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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Proof of sandbox popularity?

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228 posts found
  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11921

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

5/13/13 6:03:50 AM#201
Originally posted by NaMeNaMe
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by General-Zod

Skyrim isnt a sandbox

I don't think there's a single professional in the game industry that would agree with you on that one, but I guess that's no different than any of your posts. 

Skyrim is NOT sandbox. It has sandbox elements. You cannot call skyrim a sandbox because it isn't no one has ever referred to the game as a sandbox don't even start.

"don't even start"

Yay, shout down anything that contradicts your beliefs. However, to address your claim that no one has ever referred to the game as a sandbox, here are a few links:

 

"Fallout and Skyrim are both open-world, sandbox RPG games with an identifiable Bethesda style."
 - Colin Moriarity, IGN
http://www.ign.com/articles/2011/11/29/five-lessons-fallout-4-can-learn-from-skyrim-3


"Since Skyrim is a sandbox game, the possibilities for new content are endless."
 - PC Magazine
http://www.pcmag.com/slideshow/story/307939/10-must-have-skyrim-mods


"But make no mistake about it, Skyrim is a fantasy sandbox game more than it is an RPG (because having RPG elements does not make you an RPG these days)."
- GOTY Awards
http://gotyawards.com/skyrim/


"Skyrim was in pre-production from 2006, well before the release of Fallout 3, so the team at Bethesda has spent almost seven years in its shivering sandbox."
 - PC Gamer
http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/04/15/skyrim-team-to-move-on-to-bethesdas-next-major-project/

 

I noticed you didn't have anything to support your particular stance. Was that an oversight?

  Quirhid

Novice Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5492

I dare you to pin a label on me.

5/13/13 8:28:45 AM#202

Just being open-ended, or having an open world doesn't mean the game is a sandbox, but apparently many people think so even though this would also mean every other Themepark MMO could considered a sandbox.

I guess, the terms don't have to be accurate or to make sense. Oh well...

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1551

5/13/13 8:31:39 AM#203
Originally posted by Quirhid

Just being open-ended, or having an open world doesn't mean the game is a sandbox, but apparently many people think so even though this would also mean every other Themepark MMO could considered a sandbox.

I guess, the terms don't have to be accurate or to make sense. Oh well...

Your right in one sense but what themeparks do you consider to be open world?

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  jmcdermottuk

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/10/06
Posts: 772

5/13/13 8:34:45 AM#204

The problem with sanbox MMO's is they're all Indie productions and they all go the FFA Full Loot route, which scares off probably 70% of their potential customer base.

 

If the sandbox is done right, like EVE, then it can work and be popular. If it's done wrong like DF or MO, it suffers.

  Benedikt

Tipster

Joined: 12/12/04
Posts: 1294

We live for The One, we die for The One.

5/13/13 8:51:58 AM#205
Originally posted by bcbully
15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 

proof of that statement?

  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1551

5/13/13 8:57:21 AM#206
Originally posted by Benedikt
Originally posted by bcbully
15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 

proof of that statement?

Google it, it's not hard to find.

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  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11921

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

5/13/13 9:04:00 AM#207
Originally posted by Apraxis

I personally think Sandboxes should go a step backward. Not Massive Multiplayer, but much more just Multiplayer, with Servers capable of a few hundred(and not thousands) of players.

I also think sandboxes should take a step back, but with the opposite approach - keep the MMO part and drop the RPG part. Focus on a persistent state virtual world. While, under that criteria, FB or Pintrest can be classified an MMO, it does show the level of interest in a sandbox environment where people can build, socialize, share and be creative.

  User Deleted
5/13/13 9:04:41 AM#208
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by Benedikt
Originally posted by bcbully
15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 

proof of that statement?

Google it, it's not hard to find.

"I saw it on the internet... so it must be true.  They can't put anything on the internet that isn't true."

I still love that commercial... "he's a french model."

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11921

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

5/13/13 9:08:12 AM#209
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by Benedikt
Originally posted by bcbully
15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 

proof of that statement?

Google it, it's not hard to find.

