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News & Features Discussion  » [Review] Neverwinter: An Astral Diamond in the Rough

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177 posts found
  Greatsword

Novice Member

Joined: 11/18/05
Posts: 53

5/30/13 5:52:37 PM#101

I'd rate it 5/10, but only if you consider 5 as a truly average game.


Since most people see 5 as a rather horrible rating, my rating in "most people's language" would probably be 7 as well.


  Mtibbs1989

Elite Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 2728

5/30/13 6:05:49 PM#102

Originally posted by Greatsword

I'd rate it 5/10, but only if you consider 5 as a truly average game.




Since most people see 5 as a rather horrible rating, my rating in "most people's language" would probably be 7 as well.





 


 I totally with your rating, I believe 5/10 is a truly average experience with this game. There's nothing significant other than the foundry that separates this game from other MMO's. However, just because this game has the foundry does not . The mass amounts of game breaking/economy breaking exploits, lack of content, lack of gear variations, and other cons definitely subtract from the score.



Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.

  Golelorn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/23/03
Posts: 1070

5/30/13 6:05:57 PM#103
Too many exploiters and botters for this game to have any longevity. That is why the cash shop is so high. Its there to get your money fast, because you won't be around long.
  JediSeer

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/11
Posts: 21

5/30/13 7:14:24 PM#104
Originally posted by evilastro

Originally posted by kakasaki


Originally posted by JediSeer





"Trickster Rogues can sneak around behind and pick off the strongest monster."


So, you're one of those are you?! I see you far too often when I play! If you are playing a rogue this way, then you are doing it wrong!


Sadly, you are one of my pet peeves...and I repeat, this is certainly NOT the proper way to play a rogue!


People that play rogues, please understand, your job is NOT to go beating on the strongest monsters, bosses, or champions until after you've taken care of the squishies. Squishies or soft targets like casters, healers and trash mobs are your number one priority!


Your job is NOT to go and tackle the toughest mob that the tank is trying to keep occupied while there are still adds running round (most likely harassing the clerics)!


If you play your rogue this way, then I would imagine you may also be the same player that often complains that you're not getting healed properly. This is because the clerics are too busy trying to get the adds off of them, while you are incorrectly trying to attack the tank's target and allowing those mobs to preoccupy your clerics and control wizards.


Let the tank hold the bosses aggro, while the healer heals and wizard controls and take out the squishies/adds. You'll be amazed as to how much easier the party manages itself!


Most players believe it is the healers that are the difference between a great party and a bad one; I'd argue that the rogue is the key to a successful party, not the healers. A rogue that knows how to properly do its job makes all the difference!


---


Aside from that, great article and I agree with everything you said, particularly the overpriced Zen items. This absurd mentality of overpricing things and the negative effect it has is unfortunately something so many companies fail to see! It's the reason why Amazon and Walmart are two of the richest companies in the world as cheaper prices mean more customers and more frequent purchases, which in turn equals bigger growth and more sustainable profit.



 

I was going to go full "who are you to tell people how to play" and "it's your opinion" but, honestly, you are 100% correct in your points. "Those" rogues bother the hell out of me too (I play a healer most of the time).


Actually you are both wrong. Rogues are meant to attack the bosses / strongest mobs. Wizards and GWFs are meant to pick off the weak AE adds.

Then I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I also find it convenient that you gave no argument to back up you opinion.

 

I'm not saying rogues shouldn't be taking down bosses eventually, just not at first. Wizards are CC specialists not single-target damage dealers. The idea that they should be taking out adds, I find laughable. They should be helping to control the crowd in particular the bosses.

 

Rogues on the other hand are the biggest single-target damage dealers in the game and therefore can take out most soft targets extremely quickly. In addition, having stealth with combat advantage in this game gives them the ability to easily flank those adds, taking those adds out even faster.

 

I will agree that GW Fighters could also help with adds and soft targets, but like the CW are also more AoE than the rogue and therefore are not perfectly suited for single targets. In my opinion, GW Fighters are better used to attack adds that are attacking the tank. This way, GWFs are still hitting the boss the majority of the time. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be as many GWFs in the game, so I haven't seen them perform all that much.

