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The Repopulation

The Repopulation 

General Discussion  » Free to Play, why?

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150 posts found
  Akerbeltz

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/12/13
Posts: 151

 
OP  4/19/13 3:26:34 AM#1

Good day:

 

My idea of a filling and fun MMORPG is one that ideally provides with a virtual world with a high degree of freedom and interaction. In this sense, The Repopulation looks very interesting, and the more I read and see about its features and current status, the more convincing I find it.

Thing is the other day I almost fell of my chair when I found out in The Repop Website that the payment model was to be Free to Play based.

I think the ideal model for a substantial MMORPG is a subscription based one: it gives a sense of exclusivity to the gamer, very especially when a particular MMORPG looks oriented to a niche public that looks for a long-term gaming experience. In addition to this, I think the subscription model in certain way ensures customer’s tranquility with regards to maintenance, missions updates, dev run events and the so. No need to mention that, in my opinion, a subscription model discourages undesirable MMO fauna (trolls, kids, MMO tourists…).

For the reasons given above, I have the sensation that FTP might not be the best model for The Repop. Anyway, this could be a personal prejudice or perhaps there’s something I’m not getting.

What is your opinion about this?

Thanks in advance!
 

Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.

  User Deleted
4/19/13 3:34:13 AM#2

It's an indie game on a shoestring budget, and without any sort of marketing department.  There's a large amount of MMO fatigue as well, which means any game requiring a subscription had better damn well be a good one.  I don't mean Eve Online niche market good either.

The game was, unfortunately, destined to be a niche game at best.  Making it F2P is probably smart because it just doesn't have the mass appeal for most people to want ot plop down $60 and a sub fee for yet another MMO that probably won't pan out.

  GwapoJosh

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/10/12
Posts: 1009

4/19/13 3:36:04 AM#3
F2p is the only thing I hate about The Ropop..  It is a game that will need a great community and f2p brings so much trash.

"You are all going to poop yourselves." BillMurphy

  User Deleted
4/19/13 3:39:39 AM#4
Originally posted by Akerbeltz

Good day:

 

My idea of a filling and fun MMORPG is one that ideally provides with a virtual world with a high degree of freedom and interaction. In this sense, The Repopulation looks very interesting, and the more I read and see about its features and current status, the more convincing I find it.

Thing is the other day I almost fell of my chair when I found out in The Repop Website that the payment model was to be Free to Play based.

I think the ideal model for a substantial MMORPG is a subscription based one: it gives a sense of exclusivity to the gamer, very especially when a particular MMORPG looks oriented to a niche public that looks for a long-term gaming experience. In addition to this, I think the subscription model in certain way ensures customer’s tranquility with regards to maintenance, missions updates, dev run events and the so. No need to mention that, in my opinion, a subscription model discourages undesirable MMO fauna (trolls, kids, MMO tourists…).

For the reasons given above, I have the sensation that FTP might not be the best model for The Repop. Anyway, this could be a personal prejudice or perhaps there’s something I’m not getting.

What is your opinion about this?

Thanks in advance!
 

Two opinions: First that your opinion is about 8 or so years out of date when it comes to F2P and second trolls aren't discouraged by a sub model, kids either, they'll just be more vicious in a rules appropriate way respectively get mommy's credit card and tourists are always good for an MMO because some tourists decide they wanna stay :) happens both in MMOs and in real life, most won't stay but that small group that does will bring new faces, new strife, new friendships to the community which in a sandbox type game isn't nice, it's crucial.

  Anthur

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 621

4/19/13 3:43:24 AM#5

I agree that F2P is usually bad for community.

On the other hand I won't pay for a MMO anymore unless I get at least a free trial period, some open beta or it is even f2p. Sorry, so much trash MMOs get released. And the only way to find out if a MMO is worth my money is to play it myself.

