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Neverwinter

Neverwinter 

General Discussion  » Really Enjoyng the Game but the Cash Shop is soooooo Expensive!!

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59 posts found
  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 4837

4/29/13 7:23:06 AM#21
Originally posted by ZedTheRock
Originally posted by JeroKane

Wow nice repsonses in here! I guess this is the level of people who play these kind of games?

I guess just one more reason to quit this game and avoid it at all costs.

At the OP. I agree! I made a topic yesterday about the EXACT same thing!

Just be prepared to get flamed to death.

I paid 56 euros for the Guardian pack and spend some money on keys.

But lo and behold.... I am flamed for bieng a freeloader complaining about cash shop prices and how ingame stuff practically forces you into the Cash Shop. lol.

I play for example Guardian and the T3 companion to go for is the T3 healer companion, which was to be my primary goal to get, as it would complement my character best.

Now here comes the kicker. This T3 companion costs ingame at the vendor 360 Ardent Coins. It's the only one available and the only way to get it.

For people's information. You can get 1 single Ardent Coin a day, by using Invoke prayer at a rest spot.

So you will have to login for a total of 360 days to collect 360 Ardent Coins to be able to buy this T3 healer companion.

But no worries... I am sure Cryptic will put this companion (or a comparable one) in the Zen store soon for a nice PREMIUM price of 40 bucks PER character!

It's stuff like this, which seems to be the typical F2P tactics that really turn me off from these games.

Or you know could wait for the Companion Training Manuals get implemented.  If you bothered to check the COmpanion store you would see they are coming soon.

 

DOn't bitch about it, especially on a generic gameing site like this.  Post o nthe forums that you want to see them, or bump 1 of the many posts asking for the other companions to get fixed/buffed.  Cryptic did say they will listen to all feedback and enough of us ask for soemthing then it might happen.

 

Posting here and complaining shows a lack of maturity and only resorts to flaming.

 How is this complaining?

Right now tank classes are getting the shaft, compared to other classes who benefit from DPS, Tank or Buff companions, from which T3 ones are much easier obtainable.

This T3 healer companion, the only one, is hardlocked for 360 days!

And training manuals labeled as SoonTM isn't gonna help anyone now.

And when they finally get implemented, what will be the cost? If the Mount upgrade manuals are any indication... then you are looking at at least 3,5 to 4 million Astral Diamonds total to upgrade a T1 companion to T3!

Good luck in acquiring that amount of AD within a reasonable time. Unless you want to convert it. Which is not available yet, as no one is interested in selling AD for Zen yet. You will still be looking at considerable money or insane amount of time investment to get it.  So in the end it ends up being cheaper and less of a headache to just buy it outright in the Zen Store for 40 bucks!

And that is exactly what the OP, me and others are trying to say.

I don't mind having to invest time in a game to acquire stuff. As long as it's reasonable and doesn't turn into an endless mindless grind.

I don't mind Cryptic needing to make money, as they need to to survive. As long as prices are reasonable and the gameplay not gonna suffer from it.

There is a fine balance into everything. And right now the balance on sertain things is WAY OFF and seriously off-putting ! /shrug

  ZedTheRock

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/15/13
Posts: 175

4/29/13 7:35:34 AM#22
Originally posted by JeroKane
Originally posted by ZedTheRock
Originally posted by JeroKane

Wow nice repsonses in here! I guess this is the level of people who play these kind of games?

I guess just one more reason to quit this game and avoid it at all costs.

At the OP. I agree! I made a topic yesterday about the EXACT same thing!

Just be prepared to get flamed to death.

I paid 56 euros for the Guardian pack and spend some money on keys.

But lo and behold.... I am flamed for bieng a freeloader complaining about cash shop prices and how ingame stuff practically forces you into the Cash Shop. lol.

I play for example Guardian and the T3 companion to go for is the T3 healer companion, which was to be my primary goal to get, as it would complement my character best.

Now here comes the kicker. This T3 companion costs ingame at the vendor 360 Ardent Coins. It's the only one available and the only way to get it.

For people's information. You can get 1 single Ardent Coin a day, by using Invoke prayer at a rest spot.

So you will have to login for a total of 360 days to collect 360 Ardent Coins to be able to buy this T3 healer companion.

