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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] General: Becoming a F2P Convert

9 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Last Search
172 posts found
  scritty

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/12
Posts: 89

5/25/13 6:57:14 AM#41

So many assumptions at the top of this blog are just wrong. Swtor made cash LOTS of it - it 100% covered development costs in 6 months as a subscription model.

It would have taken 7 years even at CURRENT high player levels to do the same thing as it is set up now.

And there is the thing SWTOR and LOTRO STO and others were NOT DEVELOPED free to play. F2P players have the great luck to be playing a AAA sub game that fell into F2P.

Also if they want players to pay for micro transactions - and enough of them to make a decent amount of money for the game over the long term - then what is offered needs to actually have some value in game most of the time. There are so many times most people will pay for a different colored hat or a mount that looks slightly different but acts exactly the same. As soon as they do people QQ about "This is Pay to win" and is far as PvE goes it often is - but without buying P2W PvE items then finance model of these games would fall flat and the servers would shut in no time.

  Mimzel

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/08/07
Posts: 372

5/25/13 7:02:14 AM#42

Love your articles, Chris! You have an excellent way of expressing yourself. I do think it's the right way of thinking about it; F2P as we know it now is a phase in the MMORPG genre. It will most likely continue to search for the golden Best Practice.

I hate F2P games which deliberately fill their roads with pot holes and then sell asphalt in their cash shop. Games like Tera, however, have struck a positive chord with me.

  User Deleted
5/25/13 7:55:53 AM#43
I have yet to see a MMO that was designed to be F2p, that's any good.
  Segun777

Jade Dynasty Correspondent

Joined: 6/22/09
Posts: 98

5/25/13 8:29:37 AM#44
Great article.
  Destai

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/31/09
Posts: 513

5/25/13 8:30:18 AM#45

Well OP, I'm happy you pointed out what is wrong the with the model. You've highlighted the fact that these games were failures, in some respect or the other. You've also highlighted the fact that they gate content - you'd think it'd be the opposite. You've pointed out exactly what's wrong with the genre and by proximity, you are part of the problem.

 

If I wanted lotteries, I'd go to the casino. If I wanted to get nickel-and-dimed, I'd go to a pawn shop. Most of the f2p games should have been shut down and their existence makes me lament every announcement of an MMO because all I can think of is how bad they will suck and how much money they ask for around every turn.  

 

Personally, I don't believe in supporting any game that gates content, or asks for points or money everytime I turn around. I'm a firm believer in the buy-to-play model, but I'd support f2p games that have a cosmetic cash shop. I'm hoping Rift is done well, I've really enjoyed that game and I'd hate to see it become another LoTRO.

 

Currently Playing: World of Warcraft, GTA Online
Occasionally Playing: Guild Wars 2, the Secret World


Past Loves: Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online, Everquest

  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 3064

5/25/13 8:39:37 AM#46

There's only one way to fight the "F2P Blight" that's ruining the MMO genre...

 

Play them all to the max without spending a single cent !

 

Because if the F2P developers don't make enough income on their current pricing models, they will make them more restrictive to "encourage" players to spend more. In short, they will become more and more P2W in an effort to extract cash from player wallets constantly. They will slowly kill themselves...

  User Deleted
5/25/13 8:51:12 AM#47
Originally posted by SpottyGekko

There's only one way to fight the "F2P Blight" that's ruining the MMO genre...

 

Play them all to the max without spending a single cent !

 

Because if the F2P developers don't make enough income on their current pricing models, they will make them more restrictive to "encourage" players to spend more. In short, they will become more and more P2W in an effort to extract cash from player wallets constantly. They will slowly kill themselves...

So you wanna save the MMO genre by ruining it? You are very aware that your, and I am using the term generously, advice wouldn't mean the death of F2P games, it would mean the death of games where advantages are not being sold in cash shops and if you think P2P devs won't get in on that action you're really optimistic (again being very generous). How would they get away with selling power in a p2p game? why elementary my dear boy: down the sub to 10 maybe even 5 monetary units per month (be that dollars, euros, british pounds, whatever) and then put in necessary for high level play items in the cash shop and also make it available in-game at massively low drop rates off high level bosses in raids or via special rare events. Think that's impossible? Not so many people from P2P community wouldn't say "it keeps the riff raff out and I pay so little already! why not pay more?".

