusive-interview-arenanets-colin-johanson/

i don't know why you are so worried, people will still play GW2 when TES is released, they will probably be simmilar PVP wise, but heres hoping TES is a little bit better.

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 8:06:17 PM#78
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Iselin

 "Shut WOW down" is your spin... 10 Mil copies? Quite possible... "abandoning MMO association" once again, your own brand of melodramatic hyperbole....

My side? Unless you mean rational people that don't go off half-cocked on every issue with melodrama, as you do, and who will either play this game or not depending on whether it sucks or not when it's released... I don't have any other side.

Don't mistake my reply to you as support for anything. It's just a reply against melodramatic nonsense...nothing more.

 More proof you have NO CREDIBILITY at all.

http://www.justpushstart.com/2013/06/e3-2013-elder-scrolls-online-is-a-multiplayer-game-with-social-interactions/

Matt Frior, THE MAN MAKING THE GAME "Elder Scrolls Online is a multiplayer game with a built in social aspects like doing quests with friends or guilds. Though it’s not really an MMO at all".

http://www.strategyinformer.com/news/23350/the-elder-scrolls-online-is-more-a-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-game-than-an-mmo

""This is more a multiplayer Elder Scrolls game than an MMO," Matt Firor explains to Gamereactor"

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/06/05/zenimax-views-teso-as-more-multiplayer-elder-scrolls-than-mmo/

"We wanted to get Elder Scrolls players who were unfamiliar with online games and MMO terms to get in, play, have fun and get introduced to the multiplayer aspects."

Sorry buddy, your rose colored glasses have blinded you to everything...even the people making the game you are trying to hump agree with ME and what I have stated here. They are in full tilt damage control now trying to undo the last years worth of hype that completely missed its mark which is NOT YOU. lol...

 Lol. I guess I missed where they got rid of Cyrodiil and AvA...oh wait they didn't: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/view/videos/play/3123/E3-2013-Talking-PVP-with-Brian-Wheeler.html

The game hasn't changed in the slightest but you obviously are swallowing all the new hype they're spoon feeding you. Can't say I'm surprised.

 Where did *I* say the game changed? Didn't, grasping at straws again so you don't have to refute why the COMPANY is pushing it as something different?

Yep, cause you bought into all that old spoon fed hype.

You still haven't done a thing to gain any credibility back, the company itself changed its tune and that only happens for a reason...TES fans weren't buying into it and hated the idea.

Funny thing is, it doesn't MATTER what they do. If they go more MMO, TES fans wont buy into it as THEY SAID THEMSELVES in those interviews. If they go lite MMO, the MMO crowd wont buy into it because it will be a crappy MMO. If they go TES Multiplayer the TES crowd still wont buy into it because of its massive weak DaoC faction/race/zone limitations.

This is what happens when an IP is used by people wanting to make a game based on a different IP that wasn't good enough for a sequel in the first place.

Look I don't have enough time to debate with someone who is so insecure that he's unable to say "I think that..." Or "In my opinion..." or "I'm willing to bet that..." Everything that you type is all about trying to characterize your biased opinions with terminology to try to sell us on the idea that you have insider knowledge as when you preface all your rants with "most people" or when you tell us that you can read the minds of the developers because you know the reason why they are currently pitching the game at the wider ES player base.

my opinion is that the reason is not as dramatic as you try to portray it. They've told us MMO players about ESO the MMO and those of us who have been listening know it's an MMO -- if you don't think it is maybe you can tell us how it isn't. Now they are targeting a different group of people who might be afraid of the term MMO; maybe because they think it will "eat their life" ... which is typically what gamers who don't play MMOs say about why they don't.

they are trying to attract that crowd by emphasizing how it can be played just like a single player game. Did you think that playing ESO as an SP game is a new concept? Have you never seen that in all modern MMOs? It's targeted marketing to try to increase hype and maybe tap a new demographic... That's all it is.

But I know, that doesn't scream "News on FOX at 11" enough for you, nor does it fit with your pre-conceived judgement of how ESO will turn out. It's much more fun for you to just use it to bash the game as you have done with every single announcement that has been made about it in the past 6 months.

BTW... Your preoccupation with the word "credibility" and your constant ad-hominems tells us quite a bit about you and not so much about your target du jour. just saying...

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 4155

6/18/13 9:12:09 PM#79
Originally posted by TheRose
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by azzamasin

Same here and unlike jctgs (or however he spells his name) is wrong about people not understanding DAoC.  DAoC RvR is synonymous across the MMO genre as having excellent PvP with many people considering it the best iteration of PvP in an MMO to date. 