Well, I had trouble finding it, as the only Age of Wushu 15 million reference I could find was about some dude's rep. However, I did find this:

http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/20120606006747/en/Age-of-Wulin/martial-arts/beta

which was rather impressive.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4071

5/13/13 9:24:01 AM#210
Originally posted by jmcdermottuk

The problem with sanbox MMO's is they're all Indie productions and they all go the FFA Full Loot route, which scares off probably 70% of their potential customer base.

 

If the sandbox is done right, like EVE, then it can work and be popular. If it's done wrong like DF or MO, it suffers.

FFA Full loot pvp is just fine.. sure its not for everyone but still done right it makes the game.. infact since playing full loot PVP based games i find it very hard to get into standard MMORPGs without getting bored.

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  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10427

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

5/13/13 9:40:06 AM#211


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by SavageHorizon

Originally posted by Benedikt

Originally posted by bcbully 15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 
proof of that statement?
Google it, it's not hard to find.
Well, I had trouble finding it, as the only Age of Wushu 15 million reference I could find was about some dude's rep. However, I did find this:

http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/20120606006747/en/Age-of-Wulin/martial-arts/beta

which was rather impressive.




The Chinese version of the game had ten million people register. Kind of like Rift had a million people register. Except it was ten million register.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  SavageHorizon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/14/13
Posts: 1551

5/13/13 9:41:03 AM#212
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by SavageHorizon
Originally posted by Benedikt
Originally posted by bcbully
15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 

proof of that statement?

Google it, it's not hard to find.

Well, I had trouble finding it, as the only Age of Wushu 15 million reference I could find was about some dude's rep. However, I did find this:

http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/20120606006747/en/Age-of-Wulin/martial-arts/beta

which was rather impressive.

There you go, they also give something back as well.

http://www.mmoculture.com/2013/04/age-of-wushu-jet-li-graces-first-global-pvp-tournament/

I like the game a lot, looking forward to Age Of Wulin and European version of the game which imo will be better optimized for Europe than the us version.

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  Benedikt

Tipster

Joined: 12/12/04
Posts: 1294

We live for The One, we die for The One.

5/13/13 9:47:10 AM#213
Originally posted by lizardbones

 


Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by SavageHorizon

Originally posted by Benedikt

Originally posted by bcbully 15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 
proof of that statement?
Google it, it's not hard to find.
Well, I had trouble finding it, as the only Age of Wushu 15 million reference I could find was about some dude's rep. However, I did find this:

 

http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/20120606006747/en/Age-of-Wulin/martial-arts/beta

which was rather impressive.




The Chinese version of the game had ten million people register. Kind of like Rift had a million people register. Except it was ten million register.

 

well i dont of course know how much ppl in china spend on f2p mmorpgs, but that milion people actually paid for rift, unlike in case of f2p registrations

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10427

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

5/13/13 9:59:39 AM#214


Originally posted by Benedikt

Originally posted by lizardbones  

Originally posted by Loktofeit

Originally posted by SavageHorizon

Originally posted by Benedikt

Originally posted by bcbully 15 million playing Age of Wushu worldwide (more than WoW). 
proof of that statement?
Google it, it's not hard to find.
Well, I had trouble finding it, as the only Age of Wushu 15 million reference I could find was about some dude's rep. However, I did find this:   http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/20120606006747/en/Age-of-Wulin/martial-arts/beta which was rather impressive.
The Chinese version of the game had ten million people register. Kind of like Rift had a million people register. Except it was ten million register.  
well i dont of course know how much ppl in china spend on f2p mmorpgs, but that milion people actually paid for rift, unlike in case of f2p registrations



Trion announced the number of people who registered for their website, but they didn't announce their sales until later. We have no idea if the people who registered actually bought the game. They did sell a million+ copies of the game though. SWToR did the same thing, announced registrations, and then announced sales later. It's a PR thing that started with SWG.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  gimmesome

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 368

5/13/13 10:01:13 AM#215

@OP

Forums are a bad example of "proof" -

You want at least a good idea on the gaming climate, Go on steam and look at the most popular downloads.

 

Amongst the newest, shiniest releases, you'll usually if not always see the sandboxy titles in that list, such as Minecraft, Kerbal Space Program, Train Sims, Truck sims, Prison Architect, Terraria, etc...   Some of these games aren't even finished being developed and people are paying the developers to 1) play them and 2) show their support with their wallets.      

