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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » 10 people are kicking the guy, guess I should too

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430 posts found
  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:11:18 PM#1

What I have seen on this forum is far from constructive feedback. Its been on the level of hate that is down right sad. They have made a concession but to please the mob mentality of this forum it would be no small task. You can label it as giving just your opinion and that is what some do but there is a vast number of people here who attack anyone that has anything opsitive to say about the game thats not in line with the small mob thats grown here.

I hope the devs dont cave in at this point thinking this is the general status quo on ESO fans. Its mostly a MMOrpg.com theme thats is in almost every forum now. Hate is in, and we call it feedback. We hate before even get gameplay footage. We hate and tell devs how to make the game and whats wrong with it before we even play it. No wonder new games dont tell us they are even making a game till they are 3-4 years into development. 

We kick and bite at every design choice the devs make and as always, most people who like it dont post much past awesome I cant wait to play. So the devs mostly see the angery mob and start questioning if they should change their development path. Often games over the years has done just this and we gamers play a large part in why we are getting more and more crappy games. Developers no long just have fans, they have mobs that think they know better about game development then they and we create negitive feedback till they see it our way. Or else we will post something negitive in every thread and news outlet about the game. We drive away people thinking maybe our negitive thinking maybe true and often drive off new fans before any real reason is valid to do so. We dont have a product in had to be upset about.

Like all the flipping out about the DAoC PvP model. Its just 1 part of the game. The PvE thats been talked about is rich and full of life much like TES. Sure its done in a MMO way but thats what needs to be done as TES with group play a MMO does not make. You have open world dungeons 2 and 5 man. Instance dungeons as well. Solo caves and ruins to explore. Join the mage guild and get rewarded for exploring. There is open world quests and free roaming quests. You also have the new phased events for orgnized guilds and groups to take on and on top of that you get level 50 you get 2 whole maps as elder game to explore to your hearts content. What game has to much elder game? 

But thats not what we talk about. We pick and pick at one point and make a storm on why its so bad till its changed. Then we pick a different point and do the same thing till all thats left is a shell of a game that was its original design. It becomes so messed up that when its finaly released we all say... see this game does suck but we are in a large part to blame. I hope the ESO devs keep the corse and not even bother coming to look at what the so called fans have to say here. 

  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/20/13 1:29:21 PM#2
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

What I have seen on this forum is far from constructive feedback. Its been on the level of hate that is down right sad. They have made a concession but to please the mob mentality of this forum it would be no small task. You can label it as giving just your opinion and that is what some do but there is a vast number of people here who attack anyone that has anything opsitive to say about the game thats not in line with the small mob thats grown here.

I hope the devs dont cave in at this point thinking this is the general status quo on ESO fans. Its mostly a MMOrpg.com theme thats is in almost every forum now. Hate is in, and we call it feedback. We hate before even get gameplay footage. We hate and tell devs how to make the game and whats wrong with it before we even play it. No wonder new games dont tell us they are even making a game till they are 3-4 years into development. 

We kick and bite at every design choice the devs make and as always, most people who like it dont post much past awesome I cant wait to play. So the devs mostly see the angery mob and start questioning if they should change their development path. Often games over the years has done just this and we gamers play a large part in why we are getting more and more crappy games. Developers no long just have fans, they have mobs that think they know better about game development then they and we create negitive feedback till they see it our way. Or else we will post something negitive in every thread and news outlet about the game. We drive away people thinking maybe our negitive thinking maybe true and often drive off new fans before any real reason is valid to do so. We dont have a product in had to be upset about.

Like all the flipping out about the DAoC PvP model. Its just 1 part of the game. The PvE thats been talked about is rich and full of life much like TES. Sure its done in a MMO way but thats what needs to be done as TES with group play a MMO does not make. You have open world dungeons 2 and 5 min. Instance dungeons as well. Solo caves and ruins to explore. Join the mage guild and get rewarded for exploring. There is open world quests and free roaming quests. You also have the new phased events for orgnized guilds and groups to take on and on top of that you get level 50 you get 2 whole maps as elder game to explore to your hearts content. What game has to much elder game? 