But no worries... I am sure Cryptic will put this companion (or a comparable one) in the Zen store soon for a nice PREMIUM price of 40 bucks PER character!

It's stuff like this, which seems to be the typical F2P tactics that really turn me off from these games.

Or you know could wait for the Companion Training Manuals get implemented.  If you bothered to check the COmpanion store you would see they are coming soon.

 

DOn't bitch about it, especially on a generic gameing site like this.  Post o nthe forums that you want to see them, or bump 1 of the many posts asking for the other companions to get fixed/buffed.  Cryptic did say they will listen to all feedback and enough of us ask for soemthing then it might happen.

 

Posting here and complaining shows a lack of maturity and only resorts to flaming.

 How is this complaining?

Right now tank classes are getting the shaft, compared to other classes who benefit from DPS, Tank or Buff companions, from which T3 ones are much easier obtainable.

This T3 healer companion, the only one, is hardlocked for 360 days!

And training manuals labeled as SoonTM isn't gonna help anyone now.

And when they finally get implemented, what will be the cost? If the Mount upgrade manuals are any indication... then you are looking at at least 3,5 to 4 million Astral Diamonds total to upgrade a T1 companion to T3!

Good luck in acquiring that amount of AD within a reasonable time. Unless you want to convert it. Which is not available yet, as no one is interested in selling AD for Zen yet. You will still be looking at considerable money or insane amount of time investment to get it.  So in the end it ends up being cheaper and less of a headache to just buy it outright in the Zen Store for 40 bucks!

And that is exactly what the OP, me and others are trying to say.

I don't mind having to invest time in a game to acquire stuff. As long as it's reasonable and doesn't turn into an endless mindless grind.

I don't mind Cryptic needing to make money, as they need to to survive. As long as prices are reasonable and the gameplay not gonna suffer from it.

There is a fine balance into everything. And right now the balance on sertain things is WAY OFF and seriously off-putting ! /shrug

As I said, shortly the companion shop will have access to Companion Training Manuals to raise them from White to Green to Blue to Purple.

 

I agree with the premise of your argument but this isn't the place, I even started a thread over o nthe official forums to get those in game as quick as possible.  Do it there (where the Devs will read it) is all I am asking, here is pointless and reeks of complaining, especially considering the team over at NWO said they will listen to all feedback.  Wasted energy doing here friend.

SUP

  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 2748

4/29/13 7:37:11 AM#23
Originally posted by ZedTheRock
Originally posted by lickm3

 


Originally posted by JeroKane

 


So you will have to login for a total of 360 days to collect 360 Ardent Coins to be able to buy this T3 healer companion.

But no worries... I am sure Cryptic will put this companion (or a comparable one) in the Zen store soon for a nice PREMIUM price of 40 bucks PER character!

It's stuff like this, which seems to be the typical F2P tactics that really turn me off from these games.

 


 

Oh wait wait ... Thats something NEW !! Someone who made f2p game want you to spend money on a pet ? http://us.blizzard.com/store/browse.xml?f=c:5,c:33 yey, when p2p company does it with their game box prices,expansions,subscriptions then it is everything fine, right ? Simple rule - If you want to have something special then PAY for IT you are not forced to have it.

Plus it gives us a long term goal to work for.  Oh hthe horror of not being able to aquire soemthing within the first week of release.

Yup, 360 days is certainly a "Long-term Goal". Any longer-term than that, and it would probably be in the realm of "Irrelevant Goal" 

 

If doing 360 dailies is REALLY the only way of getting that companion, then I have to salute PW/Cryptic. That would mean they've decided to completely ignore current MMO trends and "accepted practice" by going back to the early EQ-style of truly long-term goals. That would take some ballz.

But sadly, it probably just means they will release it via the Cash Shop as part of the "player convenience" offerings.

 

No, it's not P2W. You can absolutely and legitimately earn it through gameplay, no if's or but's or maybe's. Just login every day (for a year), and pray at the shrine. What could be easier ?

  Shaigh

Elite Member

Joined: 3/07/13
Posts: 222

4/29/13 7:48:26 AM#24

There's no such thing as a free lunch

  Undeadly

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/03/08
Posts: 50

4/29/13 7:54:33 AM#25
Originally posted by SpottyGekko

I'll be playing the game as soon as they let the rabble in. And I'll be playing as a complete freeloader with no pre-order "founder's pack" or any other advantage.