 

Furthermore, rogues cannot take the punishment that GW Fighters can take and because of this will take far more immediate damage from the bosses. This puts added stress on the healers to keep them healed while adds are still running amuck attacking everything in sight. I've seen it time-and-time again.

 

Lastly, I'm not sure about the TR in Neverwinter (as I've not really played one), but in most every other MMO, rogues are the absolute best class at interrupting healers and other casters, which makes them duly suited for the task of taking out those mobs before focusing on the boss.

 

I have played enough MMOs and have seen enough great rogues that I fully stand by my statement. I promise that if your party attacks a dungeon this way, you will mow through things much quicker and with relative ease.

 

I'd love to hear your argument otherwise.

  Stzza

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/03/09
Posts: 31

5/30/13 7:15:37 PM#105

enjoyed the combat system, felt responsive and like I was hitting something.  thats about it though.

 

Total fast travel hub world, feels too linear to be called an MMORPG

Uninterested quests

Mute community, or the usual overused insults.

Playing : Archeage, Wildstar

Played : EVE, GW, SB, DF, AoC, WoW, WaR, L1, L2, Rift

Loved: DAoC, EVE, SB, old WoW, L2, GW2

  sirsygnus

Novice Member

Joined: 1/03/10
Posts: 2

5/30/13 7:29:16 PM#106

Originally posted by mcrippins

Agree with the overpriced cash shop. I actually use it. I'm really enjoying the game.. but $10 for a large bag is kinda rough. 

 


yes it should be 10$ for an account wide bag, not just one character.


Sygnus Moro

  jbombard

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/06/08
Posts: 466

5/30/13 7:33:28 PM#107

Wow the review gave the most praise to the areas I found least worthy of praise.




 




The graphics while not bad, are definitely not on the good side.  The character art looks like it was designed by somebody completely different than the game art.  Characters look very cartoony with the big eyes, hell they even made the half-orc female look cute, and they look very out of place in the realistic world.  Even with that aside I found everything to look very bland, and I don't mean dark like ESO, I just mean bland.




 




The combat felt very clunky.  There is a good chance I wasn't used to it, but it felt like combat animations were keeping me from moving when I needed to be moving, and moving wasn't canceling what I was doing at the time it would just move very sluggishly until the move I was in the middle of finished.  Didn't feel performance related as the game felt very light on requirements, bug maybe, or maybe I am just supposed to make a bunch of cancel action macros or something.  Still overall the combat felt more suited to a game controller than to a keyboard/mouse setup, and I think people like me that are used to the more traditional keyboard mouse setups used by MMORPGs are going to need more time to get used to it.




 




 





 

  Sho0terMcgavin

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/13/13
Posts: 318

5/30/13 8:21:33 PM#108

Originally posted by JediSeer


Originally posted by kakasaki


Originally posted by JediSeer





"Trickster Rogues can sneak around behind and pick off the strongest monster."


So, you're one of those are you?! I see you far too often when I play! If you are playing a rogue this way, then you are doing it wrong!


Sadly, you are one of my pet peeves...and I repeat, this is certainly NOT the proper way to play a rogue!


People that play rogues, please understand, your job is NOT to go beating on the strongest monsters, bosses, or champions until after you've taken care of the squishies. Squishies or soft targets like casters, healers and trash mobs are your number one priority!


Your job is NOT to go and tackle the toughest mob that the tank is trying to keep occupied while there are still adds running round (most likely harassing the clerics)!


If you play your rogue this way, then I would imagine you may also be the same player that often complains that you're not getting healed properly. This is because the clerics are too busy trying to get the adds off of them, while you are incorrectly trying to attack the tank's target and allowing those mobs to preoccupy your clerics and control wizards.


Let the tank hold the bosses aggro, while the healer heals and wizard controls and take out the squishies/adds. You'll be amazed as to how much easier the party manages itself!


Most players believe it is the healers that are the difference between a great party and a bad one; I'd argue that the rogue is the key to a successful party, not the healers. A rogue that knows how to properly do its job makes all the difference!


---


Aside from that, great article and I agree with everything you said, particularly the overpriced Zen items. This absurd mentality of overpricing things and the negative effect it has is unfortunately something so many companies fail to see! It's the reason why Amazon and Walmart are two of the richest companies in the world as cheaper prices mean more customers and more frequent purchases, which in turn equals bigger growth and more sustainable profit.