But thats not what we talk about. We pick and pick at one point and make a storm on why its so bad till its changed. Then we pick a different point and do the same thing till all thats left is a shell of a game that was its original design. It becomes so messed up that when its finaly released we all say... see this game does suck but we are in a large part to blame. I hope the ESO devs keep the corse and not even bother coming to look at what the so called fans have to say here. 

When developers or publishers choose a target audience they have to appeal to that target audience or they will fail to achieve the level of success they both predict and have based spending on. 

Age of Conan, TERA, and SWTOR just to name a few picked an audience, failed to listen to and appeal to said audience and didn't meet their goals. This hurts both players and the developer. Players end up feeling ripped off because a game touted as a game made for them turned out not to be and yet another $60+ goes down the drain, it hurts developers because then they are scrambling to fix things when its already to late. Content has to be pounded out in a short amount of time, the business model needs to be reworked, mechanics and systems need to be changed and tweaked, then they have to deal with all of this and much more while being forced to lay off the bulk of their staff. 

TESO has chosen TES fans as their target audience and this was done so the moment they decided to go with the name and the lore. If they fail to appeal and listen to their target audience it will end up causing everyone a lot of headaches and dissapointment down the road which has been proven time and time again. Look at FFXIV and what it had to go through after failing to appeal to its target audience and listen to them. They ended up having to spend twice as much as planned to develop the game in the end and their earning potential has been severely reduced after the failed first launch. 

 

Though that isn't the point of your post. You wanted to say that even though it may seem like the majority doesn't agree with the direction they are taking TESO you want Zenimax to know that its just a vocal minority and that far more people like it and just don't post on this forum. The games I listed had people saying the same thing you are saying now about them, the silent majority never materialized though and the games struggled. Would you like me to post similar posts from the FFXIV forums saying pretty much the same thing about it that you are saying now?

 

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:32:49 PM#3
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
 

When developers or publishers choose a target audience they have to appeal to that target audience or they will fail to achieve the level of success they both predict and have based spending on. 

Age of Conan, TERA, and SWTOR just to name a few picked an audience, failed to listen to and appeal to said audience and didn't meet their goals. This hurts both players and the developer. Players end up feeling ripped off because a game touted as a game made for them turned out not to be and yet another $60+ goes down the drain, it hurts developers because then they are scrambling to fix things when its already to late. Content has to be pounded out in a short amount of time, the business model needs to be reworked, mechanics and systems need to be changed and tweaked, then they have to deal with all of this and much more while being forced to lay off the bulk of their staff. 

TESO has chosen TES fans as their target audience and this was done so the moment they decided to go with the name and the lore. If they fail to appeal and listen to their target audience it will end up causing everyone a lot of headaches and dissapointment down the road which has been proven time and time again. Look at FFXIV and what it had to go through after failing to appeal to its target audience and listen to them. They ended up having to spend twice as much as planned to develop the game in the end and their earning potential has been severely reduced after the failed first launch. 

 

Though that isn't the point of your post. You wanted to say that even though it may seem like the majority doesn't agree with the direction they are taking TESO you want Zenimax to know that its just a vocal minority and that far more people like it and just don't post on this forum. The games I listed had people saying the same thing you are saying now about them, the silent majority never materialized though and the games struggled. Would you like me to post similar posts from the FFXIV forums saying pretty much the same thing about it that you are saying now?

 

I am one of many fans of TES who is part of the target audience. Been playing TES games forever. I have played them to death. I am a HUGE TES fan. I will admit my fav PvP I have ever played was DAoC but this game has more then enough TES in it to make any fan happy if they would take time to look past the mob. 

  steuss

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/03/05
Posts: 129

4/20/13 1:34:07 PM#4

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

  Deadlobster

Novice Member

Joined: 12/18/06
Posts: 109

SWG Veteran (pre cu), GW I and II, AoC, WarOnline,Darkfall, Vanguard, SWTOR,WoW,Rift, FFTRR