It will be interesting to see just how long I can last before I have to make the decision: "Pay or Quit"

Same here. :D

  MadDemon64

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1067

Why is it that fantasy trolls are vulnerable to fire, but internet trolls thrive on flame wars?

4/29/13 8:01:16 AM#26

I was originally going to buy only the Dragonborn race when it is released in the cash shop (assuming that it is a cash shop race and not available to all for free), but it sounds like I will be needing to spend my money on bags.

Ah well, nothing a few surveys and videos can't fix.

Since when is Tuesday a direction?

  hfztt

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/31/05
Posts: 596

4/29/13 8:01:54 AM#27
Originally posted by Shaigh

There's no such thing as a free lunch

There is. There totally is.

But you have to consider WHY it is free...

  Omnifish

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/16/11
Posts: 608

I'll kick your a**e so hard, you could build a swimming pool in the footprint!

4/29/13 8:16:33 AM#28
Originally posted by ShakyMo
A good f2p setup should have a sub option that works out cheaper if you play a lot.

 

That's not really the setup there going for here, although I agree with that option.

Most games that do that are failed subscription games. Their f2p options is bascially a, 'free 2 try', method that makes it a better deal to subscribe if you want better access to the game.

NW is setup to maximise a heavy investment from a smaller playerbase, much like every other PW game. I guess they figure it's more profitable to have 2,000 people spending 40-60bucks a month then say 20,000 maybe only subbing.

PW have been very successful with this business model. Personally I think it's a shitty burden on the dedicated few who play substandard- turned- around- in- two years- products, were most of the dev time is taken up creating new cash shop barriers,but that's not really news is it?

This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!

  Reklaw

Elite Member

Joined: 1/07/06
Posts: 6085

The adult I am takes care of most things real life. However my inner-child is a GAMER!!

4/29/13 8:22:25 AM#29
Originally posted by plescure

and i know what ppls first comeback will be "so dont use it then!"

 

the problem is the game is very clever in manipulating you to use it. with my founders pack i got a 200 stack of healthstones! brillaint. got me out of so many scrapes! go to buy more ....1.5k zen (about £11) Loads of lovely loot dropping all the time, the 2 bags i get with the game are constantly full in no time so i either got to the vendor every 20 mins or go buy a new bag....... 1k zen!! thats like £7.50 in RL money! for a bag!

 

i know you can sell astral diamonds for zen but at the current exchange rate, if i sold all of my diamonds i got with my founder pack (600k) i would get about 1200 zen. its not much!

 

The game is really good. thouroughly enjoying it. Its just a shame my sphincter hurts so much from the constant shafting that Cryptic are giving me!

 A few questions if I may ask?

Healthstones: Only available in the cashshop or founderpack? Or can they be aquired by playing? as loot? craft? buy them ingame from NPC's with ingame money/credits?

Bags: Are there only bags to store items in?, no banks or vaults?

Do you really need all that loot and other things?

I often find myself with very limited bag/inventory space at the beginning of almost all MMORPG or RPG's, mainly because in the beginning I still need to find out the difference between what I really need at that moment or safe up for later. And often end up not needing half of all things I have collected later in the game.

 I do wonder does the game infact force you to acces their cashshop or is the player him or her self forcing the cashshop upon themself due to being somewhat impatient?

  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 2748

4/29/13 8:43:49 AM#30
Originally posted by Reklaw
Originally posted by plescure

<snip>

The game is really good. thouroughly enjoying it. Its just a shame my sphincter hurts so much from the constant shafting that Cryptic are giving me!

<snip>

 I do wonder does the game infact force you to acces their cashshop or is the player him or her self forcing the cashshop upon themself due to being somewhat impatient?

Of course it is the player that convinces themselves they "have to" buy things from the shop. Unless thise things can only be bought in the shop, that is.

 

But developers like PW have had plenty of experience with Cash Shop incentivizing by now. Game metrics are analysed intensively and datamined to determine the optimal tolerances and average player actions.

 

So if 50% of players buy item X at price Y rather than grind 3 weeks for it, you have a clear price point. Now you can raise the grind time (and the cash price), but then you may sell fewer items. Or you can extend the grind and LOWER the price slightly after the first month of gameplay. Suddenly the item looks like a total bargain !