  centkin

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/01/10
Posts: 827

5/25/13 9:20:57 AM#48
In a FTP game I want protection against the whales.  In essence a server where there is a subscription fee and the most you can pay per month is $50.  It gets ridiculous when you have to compete against people who are spending $700 per month on a game.  And while yes those people do rake in a lot of money, when they take the top rating EVERY TIME with people spending less having no chance, it tends to make the $50 people become $0 people. 
  Aldous.Huxley

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/04/13
Posts: 443

5/25/13 9:21:23 AM#49
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

Don't be so narrow in thought. I didn't mean that I would play all four. I just meant that I would rather see that many quality games released instead of the many junk games. I said nowhere in my post that I would play all 4. Now, 4 to choose from? Yes.

Reading is fundamental.

 

[mod edit]

[mod edit]

My point, as touched on in my post is that FTP artificially props up substandard games that would otherwise fail if they were subscription based. Since these companies have now found a way to make money from substandard games, it only gives incentive to pump out low quality games for the easy money. [mod edit]

  User Deleted
5/25/13 10:52:30 AM#50
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

Don't be so narrow in thought. I didn't mean that I would play all four. I just meant that I would rather see that many quality games released instead of the many junk games. I said nowhere in my post that I would play all 4. Now, 4 to choose from? Yes.

Reading is fundamental.

 

[mod edit]

 

 

[mod edit]

 

My point, as touched on in my post is that FTP artificially props up substandard games that would otherwise fail if they were subscription based. Since these companies have now found a way to make money from substandard games, it only gives incentive to pump out low quality games for the easy money. This is the obvious portion I believe you are missing, Captain...

[mod edit]

Substandard games are being made because people demand them (CoD, MoH, Gears of War, Halo, etc, the entire EA sports lineup). Case and point WoW held onto its title for so long and only now is it dying because it's just too old not because people are actually sick and tired of its now substandard design so kindly learn the difference between F2P and FTP and the difference between what you think F2P is doing to the market (encouraging bad games) and what it is actually doing (encouraging risks on the part of the developers with innovation and giving them a way to excuse high graphical fidelity to their investors), true there are bad sides to what is actually going on but so did the P2P system before it (so many, many substandard games or games which were forced out too soon and only under F2P do they finally find their wings).

  Aldous.Huxley

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/04/13
Posts: 443

5/25/13 11:15:47 AM#51

Yea... I think I understand now. Sub standard means innovative. Lack of polished content is risk taking. Forced CS items is actually variety in play style. And here I thought the only games that made FTP look remotely good are the sub failures because they at least attempted to make a sub worthy game.

 

Squelch...

  Whitebeards

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 823

5/25/13 11:23:55 AM#52
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

Yea... I think I understand now. Sub standard means innovative. Lack of polished content is risk taking. Forced CS items is actually variety in play style. And here I thought the only games that made FTP look remotely good are the sub failures because they at least attempted to make a sub worthy game.

 

Squelch...

For players like you a 'quality' MMO will never exist in reality because it exists in your head and nothing can ever compare to it.

[mod edit]

  Aldous.Huxley

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/04/13
Posts: 443

5/25/13 11:28:46 AM#53
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

Yea... I think I understand now. Sub standard means innovative. Lack of polished content is risk taking. Forced CS items is actually variety in play style. And here I thought the only games that made FTP look remotely good are the sub failures because they at least attempted to make a sub worthy game.

 

Squelch...

Yes because all F2P games are shit and all P2P games are God's gift to gamers.

Thank you for being brave enough to admit this.

 

/endthread

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5351

5/25/13 11:42:23 AM#54
It Is easy to be a "F2P convert" when you are converting to MMO's that started and were funded as P2P. Soon we may not have MMO's that start as P2P, that's when the real rot in the MMO genre will set in.
  GameByNight

Columnist / Podcast Host

Joined: 9/08/09
Posts: 85

5/25/13 1:16:45 PM#55
Originally posted by Scot
It Is easy to be a "F2P convert" when you are converting to MMO's that started and were funded as P2P. Soon we may not have MMO's that start as P2P, that's when the real rot in the MMO genre will set in.