 


I was going to go full "who are you to tell people how to play" and "it's your opinion" but, honestly, you are 100% correct in your points. "Those" rogues bother the hell out of me too (I play a healer most of the time).



Thanks for the support!


 


My intention is not to come off sounding like an arse. It's just that I've seen a few really good rogues in my day and noticed that this is what they do...and perhaps why everyone that plays alongside them notices how good they are. :)



This is literally how I play my rogue.  I focus on the boss, the second the next wave of adds roll out.  I make sure to clean up the healers, casters and archers.  Then help take off some of the harder hitting adds on the healer.  Then back to boss once the CW can control the last remaining adds.  I have been told at least one time I was doing it wrong.  Glad to hear we think a like.


  Ginaz

Elite Member

Joined: 4/01/07
Posts: 1715

5/30/13 9:15:01 PM#109
Can't say I really disagree with the review and the pros and cons.  Combat and game play is a blast as is the Foundry but the way the cash shop is laid out, esp. the prices, will turn many people off.  They REALLY need to re-think and lower their prices.

Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?

Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.

  User Deleted
5/30/13 9:24:18 PM#110

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989




Originally posted by wordiz



Rogues aren't OP. Before I quit due to all the problems I could 1 v 1 any class in the game with my CW with probably about 90% success, and I didn't even have a full set of top tier gear yet. I could also solo cap points with my knockbacks and CC. I'm a good player, but I'm used to struggling quite a bit more in PVP. If anything, I'd say CW's are slightly OP...which is funny because early on people were calling them underpowered. Going up against a group of them is literally impossible.




Course people that cry about getting their ass kicked in PVP when they aren't rolling in a premade are kind of silly. Players that think they should be able to walk onto a battlefield without allies and dominate are self-entitled crybabies. That's the reason why no good open world pvp exists anymore.




As far as the review: I pretty much agree. I wouldn't say 7 though, to me 7 says a game is worth playing. The game is fun, the combat and everything else is great and it had tons of potential, but the rushed release damaged the game irreversibly without  a wipe.







 




 Yeah, rogues aren't OP that much. However, I have had the occasional rogue hit 30,000+ damage on my full tank Guardian Fighter. I do believe it needs slight tweaking to lower the damage output for the class. But for the vast majority of rogues I fight. They're mostly balanced.



Rogues are fine with the exception of their one-shot daily. I mean, its a bit rediculous that they can just charge it up then get a free kill on anyone they choose without debuffing or anything, usually the DC or CW.  People complain about CW Ice Knife, but you have to fully debuff to get a one shot with that, if you open with it youll only get 1/3rd of their life off.


  User Deleted
5/30/13 9:26:46 PM#111
Removed for edit.
 

 

  User Deleted
5/30/13 9:40:21 PM#112
Originally posted by JediSeer
Originally posted by evilastro

Originally posted by kakasaki


Originally posted by JediSeer





"Trickster Rogues can sneak around behind and pick off the strongest monster."


So, you're one of those are you?! I see you far too often when I play! If you are playing a rogue this way, then you are doing it wrong!


Sadly, you are one of my pet peeves...and I repeat, this is certainly NOT the proper way to play a rogue!


People that play rogues, please understand, your job is NOT to go beating on the strongest monsters, bosses, or champions until after you've taken care of the squishies. Squishies or soft targets like casters, healers and trash mobs are your number one priority!


Your job is NOT to go and tackle the toughest mob that the tank is trying to keep occupied while there are still adds running round (most likely harassing the clerics)!


If you play your rogue this way, then I would imagine you may also be the same player that often complains that you're not getting healed properly. This is because the clerics are too busy trying to get the adds off of them, while you are incorrectly trying to attack the tank's target and allowing those mobs to preoccupy your clerics and control wizards.


Let the tank hold the bosses aggro, while the healer heals and wizard controls and take out the squishies/adds. You'll be amazed as to how much easier the party manages itself!


Most players believe it is the healers that are the difference between a great party and a bad one; I'd argue that the rogue is the key to a successful party, not the healers. A rogue that knows how to properly do its job makes all the difference!