4/20/13 1:35:28 PM#5
I think the first post mentioned the unreasonable hate that forums users seem to show. It's a game, a game trying to suit many peoples play styles. I'm not one for flaming, any negative comment I've left has been on games I've played and left and I generally say what I like/disliked. I've actually gone back to my first love SWG (emu). Nothing been as good since and I've played a fair bit.
  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/20/13 1:36:34 PM#6
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

What I have seen on this forum is far from constructive feedback. Its been on the level of hate that is down right sad. They have made a concession but to please the mob mentality of this forum it would be no small task. You can label it as giving just your opinion and that is what some do but there is a vast number of people here who attack anyone that has anything opsitive to say about the game thats not in line with the small mob thats grown here.

I hope the devs dont cave in at this point thinking this is the general status quo on ESO fans. Its mostly a MMOrpg.com theme thats is in almost every forum now. Hate is in, and we call it feedback. We hate before even get gameplay footage. We hate and tell devs how to make the game and whats wrong with it before we even play it. No wonder new games dont tell us they are even making a game till they are 3-4 years into development. 

We kick and bite at every design choice the devs make and as always, most people who like it dont post much past awesome I cant wait to play. So the devs mostly see the angery mob and start questioning if they should change their development path. Often games over the years has done just this and we gamers play a large part in why we are getting more and more crappy games. Developers no long just have fans, they have mobs that think they know better about game development then they and we create negitive feedback till they see it our way. Or else we will post something negitive in every thread and news outlet about the game. We drive away people thinking maybe our negitive thinking maybe true and often drive off new fans before any real reason is valid to do so. We dont have a product in had to be upset about.

Like all the flipping out about the DAoC PvP model. Its just 1 part of the game. The PvE thats been talked about is rich and full of life much like TES. Sure its done in a MMO way but thats what needs to be done as TES with group play a MMO does not make. You have open world dungeons 2 and 5 min. Instance dungeons as well. Solo caves and ruins to explore. Join the mage guild and get rewarded for exploring. There is open world quests and free roaming quests. You also have the new phased events for orgnized guilds and groups to take on and on top of that you get level 50 you get 2 whole maps as elder game to explore to your hearts content. What game has to much elder game? 

But thats not what we talk about. We pick and pick at one point and make a storm on why its so bad till its changed. Then we pick a different point and do the same thing till all thats left is a shell of a game that was its original design. It becomes so messed up that when its finaly released we all say... see this game does suck but we are in a large part to blame. I hope the ESO devs keep the corse and not even bother coming to look at what the so called fans have to say here. 

When developers or publishers choose a target audience they have to appeal to that target audience or they will fail to achieve the level of success they both predict and have based spending on. 

Age of Conan, TERA, and SWTOR just to name a few picked an audience, failed to listen to and appeal to said audience and didn't meet their goals. This hurts both players and the developer. Players end up feeling ripped off because a game touted as a game made for them turned out not to be and yet another $60+ goes down the drain, it hurts developers because then they are scrambling to fix things when its already to late. Content has to be pounded out in a short amount of time, the business model needs to be reworked, mechanics and systems need to be changed and tweaked, then they have to deal with all of this and much more while being forced to lay off the bulk of their staff. 

TESO has chosen TES fans as their target audience and this was done so the moment they decided to go with the name and the lore. If they fail to appeal and listen to their target audience it will end up causing everyone a lot of headaches and dissapointment down the road which has been proven time and time again. Look at FFXIV and what it had to go through after failing to appeal to its target audience and listen to them. They ended up having to spend twice as much as planned to develop the game in the end and their earning potential has been severely reduced after the failed first launch. 

 

Though that isn't the point of your post. You wanted to say that even though it may seem like the majority doesn't agree with the direction they are taking TESO you want Zenimax to know that its just a vocal minority and that far more people like it and just don't post on this forum. The games I listed had people saying the same thing you are saying now about them, the silent majority never materialized though and the games struggled. Would you like me to post similar posts from the FFXIV forums saying pretty much the same thing about it that you are saying now?