  CyclopsSlayer

Novice Member

Joined: 1/31/04
Posts: 532

4/19/13 3:51:40 AM#6
F2P is the death of Community. Players seem to feel much more dedicated to a P2P world, when it comes to things like Guilds and group activities. In every F2P game I have played so far guilds and such groups seem to fail time and time again as people feel little need to log on and work together. RP seems to be in need of a strong group and coordinated activity, F@P does not support such.
  User Deleted
4/19/13 4:45:47 AM#7
Originally posted by CyclopsSlayer
F2P is the death of Community. Players seem to feel much more dedicated to a P2P world, when it comes to things like Guilds and group activities. In every F2P game I have played so far guilds and such groups seem to fail time and time again as people feel little need to log on and work together. RP seems to be in need of a strong group and coordinated activity, F@P does not support such.

Aside from EVE and WoW name two communities of P2P games which are dedicated to their game more than the best F2P communities, until such a time keep your opinions under the format of opinions not facts.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4138

4/19/13 5:01:04 AM#8

I agree free to play is the only bad thing about this game :(

Still its the only MORPG im really looknig forward to this year.

My 3D models
http://dragon3d.webs.com/

  JC-Smith

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/02/11
Posts: 321

4/19/13 6:23:09 AM#9

The three largest reasons:

  • For an indie title, getting people to try the game is half the battle. You don't have a large marketing budget. You spread through word of mouth. It's much easier to gain players in a free to play title because there is no barrier of entry. If someone tells their friend to try a game, it's easy for them to hop right in and play together.
  • It's tough for any game to maintain a healthy audience long-term as a subscription title with so many free options out there these days. The result is games generally sell well, then die off more quickly than they did in the days when there were few options and trying each had a price tag.
  • Players generally will cancel old subscriptions to try new ones, which takes players out of your world and worsens the experience for everyone else. Free to play titles allow players to play other games, but check in from time to time, which aids the community as a whole.
  • Many titles now ship with subscription to get their box sales and initial profit, and then switch to free to play later when it's clear that they are hemmoraghing players. The problem in that case is that the perception is then that they are doing poorly which hurts customer opinion. Server merges create a similar problem.
I'm not saying that the subscription model doesn't work. It definitely does. But there is also a reason the bulk of upcoming titles are going the free to play (or the box price and no subscription) route. It's simply a healthier model for most games.
 
I think a lot of players dislike F2P simply because of the implementations in certain games they have played previously. It is annoying to have paid a box price and subscription for a game, to see it later turn free to play and you notice that you would have spent so much more to unlock all the classes, races or content than if you had just paid the box price and subscription. To see that it's free to play but the only way to unlock everything is to still pay a subscription. Or to find that the only way to play competitively is to spend money.

Those are problems with the implementation though and not the model. Developers are still trying to find what they can and can't do, and some are still trying to nickel and dime players for as much as they can get. That's certainly not the approach being taken with Repop though. We value free players. And the membership options are similar to just a box price with no subscription (with the lower end ones being cheaper). Aside from some skill gain bonus potions (which give a much smaller bonus than in many of the other titles out there), there really won't be any performance gain from cash shop items. You'll be unlocking perks (more bank space, more inventory space, more mission slots, etc), purchasing cosmetic items (purely cosmetic/no stat differences), and the like.

The difference really just comes in how developers perceive free players. A common way early on of treating non-paying players was to make their lives difficult so that they either quit or paid. Some games still use that same approach. But the approach Repop (and numerous other free to play titles) is taking is that free players are valuable to the game. Sure you need paying customers to stay afloat. But when you create a game where only paying customers can play effectively,  you drive away free players. And that is a bad thing. Those players add to the community. Maybe one day they turn into a paying customer, maybe not. But maybe they introduce someone else to the game who does. Maybe they have or become friends with players who are and their being around makes the other players happy.

Noone enjoys an empty world. MMOs are about being social. We'd rather have 50,000 players with only 5,000 of them paying than we would to have 5,000 subscribers. And the reality is with free to play, if you build it they will come. Getting a large number of players to try your game isn't difficult with a free to play title. They have nothing to lose except for download time. Free to play gets them in the door, and then it's up to developers to create a product that will keep them there. That's all you can really ask for.