---


Aside from that, great article and I agree with everything you said, particularly the overpriced Zen items. This absurd mentality of overpricing things and the negative effect it has is unfortunately something so many companies fail to see! It's the reason why Amazon and Walmart are two of the richest companies in the world as cheaper prices mean more customers and more frequent purchases, which in turn equals bigger growth and more sustainable profit.



 

I was going to go full "who are you to tell people how to play" and "it's your opinion" but, honestly, you are 100% correct in your points. "Those" rogues bother the hell out of me too (I play a healer most of the time).


Actually you are both wrong. Rogues are meant to attack the bosses / strongest mobs. Wizards and GWFs are meant to pick off the weak AE adds.

Then I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I also find it convenient that you gave no argument to back up you opinion.

 

I'm not saying rogues shouldn't be taking down bosses eventually, just not at first. Wizards are CC specialists not single-target damage dealers. The idea that they should be taking out adds, I find laughable. They should be helping to control the crowd in particular the bosses.

 

Rogues on the other hand are the biggest single-target damage dealers in the game and therefore can take out most soft targets extremely quickly. In addition, having stealth with combat advantage in this game gives them the ability to easily flank those adds, taking those adds out even faster.

 

I will agree that GW Fighters could also help with adds and soft targets, but like the CW are also more AoE than the rogue and therefore are not perfectly suited for single targets. In my opinion, GW Fighters are better used to attack adds that are attacking the tank. This way, GWFs are still hitting the boss the majority of the time. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be as many GWFs in the game, so I haven't seen them perform all that much.

 

Furthermore, rogues cannot take the punishment that GW Fighters can take and because of this will take far more immediate damage from the bosses. This puts added stress on the healers to keep them healed while adds are still running amuck attacking everything in sight. I've seen it time-and-time again.

 

Lastly, I'm not sure about the TR in Neverwinter (as I've not really played one), but in most every other MMO, rogues are the absolute best class at interrupting healers and other casters, which makes them duly suited for the task of taking out those mobs before focusing on the boss.

 

I have played enough MMOs and have seen enough great rogues that I fully stand by my statement. I promise that if your party attacks a dungeon this way, you will mow through things much quicker and with relative ease.

 

I'd love to hear your argument otherwise.

Have you not run end game dungeons? I will give you a pro tip:
 

The strat for everything, and I mean everything, is to have two clerics stacking astral shield, two control wizards throwing mobs off the edge (where possible) or AE burning adds, and having one rogue on the boss. Wizards as crowd control? Please. They are the best AE damage in the game, and you need to burn the adds, not control them, otherwise you will get overwhelmed. AE control skills have a max target of 7. If you don't burn the adds, your control skills will be worthless as you will have more adds than you can control.

GF are not needed or used at all. But if you are going to use one, they are used to round up the adds. Not to tank the bosses, who usually have slow casting attacks that are easily dodged by a TR.

It's common knowledge, I don't really need anything else to back it up. Rogues are single target DPS, they are just there to keep aggro and burn the names.
 

Clearly you just havent played endgame yet.

  User Deleted
5/30/13 9:40:25 PM#113

@evilastro


please learn how to quote, that's unreadable


  User Deleted
5/30/13 9:41:44 PM#114
Originally posted by picommander

@evilastro


please learn how to quote, that's unreadable

It screwed up the spacing when I edited. Couldnt be bothered fixing it so just reposted.

  Crinnim

Novice Member

Joined: 6/06/10
Posts: 39

5/30/13 10:14:04 PM#115

"That sounds like a lot until it’s realized that that’s it"


Ermagerd!


  mcrippins

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/01/07
Posts: 1005

5/30/13 10:16:26 PM#116
Originally posted by BillMurphy

ITS STILL IN OPEN BETA FOR A REASON... Stop trying to rush it.

So if a new resturaunt in town opens up and does an opening special and gave everyone food posioning, they should not be held accountable?  That is essential the mentality "open-beta."  Like peopel have said and Suzie says, the moment you accept money from the in-game store then the game is released.

And it's nice to see the fans outright diss the review even though most agree to the scoring.  http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?311821-MMORPG-com-s-Neverwinter-Review

I feel like they're not bashing the review itself, but the argument between beta and release.  That, and most users there seem to think this is the woeful MMORPG.com of a few years back, not today.  I think we've really come a long way in our content, and I hope you guys are starting to see the fruits of our efforts.