 

I am one of many fans of ESO is who the target audience. Been playing TES games forever. I have played them to death. I am a HUGE TES fan. I will admit my fav PvP I have ever played was DAoC but this game has more then enough TES in it to make any fan happy if they would take time to look past the mob. 

Obviously not, you are trying to say anyone that doesn't like the direction is simply following the hate mob. I however formed my opinion by watching the videos, reading the information, and getting some actual play time with the game. I've been a TES fan since daggerfall and no, TESO doesn't have enough TES in it to make me happy so your statement as much as you wish it were true is not. You will have to simply accept that. 

  Shaigh

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/07/13
Posts: 281

4/20/13 1:40:44 PM#7
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

Its not tab-target wow clone, you would know that if you weren't so quick to jump to conclusions.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:41:33 PM#8
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

IMO they are giving the best of both worlds. Open world PvP would step on the toes of the pure PvE fan thats at the core of most TES fans. Exploring being the hero and whats this... why am I being attacked by 3 players while I was trying to do a quest to save that town over there? The flag system many games uses is bad design as well as it so easy to force people becomes flagged when they dont want to. The DAoC model of 3 factions maps gives the PvEer their space to play and brings all PvPers to one map. That keeps the war in one place and because of this you have more large scale battles and thats alway fun. Once you hit 50, you can go anywhere and like I said above, you get 2 whole maps as elder game. Every game needs more elder game. Its far from a place of being rightly pissed.

  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15605

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

4/20/13 1:41:46 PM#9
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

You realize it's a soft target system that features hybrid action combat right? The combat is nothing like WOW. Besides I was under the impression actual "WOW clones" are games that focus on gear treadmills that gate content based on gear.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  stragen001

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/09/09
Posts: 1737

Mr Flibble is VERY cross

4/20/13 1:43:32 PM#10

The biggest problem is tab targetting. TESO games have always been first/third person action combat style (cant think of the right word here) and thats what everyone was excited to see in an MMO. Then they said "yeah, we're not doing that"

Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:43:49 PM#11
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
 

I am one of many fans of ESO is who the target audience. Been playing TES games forever. I have played them to death. I am a HUGE TES fan. I will admit my fav PvP I have ever played was DAoC but this game has more then enough TES in it to make any fan happy if they would take time to look past the mob. 

Obviously not, you are trying to say anyone that doesn't like the direction is simply following the hate mob. I however formed my opinion by watching the videos, reading the information, and getting some actual play time with the game. I've been a TES fan since daggerfall and no, TESO doesn't have enough TES in it to make me happy so your statement as much as you wish it were true is not. You will have to simply accept that. 

Oooo got to play for 20 min and you think you know the game? How cute. Guess most MMOs get to full swing by then who knew.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:45:03 PM#12
Originally posted by stragen001

The biggest problem is tab targetting. TESO games have always been first/third person action combat style (cant think of the right word here) and thats what everyone was excited to see in an MMO. Then they said "yeah, we're not doing that"

But they are.... guess thats one more person off this mob? No... oh ok. Keep kicking then!!! Soft targetting, you can also tab target if you wish. Healers dont even need to target a player to heal.

  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/20/13 1:45:30 PM#13
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

You realize it's a soft target system that features hybrid action combat right? The combat is nothing like WOW. Besides I was under the impression actual "WOW clones" are games that focus on gear treadmills that gate content based on gear.

Its an exaggeration of some elements that many dislike about TESO. The hotbar was like a kick in the gut for a lot of fans. Once NDA is lifted players will get to go into more details. While it isn't really a WoW clone, its a lot closer to WoW than a lot of TES fans wanted. 

  hammarus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/11/10
Posts: 180

4/20/13 1:46:02 PM#14
Perhaps we as a gaming culture have been burned so often that we are entitled to our hate.
  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/20/13 1:46:02 PM#15
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
 

I am one of many fans of ESO is who the target audience. Been playing TES games forever. I have played them to death. I am a HUGE TES fan. I will admit my fav PvP I have ever played was DAoC but this game has more then enough TES in it to make any fan happy if they would take time to look past the mob. 