That's not to say free to play is a perfect model. It is more difficult to get rid of problem players without a barrier of entry. But noone likes to use months (or years) of work. The problem players in free to play titles are generally gold spammers and things of that nature. You can circumvent them with ignore commands, report and auto-detection methods. Overall you just have to weigh the bad with the good. And there are more positive things to be gained from free to play than a subscription model for this title.

http://www.therepopulation.com - Scfi Fi Sandbox.

  User Deleted
4/19/13 7:17:54 AM#10
Originally posted by JC-Smith

The three largest reasons:

  • For an indie title, getting people to try the game is half the battle. You don't have a large marketing budget. You spread through word of mouth. It's much easier to gain players in a free to play title because there is no barrier of entry. If someone tells their friend to try a game, it's easy for them to hop right in and play together.
  • It's tough for any game to maintain a healthy audience long-term as a subscription title with so many free options out there these days. The result is games generally sell well, then die off more quickly than they did in the days when there were few options and trying each had a price tag.
  • Players generally will cancel old subscriptions to try new ones, which takes players out of your world and worsens the experience for everyone else. Free to play titles allow players to play other games, but check in from time to time, which aids the community as a whole.
  • Many titles now ship with subscription to get their box sales and initial profit, and then switch to free to play later when it's clear that they are hemmoraghing players. The problem in that case is that the perception is then that they are doing poorly which hurts customer opinion. Server merges create a similar problem.
I'm not saying that the subscription model doesn't work. It definitely does. But there is also a reason the bulk of upcoming titles are going the free to play (or the box price and no subscription) route. It's simply a healthier model for most games.
 
I think a lot of players dislike F2P simply because of the implementations in certain games they have played previously. It is annoying to have paid a box price and subscription for a game, to see it later turn free to play and you notice that you would have spent so much more to unlock all the classes, races or content than if you had just paid the box price and subscription. To see that it's free to play but the only way to unlock everything is to still pay a subscription. Or to find that the only way to play competitively is to spend money.

Those are problems with the implementation though and not the model. Developers are still trying to find what they can and can't do, and some are still trying to nickel and dime players for as much as they can get. That's certainly not the approach being taken with Repop though. We value free players. And the membership options are similar to just a box price with no subscription (with the lower end ones being cheaper). Aside from some skill gain bonus potions (which give a much smaller bonus than in many of the other titles out there), there really won't be any performance gain from cash shop items. You'll be unlocking perks (more bank space, more inventory space, more mission slots, etc), purchasing cosmetic items (purely cosmetic/no stat differences), and the like.

The difference really just comes in how developers perceive free players. A common way early on of treating non-paying players was to make their lives difficult so that they either quit or paid. Some games still use that same approach. But the approach Repop (and numerous other free to play titles) is taking is that free players are valuable to the game. Sure you need paying customers to stay afloat. But when you create a game where only paying customers can play effectively,  you drive away free players. And that is a bad thing. Those players add to the community. Maybe one day they turn into a paying customer, maybe not. But maybe they introduce someone else to the game who does. Maybe they have or become friends with players who are and their being around makes the other players happy.

Noone enjoys an empty world. MMOs are about being social. We'd rather have 50,000 players with only 5,000 of them paying than we would to have 5,000 subscribers. And the reality is with free to play, if you build it they will come. Getting a large number of players to try your game isn't difficult with a free to play title. They have nothing to lose except for download time. Free to play gets them in the door, and then it's up to developers to create a product that will keep them there. That's all you can really ask for.

That's not to say free to play is a perfect model. It is more difficult to get rid of problem players without a barrier of entry. But noone likes to use months (or years) of work. The problem players in free to play titles are generally gold spammers and things of that nature. You can circumvent them with ignore commands, report and auto-detection methods. Overall you just have to weigh the bad with the good. And there are more positive things to be gained from free to play than a subscription model for this title.