(I think) Regardless of whether "people" like sandboxes or themeparks, they want an engaging game that will be more gratifying and worth their time in the long run, more so than what the current crop of AAA titles are offering.    Fun is fun, but after a while, especially after years of WoW burnout,  it must get old to play some other gear treadmill game that is designed around 'endgame' only to find that you can get there and use up all the content in a month, then move on to the next themepark, and the next and so on.  Sooner or later, even the most devout themepark fan will yearn for a game that will last longer than what they've been playing.   

There in lies what I consider the heart of sandbox style play, or better, classic-MMORPG.    Longevity.  

That longevity was achieved by the games being designed and utilized so that the players could build.  Build content, build story, build community, build legends.    Recently this genre's AAA releases have all but stripped that out of the games and replaced it with more and more combat.    

But the yearning is still there, and I still think there is proof of that, even if you disagree as to what I would consider proof in the matter.

 

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19248

5/13/13 10:26:14 AM#216
Originally posted by gimmesome  

(I think) Regardless of whether "people" like sandboxes or themeparks, they want an engaging game that will be more gratifying and worth their time in the long run, more so than what the current crop of AAA titles are offering.    Fun is fun, but after a while, especially after years of WoW burnout,  it must get old to play some other gear treadmill game that is designed around 'endgame' only to find that you can get there and use up all the content in a month, then move on to the next themepark, and the next and so on.  Sooner or later, even the most devout themepark fan will yearn for a game that will last longer than what they've been playing.   


 

Nah .. short games are fine. You can move-on and have new experiences faster.

  gimmesome

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 368

5/13/13 11:20:06 AM#217
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by gimmesome  

(I think) Regardless of whether "people" like sandboxes or themeparks, they want an engaging game that will be more gratifying and worth their time in the long run, more so than what the current crop of AAA titles are offering.    Fun is fun, but after a while, especially after years of WoW burnout,  it must get old to play some other gear treadmill game that is designed around 'endgame' only to find that you can get there and use up all the content in a month, then move on to the next themepark, and the next and so on.  Sooner or later, even the most devout themepark fan will yearn for a game that will last longer than what they've been playing.   


 

Nah .. short games are fine. You can move-on and have new experiences faster.

What's to stop you from leaving a game with longevity, if you're in need of a new experience?  Leaving behind a game for the others to still enjoy in the long term while you find another title to play, perhaps a shorter, faster paced title?  

I don't disagree with you.  Some people want this and some people want that.  I don't see that as a reason to completely stop designing either one, though.  

 

 

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19248

5/13/13 11:22:00 AM#218
Originally posted by gimmesome
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by gimmesome  

(I think) Regardless of whether "people" like sandboxes or themeparks, they want an engaging game that will be more gratifying and worth their time in the long run, more so than what the current crop of AAA titles are offering.    Fun is fun, but after a while, especially after years of WoW burnout,  it must get old to play some other gear treadmill game that is designed around 'endgame' only to find that you can get there and use up all the content in a month, then move on to the next themepark, and the next and so on.  Sooner or later, even the most devout themepark fan will yearn for a game that will last longer than what they've been playing.   


 

Nah .. short games are fine. You can move-on and have new experiences faster.

What's to stop you from leaving a game with longevity, if you're in need of a new experience?  Leaving behind a game for the others to still enjoy in the long term while you find another title to play, perhaps a shorter, faster paced title?  

I don't disagree with you.  Some people want this and some people want that.  I don't see that as a reason to completely stop designing either one, though.  

 

 


Nothing. I am not arguing i cannot quit. I am arguing that the statement "Sooner or later, even the most devout themepark fan will yearn for a game that will last longer than what they've been playing." is not true.

 

  thinktank001

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/13/08
Posts: 1796

5/13/13 12:32:19 PM#219
Originally posted by Loktofeit

"don't even start"

Yay, shout down anything that contradicts your beliefs. However, to address your claim that no one has ever referred to the game as a sandbox, here are a few links:

 

 

I wouldn't consider a review article as a credible source, unless it was a direct quote from the developer.   Anyone could do a review and call it a themepark.   

  VengeSunsoar

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/10/04
Posts: 4717

Be Brief, Be Bright... Be Gone.

5/13/13 12:33:48 PM#220
Is a developer the only one that is qualified to determine if a game is a sandbox?

Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

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