 

I choose not to see your fruits, but the content has drastically improved over the last 2 years.

 
 
  Distaste

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 668

5/30/13 10:23:51 PM#117

Neverwinter is probably a 5 at best currently.

Class balance is an utter mess. TR and CW dominate and clerics are there only to drop astral shields. DC's actually have a passive "buff" that makes them heal themselves for 40% less just to give you an idea of how horribly put together the classes are(the reason given is because they wanted clerics to use potions...). Many skills do not work how the tooltip says, some are broken, and others are so broken they do the opposite of the tooltips.

Dungeons are boring because every single boss/trash pack are exactly the same; red circles and tons of adds. As a cleric it's the worse experience ever because not only are you the healer but now you're tanking because aggro is broken. Don't assume you'll be getting loot either if you're in a PUG because everyone needs on everything because they want Astral diamonds.

Leveling becomes monotonous because every single zone is setup the same Intro quests->followups->Instanced dungeon->next questhub->repeat. Again there is little mob variety and if you're a cleric(low dps) past 40 becomes dreadfully slow since everything heals, summons more adds, or has a ton of health compared to your dps.

PvP is not even worth doing unless you're a TR or CW due to the horrid class balance. There is no real matching so you can be at GS 5k and be vs a premade 5 man with GS 10k. If you PUG queue you have an equal chance of getting an AFKer or having the group leader(given to a random player) kick you because he can. Honestly 3/4 my PvP gear(which isn't even that great) was bought with glory from losses due to either AFKers, going against premades, or bad class comp(not enough TR or CW).

The economy is essentially fixed to AD's but getting them is a pain. You can do your dailies(which at 60 are incredibly tedious especially since you're forced into doing things you don't really want to do). I just hate when they add a 2nd gated currency that cannot be earned through normal play. GW2 did the same thing with laurels and it makes playing the game tedious.

What's wrong with the game is easily shown in the profession(crafting) missions. Do I send out my crafters out on a 2 hour mission and I get 200 astral diamonds, 1s, and 40xp or an 8 hour mission and I get 300 astral diamonds 2s and 40xp. The game isn't balanced, lacks polish, lacks variety, and lacks depth. If 10 is the best MMO and 1 is the worse, Neverwinter is a 5.

  enntense

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/12
Posts: 15

5/30/13 10:27:16 PM#118
Yeah, well....Here's the total fail part..This is supposed to be D&D...Uh where is the D&D?  Anyone find any D&D in their game?  I already left the game.  Hope you guys enjoy the D&D'less Neverwinter.
  User Deleted
5/30/13 10:35:07 PM#119
Originally posted by Distaste

Class balance is an utter mess. TR and CW dominate and clerics are there only to drop astral shields. DC's actually have a passive "buff" that makes them heal themselves for 40% less just to give you an idea of how horribly put together the classes are(the reason given is because they wanted clerics to use potions...). Many skills do not work how the tooltip says, some are broken, and others are so broken they do the opposite of the tooltips.

PvP is not even worth doing unless you're a TR or CW due to the horrid class balance. There is no real matching so you can be at GS 5k and be vs a premade 5 man with GS 10k. If you PUG queue you have an equal chance of getting an AFKer or having the group leader(given to a random player) kick you because he can. Honestly 3/4 my PvP gear(which isn't even that great) was bought with glory from losses due to either AFKers, going against premades, or bad class comp(not enough TR or CW).

Picking up on these two points.

1) Clerics got the self heal debuff because they were stupidly OP without it. As it stands you barely need potions as a DC. Before the debuff they were simply unkillable.

2) GWF and GFs are actually the king of PvP at the moment. But only if you are good. Both have crazy burst DPS and the best CC in the game (obliterates the short duration CW stuff). They can literally stunlock you to death. If either get in melee range of a CW / TR its game over.

  mysticmouse

Novice Member

Joined: 4/05/11
Posts: 84

5/30/13 10:58:33 PM#120
I tried the game out and found lots of issues and things i did not enjoy. I would rate it about a 6 overall.
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