 Only to former DaoC players.

Nobody that came In with Guild Wars 1 believes DaoC had better PvP, nobody that came in with WoW believes it either, nobody that came into the MMO genre within the last 3 years says "boy that DaoC had better PvP than the MMOs I have played!"

Because they NEVER PLAYED IT...oh wait, do you actually think that because YOU and some other former DaoC players post online about it that it makes people believe your experiences with that game is going to change their mind about their own experiences?!?

Rose colored glasses...glasses that have made some people so blind that they wont even admit that if DaoCs RvR was so damn great...why the hell didn't ANYONE EVER COPY IT? They didn't, because of its massive flaws and limitations.

I must confess ive never played daoc, im too young.

but my current mmo of choice planetside 2 and its predecessor owe daoc heavily.

lots of people have tried to copy DAOCs PVP with varying degrees of success, but most of them tweak it in a bad way and ruin it.

only SOE have succeeded with both Planetside and planetside 2

mythic themselves tried with warhammer, which although i found fun for a few months, was fattaly flawed by having 2 sides and a city seige mechanic which meant it had to reset

Your game of choice GW2 got most things right, although it was small scale and mean in terms of map size and player capacity. I tried to like it I really did, I did kinda like its PVE, but its PVP didn't hold my interest at all because its just RED vs GREEN vs BLUE and lets all stop for a nice cup of tea and a slice of cake 2 weeks later before we fight another RED vs GREEN vs BLUE battle for two weeks.  

In planetside two I've got a hook, I want to see them Smurfs and Commies die, I want to hear the lamentations of their menfolk.  I hate that guild that killed me over and over and over then did a huge airdrop on the crown 2 months ago.  GW2 lacks that, its fun for a few months, but there's no rivalry.  Things like the Dolyaks and Relics were nice features though, they gave it bit more tactics compared to the below games which failed badly.

Blizzard tried to copy it with wrath of the liche king, but they did some stupid thing where you had to be there at certain times or it wasn't on, isn't the point of this PVP style to always have PVP available and not be sat in a queue?

Funcom and Trion tried it, but on a much smaller scale, even than gw2, but it was ruined by cross factioning, because everyone could be friends in pve

Looking at future MMOs and as a fan of this PVP style, middle of the road if you like, I hate the wow style minigames, but I tried eve and that was too hardcore for me.

ESO will not work because of the everyone on the same server thing.  Plus i think an archage type PVP system would have fitted the lore better.

CU will work, its being made by one of the only two groups of people who've ever managed to pull this PVP style off

WH40K will half work, it will be OK, but its making the same flaw as WAR and GW2, it has a campaign that has to reset.  OK its 3 months, but it shouldn't stop, after all "in the grim dark future of humanity there is only war"

also for fun ------- http://tap-repeatedly.com/2011/09/exclusive-interview-arenanets-colin-johanson/

i don't know why you are so worried, people will still play GW2 when TES is released, they will probably be simmilar PVP wise, but heres hoping TES is a little bit better.

Very nice summary of PvP in the last 5 years or so. Specially liked the "lamentation of their menfolk" bit :)

About ESO and the mega server thing... You know about "campaigns?" It!s what they're calling their AvA server-within-a-server thing. Once you're in a campaign you're there for life...or until you use in game PvP currency to buy your way into switching to a different one. Their plan is to even give them unique names.  Switching campaigns is supposed to be as big a deal as SW itching servers is in other games...but bigger than the switch to whichever server is winning crap we see in GW2.

In PVE? Yeah it's one big server and you'll be playing with players from your faction who may PvP in a different campaign. It's not my favorite idea in the world either since I'd prefer PvEing with the same crowd you PvP with... But I can do that within my guild so it's better than nothing. But the Cyrodiil campaigns at least function like servers.

  TheRose

Novice Member

Joined: 6/18/13
Posts: 5

6/18/13 9:36:51 PM#80
I'm looking forwards to it, I find this kind of pvp inclusive and fun. Even gw2. I was perhaps a bit harsh on it, due to our friend here and his obvious agenda.

But the games I've enjoyed it in had traditional servers, so I'm sceptical. I hated pvp in wow and stuck to doing dungeons, I think because its so small scale you get told off for doing things wrong, I also hate fps pvp, except for planetside 2. But warhammer converted me to pvp with its team work and the more the merrier approach, so I welcome games doing simmilar pvp.
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