Thank you for your concise and impartial response to the thread Mr Smith -suddenly feels the need to put on a leather coat and shades-.  I've already signed up  for alpha testing ^^ and I'll be there when the game launches either way, the crafting system sounds good and the ability to be a gunslinger samurai (by mixing and matching skills) in-game makes my little EVE-loving black heart grow in size.

 

(yes I am weird)

  CyclopsSlayer

Novice Member

Joined: 1/31/04
Posts: 532

4/19/13 8:43:27 AM#11

Vanguard:SoH - Even though it was on life support with no real dev tem for years, it had several vibrant guilds raiding and grouping. Went F2P and a few months later most all the big raiding guilds have packed up and moved on. The existng ones can't even reliably form 6 man groups. The F2P cash shop model eliminated the need for end game content as BIS gear now drops from L10 boxes you need to buy a key to open.

Lineage 2 - Went F2P about a year ago, now no one raids, no one seiges, no one PvP's, pure casual heaven. The guild there went from 20-50 online in any single night, to often <5 on in prime time. The Dragon raids that required 100+ people never seem to happen.

Aion - Alliances would form everytime a Fortress would go vulnerable, they regularly changed hands. Went F2P and it went from 2 fortress attack/defenses a night to 1 maybe 2 nights a week. Same number of people around, the Season boss would get mobbed, just no one cared to work to own a fortress any more.

EQ1, EQ2, DDO, went Freemium so are only technically F2P, you need to pay to get full content. Age of Wushu is looking to be the same. Allods is pure P2W.

Games that are designed F2P from scratch may fair better, as GW1/2. I cannot speak about SWTOR as I left long before F2P and refuse to look back.

  Giddian

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/03/06
Posts: 431

4/19/13 8:52:09 AM#12
Originally posted by GwapoJosh
F2p is the only thing I hate about The Ropop..  It is a game that will need a great community and f2p brings so much trash.

Having money to pay for a Sub does not mean they aren't trash.

On allot of the MMO's I play on are sub based and have an overabundance of trash.

 

I think this is a poor argument. 80%-90% of the FTP MMO's out their are Garbage. Not all of them. I think they should be judge on an individual Basis.

  Thorkune

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1820

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

4/19/13 9:00:02 AM#13
Originally posted by GwapoJosh
F2p is the only thing I hate about The Ropop..  It is a game that will need a great community and f2p brings so much trash.

I feel the complexity of the game will weed out the folks that normally bring the kiddie drama into F2P.

/2cents

  magichacker

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/05/08
Posts: 7

4/19/13 10:49:34 AM#14

Keep in mind that they do have Membership packages that sort of makes it Buy to Play for people looking to have cities, etc. so at least those people will have put something down.  I plan on the 2nd tier myself.

There are 3 membership levels available and the higher end memberships offer more slots. Additionally, Silver membership will offer access to be part of the City Council and be part of Nation Leadership, Gold Membership will open up being a City Mayor, and Platinum Membership will allow you to create a Nation.

 So at least those taking part in City leadership and nation leadership will be people who would make this game BtP over FtP.

 

 

  JC-Smith

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/02/11
Posts: 321

4/19/13 11:16:00 AM#15

[quote]Keep in mind that they do have Membership packages that sort of makes it Buy to Play for people looking to have cities, etc. so at least those people will have put something down. [/quote]

That's actually incorrect, though the wording used in the quote is definitely confusing. What the memberships are required for is creating a nation, having leadership of a nation transferred to you or being a part of a city's leadership (mayor or council). For creating nations the problem is the alliances and relations. We don't want every free to play player being able to create a nation as there would be a ton of nations with the minimum number of free players having to be tracked in the system. But without some type of a leadership transfer restriction they would be able to have a person with a membership create for them and transfer, so there had to be some type of a restriction there.

http://www.therepopulation.com - Scfi Fi Sandbox.