Obviously not, you are trying to say anyone that doesn't like the direction is simply following the hate mob. I however formed my opinion by watching the videos, reading the information, and getting some actual play time with the game. I've been a TES fan since daggerfall and no, TESO doesn't have enough TES in it to make me happy so your statement as much as you wish it were true is not. You will have to simply accept that. 

Oooo got to play for 20 min and you think you know the game? How cute. Guess most MMOs get to full swing by then who knew.

Sorry lol... I've played more than you think :) 

  stragen001

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/09/09
Posts: 1737

Mr Flibble is VERY cross

4/20/13 1:46:06 PM#16
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by stragen001

The biggest problem is tab targetting. TESO games have always been first/third person action combat style (cant think of the right word here) and thats what everyone was excited to see in an MMO. Then they said "yeah, we're not doing that"

But they are.... guess thats one more person off this mob? No... oh ok. Keep kicking then!!!

Really? cos all the information I have seen says they are doing tab targetting/hotbar skills/etc. Do you have some other info you would like to share?

Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

4/20/13 1:47:23 PM#17

well the game has 2 daoc features

1 equality of pve/pvp and crafted gear - GOOD

2 some sort of 3 sided pvp at endgame, i have very serious doubts this will be anything like as good as DAOC

the game has a few TES features

the combat is TES like

they have books and lore in the world like tes.

 

then the game has these features

1 instancing all over the place

2 phased up the kazoo

3 you are the hero style personal story line with voice over and what have you

4 mega server thing

5 quests that lead you through the story, can't just wander off and find stuff to do.

 

so to me the game sounds more like a fantasy TSW than anything else.

 

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:48:08 PM#18
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

You realize it's a soft target system that features hybrid action combat right? The combat is nothing like WOW. Besides I was under the impression actual "WOW clones" are games that focus on gear treadmills that gate content based on gear.

Its an exaggeration of some elements that many dislike about TESO. The hotbar was like a kick in the gut for a lot of fans. Once NDA is lifted players will get to go into more details. While it isn't really a WoW clone, its a lot closer to WoW than a lot of TES fans wanted. 

Even if you are right... WoW was a EQ clone and every MMO after that did the same thing. The idea of a WoW clone has been washed to thin it has almost no meaning. ESO is not a gear threadmill game. It has DAoC RvR PvP. It has open world public quests and dungeons. It has so much thats not a copy of WoW I am not even sure how the label fits.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3466

 
OP  4/20/13 1:50:14 PM#19
Originally posted by ShakyMo

well the game has 2 daoc features

1 equality of pve/pvp and crafted gear - GOOD

2 some sort of 3 sided pvp at endgame, i have very serious doubts this will be anything like as good as DAOC

the game has a few TES features

the combat is TES like

they have books and lore in the world like tes.

 

then the game has these features

1 instancing all over the place

2 phased up the kazoo

3 you are the hero style personal story line with voice over and what have you

4 mega server thing

5 quests that lead you through the story, can't just wander off and find stuff to do.

 

so to me the game sounds more like a fantasy TSW than anything else.

 

And WoW was taken from a RTS and no one knew how good that game was going to be till they... wait for it... played it. 

  duggyfr3sh123

Novice Member

Joined: 4/19/13
Posts: 102

4/20/13 1:51:22 PM#20
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by steuss

People are rightly pissed because the TESO devs basically said, we're gonna make TES a MMO, and everyone was happy, but then people see the actual gameplay and think, "Wtf? this is tab, target, WoW clone bullshit, again. This is NOTHING like TES.

 

I'm pissed. Why aren't you? Are you happy with mediocrity and green text?

You realize it's a soft target system that features hybrid action combat right? The combat is nothing like WOW. Besides I was under the impression actual "WOW clones" are games that focus on gear treadmills that gate content based on gear.

lol. it's metroid prime's annhilitor beam lock on. not even aiming at all, the cursor auto targets after one second of hovering, you shot and run/jump/turn the projectile bobs weaves and homes in.

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