 

In many of these F2P games, I'm convinced the developers have far more fun adjusting and fine-tuning the Cash Shop monetization than they do actually developing the game.

  User Deleted
4/29/13 9:04:41 AM#31

Learn to embrace the idea that good things come to those that wait... I know the microwave was a godsend, but in reality, you get the same food out of an oven, it only takes longer to prepare/cook.

 

Practice a little discipline... try to play the game without using the cash shops... I know it's a real challenge to have to vendor items every so often, but it's a tried and true method.  All it costs is time.  And just what are you after here?  A way to pass the time away.  If you wanted to do something productive, you'd wash the car, do the laundry, paint the house, or earn an extra degree.  Games are time wasters... buying things in cash shops saves time but it is in direct opposition to what you are trying to do in game, which is to pass time away.

 

All I hear is someone trying to get there fast... the "there" isn't going anywhere, are you?

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5575

4/29/13 10:28:34 AM#32

Originally posted by Omnifish

Originally posted by ShakyMo
A good f2p setup should have a sub option that works out cheaper if you play a lot.

That's not really the setup there going for here, although I agree with that option.

Most games that do that are failed subscription games. Their f2p options is bascially a, 'free 2 try', method that makes it a better deal to subscribe if you want better access to the game.

NW is setup to maximise a heavy investment from a smaller playerbase, much like every other PW game. I guess they figure it's more profitable to have 2,000 people spending 40-60bucks a month then say 20,000 maybe only subbing.

PW have been very successful with this business model. Personally I think it's a shitty burden on the dedicated few who play substandard- turned- around- in- two years- products, were most of the dev time is taken up creating new cash shop barriers,but that's not really news is it?

Cryptic/PW have STO setup this way as well.  Some things are fairly cheap though, like character slots and the occassional inventory slot/bag.

I've yet to see a sub game, or a sub-option in a sub-free game, come out cheaper than not doing a subscription.  Basically that just sets the floor on what you're spending.  In some games it unlocks some features, but after that it's not usually cheaper to maintain that subscription.  I pay $15/mo in Tera at the moment because the sub gives me buffs for leveling.  It would just be cheaper if I took the slow route and didn't sub.  I subscribe for the benefits and because I like to support the games I'm playing.

Originally posted by SpottyGekko

I'll be playing the game as soon as they let the rabble in. And I'll be playing as a complete freeloader with no pre-order "founder's pack" or any other advantage.

It will be interesting to see just how long I can last before I have to make the decision: "Pay or Quit"

Some stuff in the cash shop isn't too expensive - character slots are around $6 for 2.  A 24 slot bag is around $10.  The expensive stuff like the best mounts and companions can wait as I feel they're outlandishly priced.  Still you can play for fairly cheap if you take the slower road.

I don't mind if some things are expensive, but it means I'll buy things less often, not spend more.  I spend about $40 - $80 every 6 months on a game I'm playing.  If items are priced around that then I buy less or don't buy at all.

I do feel obligated to support games I play, but I don't feel obligated to throw my money at them.

 

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5073

4/29/13 10:46:39 AM#33
Originally posted by pmiles

Learn to embrace the idea that good things come to those that wait... I know the microwave was a godsend, but in reality, you get the same food out of an oven, it only takes longer to prepare/cook.

 

Practice a little discipline... try to play the game without using the cash shops... I know it's a real challenge to have to vendor items every so often, but it's a tried and true method.  All it costs is time.  And just what are you after here?  A way to pass the time away.  If you wanted to do something productive, you'd wash the car, do the laundry, paint the house, or earn an extra degree.  Games are time wasters... buying things in cash shops saves time but it is in direct opposition to what you are trying to do in game, which is to pass time away.

 

All I hear is someone trying to get there fast... the "there" isn't going anywhere, are you?

food cooked in  a microwave is generally inferior to oven cooked food.. in both taste, and appearance.

  SpottyGekko

Elite Member

Joined: 9/26/04
Posts: 2748

4/29/13 10:55:51 AM#34
Originally posted by Torvaldr

.....

Originally posted by SpottyGekko

I'll be playing the game as soon as they let the rabble in. And I'll be playing as a complete freeloader with no pre-order "founder's pack" or any other advantage.