  Scottgun

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/05/07
Posts: 340

4/19/13 11:33:42 AM#16
Like others said, when you are not a big-production house, F2P is really your only option. They have to get investment capital, and those investors are looking for a quick return, and F2P is great at the quickie buck. The downside is that the market gets saturated with 6.023x1023 F2P games that are pure crap and basically a player has to wade trhough a river of crap and somehow find the one turd that isn't so bad.

How not to sell me on a game: "And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate [x game's] uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun."

  h0urg1ass

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/29/05
Posts: 300

4/19/13 11:45:45 AM#17

Free to Play instead of Free Trial.  Sigh.

Oh well.  Another game filed into the "could have been decent" bin.

Guess I won't be taking a break from EVE after all.

  magichacker

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/05/08
Posts: 7

4/19/13 12:23:43 PM#18
Originally posted by JC-Smith

[quote]Keep in mind that they do have Membership packages that sort of makes it Buy to Play for people looking to have cities, etc. so at least those people will have put something down. [/quote]

That's actually incorrect, though the wording used in the quote is definitely confusing. What the memberships are required for is creating a nation, having leadership of a nation transferred to you or being a part of a city's leadership (mayor or council). For creating nations the problem is the alliances and relations. We don't want every free to play player being able to create a nation as there would be a ton of nations with the minimum number of free players having to be tracked in the system. But without some type of a leadership transfer restriction they would be able to have a person with a membership create for them and transfer, so there had to be some type of a restriction there.

That is what I was meaning, people who create the city, etc.  I meant this also of course as a possitive as I love this aspect of the game.  I'm 190% a Repop fan and will be paying the $100.00 soon for the higher membership level and perks.  Wife and both sons will also be buying and playing this also.

We had 4 copies of SWG back in the day and was the only MMO we played together and all 4 members of the family agreed on was amazing and fun.  Soooo looking forward to this coming out.

Spread the word everyone about this amazing game and get everyone on board :-)

  wowclones

Novice Member

Joined: 6/15/12
Posts: 133

4/22/13 9:54:14 PM#19
Originally posted by Akerbeltz

Good day:

 

My idea of a filling and fun MMORPG is one that ideally provides with a virtual world with a high degree of freedom and interaction. In this sense, The Repopulation looks very interesting, and the more I read and see about its features and current status, the more convincing I find it.

Thing is the other day I almost fell of my chair when I found out in The Repop Website that the payment model was to be Free to Play based.

I think the ideal model for a substantial MMORPG is a subscription based one: it gives a sense of exclusivity to the gamer, very especially when a particular MMORPG looks oriented to a niche public that looks for a long-term gaming experience. In addition to this, I think the subscription model in certain way ensures customer’s tranquility with regards to maintenance, missions updates, dev run events and the so. No need to mention that, in my opinion, a subscription model discourages undesirable MMO fauna (trolls, kids, MMO tourists…).

For the reasons given above, I have the sensation that FTP might not be the best model for The Repop. Anyway, this could be a personal prejudice or perhaps there’s something I’m not getting.

What is your opinion about this?

Thanks in advance!
 

Tera is free, LOTRO is free, SWTOR is free, Vanguard is free,  AOC is free, Gw2 is free (with Repop you have to buy a one time sub to unlock), secret world is free (with Repop you have to buy a one time sub to unlock), Age of Wushu is free,  several other big titles coming this year are free as well.  Not sure why we are even asking why Repop is free.

  twhint

Novice Member

Joined: 4/23/05
Posts: 563

4/30/13 9:58:00 PM#20
Another thing to keep in mind is that the best equipment loot does not drop from monsters, bosses or otherwise.  They only drop recipe components which can then be crafted into the better loot.  This kind of eliminates the whole 'b2w' argument of selling items in the store. Only thing in the store will be cosmetic items and minor items that are convenience, such as xp boosts.
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