Trending Games | ArcheAge | Elder Scrolls Online | WildStar | EverQuest Next

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,794,611 Users Online:0
Games:723  Posts:6,194,991
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Puzzle Pirates Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

General Discussion

General Discussion 

The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Respawn Entertainment trademarks 'Titan'

2 Pages 1 2 » Search
22 posts found
  DeaconX

Novice Member

Joined: 2/08/05
Posts: 3072

Stand up for what you believe; Even if you stand alone.
-==X==-
SHH, my COMMON SENSE is tingling!

 
OP  4/16/13 8:14:03 AM#1

Not sure if it has ANYTHING at all to do Blizzards TITAN

 


Why do I write, create, fantasize, dream and daydream about other worlds? Because I hate what humanity does with this one.

BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/13 8:40:37 AM#2

Hmm... if Blizzard is smart, they're calling it "Titan" right now as a code name for this very reason... preventing people from grabbing trademarks, web URLs and all that in attempts to make a quick buck selling those resources to Blizzard. I'd be willing to bet there's a secret name not "leaked" to the public that will be the actual name, and when they're ready they'll start grabbing those resources which will clue the public in to the actual name.  "Hey, Blizzard just trademarked "Time Orcs'! " 

 

Just a guess.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  ichihaifu

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/23/10
Posts: 253

4/16/13 8:45:54 AM#3

Titan is obviously a codename for a project. Every other company does that when they speak of work in progress to the public unless they have all fronts covered for cases like this.

This is someones bright idea to try and make profit with cheap methods and is a very good example of why codenames are used.

Now then I wonder what will Nvidia have to say for this.

  Betaguy

Elite Member

Joined: 12/31/04
Posts: 2582

Some folks are like Slinkies, totally useless but great fun to watch when pushed down stairs

4/16/13 8:48:56 AM#4
"Titan" is a code name for Blizzard's project not the name of the finished project, so this indivdual has claim to his Trademark "Titan" which will not effect Blizzard's upcoming MMO title. When Blizz announces the new upcoming title of the code named Titan it will switch over to the true IP.

  Lobotomist

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/07
Posts: 4775

I got so much trouble on my mind Refuse to lose.

4/16/13 8:53:21 AM#5

Titan is just code name for project. Something people call it internaly to avoid people acidentally revealing project existance.

I guess name "Titan" comes from pure megalomania on side of Blizzard.

  KaylettaJade

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/28/06
Posts: 139

4/16/13 8:59:22 AM#6

Not that I particularly care, but what if the codename has to do with the game? Not necessarily it's "final" name, but given the "leak" about time travel and the name Titan, perhaps we could infer that the game may have something to do with the titans ala Greek mythology? Chronos, the father of time, was a titan.

 

If that leak proves true, it might not be megalomania after all.

  Dexter2010

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/15/12
Posts: 141

4/16/13 9:05:13 AM#7
Could Titan's real name be Adolescent Mutant Samurai Tortoises?
  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2983

4/16/13 9:09:29 AM#8
Respawn entertainment is a proper development group backed by EA.. this isn't some individual trying to get a quick buck. They are probably making a game called Titan.
  Xiaoki

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/07/04
Posts: 2428

4/16/13 9:16:02 AM#9


Originally posted by Lobotomist
Titan is just code name for project. Something people call it internaly to avoid people acidentally revealing project existance.

I guess name "Titan" comes from pure megalomania on side of Blizzard.



Or its just Blizzard taking names from Greek mythology.

Diablo 3 was Project Hydra and Starcraft 2 was Project Medusa.


Respawn Entertainment is headed by the former 2 main guys of Infinity Ward and became popular with Call of Duty 4: Modern Combat. They left Activision and went to EA.


So, yeah, "Titan" will be a First Person Shooter published by EA. Not interested.

  Helleri

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 724

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”- Henry Ford

4/16/13 9:30:25 AM#10

Firstly... any proof of authenticity on that document? I mean it doesn't have any real info on it (as in who it is filed with and where, or any kind of instruction footnotes, which these usually have). I don't take things like that at face value.

 

The only Tradmarked use of titan I could find in US patents and trademarks office search regarding an entertainment company was this one... http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4008:izp2lh.2.2

(seems basically the same?).

The listed forms don't look like that (in appearence or the information they call for), and the application forms don't either (that type of designation isn't even an option).