You're right that my views changed with AAA games making the jump and there's good reason for that. Asking myself the questions in the column, I'm uncomfortable with games overtly selling power like those in Korea. Eg. The best items sold for cash with no way to acquire them within; openly imbalancing pve and pvp; encouraging players to compete through wallet size rather than any real dedication. That's the Eastern model. I have played a fair amount  of those titles and don't care for them; they usually feel low quality on top of pressuring your to spend. But I've been informed from playing those games and the last couple years of conversions to know that what we're seeing today is the West's take on F2P. We are much less tolerant of that game-breaking cash shops here and developers know that.

 

So it's not easy to be a F2P convert because of conversion games, it's easy because these games are refining a model customized to what our market can tolerate. But yes, the further it gets towards the Korean buy-alls, the less comfortable I am. But that's the great thing, with F2P, only the best games with the best business models will survive. I simply won't stay with a game that makes me feel inadequate because I don't want to buy items left and right. That's not fun. Other commenters smartly make this point above.

 

My personal favorite is buy to play and that's where I see the future of MMOs heading over the next five years. I would even be willing to bet that Wildstar takes up the model. Games designed with this in mind can count on an initial investment from every single player and thereby rely more on cosmetics, lotteries, and other non-game influencing shop items.

 

But by your estimation, Guild Wars 2 and Planetside 2 represent the rot of the industry? And Wildstar, if that does indeed release without a subscription fee? Make no mistake, I talk about big profile conversions but every single thing I said can be applied to games designed for the ground up for F2P or B2P. And GW2 especially shows that smart design can overcome these tired quality arguments. Examples abound outside of the MMO industry as well. Free-to-play does not mean bad, just ask LoL.

 

Writer of The Tourist, Tripping the Rift, and co-writer of Player Versus Player
Host of Game On: ESP Edition
Blogger at GameByNight.com

  Yamota

Elite Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6643

Gaming should be about fun, not gender equality.

5/25/13 3:56:29 PM#56

I agree with one thing in this column. If it wasn't for F2P, many games would die. But you know what? Then they should die. If the game is not good enough to warrant a subscription fee then it is not a good MMORPG and it would be good riddance for it to die.

F2P is nothing but a last ditch attempt for companies to squeeze the last cent out of them. And it works because there are some people out there with more money than sense and who get some sense of false accomplishment by buying themselves to the top.

  User Deleted
5/25/13 4:05:46 PM#57
-facepalms- in about 5-10 years I am willing to bet that when they come out with a pay by processing power payment system the same people who are now anti-F2P will be saying that system isn't as good as F2P is.
  Precusor

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/24/05
Posts: 4728

Aim Bot

5/25/13 4:07:00 PM#58
Originally posted by Kleptobrainiac

Yea... I think I understand now. Sub standard means innovative. Lack of polished content is risk taking. Forced CS items is actually variety in play style. And here I thought the only games that made FTP look remotely good are the sub failures because they at least attempted to make a sub worthy game.

 

Squelch...

Pretty much.

  simmihi

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/11/10
Posts: 525

5/25/13 4:10:28 PM#59
Originally posted by Yamota

I agree with one thing in this column. If it wasn't for F2P, many games would die. But you know what? Then they should die.

The problem is not F2P or B2P of P2P or whatever. The problem is that most games are garbage. They all follow the same model:solo leveling, gear/instance/raid oriented endgame. Almost zero character customization and development (and here i mean actually "Choice", the Choice to have more than 1-3 standard min-max "paths" for your "class" and "race" or "profession"). If you played one of these games, you've played them all. How many times can we fall into the same trap?

There is only one big title (EvE) which does not follow this model, and is not doing bad at all.

  Whitebeards

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 823

5/25/13 4:14:40 PM#60
Originally posted by Dihoru
-facepalms- in about 5-10 years I am willing to bet that when they come out with a pay by processing power payment system the same people who are now anti-F2P will be saying that system isn't as good as F2P is.

Fact is that these people are in minority and they are upset because their numbers are not enough to sustain P2P MMOS. They know they are losing on this turf so making noise on forums is the only thing left to do.

Even companies like Trion who said they will never go F2P with Rift had to out of necessity. So no matter how much P2P supporters make a fuss, in reality there are not just enough of them to sustain a new MMO on P2P model.

Any MMO that makes the mistake of releasing as a P2P MMO will soon realize this.

 

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