It will be interesting to see just how long I can last before I have to make the decision: "Pay or Quit"

Some stuff in the cash shop isn't too expensive - character slots are around $6 for 2.  A 24 slot bag is around $10.  The expensive stuff like the best mounts and companions can wait as I feel they're outlandishly priced.  Still you can play for fairly cheap if you take the slower road.

I don't mind if some things are expensive, but it means I'll buy things less often, not spend more.  I spend about $40 - $80 every 6 months on a game I'm playing.  If items are priced around that then I buy less or don't buy at all.

I do feel obligated to support games I play, but I don't feel obligated to throw my money at them.

 

I'm usually quite free-spending if I'm playing a game that I enjoy. The only reason why I'm being tightfisted with Neverwinter is because I'm not at all sure if I'll actually enjoy it. If it had been B2P or P2P without a trial, I'd not even be posting in these forums.

  Grailer

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/13/06
Posts: 819

4/30/13 2:15:47 AM#35
Originally posted by Wizardry
Originally posted by lickm3

If you have played any p2p game like WoW don't you have to pay each month 15bucks for it ? So there you spend let's say 45bucks and you can play the rest of your life for free. Also you don't need to pay any stupid game box / expassion. Those threads are pathetic.

edit: remember, no one works for free and I bet that you too. When some devs put their time into it they want be paye'd. You can do only two things - If you don't like the cash shop, stop playing it. Or play it as a complety free user without spending any money into it. It would be still a good game.

Well you are 100% correct,it is stil lVERY misleading to use the F2p title or give players the assumptio nthey ar not paying as much or maybe more.

Yes of couirse they are to be paid,but you know what,many of us prefer the straight up front cost,no hidden BS.

Think of it like buying  a car.We all know they are not giving cars away for free but imagine they pretend to dell you one for 5k,you go grab a car,then they want 20k insurance waiver to take it off the lot.Another 10 k for the actual key ,ignition has a security code,need another 10k for that .Oh you want the air conditioning and windows to work,another 10k.Oh btw the steeering wheel is locked another 10k.Wipers won't work another 10k.Oh ya transmission is locked ,another 10k.oh you wanted a motor ..lol another 50k.

I think we would rahter just have the car work as intended when we buy it,no hidden costs,any other pay plan is very misleading.

 

 

What if the car is ok but only worth say 5k , however if they let you drive the car for free for a while you find that it is annoying having no wipers espeically when its raining , so you pay 2k for some wipers .  Then after a while you find that the trunk is just not big enough to store things so you buy a trailer for the car which costs another 5k . 

Time passes and you see your friends riding around in red sports cars ,  it just so happens there is a spoiler kit for the car you have for a mere 5k and also a pair job is only 2k .   

Guess what you just spent 14k on a car you wouldve only paid 5k for . Damn

 

  kamiyadori

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/13
Posts: 16

4/30/13 2:25:11 AM#36

Forgot Quote ~~

  kamiyadori

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/13
Posts: 16

4/30/13 2:26:48 AM#37
Originally posted by JeroKane

Wow nice repsonses in here! I guess this is the level of people who play these kind of games?

I guess just one more reason to quit this game and avoid it at all costs.

At the OP. I agree! I made a topic yesterday about the EXACT same thing!

Just be prepared to get flamed to death.

I paid 56 euros for the Guardian pack and spend some money on keys.

But lo and behold.... I am flamed for bieng a freeloader complaining about cash shop prices and how ingame stuff practically forces you into the Cash Shop. lol.

I play for example Guardian and the T3 companion to go for is the T3 healer companion, which was to be my primary goal to get, as it would complement my character best.

Now here comes the kicker. This T3 companion costs ingame at the vendor 360 Ardent Coins. It's the only one available and the only way to get it.

For people's information. You can get 1 single Ardent Coin a day, by using Invoke prayer at a rest spot.

So you will have to login for a total of 360 days to collect 360 Ardent Coins to be able to buy this T3 healer companion.

But no worries... I am sure Cryptic will put this companion (or a comparable one) in the Zen store soon for a nice PREMIUM price of 40 bucks PER character!

It's stuff like this, which seems to be the typical F2P tactics that really turn me off from these games.

 

Can you not just rnjoy the game without worrying about the shop? I am doing it and no worries yet. Everything Can be earned in the game that can be bough on the shop. Yes it wil take more time but so what? You wants to fast track everything. I play games to pass time, the longer they take me the better. 