Qualifiers for failing to deliver on story (in a supposedly story driven MMORPG):
If my character starts out ship wrecked on a beach.
If my character has amnesia; But, is also somehow the chosen one.
If my character has a place of origin that they will likely never set foot in until mid-high level.

  jinxit

Novice Member

Joined: 9/07/06
Posts: 864

4/16/13 9:39:19 AM#11
Originally posted by Dexter2010
Could Titan's real name be Adolescent Mutant Samurai Tortoises?

Adolescent Transmuted Samurai Tortoises

Fixed. :P

  adam_nox

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/31/06
Posts: 2052

4/16/13 9:44:12 AM#12

you can trademark a single dictionary word now?

 

I'm going to hurry and trademark about 2,000 words, brb.

  Helleri

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 724

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”- Henry Ford

4/16/13 9:49:57 AM#13
you can trademark words from the dictionary yes...within your state/province, for a limited duration of time, for a purpose, with terms so open it only applies to a specific logo. Trademarks are not papers of ownership on words...they are registration of the mark you are operating under for your trade in your area.

Qualifiers for failing to deliver on story (in a supposedly story driven MMORPG):
If my character starts out ship wrecked on a beach.
If my character has amnesia; But, is also somehow the chosen one.
If my character has a place of origin that they will likely never set foot in until mid-high level.

  Slampig

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 2381

Whatever you do, do NOT speak ill of Asheron's Call 2...

4/16/13 9:55:38 AM#14

Remember when we actually just played games instead of looking up shareholder meeting transcripts and copyright applications?

 

That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  Quizzical

Guide

Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 13179

4/16/13 9:58:09 AM#15

You can only trademark something for a specific purpose.  No one but Microsoft can make an operating system called Windows, but companies that sell glass can call it windows without infringing on Microsoft's trademark.

You an trademark a specific name of a game, but presumably they wouldn't be able to prevent others from using the word Titan in their game name, considering that some games already do.  Without even leaving this site:

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/826/Realm-of-the-Titans.html

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/894/The-Lost-Titans.html

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/836/Titan-Siege.html

  Quizzical

Guide

Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 13179

4/16/13 9:59:04 AM#16
Originally posted by Slampig

Remember when we actually just played games instead of looking up shareholder meeting transcripts and copyright applications?

 

That was only because we didn't have access to look it up, as there wasn't anything like the modern Internet.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11309

4/16/13 10:01:59 AM#17
  Helleri

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 724

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”- Henry Ford

4/16/13 10:03:47 AM#18

Usually trademark infringment (that is persuable in some sort of judicial or mediary setting) is over actual confusion as to distinguishing between business'.

Like Quizzical said...Can't make an operating system called Windows or an operating system called VVindows.

Qualifiers for failing to deliver on story (in a supposedly story driven MMORPG):
If my character starts out ship wrecked on a beach.
If my character has amnesia; But, is also somehow the chosen one.
If my character has a place of origin that they will likely never set foot in until mid-high level.

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6590

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

4/16/13 10:08:12 AM#19

Well i think there is something there but not quite what you think.

Blizzard is kind of famous for hiring other developers to do work for them but in this case i would say no.

The reason is that Respawn is under license to EA and they do not get along.

They had that whole law suit over the COD franchise.

This is probably a case of EA trying to annoy Activision by securing the rights to the title "TITAN".

ALl it measn is that the game will not be called Titan.

However being the founders of the COD franchise,this Titan game might be worth checking out,when it comes out.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Helleri

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 724

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”- Henry Ford

4/16/13 10:11:11 AM#20
Originally posted by Wizardry

Well i think there is something there but not quite what you think.

Blizzard is kind of famous for hiring other developers to do work for them but in this case i would say no.

The reason is that Respawn is under license to EA and they do not get along.

They had that whole law suit over the COD franchise.

This is probably a case of EA trying to annoy Activision by securing the rights to the title "TITAN".

ALl it measn is that the game will not be called Titan.

However being the founders of the COD franchise,this Titan game might be worth checking out,when it comes out.

And once gain the biggest jerks in the gaming industry are...*drum roll*...EA games! yay -_-

Qualifiers for failing to deliver on story (in a supposedly story driven MMORPG):
If my character starts out ship wrecked on a beach.
If my character has amnesia; But, is also somehow the chosen one.
If my character has a place of origin that they will likely never set foot in until mid-high level.

2 Pages 1 2 » Search