And I highly doubt they are going to put the  RAREST companion on the ZEN market. Hell, Did you know if you miss 7 days without invocation you loose all your Ardent coins. The Companion is an incentive to keep playing the game, they are not going to sell it for cash. 

  kriminal66

Novice Member

Joined: 3/15/12
Posts: 76

4/30/13 2:31:15 AM#38
Originally posted by Grailer
Originally posted by Wizardry
Originally posted by lickm3

If you have played any p2p game like WoW don't you have to pay each month 15bucks for it ? So there you spend let's say 45bucks and you can play the rest of your life for free. Also you don't need to pay any stupid game box / expassion. Those threads are pathetic.

edit: remember, no one works for free and I bet that you too. When some devs put their time into it they want be paye'd. You can do only two things - If you don't like the cash shop, stop playing it. Or play it as a complety free user without spending any money into it. It would be still a good game.

Well you are 100% correct,it is stil lVERY misleading to use the F2p title or give players the assumptio nthey ar not paying as much or maybe more.

Yes of couirse they are to be paid,but you know what,many of us prefer the straight up front cost,no hidden BS.

Think of it like buying  a car.We all know they are not giving cars away for free but imagine they pretend to dell you one for 5k,you go grab a car,then they want 20k insurance waiver to take it off the lot.Another 10 k for the actual key ,ignition has a security code,need another 10k for that .Oh you want the air conditioning and windows to work,another 10k.Oh btw the steeering wheel is locked another 10k.Wipers won't work another 10k.Oh ya transmission is locked ,another 10k.oh you wanted a motor ..lol another 50k.

I think we would rahter just have the car work as intended when we buy it,no hidden costs,any other pay plan is very misleading.

 

 

What if the car is ok but only worth say 5k , however if they let you drive the car for free for a while you find that it is annoying having no wipers espeically when its raining , so you pay 2k for some wipers .  Then after a while you find that the trunk is just not big enough to store things so you buy a trailer for the car which costs another 5k . 

Time passes and you see your friends riding around in red sports cars ,  it just so happens there is a spoiler kit for the car you have for a mere 5k and also a pair job is only 2k .   

Guess what you just spent 14k on a car you wouldve only paid 5k for . Damn

 

actually wouldnt the car be 19k   5k for car 14k for parts and trailor

  Purutzil

Elite Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2821

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

4/30/13 2:32:38 AM#39

My advice: Play the game and do NOT buy from the cash shop. If people are vocal and they aren't getting many purchases, hopefully it will wise them up that the cash shop is far to unreasonable. I'm assuming they are mostly trying to cash in on early excitement in order to rake in cash before probably trying to 'sell' by using sales or other things to draw attention to purchase goods. 

 

They NEED to lower the prices for sure if they hope to garnish customers. They have a good game, they just unfortunately don't seem to realize that if you overcharge for stuff, your going to make far less since less people will bother to pay.

  Sulaa

Novice Member

Joined: 7/13/11
Posts: 830

4/30/13 2:41:56 AM#40
Originally posted by plescure

and i know what ppls first comeback will be "so dont use it then!"

 

the problem is the game is very clever in manipulating you to use it. with my founders pack i got a 200 stack of healthstones! brillaint. got me out of so many scrapes! go to buy more ....1.5k zen (about £11) Loads of lovely loot dropping all the time, the 2 bags i get with the game are constantly full in no time so i either got to the vendor every 20 mins or go buy a new bag....... 1k zen!! thats like £7.50 in RL money! for a bag!

 

i know you can sell astral diamonds for zen but at the current exchange rate, if i sold all of my diamonds i got with my founder pack (600k) i would get about 1200 zen. its not much!

 

The game is really good. thouroughly enjoying it. Its just a shame my sphincter hurts so much from the constant shafting that Cryptic are giving me!

First of all don't pre-purcharse virtual items in games!  I would advise to generally stop pre-ordering & pre-purcharsing anything. 

Secondly.   There is nothing for free.   Either game companies will try to charge you with fixed amount of money - like game purcharse in 'single player' games,  fixed amount of susbciption same for everyone - in pure p2p games or big amount of continous small purcharses in cash shop like Neverwitner do.   You have to decide what you like more.   Hoping that most game developers will offer very small and very cheap cash shops is naive.

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